Health bills fail to block illegals from coverage

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants could receive health care coverage from their employers under the bills winding their way through Congress, despite President Obama's explicit pledge that illegal immigrants would not benefit.

The House bill mandates, and the Senate bill strongly encourages, businesses to extend health care coverage to all employees. But the bills do not have exemptions to screen out illegal immigrants, who usually obtain jobs by using false identities and are indistinguishable from legal workers.

A rough estimate by the Center for Immigration Studies suggests that the practical effect of the mandates would be that about 1 million illegal immigrants could obtain health insurance coverage through their employers.

Democrats who wrote the House bill said that employer coverage for illegal immigrants is not intentional, but rather the outcome of people breaking the law.

"It's possible an employee could deceive an employer with a fraudulent document, just as under current law, to gain employment, just as it's possible for all sorts of criminal activity to occur, and why we have law enforcement," said Nadeam Elshami, a spokesman for House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, California Democrat, who wrote the final House bill.

Republicans said that loopholes in the bill could allow coverage to just about any illegal immigrant who wants to cheat the system.

"This is a complete cover-all-the-gaps federal health insurance for illegals, whether it be under Medicaid, the refundable tax credit or whether it be under their employers who would not be able to verify their employers unless we fix E-Verify," said Rep. Steve King of Iowa, the top Republican on the House Judiciary Committee's immigration subcommittee.

How to deal with immigrants, both legal and illegal, remains one of the thorniest issues in the health care debate. In his address to a joint session of Congress in September, Mr. Obama specifically challenged Republicans who said his plans would extend coverage to illegal immigrants.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/n...-from-coverage/

[Danno 1,228]

I hope no one is silly enough to actually believe any government run plan would NOT include Illegals.

I mean think about it.... millions and millions of people showing up at the hospital with no provision to give away free services to people in need? Come on now..

"sorry Mr Sanchez we know your arm is broken but we have no way to treat you".

Even if theLegislators were forced..... to put it in black-n-white, to prevent them from taking part in this huge give-away, as soon at "Comprehensive immigration reform"

gets the nod, they will be "in" (Thats whey they call it "comprehensive".)

So danno's predictions; 1.There is too much money being offered for A gov't option HC reform package not to pass. 2. Illegals will end up being covered.... because

"They are Gods Children" (As John McCain said on his way to defeat).

Edited December 1, 2009 by Danno

[alienlovechild 75]

Hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants could receive health care coverage from their employers under the bills winding their way through Congress, despite President Obama's explicit pledge that illegal immigrants would not benefit.

The House bill mandates, and the Senate bill strongly encourages, businesses to extend health care coverage to all employees. But the bills do not have exemptions to screen out illegal immigrants, who usually obtain jobs by using false identities and are indistinguishable from legal workers.

A rough estimate by the Center for Immigration Studies suggests that the practical effect of the mandates would be that about 1 million illegal immigrants could obtain health insurance coverage through their employers.

Democrats who wrote the House bill said that employer coverage for illegal immigrants is not intentional, but rather the outcome of people breaking the law.

What Obama meant was that the bills didn't explicitly provide coverage for illegal immigrants so he didn't lie outright on that but there will be de facto coverage nonetheless.

[Heracles 417]

If you guys are correct and the government plan does shiftily include illegals, America will end up bankrupt.

I do hope dems are not dumb enough to try sneak it in. You cannot go from zero coverage to covering the world.

Edited December 1, 2009 by Booyah!

[Danno 1,228]

If you guys are correct and the government plan does shiftily include illegals, America will end up bankrupt.

I do hope dems are not dumb enough to try sneak it in. You cannot go from zero coverage to covering the world.

Heck it could be the next few waves of Boarder-Jumpers are not coming to hang drywall or cut grass but rather for getting Dialysis and Kemo.

[slim 1,534]

If you guys are correct and the government plan does shiftily include illegals, America will end up bankrupt.

I do hope dems are not dumb enough to try sneak it in. You cannot go from zero coverage to covering the world.

We're going to end up bankrupt anyway. Ever heard of Social Security and/or Medicare? Funny that those two programs are actually being used to support the call for health care reform!

[Nagishkaw 510]

Democrats who wrote the House bill said that employer coverage for illegal immigrants is not intentional, but rather the outcome of people breaking the law.

