Supreme Court won't hear same-sex adoptive parents case

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

At least there's some normality left in this country.

http://news.yahoo.com/supreme-court-wont-hear-same-sex-adoptive-parents-150738679.html;_ylt=AvRxdjauXAleM1TdXlvF6OFvzwcF;_ylu=X3oDMTNvM2pnZTRsBG1pdANKdW1ib3Ryb24gVVNTRgRwa2cDMjQyMTdmNTItNTBhMi0zNzY0LWI2MmEtNjNhYWVkZjRmMDM0BHBvcwMyBHNlYwNqdW1ib3Ryb24EdmVyAzIwNDk2NDkwLWY0MWItMTFlMC05YmM3LTU3Y2QzNWEwYzA0Nw--;_ylg=X3oDMTFnN2dtdDIzBGludGwDdXMEbGFuZwNlbi11cwRwc3RhaWQDBHBzdGNhdAN1cwRwdANzZWN0aW9ucw--;_ylv=3

By James Vicini | Reuters – 8 hrs ago

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Supreme Court refused on Tuesday to consider the rights of same-sex parents in a setback for two gay men who wanted both of their names listed on their adopted son's birth certificate.

In a case closely watched by gay rights advocates, the high court rejected without comment an appeal by Oren Adar and Mickey Ray Smith, who sued to be listed as parents on a Louisiana birth certificate of the infant they adopted.

The justices let stand a ruling by a U.S. appeals court that a Louisiana registrar's decision not to list both men does not violate the child's right to equal protection under the law and does not deny legal recognition of the New York adoption.

In Louisiana, adopted children can get new birth certificates with their new parents' names on them. In the state, only married couples may adopt a child.

Because the gay couple was not married, the registrar refused to list both names on the birth certificate but offered to put one name on because Louisiana also allows a single-parent adoption.

There have been a number of major legal battles over the rights of homosexuals, including a landmark gay marriage case from California and cases on the rights of gays to adopt.

The boy, identified in court documents only as "J.C.," was born in Shreveport, Louisiana, in 2005. His mother gave Adar and Smith custody of the baby shortly after birth and the couple legally adopted the infant in New York state in 2006.

After the adoption, Adar and Smith wanted the birth certificate changed with their names listed instead of the biological parents. The couple, former California residents, now live in the Orlando, Florida, area.

Washington-based attorney Paul Smith argued in the Supreme Court appeal that Louisiana unconstitutionally treated children differently based on the marital status of their adoptive parents. He also said the Constitution required states to accept as valid legal judgments issued in other states.

Louisiana Attorney General James "Buddy" Caldwell urged the Supreme Court to reject the appeal and said the appeal court's ruling does not merit review.

He said the high court should not confront the issues now, that society's views about the family were changing and the issues were likely to come up again in the future.

The Supreme Court case is Oren Adar v. Darlene Smith, No. 11-46.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

For many years there were some gun ownership cases that were not heard by the Supremes. Each time the people that want to take away our civil rights would cheer that they had finally succeeded in destroying one of our rights. But what had happened, really, was that the Supremes had failed to rule because of some technicality or another. Failing to accept a case does not mean the issue is settled, in fact it was never addressed. Nothing has been determined on legal merit.

Then came Heller in 2008 and McDonald in 2010 and you no longer heard the cheering from the anti-civil rights crowd. Then they relaized they never had won anything except a stay of execution

The bad news Kip, is that there has been no ruling.

Believing in civil rights does not mean you have to be gay or even think it is OK. You just have to hold our rights above personal preference. I get to own assault rifles and they get to be gay.

You get to live how you want, and they get to live how they want.

[Danno 1,228]

At least there's some normality left in this country.

With the huge number of normal couples out there... why would a mother give birth and then hand the child over to two men playing man and wife?

It's really unfortunate.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

For many years there were some gun ownership cases that were not heard by the Supremes. Each time the people that want to take away our civil rights would cheer that they had finally succeeded in destroying one of our rights. But what had happened, really, was that the Supremes had failed to rule because of some technicality or another. Failing to accept a case does not mean the issue is settled, in fact it was never addressed. Nothing has been determined on legal merit.

Then came Heller in 2008 and McDonald in 2010 and you no longer heard the cheering from the anti-civil rights crowd. Then they relaized they never had won anything except a stay of execution

The bad news Kip, is that there has been no ruling.

