The Rise of the Religious Left -- Why Christianity Isn't Just for Conservatives

[Ban Hammer 14,665]

Steven,

The Wright issue is a loser. Why the fuсk would you bring it up?

let him run with it, it should be entertaining to watch him.

[HAL 9000 96]

And even more telling how other, more consistent nutjobs get the slip.

[The_Dude 1,142]

Joe is right,

Stevologic 1, Dannologic -20.

It's sad when Joelogic makes Dannologic look attractive.

[Danno 1,228]

I know it was just an Opinion piece but she could have posted just a few "facts"... to back up this

story of hers.

The fact that she used REV Wright as the shining example, tells us

1. where she is coming from

2. how desperate she is to make her case

3. How mistaken she truly is as even the Racist REV wright has been around for a long long time... nothing new here.

I'll let you in on a secret...., religious liberals raise "non-believing" children.

So even if there were a sudden rush of Liberals to the Church house, it's an impotent future.

The author was pointing out the good things that the Rev. Wright has done. Although he has said some outrageous things, compared to what some of the most prominent preachers of the Right have said - he's mild, and yet you aren't upset with their outrageousness.

Here's just a few quotes that I'm sure you'll defend as not being outrageous.

From the Rev. Jerry Falwell (founder of the Moral Majority)

“AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals; it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals”

“If you're not a born-again Christian, you're a failure as a human being”

"I hope I live to see the day when, as in the early days of our country, we won't have any public schools. The churches will have taken them over again and Christians will be running them. What a happy day that will be!"

"Billy Graham is the chief servant of Satan in America."

......

Rev. Pat Robertson (former Republican presidential candidate)

"Well, I totally concur." –Pat Robertson to Jerry Falwell following the Sept. 11 attacks, after Falwell said, "I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way -- all of them who have tried to secularize America -- I point the finger in their face and say: "You helped this happen."

"Just like what Nazi Germany did to the Jews, so liberal America is now doing to the evangelical Christians. It's no different. It is the same thing. It is happening all over again. It is the Democratic Congress, the liberal-based media and the homosexuals who want to destroy the Christians. Wholesale abuse and discrimination and the worst bigotry directed toward any group in America today. More terrible than anything suffered by any minority in history."

...

There's plenty more....but I know that you find such outrageous statements more palatable coming from White Protestants.

Steve nice try at dodging the issue (The one you started this thread with).

The piece you posted when you opened up this conversation, has no logic and I used "it" to make my point.

You on the other hand post a bunch of irrelevant quotes which may or may never have even been made.... by people who have nothing to do with this topic........ so why dodge my points by throwing them out there?

Let me repeat my point.... Where is the evidence of a "rise" in the religious left"?

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Let me repeat my point.... Where is the evidence of a "rise" in the religious left"?

There are there. They are just not on TV asking for money. Well they are, but they are "Save the Children", or "Save the Animals". Being religious is being socially conscious, not just waiting for the rapture, or screwing teenage girls (or boys).

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I know it was just an Opinion piece but she could have posted just a few "facts"... to back up this

story of hers.

The fact that she used REV Wright as the shining example, tells us

1. where she is coming from

2. how desperate she is to make her case

3. How mistaken she truly is as even the Racist REV wright has been around for a long long time... nothing new here.

I'll let you in on a secret...., religious liberals raise "non-believing" children.

So even if there were a sudden rush of Liberals to the Church house, it's an impotent future.

The author was pointing out the good things that the Rev. Wright has done. Although he has said some outrageous things, compared to what some of the most prominent preachers of the Right have said - he's mild, and yet you aren't upset with their outrageousness.

Here's just a few quotes that I'm sure you'll defend as not being outrageous.

From the Rev. Jerry Falwell (founder of the Moral Majority)

"AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals; it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals"

"If you're not a born-again Christian, you're a failure as a human being"

"I hope I live to see the day when, as in the early days of our country, we won't have any public schools. The churches will have taken them over again and Christians will be running them. What a happy day that will be!"

"Billy Graham is the chief servant of Satan in America."

......

Rev. Pat Robertson (former Republican presidential candidate)

"Well, I totally concur." –Pat Robertson to Jerry Falwell following the Sept. 11 attacks, after Falwell said, "I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way -- all of them who have tried to secularize America -- I point the finger in their face and say: "You helped this happen."

