Oh This is RICH... Obama "Blackmailed" Into Extended Tax Cuts For All..

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Just written to my REPUBLICAN Congressman asking him not to support the deal

The only way to reduce the deficit is to cut unnecessary expenses AND raise taxes on those who can pay easily (People like me).

Military spending, which is greater than all the countries of the world put together is a sacred cow that needs to be tethered.

I would do this before I chopped medical care and pensions for the old and poor. I know there are many on here who don't care about anyone else and also support extra-judicial kidnapping/torture/murder even for a guy who leaks that the US ambassador thought that that Hillary had a fat batty. I reject those people in their entirety because they have the values of sociopaths.

I think many Republicans are looking at the future for the country and are worried that with these Republican measures, the country will be harmed. Ever increasing carrier battle groups and Military Bases and low tax for the fabulously rich 1% and strip the poor and sick of America of their basic help ? What a policy ! Yes, even extreme right wingers are regretting what they wished for and realise as I do, that we the rich and comparatively rich, will suffer in the long term as the country, and the currency, and society collapses.

Talk about death panels - taking it out out of pensions and social security is the biggest death panel of all.

I am talking as an independent too - I have written a semi- abusive letter to the Democrats and there is no way I will vote for Obama

First because of his abuse of the Police Officer over Gatesgate

Then his anti - British unfair stance over BP (related to his terrorist grandfather's treatment by the British)

Then this - he is pro war, pro the Military Industrial complex and pro - Billionaire and uncaring about the future of deficits or the well being of the country in the long term.

Both Republicans and Democrats and Independents should ditch this guy and he should not be nominated in 2012

I would trust Bill Clinton with my daughter before I would trust this guy with my vote

Good to be active and write in, but ignorant....

The top don't pay enough?

The bottom 50% don't pay jack and we say others don't pay enough? That argument is ridiculous.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The Left wants to raise taxes without cutting spending as well, you seem keen to ignore this...

I mention in every other post that spending is the problem, yet I guess you are picking what you want out of my posts....

Stay on topic. We are talking about the Bush Tax Cuts and you claiming that had no negative bearing on the deficit, which is false.

As for spending....the expenditures already exist. Until there is a budget agreement with spending cuts, those expenditures have to be paid for or they add to the deficit.

Were the two wars budgeted for? How about the Medicare increase under Bush? Bush Tax Cuts? Nope. None of it was budgeted for. We had 8 years of fiscal irresponsibility by the Bush Administration, mainly from those key policies. That is something you continue to ignore or dismiss as not being an issue when it comes to deficit reduction.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Stay on topic. We are talking about the Bush Tax Cuts and you claiming that had no negative bearing on the deficit, which is false.

As for spending....the expenditures already exist. Until there is a budget agreement with spending cuts, those expenditures have to be paid for or they add to the deficit.

Were the two wars budgeted for? How about the Medicare increase under Bush? Bush Tax Cuts? Nope. None of it was budgeted for. We had 8 years of fiscal irresponsibility by the Bush Administration, mainly from those key policies. That is something you continue to ignore or dismiss as not being an issue when it comes to deficit reduction.

You apparently need to go back and read what I say time after time on military spending, etc... I know you've seen my posts before about it.

Expenditures might already exist, but as with anything, when funds are low, you cut your budget when the money isn't there. You don't go force your next door neighbor to take it out of their wallet.

[Captain Oates 910]

Good to be active and write in, but ignorant....

The top don't pay enough?

The bottom 50% don't pay jack and we say others don't pay enough? That argument is ridiculous.

The bottom 50% pay little because they earn little. The top 1% have the majority of the wealth. The top 2% own a big chunk of the rest.

That is called the progressive tax system and is the ethos in all first world countries

If you are going to use epithets like 'ignorant', you should at least explain what you mean by that ?

You are just trotting out received hard line uninformed party dogma and I bet you know less about the American Economy and taxation than most - and far less than me for sure

People with huge fortunes like Warren Buffet are also embarrassed at the US tax system and think that people with hundreds of billions in the bank should pay more before we strip poor old people of health and pensions

I know that 'the poor' in the US is unspoken code for 'black' and that is the reason why the cruelest Republicans are prepared to target them and give the money to Billionaires and Lockheed Martin and Blackwater etc etc

People who are not black and own their own house think they are one of the Billionaire class and their interest coincide. They don't

You apparently need to go back and read what I say time after time on military spending, etc... I know you've seen my posts before about it.

Expenditures might already exist, but as with anything, when funds are low, you cut your budget when the money isn't there. You don't go force your next door neighbor to take it out of their wallet.

I bet you don't live next door to George Soros

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

The bottom 50% pay little because they earn little. The top 1% have the majority of the wealth. The top 2% own a big chunk of the rest.

That is called the progressive tax system and is the ethos in all first world countries

If you are going to use epithets like 'ignorant', you should at least explain what you mean by that ?