Believing in civil rights does not mean you have to be gay or even think it is OK. You just have to hold our rights above personal preference. I get to own assault rifles and they get to be gay.

You get to live how you want, and they get to live how they want.

Call me old fashioned, but I don't think it's healthy for a child to be raised by a couple of homosexuals.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Call me old fashioned, but I don't think it's healthy for a child to be raised by a couple of homosexuals.

I think it is best for a child to be raised by two parents that care about the child and make the child their priority in life. What is NOT important is what those two adults do together in the bedroom with the door closed.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

I think it is best for a child to be raised by two parents that care about the child and make the child their priority in life. What is NOT important is what those two adults do together in the bedroom with the door closed.

Your saying it's healthy/normal for a kid to be raised in an environment where he has two dads playing house? I mean let's be honest. That kids head is going to be messed up for life. And it gets worse for the kid when it comes to his/her class mates and peers. It's sick imo. It's bad enough they are trying to play house as if they are normal, but to bring a child into that environment should be a crime.

Edited October 12, 2011 by Why_Me

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Your saying it's healthy/normal for a kid to be raised in an environment where he has two dads playing house? I mean let's be honest. That kids head is going to be messed up for life. And it gets worse for the kid when it comes to his/her class mates and peers. It's sick imo. It's bad enough they are trying to play house as if they are normal, but to bring a child into that environment should be a crime.

I am saying it doesn't matter. Most of the messed up kids come from Hetero households or single parent households. I am saying the sexuality of the parents does not matter. Heck, we do some very hetero stuff that would be pretty traumatizing to a 7 year old in our bedroom. We close the door.

I just think that gay men/lesbian women have every bit the same chance of being good, or bad, parents as anyone else. If they are crappy parents it is because they are crappy people.

[BSquared 9]

Your saying it's healthy/normal for a kid to be raised in an environment where he has two dads playing house? I mean let's be honest. That kids head is going to be messed up for life. And it gets worse for the kid when it comes to his/her class mates and peers. It's sick imo. It's bad enough they are trying to play house as if they are normal, but to bring a child into that environment should be a crime.

Allowing a gay couple (male or female), who love their child tremendously, to raise it, should not be a crime. I've seen/know of several gay couples raising children (I work in a NICU) & I much prefer sending babies home with 2 mothers (or fathers) than I do with two drug addicts. At least we know the gay couple will love & care for the child & its chances of showing up dead on the street are slim. Just my opinion.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Your saying it's healthy/normal for a kid to be raised in an environment where he has two dads playing house? I mean let's be honest. That kids head is going to be messed up for life. And it gets worse for the kid when it comes to his/her class mates and peers. It's sick imo. It's bad enough they are trying to play house as if they are normal, but to bring a child into that environment should be a crime.

Sex with a man would be sick in my opinion also, so I don;t do it. But my opinion does not extend beyond my bedroom.

I assure you that we do some stuff that some hetros would think is sick, and you probably do also. So what? Who is to decide what is done in your bedroom? You? Or someone else? Do you remember when I made a comment about "shaving" and how many people said it was "sick" or demented for a woman to shave...remember? C'mon, Kip, where does this end?

Edited October 12, 2011 by Gary and Alla

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

I am saying it doesn't matter. Most of the messed up kids come from Hetero households or single parent households. I am saying the sexuality of the parents does not matter. Heck, we do some very hetero stuff that would be pretty traumatizing to a 7 year old in our bedroom. We close the door.

I just think that gay men/lesbian women have every bit the same chance of being good, or bad, parents as anyone else. If they are crappy parents it is because they are crappy people.

Ya I can hear it now when that kid has his first sleep over. "Don't pay any attention to that noise upstairs, it's just my dad giving it to my dad".

Holidays would be a really big hit for that kid, especially at family diners, or better yet school sports events.

[웃 910]

Your saying it's healthy/normal for a kid to be raised in an environment where he has two dads playing house?

lol....Kip, how many Lesbos were straight before they figured out they would rather be with women than men....But had kids before they figured it out?

Most of them actually...So you already have A LOT of lesbos raising their own children.

The problem is there are tens of millions of straight parents that are TERRIBLE...drug addicts, too poor, too dumb, too strict, beat their kids...beat the mom....DV....drunks...these are some examples but easily 100 more.