:wacko:

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

As long as there's no strict enforcement on employers who hire illegal immigrants, I'd much rather have those employers pay for the illegal immigrant's health care coverage. Otherwise, the illegals only end up in county clinics and the ER at the expense of the taxpayer. Should there be stronger enforcement on employers in regards to the hiring of illegal immigrants? Absolutely. Is the health care reform bill the way to do that? I don't think so. Does the proposed health care reform offer subsidies for health care coverage to illigal immigrants? No, it does not.

[Dan J 277]

Hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants could receive health care coverage from their employers under the bills winding their way through Congress, despite President Obama's explicit pledge that illegal immigrants would not benefit.

The House bill mandates, and the Senate bill strongly encourages, businesses to extend health care coverage to all employees. But the bills do not have exemptions to screen out illegal immigrants, who usually obtain jobs by using false identities and are indistinguishable from legal workers.

A rough estimate by the Center for Immigration Studies suggests that the practical effect of the mandates would be that about 1 million illegal immigrants could obtain health insurance coverage through their employers.

Democrats who wrote the House bill said that employer coverage for illegal immigrants is not intentional, but rather the outcome of people breaking the law.

"It's possible an employee could deceive an employer with a fraudulent document, just as under current law, to gain employment, just as it's possible for all sorts of criminal activity to occur, and why we have law enforcement," said Nadeam Elshami, a spokesman for House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, California Democrat, who wrote the final House bill.

Republicans said that loopholes in the bill could allow coverage to just about any illegal immigrant who wants to cheat the system.

"This is a complete cover-all-the-gaps federal health insurance for illegals, whether it be under Medicaid, the refundable tax credit or whether it be under their employers who would not be able to verify their employers unless we fix E-Verify," said Rep. Steve King of Iowa, the top Republican on the House Judiciary Committee's immigration subcommittee.

How to deal with immigrants, both legal and illegal, remains one of the thorniest issues in the health care debate. In his address to a joint session of Congress in September, Mr. Obama specifically challenged Republicans who said his plans would extend coverage to illegal immigrants.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/n...-from-coverage/

Lets see here:

If illegal aliens can get no coverage whatsoever, then the only option for care is uncompensated care provided by hospitals and clinics. In other words, you will pay for it anyway, in the form of higher prices.

The other option is let those who can get coverage from employers, but do allow then to qualify for tax payer funded subsidies. So they would be directly or indirectly paying the entire premium, by themselves or with employer help.

What is there to be enraged about here?

[*JG* 2]

Yet, I have to wait 10 additional years to get a mammogram!

BS!!!!

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Yet, I have to wait 10 additional years to get a mammogram!

BS!!!!

Says who?

Hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants could receive health care coverage from their employers under the bills winding their way through Congress, despite President Obama's explicit pledge that illegal immigrants would not benefit.

The House bill mandates, and the Senate bill strongly encourages, businesses to extend health care coverage to all employees. But the bills do not have exemptions to screen out illegal immigrants, who usually obtain jobs by using false identities and are indistinguishable from legal workers.

A rough estimate by the Center for Immigration Studies suggests that the practical effect of the mandates would be that about 1 million illegal immigrants could obtain health insurance coverage through their employers.

Democrats who wrote the House bill said that employer coverage for illegal immigrants is not intentional, but rather the outcome of people breaking the law.

"It's possible an employee could deceive an employer with a fraudulent document, just as under current law, to gain employment, just as it's possible for all sorts of criminal activity to occur, and why we have law enforcement," said Nadeam Elshami, a spokesman for House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, California Democrat, who wrote the final House bill.

Republicans said that loopholes in the bill could allow coverage to just about any illegal immigrant who wants to cheat the system.

"This is a complete cover-all-the-gaps federal health insurance for illegals, whether it be under Medicaid, the refundable tax credit or whether it be under their employers who would not be able to verify their employers unless we fix E-Verify," said Rep. Steve King of Iowa, the top Republican on the House Judiciary Committee's immigration subcommittee.

How to deal with immigrants, both legal and illegal, remains one of the thorniest issues in the health care debate. In his address to a joint session of Congress in September, Mr. Obama specifically challenged Republicans who said his plans would extend coverage to illegal immigrants.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/n...-from-coverage/

Lets see here:

If illegal aliens can get no coverage whatsoever, then the only option for care is uncompensated care provided by hospitals and clinics. In other words, you will pay for it anyway, in the form of higher prices.

