Choking on evidence

[Dan T 8]

When I weighed the envelope of evidence for postage it came out to be over 1 pound. When I was assembling the packet I remember having the sentiment that I sincerely hoped for someone to go at least temporarily blind while pouring of the pile of unnesaccary bs that we compiled just so some useless beurocrat who couldnt get hired for pizza delivery could justify his job. We figured it was cheaper to scan and print plain paper copies of all of our photos than to have actual duplicates made. We sent over 30 photos, btw. We sent in photocopies of every single page of both of our passports. A lease agreement for every year that I lived in this appartment and the years we've spent here together, 5 total. Joint car insurence, a notice of my company droping its insurence plan that we were both benificiaries of, 7 affidavits, tax returns from 2006 to 2009 including business taxes for the LLC that my wife and I formed in 2008, our business formation documents, copies of her thyroid medication proving that she has a condition that makes conception a very expensive endeavor, and Im sure I've missed a few things. We can't afford kids or a mortgage, I know that doesnt stop a lot of people from burdoning society with their mistakes but we actually have a conscience. I am disgusted with the entire process, both for its bloat, and for its expense. If my wife could have simply hopped a fence over our Southern boarder instead of paying through the nose and waste so much time on this useless paperwork just because she comes from a civilized modern country(Ireland) I may have considered that, but oh yeah I forgot I do have a conscience.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I wonder whether they simply go by weight for approval, or just set the "heavier" packets aside, to go through later, when they get in the mood.

I noticed there seems to be two types of clerks:

1) Expedient and Efficient -- how many cases can be completed in one day.

2) Self Appointed Gate Keeper -- Picks out the most difficult case, and spends the whole day hand walking it around the office so show everybody else what he/she thinks of the applicant.

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

I sent 16 pages total. Cover page, I-751 form, copy of Green Card, Letter from Bank, 3 Car Titles, 2 Insurance policies, Credit Cards, AAA cards, and 4 pages of 3 photos each.

I did not try to make the I.O.'s life a living hell by choking them in bullsh*t so that they would put my file down and wait for another schmack to deal with it, eventually. My objective was it to make it easy to approve my petition fast and without having to dig through unnecessary #######. Worked quickly and like a charm.

But I guess everyone his own, right?

[Dan T 8]

I sent 16 pages total. Cover page, I-751 form, copy of Green Card, Letter from Bank, 3 Car Titles, 2 Insurance policies, Credit Cards, AAA cards, and 4 pages of 3 photos each.

I did not try to make the I.O.'s life a living hell by choking them in bullsh*t so that they would put my file down and wait for another schmack to deal with it, eventually. My objective was it to make it easy to approve my petition fast and without having to dig through unnecessary #######. Worked quickly and like a charm.

But I guess everyone his own, right?

In all honesty I did not purposely set out to swamp the poor bastards either, the pile of paperwork just kind of grew exponentially on its own as a function of the stress that is inevitable when someone like me who has zero faith in government agencies is forced to deal with such a bloated non-sensical beaurocracy. It wasnt until I saw the sheer volume of paperwork ammmassed in all its non-eco-friendly glory that I started to have malicious intent towards a bunch of people that couldnt sell condoms at an abortion clinic.

[second stage 14]

You have exhaustive list but am going to pick on some that's considered optional.

We sent over 30 photos, btw. We sent in photocopies of every single page of both of our passports. A lease agreement for every year that I lived in this appartment and the years we've spent here together, 5 total. Joint car insurence, a notice of my company droping its insurence plan that we were both benificiaries of, 7 affidavits, tax returns from 2006 to 2009 including business taxes for the LLC that my wife and I formed in 2008, our business formation documents, copies of her thyroid medication proving that she has a condition that makes conception a very expensive endeavor, and Im sure I've missed a few things. We can't afford kids or a mortgage, I know that doesnt stop a lot of people from burdoning society with their mistakes but we actually have a conscience. I am disgusted with the entire process, both for its bloat, and for its expense. If my wife could have simply hopped a fence over our Southern boarder instead of paying through the nose and waste so much time on this useless paperwork just because she comes from a civilized modern country(Ireland) I may have considered that, but oh yeah I forgot I do have a conscience.

