Legitimate Relationship = $$$

[Gagan and Lindsay 2]

As I sit and wait for my NOA2, I can't help but think about the K-1 process. I've been on VJ for several months now and I've read numerous success stories but also numerous horror stories. I know I need to be informed of the worst case scenarios to be prepared but I can't help in worrying that for some reason my legitimate relationship may not be approved because the country my fiance is from is high-fraud and the CO did not like the way he said "the".

As I've read different journeys I've realized the proof of the relationship is not necessarily in the "pudding". I feel the CO wants to see how much money are you willing to spend to validate and prove you have a legitimate relationship. Have you gone to see each other several times spending thousands of dollars in airfare, hotels, etc? Have you spent hundreds of dollars sending letters or packages to your fiance across international waters (are we not in the 21st century?!?) when you could just send an e-mail or wait to deliver the package and gift when you actually visit them?

Does quality not mean more than quantity? Why would $$$ be an indicator of authenticity? If someone was trying to "buy" their way into the US, don't you think it would be via $$$ (bribes)?

Why is religion such a red flag when one of my freedoms as a USC is freedom of religion? Can I not love someone from another religion? Even two USCs from different states could have such different beliefs and different cultures it would be comparable to being from a different country.

Why don't they read some of the e-mails or text messages that go back and forth between the couple? You can't make up that type of conversation between 2 people in love. Why don't they care about the details?

As I digress, I am at the discretion of the US government and will follow this process if I want to have a future with my fiance in the US. I will provide as much evidence as possible that they deem valid, but I can only hope and pray that my fiance and I have a smooth journey and that we can get married in August 2012. I can only dream that this will be my last holiday season alone and that next year, we will be able to celebrate our first Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's together as husband and wife.

[Miss smarty pants 84]

Dont pay for anything for the wedding. I lost a lot of money when my k1 was denied.

[Him & Me 4]

As I sit and wait for my NOA2, I can't help but think about the K-1 process. I've been on VJ for several months now and I've read numerous success stories but also numerous horror stories. I know I need to be informed of the worst case scenarios to be prepared but I can't help in worrying that for some reason my legitimate relationship may not be approved because the country my fiance is from is high-fraud and the CO did not like the way he said "the".

As I've read different journeys I've realized the proof of the relationship is not necessarily in the "pudding". I feel the CO wants to see how much money are you willing to spend to validate and prove you have a legitimate relationship. Have you gone to see each other several times spending thousands of dollars in airfare, hotels, etc? Have you spent hundreds of dollars sending letters or packages to your fiance across international waters (are we not in the 21st century?!?) when you could just send an e-mail or wait to deliver the package and gift when you actually visit them?

Does quality not mean more than quantity? Why would $$$ be an indicator of authenticity? If someone was trying to "buy" their way into the US, don't you think it would be via $$$ (bribes)?

Why is religion such a red flag when one of my freedoms as a USC is freedom of religion? Can I not love someone from another religion? Even two USCs from different states could have such different beliefs and different cultures it would be comparable to being from a different country.

Why don't they read some of the e-mails or text messages that go back and forth between the couple? You can't make up that type of conversation between 2 people in love. Why don't they care about the details?

As I digress, I am at the discretion of the US government and will follow this process if I want to have a future with my fiance in the US. I will provide as much evidence as possible that they deem valid, but I can only hope and pray that my fiance and I have a smooth journey and that we can get married in August 2012. I can only dream that this will be my last holiday season alone and that next year, we will be able to celebrate our first Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year's together as husband and wife.

I hear you loud and clear. I have the same fear. All we can do is hope and pray for best.

I wish both of you luck

[brian_n_phuong 193]

As I've read different journeys I've realized the proof of the relationship is not necessarily in the "pudding". I feel the CO wants to see how much money are you willing to spend to validate and prove you have a legitimate relationship. Have you gone to see each other several times spending thousands of dollars in airfare, hotels, etc? Have you spent hundreds of dollars sending letters or packages to your fiance across international waters (are we not in the 21st century?!?) when you could just send an e-mail or wait to deliver the package and gift when you actually visit them?