The other option is let those who can get coverage from employers, but do allow then to qualify for tax payer funded subsidies. So they would be directly or indirectly paying the entire premium, by themselves or with employer help.

What is there to be enraged about here?

Nothing. It's just another one of these

[Ban Hammer 14,703]

If you guys are correct and the government plan does shiftily include illegals, America will end up bankrupt.

I do hope dems are not dumb enough to try sneak it in. You cannot go from zero coverage to covering the world.

unfortunately, both dems and repubs will try to do that. they've all sold out like benedict arnold.

[Heracles 417]

Lets see here:

If illegal aliens can get no coverage whatsoever, then the only option for care is uncompensated care provided by hospitals and clinics. In other words, you will pay for it anyway, in the form of higher prices.

The other option is let those who can get coverage from employers, but do allow then to qualify for tax payer funded subsidies. So they would be directly or indirectly paying the entire premium, by themselves or with employer help.

What is there to be enraged about here?

Well you are assuming that they are being paid legitimately. I am sure this tax on employers will be based on the employee’s paycheck. Or are we going to use the tired 'illegal aliens pay tax too' rhetoric? How much tax does an American landscaper pay? After all, they're not on Aussie wages.

With attitudes like these it's no wonder why Repubs clearly don't trust Dems with money. In one breath you guys go on about 'not doing enough for the poor', then in the other you want to help the poor of the world. Unfortunately, in the real world, it simply doesn't work that way. You have to choose between the two. Are you going to assist the poor in your country or you are going to allocate these same scarce resources to assist the poor of South America?

I think the Repubs are right on the money here. There is probably going to be a Supreme Court ruling, as there was with education, ruling you cannot check the status of patients. This is America after all, a country where the courts rather than the will of the people runs the show. The equivalent education example is scary. Millions of additional students from illegal aliens now compete with American citizens for the same finite (limited) school budget. Therefore, instead of hiring an extra teacher to assist disadvantaged Americans, a school needs to hire their 6th ESOL teacher. Instead of having smaller class sizes, so more quality time is available per student, class sizes have actually increased in order to fund ESOL teachers.

Before you assume this guy is just some cold-hearted conservative, you are wrong. I feel for the poor illegal aliens, however, I do realize that no country has a bottomless pit of money. You have to draw the line somewhere, otherwise you end up actually impeding rather than assisting others. After all, it's the only way Australia has been able to successfully assist their poor.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Lets see here:

If illegal aliens can get no coverage whatsoever, then the only option for care is uncompensated care provided by hospitals and clinics. In other words, you will pay for it anyway, in the form of higher prices.

The other option is let those who can get coverage from employers, but do allow then to qualify for tax payer funded subsidies. So they would be directly or indirectly paying the entire premium, by themselves or with employer help.

What is there to be enraged about here?

Well you are assuming that they are being paid legitimately.

Actually, I fail to see where that assumption was made. The point is that we pay for the health care of illigal immigrants today whenever they go to county facilities or the ER w/o paying for the services received. The cost of this care - inc ase of the ER the most expensive care to be had - is shouldered by those that carry insurance and by the taxpayer. If we can get even a part of those into employer sponsored coverage then that will lower the cost of their care to the rest of us. The health care reform bill specifically excludes taxpayer funded subsidies for illegal immigrants to purchase insurance policies on the market.

Again, when the point is made that illegal immigrants will be able to obtain employer sponsored health insurance as a result of the health care reform effort, it's a nonsense argument. They can do that today. Only they don't because their employers are not likely to shell out this benefit w/o having much of an incentive to do so. Hence, the rest of us, those that carry insurance and those that pay taxes, bear the burden of the health care they receive today.

Do we need to address the issue of employers hiring illegal immigrants? Absolutely. Is the health care reform bill the way to that? Absolutely not.

[nowhereman 1]

This topic has been covered before on VJ & it was proven quite definitively that President Obama did not lie about this issue. The health care bill specifically disallows coverage of illegal aliens, but since enforcement measures are spotty some will slip through the cracks. To say President Obama lied about this would be like saying cops "allow" crimes to be committed (since not all crimes are prevented). Very misleading & flawed "logic" by the OP.