Guns from U.S. sting found at Mexican crime scenes

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

http://news.yahoo.com/guns-u-sting-mexican-crime-scenes-report-131600807.html

By Jeremy Pelofsky | Reuters – 23 hrs ago

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - At least 122 firearms from a botched U.S. undercover operation have been found at crime scenes in Mexico or intercepted en route to drug cartels there, a Republican congressional report issued on Tuesday said.

Mexican authorities found AK-47 assault rifles, powerful .50 caliber rifles and other weapons as early as November 2009 that were later linked to the U.S. sting operation to trace weapons crossing the border to Mexico, the report said.

Guns from the program, dubbed "Operation Fast and Furious," were also found at the scene of the murder of a U.S. Border Patrol agent in the border state of Arizona last December. It is unclear if they were the weapons responsible for his death.

U.S. authorities set up the undercover operation in 2009 to try to track guns bought in Phoenix on behalf of Mexican drug cartels, but many of the weapons were never traced after they left the hands of the initial buyer.

The sting has become an embarrassment for the Obama administration and its Justice Department, rather than a victory in stemming the illegal flow of weapons to Mexico.

It has also hurt ties with Mexico, which has been battling the cartels in a war in which tens of thousands have died.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives and federal prosecutors had hoped the sting would help them track gun buyers reselling weapons to cartels. But U.S. ATF agents did not see many of the purchases or follow many of the guns after the initial purchaser re-sold them.

At least 122 firearms bought by suspected gun traffickers were found at Mexican crime scenes or caught going to the cartels in 48 separate instances, according to the report done for the House of Representatives Oversight Committee and the Senate Judiciary Committee senior Republican Charles Grassley.

Of the 2,000 weapons sold to the suspected gun traffickers, just over half remain unaccounted for, the report added. The ATF was unaware of most of the gun sales when they occurred, according to the Justice Department, which oversees it.

"Given the vast amount of 'Operation Fast and Furious' weapons possibly still in the hands of cartel members, law enforcement officials should expect more seizures and recoveries at crime scenes," the congressional report said.

The Justice Department's internal watchdog is also conducting its own investigation of the sting.

The department said it could only confirm 96 guns recovered in Mexico that were tied to suspects being tracked in the operation, but it said that ATF did not have complete information on how many were recovered at crime scenes there.

Some 274 weapons were recovered in the United States and, so far, about a dozen were found at crime scenes, according to details given to Grassley and obtained by Reuters.

LAWMAKERS SLAM FAILURE TO FOLLOW UP

During a nearly five-hour hearing, members of the House oversight panel grilled ATF officials who ran the operation and slammed them for allowing weapons to go across the border without being fully tracked, a charge they denied.

"It seems like you knowingly allowed these weapons to get out of your control, knowingly, to someone you knew was trafficking into Mexico," said Republican Darrell Issa, the House panel's chairman. "You saw the results, you allowed it continue and now you're telling us we don't let guns walk."

ATF officials acknowledged making mistakes but the head of the Phoenix office at the time, William Newell, insisted the sting did not let weapons freely go to Mexico and the goal was to take down the network supplying the drug cartels.

"It is my opinion that we did not let guns walk," he said.

"You're entitled to your opinion, not to your facts," Issa quickly retorted.

ATF officials said that arresting initial gun buyers, known as straw buyers, would do little to take out the network. Authorities tried to track the guns but Newell acknowledged that "not in every instance" were they able to do so.

"If we pick off these one or two straw purchasers, they get replaced in a day, and we have even more guns going into Mexico," said Bill McMahon, head of the ATF's operations in the western United States at the time of the operation.

In a closed-door interview with the House panel, the acting ATF deputy director William Hoover said he sought to shut down the sting operation as early as March 2010 but acknowledged that he should have made more efforts to do so.

[slim 1,533]

What I've never understood is why it's our job to stop guns going into Mexico. Shouldn't that be their job?

Oh, and why we have a BATFE is beyond me as well.

[Bad_Daddy 2,209]

What I've never understood is why it's our job to stop guns going into Mexico. Shouldn't that be their job?

Oh, and why we have a BATFE is beyond me as well.