Does quality not mean more than quantity? Why would $$$ be an indicator of authenticity? If someone was trying to "buy" their way into the US, don't you think it would be via $$$ (bribes)?

What you have said makes perfect sense from a 'logical' standpoint, and would find myself in complete agreement. However, the same logic may not work from a practical standpoint from the perspective of the CO.

Try to place yourself in the CO's position. He/She has a VERY small amount of time to sift through a stack of paperwork, ask a few questions, and make a snap decision that will effect peoples lives forever. They are bombarded with lies, cheats, and criminals who are VERY talented at looking and sounding like a sincere and loving fiance. The CO's are not heartless, and are effected by the crying, heartbroken, and sometimes hostile fiance who is handed a denial or blue slip of paper. The CO is under incredible pressure from their supervisor to not only make the correct decision, but to ALSO do it FAST to prevent a backlog of cases. Not to mention that these people do this same job over and over and over.

So if you were a CO, what questions would you ask? What evidence would you want to see? What would sway you too see inside peoples heart? Is this person a fraud? What if I decide incorrectly and ruin a good persons life? You need to make that life-altering decision NOW, you have 15 minutes, HURRY the next 20 couples are waiting!

Edited December 7, 2011 by Brian_N_Phuong

[Gagan and Lindsay 2]

What you have said makes perfect sense from a 'logical' standpoint, and would find myself in complete agreement. However, the same logic may not work from a practical standpoint from the perspective of the CO.

Try to place yourself in the CO's position. He/She has a VERY small amount of time to sift through a stack of paperwork, ask a few questions, and make a snap decision that will effect peoples lives forever. They are bombarded with lies, cheats, and criminals who are VERY talented at looking and sounding like a sincere and loving fiance. The CO's are not heartless, and are effected by the crying, heartbroken, and sometimes hostile fiance who is handed a denial or blue slip of paper. The CO is under incredible pressure from their supervisor to not only make the correct decision, but to ALSO do it FAST to prevent a backlog of cases. Not to mention that these people do this same job over and over and over.

So if you were a CO, what questions would you ask? What evidence would you want to see? What would sway you too see inside peoples heart? Is this person a fraud? What if I decide incorrectly and ruin a good persons life? You need to make that life-altering decision NOW, you have 15 minutes, HURRY the next 20 couples are waiting!

Very good point...I am in management for my job so one of my duties is hiring people. Typically, when I conduct interview screenings, I don't have much time. I'm between meetings and I really only have 3-5 minutes. I ask about their previous experience, look at their resume, listen to how they answer the questions, and then go with my gut to make a decision. I know not everyone works that way but I have never been wrong when I go with my first instinct. Even when there are multiple supervisors interviewing/screening the same person, if I'm out-voted...I still end up right as that person ends up not being a good employee or ends up leaving the company fairly quickly after starting their job.

I know the CO has a very hard job but the USCIS spends 4+ months with our paperwork and then they approve it. You would think they would do some research and actually review some of the documentation. You would think the petition approval would mean something more...

I love hearing everyone's opinions and feedback...Keep them coming!

[dukeandduchess 141]

I feel bad for people who have to go through high-fraud countries. That said, there are reasons for looking at cases from certain countries with more scrutiny. In the end, everyone is doing what they need to do.

I noticed you're planning your wedding for 8 months from now. I think you should consider this very carefully because there is no certainty in this process and your case could go very quickly or take a long time.

Best of luck.