photos = not needed or maybe a couple. 30 is overkill

passport copies = not needed

affidavits = 2 is enough, 7 is overkill

If your wife jumped the border then she wouldn't be able to work legally, can't drive, apply for a mortgage or even have kids(since your conscious doesn't allow to use welfare or public money and paying out of pocket for delivery at a hospital can run into $50K)

[Kathryn41 3,205]

In all honesty I did not purposely set out to swamp the poor bastards either, the pile of paperwork just kind of grew exponentially on its own as a function of the stress that is inevitable when someone like me who has zero faith in government agencies is forced to deal with such a bloated non-sensical beaurocracy. It wasnt until I saw the sheer volume of paperwork ammmassed in all its non-eco-friendly glory that I started to have malicious intent towards a bunch of people that couldnt sell condoms at an abortion clinic.

I have to laugh at this! If you swamped them, we totally submerged them. My package was over 2 1/2 pounds of paperwork! In our 'defense', however, we had been married nearly 4 years by the time we got to the I-751 - and none of the delays in the process were ours - it was all their's. It took nearly 2 years to get the AOS approved - and it was approved 3 weeks prior to our 2nd anniversary when we would have received the 10 year card instead of going through ROC - all this after a 9 month wait for the K-1. So because of those '3 weeks' I figured if they wanted proof - I would give them proof. I documented each of those 4 years very well and did not feel the slight bit guilty. They made me wait all of those years and still required proof that our marriage was valid and not for immigration purposes, so, I didn't want to leave any potential doubt in their minds! If they had been more effective and timely throughout the rest of our process then they would have saved themselves from having to review so much evidence - but they didn't, so evidence they got! Even so, it took a year to get approval (the average for VSC at the time was 12 to 15 months). I had a lot of satisfaction during my naturalization interview seeing my file on the IO's desk - it took two big folders! I said 'It's a big file" and without looking up, the IO said almost in a voice of awe 'it's huge'. Yep - they earned their paycheque that day ! :D

Edited March 17, 2010 by Kathryn41

[Dan T 8]

You have exhaustive list but am going to pick on some that's considered optional.

photos = not needed or maybe a couple. 30 is overkill

passport copies = not needed

affidavits = 2 is enough, 7 is overkill

If your wife jumped the border then she wouldn't be able to work legally, can't drive, apply for a mortgage or even have kids(since your conscious doesn't allow to use welfare or public money and paying out of pocket for delivery at a hospital can run into $50K)

Some states do allow these services for people not in the country legally because they deem illegal alien issues to be the sole domain of ICE and see no reason for state or local resources to be diverted to a task for the federal government. Plus didnt you know that forcing people to go through a legal process just to get a job or live here is rascist? You clearly don't follow American politics very closely, and I clearly follow it too much for my own good so take no offense from this over zealot nut.

[Tunisia216 2]

We did the same for fear it "wouldn't be enough" and it was a very heavy/large package.

I just can not wait until this is over and I can throw away a utility bill after I pay it without that constant feeling of worry that I may need this later to prove our existence.

[Udella&Wiz 325]

I don't see why everyone is so hell bent on sending huge packages that just cause the person working on your case to spend twice as much time on it. We sent something similar to Just Bob. Good supporting documents that show that we live at the same address,happily married, some tax transcrits and the like. A few photos (probably less then 10...printed by us, honestly photos don't mean that much....anyone can photoshop these days )

You do not need to send every phone bill you've ever had together (all 15 pages each)...a 'reasonable' selection throughout the last 2 year span is good, same for other bills.

Then there are the people who wonder if they should have 2 punch holes at the top 3 down the side...cripes people....why not send them a professionally bound book, I mean REALLY!

OK...rant done. People take themselves far too seriously during this process. Each step along the way I have sent what was asked for, didn't get RFE's and my ROC was recently approved withut the blink of an eye.

[Tunisia216 2]

I'm one of those people that sent the professional bound book. My husband actually asked me if I was considering sending it off to a publishing house when I was done.

I do not trust them because of previous experiences, however I agree I probably sent far too much information and it was more to make me sleep better at night than to assist them with our case.

In my defense it was categorically organized, labeled, indexed, and accompanied with tables of contents so they shouldn't have any issue thumbing to whatever they'd like to see.