You are just trotting out received hard line uninformed party dogma and I bet you know less about the American Economy and taxation than most - and far less than me for sure

People with huge fortunes like Warren Buffet are also embarrassed at the US tax system and think that people with hundreds of billions in the bank should pay more before we strip poor old people of health and pensions

I know that 'the poor' in the US is unspoken code for 'black' and that is the reason why the cruelest Republicans are prepared to target them and give the money to Billionaires and Lockheed Martin and Blackwater etc etc

People who are not black and own their own house think they are one of the Billionaire class and their interest coincide. They don't

I bet you don't live next door to George Soros

I forgot all about this. WB paid something like 18%?

[Obama 2012 1,714]

The bottom 50% pay little because they earn little. The top 1% have the majority of the wealth. The top 2% own a big chunk of the rest.

That is called the progressive tax system and is the ethos in all first world countries

If you are going to use epithets like 'ignorant', you should at least explain what you mean by that ?

You are just trotting out received hard line uninformed party dogma and I bet you know less about the American Economy and taxation than most - and far less than me for sure

People with huge fortunes like Warren Buffet are also embarrassed at the US tax system and think that people with hundreds of billions in the bank should pay more before we strip poor old people of health and pensions

I know that 'the poor' in the US is unspoken code for 'black' and that is the reason why the cruelest Republicans are prepared to target them and give the money to Billionaires and Lockheed Martin and Blackwater etc etc

People who are not black and own their own house think they are one of the Billionaire class and their interest coincide. They don't

I bet you don't live next door to George Soros

The bolded is your damn ignorance.... #1 Nation Defense is a job of the goverment..... Redistributing wealth is not... #2 nothing is codename "black" as the majority of poor people in case you didn't know are WHITE. Of course I know the left has a hard time spelling this out, but it's true... #3 those "billionaires" pay the vast majority of the taxes when everyone else does not.

Class warfare is hilarious and taxation has nothing to do with how well people are doing. Laws, regulations, etc. have a lot more to do with people succeeding and getting ahead in life than taxes do. Redistrubuting wealth only encourages a welfare/lazy state.

Government is needed, but it's abused and overused and has been since the great society and just before.

[Captain Oates 910]

The bolded is your damn ignorance.... #1 Nation Defense is a job of the goverment..... Redistributing wealth is not... #2 nothing is codename "black" as the majority of poor people in case you didn't know are WHITE. Of course I know the left has a hard time spelling this out, but it's true... #3 those "billionaires" pay the vast majority of the taxes when everyone else does not.

Class warfare is hilarious and taxation has nothing to do with how well people are doing. Laws, regulations, etc. have a lot more to do with people succeeding and getting ahead in life than taxes do. Redistrubuting wealth only encourages a welfare/lazy state.

Government is needed, but it's abused and overused and has been since the great society and just before.

Name one advanced country that does not tax the rich at a higher percentage rate than the poor. That is redistribution and is the agreed way to run the country by all first world countries. Every NATO ally practices distribution of wealth.

You are taking on the world and the system the USA has embraced for generations under the Republicans and Democrats alike. It you who is ignorant of your own country's history and taxation system. The extreme right wing are not part of American mainstream politics and never have been and never will be.

By the way, 'ignorance ' is lack of knowledge on a subject and not someone who has a different viewpoint. I fundamentally disagree with your 'I am all right jack and the devil take the hindermost' politics, but I am far from an ignorant person. I confess to being ignorant of what twisted thought process makes christians and people who claim to be 'nice', abandon the sick and the weak to further feather the nest of the super rich

[mawilson 2,133]

It's the current spending levels that are the problem.

Not really - government expenditures have indeed grown, but revenues have decreased more significantly as a result of the economic recession.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

Name one advanced country that does not tax the rich at a higher percentage rate than the poor. That is redistribution and is the agreed way to run the country by all first world countries. Every NATO ally practices distribution of wealth.

You are taking on the world and the system the USA has embraced for generations under the Republicans and Democrats alike. It you who is ignorant of your own country's history and taxation system. The extreme right wing are not part of American mainstream politics and never have been and never will be.

By the way, 'ignorance ' is lack of knowledge on a subject and not someone who has a different viewpoint. I fundamentally disagree with your 'I am all right jack and the devil take the hindermost' politics, but I am far from an ignorant person. I confess to being ignorant of what twisted thought process makes christians and people who claim to be 'nice', abandon the sick and the weak to further feather the nest of the super rich

See, you proved your ignorance once again in your last statement. Day in and day out we see community outreach to those in need with no government intervention necessary. The church that my aunt goes to has a benevolence center there that is waiting for anyone who needs help with food, clothing, etc. no membership necessary, just a need. No government application necessary, no red tape, just people helping people. This is the case with churches all around this area actually, and even other community programs done by the people without government assistance, all on private donations alone.

Human beings despite our selfish nature, are very kind hearted and will take care of our fellow man in his/her time of need. We don't need government stealing from person A and giving it to person B. Actually government does more to harm charities a lot of times than help (see the stupid "cash for clunkers" ####### this past summer for example).

Community is the key at the end of the day, not a vast government welfare state. All a welfare state does is discourage some from helping others who feel that those people can get help from the government, and it creates a war between the people based on who's got what.