[mr and mrs 187]

for me it was less about the money. yes, we visited every 6 months for 5 years. yes, we sent expensive packages once in awhile. yes, the phone bills sometimes were shocking. but this is what we chose to spend money on. we sort of budgeted for it and made it work, because we wanted to make us work.

what i found more difficult was the emotional price. it was a very stressful process for me personally. it was so scary to think that i had to prove to some government agency that i was in love and want to get married. pulling together the 129F was a huge effort, but i took the application seriously and did my research (thank you VJ x 1 million). but that effort was exhausting. i was lucky to have lots of evidence and i was even luckier that i had the luxury of a fiance from a non-high-fraud country (UK). i was aware that we had it easier than other couples in relationships just like ours. but even so, it was stressful for me.

but, once it was submitted, i just sort of let things happen. and they did, sometimes slowly, but everything fell into place. i wish i could have had the perspective then that i have now. but its something you learn. and its a good lesson because you have to keeping working with USCIS until citizenship.

i have an analogy about the various stages of this journey:

it seems we 'graduate' from stage to stage.

intial visa [elementary school]

AOS [junior high]

ROC [high school]

citizenship [university]

RFEs and administrative processing are [honors] distinctions!

someday, you will be old and wise and wont sweat the small stuff so much, especially because you will have your fiance WITH you for AOS on. and every milestone you pass will make you feel stronger and more in control of this process.

i dont think ive really said anything that addresses exactly what you brought up, but it was interesting to read your post. i wish you lots of luck, though you wont need it. you will mostly need patience and organization.

but, yeah. things would be simpler/cheaper/less stressful if we had fallen in love with a guy who lives a couple blocks away, but thats not how it happened. plus, that would have been boring! : )

again, best wishes to you and your faraway love!

ps. do k1s from india always get AP? im curious as to whether or not that possibility is factored in to your chosen wedding date?

pps, as for COs finding meaning in our submissions, i think its not a big part of it, even though to us it feels like it should be a HUGE part of it. they need to see reliable evidence that this is a bona fide relationship. you just jump through their weird hoops and smile the whole time. even in the face of an RFE. having said that, i jammed a tone of meaning into all of my submissions, because thats who i am and how i live. ive got a lot of feelings. heh.

edit: more rambling. sorry for the length!

Edited December 7, 2011 by mr and mrs

[Gagan and Lindsay 2]

but, yeah. things would be simpler/cheaper/less stressful if we had fallen in love with a guy who lives a couple blocks away, but thats not how it happened. plus, that would have been boring! : )

again, best wishes to you and your faraway love!

ps. do k1s from india always get AP? im curious as to whether or not that possibility is factored in to your chosen wedding date?

You are SO right about the boring part...There is nothing boring about an international long-distance relationship... :-)

From the research I have done on K-1's in India...They do not always get AP, but I will say that certain consulates are more strict than others so the chances are much higher at certain consulates than others. My fiance and I are going through Mumbai which has historically been a little bit easier. It's been going through a lot of changes lately though so we'll see what the outcome is. And yes that did play a factor in our wedding date but the date also has significance in our relationship and so it kind of worked out too.

We have NOA1 of 11.08.11 and the average for K-1 from start to finish was 6 months when we received NOA1. Our wedding was over 9months away from the NOA1 date. I have not seen very many people go longer than 9mos even with RFE or AP...but we'll see...I'm not making any fixed plans right now and we are not planning a HUGE wedding either. We are also having a lot of friends and family helping like with cake and photography so there is flexibility as they are all aware of the process we are going through.

All that we can do is be positive and encourage each other...no matter what the circumstances are or what our personal situation is. We are all here for the same reason and none of us want our hopes and dreams crushed before a decision is even made.

[R.&S. 2]

Very good point...I am in management for my job so one of my duties is hiring people. Typically, when I conduct interview screenings, I don't have much time. I'm between meetings and I really only have 3-5 minutes. I ask about their previous experience, look at their resume, listen to how they answer the questions, and then go with my gut to make a decision. I know not everyone works that way but I have never been wrong when I go with my first instinct. Even when there are multiple supervisors interviewing/screening the same person, if I'm out-voted...I still end up right as that person ends up not being a good employee or ends up leaving the company fairly quickly after starting their job.

I know the CO has a very hard job but the USCIS spends 4+ months with our paperwork and then they approve it. You would think they would do some research and actually review some of the documentation. You would think the petition approval would mean something more...

I love hearing everyone's opinions and feedback...Keep them coming!