Many gays are very successful, highly intelligent, fully functioning members of society. And it's pretty much an undisputed fact that many of them would make better parents than some of the dead beat parents out there today.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

Sex with a man would be sick in my opinion also, so I don;t do it. But my opinion does not extend beyond my bedroom.

I assure you that we do some stuff that some hetros would think is sick, and you probably do also. So what? Who is to decide what is done in your bedroom? You? Or someone else? Do you remember when I made a comment about "shaving" and how many people said it was "sick" or demented for a woman to shave...remember? C'mon, Kip, where does this end?

Ya where does it end? I mean bringing a child into that sick and twisted atmosphere should be a crime imo. There's nothing normal about it. I don't care if it's 2011, or 2111. Sick is sick.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Ya I can hear it now when that kid has his first sleep over. "Don't pay any attention to that noise upstairs, it's just my dad giving it to my dad".

Holidays would be a really big hit for that kid, especially at family diners, or better yet school sports events.

Kip do you have children? Have you ever had sex with kids in the house? We do it maybe 6-8 times per week. Y'know, you have to be a bit discrete and plan for it a bit. Good solid doors help.

So does plain talk. "Hey you have headphones and like music...put them on"

What you are trying to say is that what goes on in our bedroom affects our kids. It doesn't. what goes on OUTSIDE the bedroom affects our kids.

I came home and Pasha meets me immediately and asks me to go to the store to help him buy stuff for his car. Does he care that I boned his mom 4 times last night and once this morning? Does he know? If I go with him and talk to him about what he wants to talk about, help him make decisions, tell him I will help him with his studying for SATs this Saturday and not gripe that I am really tired and would rather just kick my feet up...THAT is what is important. THAt is hw you raise kids. I doubt he could care less about our sex life.

[Danno 1,228]

Allowing a gay couple (male or female), who love their child tremendously, to raise it, should not be a crime. I've seen/know of several gay couples raising children (I work in a NICU) & I much prefer sending babies home with 2 mothers (or fathers) than I do with two drug addicts. At least we know the gay couple will love & care for the child & its chances of showing up dead on the street are slim. Just my opinion.

That you'd make your logic work by comparing 2 Men to 2 Drug addicts is interesting.

Okay, I'll play along, I'd rather see a little kid go home with two drug addicts than two serial Child molesters.

[Danno 1,228]

Sex with a man would be sick in my opinion also, so I don;t do it. But my opinion does not extend beyond my bedroom.

I assure you that we do some stuff that some hetros would think is sick, and you probably do also. So what? Who is to decide what is done in your bedroom? You? Or someone else? Do you remember when I made a comment about "shaving" and how many people said it was "sick" or demented for a woman to shave...remember? C'mon, Kip, where does this end?

It's unclear to me why you think the oddness of Homosexual life, begins and ends in the area of sex.

It's way more complicated than that and you are smart enough to know that.

Interesting findings.

Study: Gay Parents More Likely to Have Gay Kids

Oct 17, 2010 – 4:14 PM

(Oct. 17) -- Walter Schumm knows what he's about to do is unpopular: publish a study arguing that gay parents are more likely to raise gay children than straight parents. But the Kansas State University family studies professor has a detailed analysis that past almost aggressively ideological researchers never had.

When one such researcher, Paul Cameron, published a paper in 2006 arguing that children of gay parents were more likely to be gay themselves, the response from the academic press was virulent, to say nothing of the popular press; the Southern Poverty Law Center, for instance, equated Cameron to a Nazi.

Not all of the vitriol was hyperbolic. Cameron does not tolerate gay people. He believes that "homosexual practice is injurious to society."

The gay press, as far back as the 1980s, labeled Cameron "the most dangerous anti-gay voice in America." Though Cameron was the first to publish papers on the dangers of secondhand smoke, the scientific community has abandoned him. The American Psychological Association long since dropped him from its membership for an "ethical" violation.

Today, Cameron is the founder and chairman of the Family Research Institute, whose "overriding mission" is to publish "empirical research on issues that threaten the traditional family, particularly homosexuality."

Schumm doesn't go for that sort of research. After Cameron's 2006 paper, Schumm listened as the academic community stated certainty of two things: Cameron was an idiotic bigot; and the existing literature showed little to no societal, cultural or parental influence on sexual orientation.

