Filing I-751 while studying abroad

[Lenny Pumpskin 0]

Here's the problem: My wife's greencard is expiring in May of this year, so we're gathering our materials to remove her conditional status. The problem is in September of last year she went back to her home country (Germany) to study abroad in a two year program. So for the last five months she's technically been living in Germany while I've been living here in the US. I've been out to visit her and I am planning to move to Germany with her later this year. After her program is complete (in 2011), we will move back to the US together. We never got a re-entry permit before she left, because we knew it would become invalid once we applied to have her conditional status removed, and she had no plans to visit in the interim. We're filling out the I-751 and we're not sure what to put down for her residence. All of her stuff is still here, and I'm here, so she still has a home in the US, but it asks for all addresses she's lived at during her conditional status and technically one of those would be in Germany.

I went to see a USCIS official today and he suggested we file everything as if she never left. He essentially said to not give them any more than they ask for, and that our situation doesn't look so good on paper, so things could get complicated. He told me to file the paperwork and hope it goes through with no questions. Once it does, we should then apply for a Re-Entry permit. If questions are raised, he said, then we can deal with them as they come. I want to trust him, but we're uncomfortable about "lying" (well, more like excluding the German address) on our I-751. We've come so far and been completely honest up till now, we'd hate to see it all ruined because of some bad advice. We're hoping some feedback from the forum can give us some guidance.

Cliff notes: My wife is filing her I-751 to remove her conditional status, but for the last five months she's been studying abroad while I've stayed in US. How should we handle this when filling out the form?

[john_and_marlene 162]

Cliff notes: My wife is filing her I-751 to remove her conditional status, but for the last five months she's been studying abroad while I've stayed in US. How should we handle this when filling out the form?

Cliff notes response: File for IR-1 when she is ready to reside in the US

[Lenny Pumpskin 0]

Cliff notes response: File for IR-1 when she is ready to reside in the US

So your advice is to abandon the current greencard application and reapply when her academics are complete?

[john_and_marlene 162]

So your advice is to abandon the current greencard application and reapply when her academics are complete?

Yes

[Lenny Pumpskin 0]

Yes

This doesn't seem like very good advice. I appreciate the input and hope you don't take offense, but your response is too brief to be helpful. We admit, this is an unusual situation but I doubt this is the first time this has happened. You need to provide some reasoning behind your statement for it to be taken seriously.

[john_and_marlene 162]

I stand by my advice. You are trying to maintain resident status for someone who is not residing in the U.S. and will not be for some time to come. It should be no problem to file for IR-1 at a time appropriate for her to return at the end of her schooling. If you continue with the removal of conditions there are a couple of problems. First, is she ready to jump on a plane on short notice to come back to the U.S. to complete a biometrics appointment? -- it will be required. Second, you will need to be honest about the fact that you are not living together in order not to commit misrepresentation for the removal of conditions -- a situation that may very likely cause a denial even after going to the expense of returning to do the biometrics.

My advice was to reapply for residence when she is ready to be a resident. How is that bad advice? If you don't like my answer, I guess you could go with one of the other nonexistent responses to your post in the past 14 hours.

Edited February 5, 2010 by john_and_marlene

[JERIII 8]

I stand by my advice. You are trying to maintain resident status for someone who is not residing in the U.S. and will not be for some time to come. It should be no problem to file for IR-1 at a time appropriate for her to return at the end of her schooling. If you continue with the removal of conditions there are a couple of problems. First, is she ready to jump on a plane on short notice to come back to the U.S. to complete a biometrics appointment? -- it will be required. Second, you will need to be honest about the fact that you are not living together in order not to commit misrepresentation for the removal of conditions -- a situation that may very likely cause a denial even after going to the expense of returning to do the biometrics.

My advice was to reapply for residence when she is ready to be a resident. How is that bad advice? If you don't like my answer, I guess you could go with one of the other nonexistent responses to your post in the past 14 hours.

I think you should talk with a lawyer.

She is a resident.

Maintaining permanent residence does not require physical presence, and being a student is a common reason for being away from "home" for a long period of time. It's also a plausible reason for not living together - which is also permitted in temporary situations - for example, when work forces couples apart.

If you do file for removal of conditions, I would list the address in Germany, and include an explanation. Do not lie.

For me, the trickiest part of this is that you are moving to Germany, and that's why I would see a lawyer. If you were not, I think it is clear that she is temporarily away from her home in the United States. But even if you do move to Germany, it may be possible to maintain her status - if, for example, you own a house to which you are returning.

With regard to filing an IR-1 later, no petition is ever "no problem." Keeping her green card, if possible, is much better than having to get it back later.

[john_and_marlene 162]

I think you should talk with a lawyer.

She is a resident.

Maintaining permanent residence does not require physical presence, and being a student is a common reason for being away from "home" for a long period of time. It's also a plausible reason for not living together - which is also permitted in temporary situations - for example, when work forces couples apart.