I'm planning on a huge bonfire when he has citizenship and I know where I can get kindling.

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

ROC is all about confirming that the couple is still married and cohabiting after almost 2 years. In most cases this can be done with very little documentation, and then there might be cases where it takes a bit more. Certainly, there is such a thing as too little and too much documentation. So for anybody not sure, it's fine to add a bit more. But sending a huge package has, in my opinion, two disadvantages:

1) It takes longer to process

2) It p*sses the I.O. off

I tell you this in all seriousness. If I were working at USCIS and somebody sent me a huge package, say a folder that is an inch thick, I would put it to the bottom of the file as long as I can, just to show them that I don't like to be bullsh*tted by somebody who thinks they can try to make my work as hard as possible, just because they feel like retaliating for their waiting time at the fiance stage.

Have too much time to collect #######? Fine, then I hope you don't mind waiting until I feel like working my way through your huge pile of meaningless paperwork.

Keep in mind, the I.O. is the person in charge here; wouldn't it make sense to make their life as easy as possible? Wouldn't you want them to grab YOUR file, look at it, read the cover letter so that they know who you are, then browse through a few pages that show them that you guys pay your taxes together, live at the same place, bank at the same bank, and celebrated the holidays together?

Make the I.O. smile, nod, and approve you quickly and easily without making it difficult or unpleasant to them.

Hey, but that's just me.

[second stage 14]

Some states do allow these services for people not in the country legally because they deem illegal alien issues to be the sole domain of ICE and see no reason for state or local resources to be diverted to a task for the federal government. Plus didnt you know that forcing people to go through a legal process just to get a job or live here is rascist? You clearly don't follow American politics very closely, and I clearly follow it too much for my own good so take no offense from this over zealot nut.

Dan,

offense none taken.

Looks like you are eager to follow American politics rather than American law..we need compliance rather than complaints.

You still have a choice. you don't have to file for ROC.

Everyone at VJ wants to help each other, you can vent but don't go over-board.

[Udella&Wiz 325]

you made me laugh anyway Tunisia...I know we all worry if we've sent what they need.

When this is all done, can we really just burn everything or do we have to keep everything forever? I've often wondered about that.

I'm one of those people that sent the professional bound book. My husband actually asked me if I was considering sending it off to a publishing house when I was done.

I do not trust them because of previous experiences, however I agree I probably sent far too much information and it was more to make me sleep better at night than to assist them with our case.

In my defense it was categorically organized, labeled, indexed, and accompanied with tables of contents so they shouldn't have any issue thumbing to whatever they'd like to see.

I'm planning on a huge bonfire when he has citizenship and I know where I can get kindling.

[Dan T 8]

Dan,

offense none taken.

Looks like you are eager to follow American politics rather than American law..we need compliance rather than complaints.

You still have a choice. you don't have to file for ROC.

Everyone at VJ wants to help each other, you can vent but don't go over-board.

The sad reality is that the bloatedness and expense of this process is born of politics, political correctness, and posturing and not of common sense and certainly not of keeping America safe. I wish I had found this website prior to filing for my ROC. The people here are all wonderful and give very useful information, however, the biggest service this website serves, in my particular case, is connecting me with people who can relate to the special kind of stress that is generated when you have to deal with a government agency that has the power to destroy your life and shows no signs of even wanting, or pretending, to function effeciently, effectively, or intelligently. I've heard too many horror stories of couples that legitimately married for love that have been denied marriage based immigration and broken up by deportation because they didnt dot every i and cross every t within the standards of a cranky incompetant official. The fact that there is even a law specialty in the field of immigration offends my sensibilities. It seems to me that the system is purposely set up to make is easier for people to ignore the law, and very difficult for people to follow. It's as if the powers that be secretly want to foster a class of citizen that is unable to take full advantage of things like minimum wage, and workers comp. I do not pretend to know their motivations but as long as there are people on this website who are willing to respond to my angst I will continue to post, I do not think I have gone anywhere near overboard. Still your point is well made, and I have no disagreement with anything you've said, so like everyone else that I have interacted with here I thank you for your words of wisdom. Please understand that my anger is directed at uscis and not at you.