We have suffered all of this in New Delhi. You can read my experience in my posts. All I can say is that New Delhi is hard nut to crack when it comes to K1. Involve your families. Have you celebrated engagement ceremony?

Good Luck.

[R.&S. 2]

We have suffered all of this in New Delhi. You can read my experience in my posts. All I can say is that New Delhi is hard nut to crack when it comes to K1. Involve your families. Have you celebrated engagement ceremony?

Good Luck.

Oh sorry, I did not see that you will be interviewed in Mumbai.

[brian_n_phuong 193]

i have an analogy about the various stages of this journey:

it seems we 'graduate' from stage to stage.

intial visa [elementary school]

AOS [junior high]

ROC [high school]

citizenship [university]

RFEs and administrative processing are [honors] distinctions!

Thats a pretty cool!

Except for those applying from Viet Nam, or several other Hi-Fraud countries! We are forced straight to PhD level right from the start. One small mistake and we are Toast !

The worst part of the process for those submitting from Viet Nam, PI, Thailand, etc, is the unfair stereotype placed on Asian females marrying a Westerner. Your fiance is quickly labeled as either an illiterate village/island mail-order bride, or some sleazy "me so horny" bargirl trying to get to the states. These roles are just reinforced by the media based on the unrealistic stereotypical roles of Asian females seen on TV and the movies.

Edited December 7, 2011 by Brian_N_Phuong

[Gagan and Lindsay 2]

We have suffered all of this in New Delhi. You can read my experience in my posts. All I can say is that New Delhi is hard nut to crack when it comes to K1. Involve your families. Have you celebrated engagement ceremony?

Good Luck.

Yes...New Delhi honestly scares me a little bit and we are going through Mumbai but not sure if they are truly any better.

I sent a book with over 200 pictures of my fiance and I together from our trips that we've spent together in India and in the US. We had a family lunch in India on my last trip there to celebrate our pre-engagement and so that I could meet his entire family, but no official engagement ceremony. I had seen too many cases where the CO questioned it as "Are you sure you did not get married?" or "Why didn't you just get married?" So he proposed to me in the US and then we had an engagement party that we sent invitations for with my friends and family. Both of our families are very supportive of the marriage even though we are different religions. We have lots of pictures all together and we even still Skype with each other's family too.

[J and S 38]

You are SO right about the boring part...There is nothing boring about an international long-distance relationship... :-)

From the research I have done on K-1's in India...They do not always get AP, but I will say that certain consulates are more strict than others so the chances are much higher at certain consulates than others. My fiance and I are going through Mumbai which has historically been a little bit easier. It's been going through a lot of changes lately though so we'll see what the outcome is. And yes that did play a factor in our wedding date but the date also has significance in our relationship and so it kind of worked out too.

We have NOA1 of 11.08.11 and the average for K-1 from start to finish was 6 months when we received NOA1. Our wedding was over 9months away from the NOA1 date. I have not seen very many people go longer than 9mos even with RFE or AP...but we'll see...I'm not making any fixed plans right now and we are not planning a HUGE wedding either. We are also having a lot of friends and family helping like with cake and photography so there is flexibility as they are all aware of the process we are going through.

All that we can do is be positive and encourage each other...no matter what the circumstances are or what our personal situation is. We are all here for the same reason and none of us want our hopes and dreams crushed before a decision is even made.

Good luck on getting through the process speedily and in time for you intended date.

Flexibility is good. As you will have no idea when your fiance will arrive. We'll just hope the best for you that it does work out

[Hank_ 9,173]

200 pictures + documents + + +

That will take three men and a small boy to just carry it to someones desk...

Then the extra time to sort through it ALL... may be why there are June filers still waiting... stuck behind large files

[Adriene H 89]

Does quality not mean more than quantity? Why would $$$ be an indicator of authenticity? If someone was trying to "buy" their way into the US, don't you think it would be via $$$ (bribes)?

That old phrase ... "Money makes the world go round"

America is very much a capitalist country.