If you do file for removal of conditions, I would list the address in Germany, and include an explanation. Do not lie.

For me, the trickiest part of this is that you are moving to Germany, and that's why I would see a lawyer. If you were not, I think it is clear that she is temporarily away from her home in the United States. But even if you do move to Germany, it may be possible to maintain her status - if, for example, you own a house to which you are returning.

With regard to filing an IR-1 later, no petition is ever "no problem." Keeping her green card, if possible, is much better than having to get it back later.

What I am saying is that it would be less expensive and easier to just reapply when the time is right. Why struggle to maintain residence under these circumstances? She doesn't plan to return until her schooling is complete. I would think that filing for IR-1 before she's ready to return would be far less expensive than paying the fees for ROC and a return flight to the US just for the biometrics and possibly another return flight if they decide to require an interview (which they might since they are not currently living together).

[rika60607 215]

Chances are, she would be glad to fly back to see her husband

She might time it with biometrics appt and interview if money is of concern

You can file for ROC, disclose information about her German address and write a letter to explain that she's temporarily away and going to school is the reason, that you are in touch and traveling to see each other. They might just approve you if evidence of financial ties and communication is strong. If not, the worst case is that they will want an interview. Once she gets the 10 year GC, she should get a re-entry permit, too.

She doesn't plan to return until her schooling is complete. I would think that filing for IR-1 before she's ready to return would be far less expensive than paying the fees for ROC and a return flight to the US just for the biometrics and possibly another return flight if they decide to require an interview (which they might since they are not currently living together).

Oh, and bring her back to the US before she's gone for 6 months, or her clock to the US citizenship will stop. That is if you care. If not, bring her back before 1 year of absence, or she will lose her GC anyway.

Edited February 5, 2010 by rika60607

[payxibka 10,045]

I think you should talk with a lawyer.

She is a resident.

Maintaining permanent residence does not require physical presence, and being a student is a common reason for being away from "home" for a long period of time. It's also a plausible reason for not living together - which is also permitted in temporary situations - for example, when work forces couples apart.

If you do file for removal of conditions, I would list the address in Germany, and include an explanation. Do not lie.

For me, the trickiest part of this is that you are moving to Germany, and that's why I would see a lawyer. If you were not, I think it is clear that she is temporarily away from her home in the United States. But even if you do move to Germany, it may be possible to maintain her status - if, for example, you own a house to which you are returning.

With regard to filing an IR-1 later, no petition is ever "no problem." Keeping her green card, if possible, is much better than having to get it back later.

trickiest part of the I-751 is the biometrics appointment (assuming the temp absence reason is accepted)... the only exception to the biometrics appointment is if you are abroad on Military or Government orders which need to be documented at the time of filing, but is not applicable here.

the OP's indication to move to Germany is in the future has nothing to do with this current filing.

maintaining permanent residency is a total seperate issue from the I-751, and can trip up anyone at anytime, whether or not you are a 2yr card holder or a 10 yr card holder

Edited February 5, 2010 by payxibka

[rika60607 215]

What's so tricky about it?

You will know about your biometrics appt at least 2 weeks ahead. Hop on the plane and come visit the husband

If timing is bad, it is possible to reschedule the biometrics appt. It is also possible to attempt a walk-in for biometrics prior to the scheduled time.

trickiest part of the I-751 is the biometrics appointment (assuming the temp absence reason is accepted)...

[payxibka 10,045]

What's so tricky about it?

You will know about your biometrics appt at least 2 weeks ahead. Hop on the plane and come visit the husband

If timing is bad, it is possible to reschedule the biometrics appt. It is also possible to attempt a walk-in for biometrics prior to the scheduled time.

sometimes easier said than done....but is doable

[Brother Hesekiel 2,236]

The I-751 is for people who reside in the US permanently. Your wife doesn't reside in the US, she resides in Germany, has been for a while, and--according to your statement--will continue to do so.

The "conditional" Green Card is based on a (happily) married couple cohabiting. You and your wife don't do that, you haven't done that in quite some time, and--and according to your statement--will continue to live apart in the next future.

Thus, there's no basis to successfully file an ROC. Sure I believe you that your wife is living abroad because she is studying there, but, then again, I'm having a hard time believing that a happily married wife wouldn't want to live and study in the country her lawfully wedded husband lives in. Hence, playing devil's advocate, I call this a bluff, and I assume a halfway smart Immigration Officer will do the same.

Can you trick the system? Perhaps you can. Can you run a red light without being caught? Perhaps you can. Can you shoot somebody without being caught? Perhaps you can.

But would you want to assume the risk of submitting a fraudulent application when it comes to the United States Government? Only you can answer that.

Here's my personal advice: take it or dismiss it.

The I-751 costs $545 and the result, once approved, is a 10-year Green Card that can be renewed indefinitely without fuss. The disadvantage in your wife's case is that she has to add the cost of a round trip ticket, about $800, to the tap, as she needs to attend the biometrics appointment and, if God will, another ticket for an interview a few weeks later. You do the math.