According to Mexico and the ultra libs here in the US...it's all the US fault. Same with illegals...that's our fault also, and we should bend over backwards for them.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

This has been going on for months but the liberal media hasn't touched it. It did get Hillary to shut her mouth regarding US gun laws and how our guns were fueling the Mexican drug wars. Turns out it was Obamas administration providing the guns with "economic stimulus" money. Obama and his staff are such bafoons!

At least one American law enforcement official has been killed by these guns.

Edited July 27, 2011 by Gary and Alla

[slim 1,533]

At least now they're starting to stand against the UN's small arms ban.

[lostinblue 1,989]

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20083772-10391695.html

At a lengthy hearing on ATF's controversial gunwalking operation today, a key ATF manager told Congress he discussed the case with a White House National Security staffer as early as September 2010. The communications were between ATF Special Agent in Charge of the Phoenix office, Bill Newell, and White House National Security Director for North America Kevin O'Reilly. Newell said the two are longtime friends. The content of what Newell shared with O'Reilly is unclear and wasn't fully explored at the hearing.

It's the first time anyone has publicly stated that a White House official had any familiarity with ATF's operation Fast and Furious, which allowed thousands of weapons to fall into the hands of suspected traffickers for Mexican drug cartels in an attempt to gain intelligence. It's unknown as to whether O'Reilly shared information with anybody else at the White House.

Congressional investigators obtained an email from Newell to O'Reilly in September of last year in which Newell began with the words: "you didn't get this from me."

"What does that mean," one member of Congress asked Newell, " 'you didn't get this from me?' "

"Obviously he was a friend of mine," Newell replied, "and I shouldn't have been sending that to him."

Newell told Congress that O'Reilly had asked him for information.

"Why do you think he asked for that information," Congressman Darrell Issa (R-CA) asked Newell.

"He was asking about the impact of Project Gunrunner to brief people in preparation for a trip to Mexico... what we were doing to combat firearms trafficking and other issues."

Today, a White House spokesman said the email was not about Fast and Furious, but about other gun trafficking efforts. The spokesman also said he didn't know what Newell was referring to when he said he'd spoken to O'Reilly about Fast and Furious.

President Obama has said neither he nor Attorney General Eric Holder authorized or knew about the operation. Holder has asked the Inspector General to investigate.

[slim 1,533]

a White House spokesman said the email was not about Fast and Furious, but about other gun trafficking efforts.

Holy Cow! There's more?

[Ban Hammer 13,716]

Holy Cow! There's more?

exactly

[mawilson 2,133]

What I've never understood is why it's our job to stop guns going into Mexico

International Traffic in Arms Regulations

Under ITAR, a US person who wants to export items on the United States Munitions List to a foreign person must obtain authorization from the US Department of State before the export can take place.

My guess is they were tracking "illegal" guns (i.e. sold without the State Department's authorization).

[slim 1,533]

International Traffic in Arms Regulations

Under ITAR, a US person who wants to export items on the United States Munitions List to a foreign person must obtain authorization from the US Department of State before the export can take place.

My guess is they were tracking "illegal" guns (i.e. sold without the State Department's authorization).

Key there is "a US person."

[mawilson 2,133]

Key there is "a US person."

How would a foreign person (or drug cartel) obtain guns here, unless they get them from a US person?

Under ITAR, a "US person" is

• a US citizen
  
• a permanent resident who does not work for a foreign company, a foreign government, or a foreign governmental agency/organization
  
• a political asylee
  
• a part of the US government, or
  
• a corporation, business, organization, or group that is incorporated in the United States under US law
  

[slim 1,533]

How would a foreign person (or drug cartel) obtain guns here, unless they get them from a US person?

Theft.

No matter how illegal you make it, criminals can always break some other law to get the tools they need.

[mawilson 2,133]

Theft.

No matter how illegal you make it, criminals can always break some other law to get the tools they need.

I guess you answered your own question ("why it's our job to stop guns going into Mexico")

Theft happens to be illegal.

[slim 1,533]

I guess you answered your own question ("why it's our job to stop guns going into Mexico")

Theft happens to be illegal.

So we're not only supposed to stop theft, but what happens to stolen items?