Schumm began investigating the second premise. "I just want to know the truth about something," he tells AOL News. And he found it strange that parents can influence so many facets of their children's lives -- but not in any way their sexual orientation.

Lawyers for the state of Florida heard of Schumm's fledgling research and invited him in 2008 to testify in a case. The state's Department of Children and Families was attempting to uphold a ban on gay and lesbian parents adopting children. Schumm's testimony actually ended up aiding the gay parents in the trial.

He said: "Gay parents can be good foster parents," and "The decision to permit homosexuals to adopt is best made by the judiciary on a case by case basis."

Schumm tells AOL News that he agreed to testify as one of the state's witnesses only if his evidence was not "slanted" for or against gay rights.

But also in his testimony was an inkling of the robust research Schumm has just completed. His study on sexual orientation, out next month, says that gay and lesbian parents are far more likely to have children who become gay. "I'm trying to prove that it's not 100 percent genetic," Schumm tells AOL News.

His study is a meta-analysis of existing work. First, Schumm extrapolated data from 10 books on gay parenting; Cameron, for what it's worth, had only looked at three, and offered no statistical analysis in his paper. Schumm skewed his data so that only self-identified gay and lesbian children would be labeled as such.

This is important because sometimes Schumm would come across a passage of children of gay parents who said they were "adamant about not declaring their sexual orientation at all." These people would be labeled straight, even though the passage's implication was that they were gay.

Schumm concluded that children of lesbian parents identified themselves as gay 31 percent of the time; children of gay men had gay children 19 percent of the time, and children of a lesbian mother and gay father had at least one gay child 25 percent of the time.

Furthermore, when the study restricted the results so that they included only children in their 20s -- presumably after they'd been able to work out any adolescent confusion or experimentation -- 58 percent of the children of lesbians called themselves gay, and 33 percent of the children of gay men called themselves gay. (About 5 to 10 percent of the children of straight parents call themselves gay, Schumm says.)

Schumm next went macro, poring over an anthropological study of various cultures' acceptance of homosexuality. He found that when communities welcome gays and lesbians, "89 percent feature higher rates of homosexual behavior."

Finally, Schumm looked at the existing academic studies, the ones used to pillory Cameron's work. In all there are 26 such studies. Schumm ran the numbers from them and concluded that, surprisingly, 20 percent of the kids of gay parents were gay themselves. When children only 17 or older were included in the analysis, 28 percent were gay.

Abbie Goldberg is a psychology professor at Clark University, and the author of "Lesbian and Gay Parents and Their Children: Research on the Family Life Cycle," which this year won the Distinguished Book Award from the APA. She hasn't read Schumm's study, only seen the abstract. But she says, in general, that a meta-analysis of this nature relies on sample sizes that are often too small and may furthermore brim with participants whose perspective is firmly aligned with the LGBT community. In other words, they're aware of these sorts of studies and seek them out.

"The fundamental problem with this [type of meta-analysis] is such samples tend to be biased," Goldberg tells AOL News.

Schumm says he guarded against that by seeking out so many different works. And across all his data -- the 10 books he consulted, the anthropological study, the scientific articles -- he noticed how lesbians begat more lesbians. In Schumm's study, he quotes from the extant literature the stories of young women, describing how being gay was never frowned upon in their household, and so that "option" was available to them. That said, Schumm also finds evidence of gay mothers pushing their daughters, upset over a relationship with a man, to "try out women."

But couldn't gay men also tell their sons this? Yes, but Schumm tells AOL News that most gay men have at some point been with a woman, so they understand why their sons might date them. Whereas the literature shows some lesbians "have a hatred of men that's intense," Schumm says.

Schumm says it shouldn't have taken until 2010 to do the meta-analysis. Too often his colleagues impose "liberal or progressive political interpretations" on their studies, which inhibit further inquiry. "It's kind of sad," he tells AOL News.

As if expecting a political backlash himself, Schumm concludes his study with a quote from philosopher Arthur Schopenhauer. "All truth passes through three stages: First it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

http://www.aolnews.com/2010/10/17/study-gay-parents-more-likely-to-have-gay-kids/

As the research become more clear studying the results of this new trend I predict we will find children do better in homes in a more normal setting, despite the genuine care and Love Homosexual couples have for these children.