A newly filed IR-1 costs less than the I-751 and one round trip ticket combined. The result is exactly the same: a 10-year Green Card that can be renewed indefinitely without fuss. It's cheaper, and, since she doesn't have to travel to the US for the biometrics appointment and has been an LPR already, a pure formality.

I would choose the latter approach.

Edited February 6, 2010 by Just Bob

[john_and_marlene 162]

The I-751 is for people who reside in the US permanently. Your wife doesn't reside in the US, she resides in Germany, has been for a while, and--according to your statement--will continue to do so.

The "conditional" Green Card is based on a (happily) married couple cohabiting. You and your wife don't do that, you haven't done that in quite some time, and--and according to your statement--will continue to live apart in the next future.

Thus, there's no basis to successfully file an ROC. Sure I believe you that your wife is living abroad because she is studying there, but, then again, I'm having a hard time believing that a happily married wife wouldn't want to live and study in the country her lawfully wedded husband lives in. Hence, playing devil's advocate, I call this a bluff, and I assume a halfway smart Immigration Officer will do the same.

Can you trick the system? Perhaps you can. Can you run a red light without being caught? Perhaps you can. Can you shoot somebody without being caught? Perhaps you can.

But would you want to assume the risk of submitting a fraudulent application when it comes to the United States Government? Only you can answer that.

Here's my personal advice: take it or dismiss it.

The I-751 costs $545 and the result, once approved, is a 10-year Green Card that can be renewed indefinitely without fuss. The disadvantage in your wife's case is that she has to add the cost of a round trip ticket, about $800, to the tap, as she needs to attend the biometrics appointment and, if God will, another ticket for an interview a few weeks later. You do the math.

A newly filed IR-1 costs less than the I-751 and one round trip ticket combined. The result is exactly the same: a 10-year Green Card that can be renewed indefinitely without fuss. It's cheaper, and, since she doesn't have to travel to the US for the biometrics appointment and has been an LPR already, a pure formality.

I would choose the latter approach.

I don't think the OP wants to hear advice based on facts and reality. Such advice appears to be dismissed.

[Lenny Pumpskin 0]

The I-751 is for people who reside in the US permanently. Your wife doesn't reside in the US, she resides in Germany, has been for a while, and--according to your statement--will continue to do so.

The "conditional" Green Card is based on a (happily) married couple cohabiting. You and your wife don't do that, you haven't done that in quite some time, and--and according to your statement--will continue to live apart in the next future.

I stated above that I'm moving to Germany in the next three months to live with her for the duration of her studies.

Thus, there's no basis to successfully file an ROC. Sure I believe you that your wife is living abroad because she is studying there, but, then again, I'm having a hard time believing that a happily married wife wouldn't want to live and study in the country her lawfully wedded husband lives in. Hence, playing devil's advocate, I call this a bluff, and I assume a halfway smart Immigration Officer will do the same.

Again, see above.

Can you trick the system? Perhaps you can. Can you run a red light without being caught? Perhaps you can. Can you shoot somebody without being caught? Perhaps you can. But would you want to assume the risk of submitting a fraudulent application when it comes to the United States Government? Only you can answer that.

You may be playing devil's advocate, but for you to suggest our marriage is anything but legitimate and put our attempt to "trick" the system on par with shooting someone is insulting. We sacrificed a lot to make a long distance relationship work for 6.5 years before we were married. We jumped through all the same hoops you did to get my wife over here. We've worked hard to be together and it's all based on the fact that we're in love with each other, as I'm sure the is case with you and your spouse (and john_and_marlene). We don't deserve to be treated like an illegal Green Card couple. I told you all the facts (some of which you missed); please don't inject your own. The advice I received to "lie" on the application was from a USCIS officer. We didn't feel comfortable with it, and that's why we're here now.

Here's my personal advice: take it or dismiss it.

The I-751 costs $545 and the result, once approved, is a 10-year Green Card that can be renewed indefinitely without fuss. The disadvantage in your wife's case is that she has to add the cost of a round trip ticket, about $800, to the tap, as she needs to attend the biometrics appointment and, if God will, another ticket for an interview a few weeks later. You do the math.

A newly filed IR-1 costs less than the I-751 and one round trip ticket combined. The result is exactly the same: a 10-year Green Card that can be renewed indefinitely without fuss. It's cheaper, and, since she doesn't have to travel to the US for the biometrics appointment and has been an LPR already, a pure formality.

I would choose the latter approach.

This may be an avenue worth pursuing. We're thinking the next best step is to book an hour with an Immigration Attorney. With three sources of information, we should be able to then make a more informed decision. I appreciate your response.

I don't think the OP wants to hear advice based on facts and reality. Such advice appears to be dismissed.

No advice was ever dismissed. I simply asked you to back up your radical suggestion with something other than a one word answer. This response is not constructive and bears no relationship to my replies in this thread.

Edited February 8, 2010 by Lenny Pumpskin