You say "every other first world nation" like it's a good thing. America isn't America because we do things like everyone else, we are who we are because we're willing to do things differently and take from other ideas and build on them. We were a nation of ideas, a nation of people who wanted to work hard and work together to build something great. Now we're just a bunch of lazy punks who relies on everyone else to do things for us. Things are "too hard." Give me a break. Our great-grandparents who went through the great depression would slap the living hell out of anyone who wouldn't take a job because they sat on "free" money from the government. All the welfare state has done is create a society in which we are no longer one who comes together, but one who would rather remain apart... Look at how much easier it is to have an old folks home now days than it is to take care of ones parents, or how easy it is to get a family member on secion 8, rather than take them in and help them build up their own stability, etc..

[Captain Oates 910]

I see you ignore my statement that redistribution of wealth has been the method of the American tax system throughout ALL of your life and under all governments. You are quick to say that America is different and superior to all other countries and the US is better and does its own thing - but the FACT is that it is exactly the same as far as a redistributive tax system is concerned ! Yes the US is the same as France and always has been ! Chew on that.

You cannot spit the words out that the US has a distributive tax system and always has had throughout living memory and both Republicans and Democrats have always voted to keep it so

Your ignorance or mental block and denial of this is dwarfed only by your brainwashed utterances on a church hand out system to the religious impoverished. Do they hand out to Muslims or tell them to go to their mosque ? Do humanists get any crusts ? What a system you propose. Cruel, unfeeling, superior, patronizing and tight fisted hand out based. Shudder

...and meanwhile the billionaires become multi- billionaires while you wait in vain for it to trickle down to you.

This approach has no future in America and this philosophy is of the past and is left behind with the Victorian workhouse and the lash

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Not really - government expenditures have indeed grown, but revenues have decreased more significantly as a result of the economic recession.

No facts, pelase. Paul doesn't take them well.

[Pooky 3,343]

Um, no. The issue had to do with those who wanted Obama to actually fail. That's different from opposing his agenda or criticizing his policies. Those who wanted him to fail, even before his first 100 days didn't care if he suddenly embraced every Republican policy, they wanted blood.

The GOP Senate, on the other, under the leadership of Mitch McConnell, have said outright that they will obstruct and effectively shut down the fed. gov't. unless the Bush Tax Cuts are extended. It's a bold faced lie to pin out of control spending on the Democrats and you know it, or you're being obtuse to the facts.

So, McConnell saying the GOP will obstruct and effectively shut down the Federal Government is a lie?

Nobody has made the claim you're looking to refute here (or should I say refudiate so that the Tea Partier in you can understand). Talk about fail.

Do you want to reconsider your statement, or admit your reading is a little lacking? Because that is exactly what Steven wrote, as clearly quoted in red from his post.

Fail Dog ... has failed again.

Just as you fail in trying to pigeonhole people in accordance with your political bias. You have no clue when it comes to my politics and a really short memory when it comes to the issues I care about. Would a Tea Party supporter be in favour of a nationwide single-payer system for healthcare? Would a GOP supporter be in favour of strict gun control? Would a Democrat supporter be in favour of reining in government spending? When you get a clue how a true Independent sees things then get back to me.

In the mean time, have fun when the Democrat hegemony crumbles at the start of the New Year and some semblance of political balance returns to Washington, for all the good that will do the country.

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Do you want to reconsider your statement, or admit your reading is a little lacking? Because that is exactly what Steven wrote, as clearly quoted in red from his post.

Fail Dog ... has failed again.

Just as you fail in trying to pigeonhole people in accordance with your political bias. You have no clue when it comes to my politics and a really short memory when it comes to the issues I care about. Would a Tea Party supporter be in favour of a nationwide single-payer system for healthcare? Would a GOP supporter be in favour of strict gun control? Would a Democrat supporter be in favour of reining in government spending? When you get a clue how a true Independent sees things then get back to me.

In the mean time, have fun when the Democrat hegemony crumbles at the start of the New Year and some semblance of political balance returns to Washington, for all the good that will do the country.

I can't quite seem to figure out why we disagree in so many threads when it seems we agree on the major topics with the exception of gun control (I'm fine with fully automatic bans but thats about it) and the fact that you want a reduction in tax and spending while I want a flatline in domestic spending, mild tax increases with a dash of military cuts.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

No facts, pelase. Paul doesn't take them well.

and you cannot read what I've said either apparently.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

It's a bold faced lie to pin out of control spending on the Democrats and you know it, or you're being obtuse to the facts.

So, McConnell saying the GOP will obstruct and effectively shut down the Federal Government is a lie?

Nobody has made the claim you're looking to refute here (or should I say refudiate so that the Tea Partier in you can understand). Talk about fail.

Do you want to reconsider your statement, or admit your reading is a little lacking? Because that is exactly what Steven wrote, as clearly quoted in red from his post.

Are you sure it's my reading that's lacking? Read the sentence and tell me where it contains any mention of obstruction or government shut down? He is saying that it's a bold faced lie to pin the out of control spending on the Democrats. Try reading it a few more times. I'm sure eventually you'll get it.