"Just like what Nazi Germany did to the Jews, so liberal America is now doing to the evangelical Christians. It's no different. It is the same thing. It is happening all over again. It is the Democratic Congress, the liberal-based media and the homosexuals who want to destroy the Christians. Wholesale abuse and discrimination and the worst bigotry directed toward any group in America today. More terrible than anything suffered by any minority in history."

...

There's plenty more....but I know that you find such outrageous statements more palatable coming from White Protestants.

Steve nice try at dodging the issue (The one you started this thread with).

The piece you posted when you opened up this conversation, has no logic and I used "it" to make my point.

You on the other hand post a bunch of irrelevant quotes which may or may never have even been made.... by people who have nothing to do with this topic........ so why dodge my points by throwing them out there?

Let me repeat my point.... Where is the evidence of a "rise" in the religious left"?

Look in your neighborhood, Danno. They're probably your neighbors that you don't like to talk to.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Religious Liberals Gain New Visibility

The religious left is back.

Long overshadowed by the Christian right, religious liberals across a wide swath of denominations are engaged today in their most intensive bout of political organizing and alliance-building since the civil rights and anti-Vietnam War movements of the 1960s, according to scholars, politicians and clergy members.

In large part, the revival of the religious left is a reaction against conservatives' success in the 2004 elections in equating moral values with opposition to abortion and same-sex marriage.

Religious liberals say their faith compels them to emphasize such issues as poverty, affordable health care and global warming. Disillusionment with the war in Iraq and opposition to Bush administration policies on secret prisons and torture have also fueled the movement.

"The wind is changing. Folks -- not just leaders -- are fed up with what is being portrayed as Christian values," said the Rev. Tim Ahrens, senior minister of First Congregational Church of Columbus, Ohio, and a founder of We Believe Ohio, a statewide clergy group established to ensure that the religious right is "not the only one holding a megaphone" in the public square.

"As religious people we're offended by the idea that if you're not with the religious right, you're not moral, you're not religious," said Linda Gustitus, who attends Bethesda's River Road Unitarian Church and is a founder of the new Washington Region Religious Campaign Against Torture. "I mean there's a whole universe out there [with views] different from the religious right. . . . People closer to the middle of the political spectrum who are religious want their voices heard."

Recently, there has been an increase in books and Web sites by religious liberals, national and regional conferences, church-based discussion groups, and new faith-oriented political organizations. "Organizationally speaking, strategically speaking, the religious left is now in the strongest position it's been in since the Vietnam era," said Clemson University political scientist Laura R. Olson.

What is not clear, according to sociologists and pollsters, is whether the religious left is growing in size as well as activism. Its political impact, including its ability to influence voters and move a legislative agenda, has also yet to be determined.

"I do think the religious left has become more visible and assertive and is attempting to get more organized," said Allen D. Hertzke, a University of Oklahoma political science professor who follows religious movements. "But how big is it? The jury is still out on that."

"My gut tells me that all this foment [on the religious left] is bound to create more involvement in politics," he said. "I don't know whether there's going to be more of them numerically, but you don't need greater numbers to have a political impact; all you need is to be more active. You already see that in Ohio and some other states, where Christian conservatives no longer have a monopoly on faith in politics."

more...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...6051901813.html

[HAL 9000 96]

Joe is right,

Stevologic 1, Dannologic -20.

It's sad when Joelogic makes Dannologic look attractive.

Dunno... the older one is trying to make a comeback. Its like the Higlander thing... we'd love it if there could only be one... but sadly... such idiocy is infectious.

[zqt3344 21]

Steve where do you come up with this left wingnut drivel at my good friend! You are a hoot! AHHA

Oh Snap. Stevologic 1, Dannologic -10.

[Danno 1,228]

I know it was just an Opinion piece but she could have posted just a few "facts"... to back up this

story of hers.

The fact that she used REV Wright as the shining example, tells us

1. where she is coming from

2. how desperate she is to make her case

3. How mistaken she truly is as even the Racist REV wright has been around for a long long time... nothing new here.

I'll let you in on a secret...., religious liberals raise "non-believing" children.

So even if there were a sudden rush of Liberals to the Church house, it's an impotent future.

The author was pointing out the good things that the Rev. Wright has done. Although he has said some outrageous things, compared to what some of the most prominent preachers of the Right have said - he's mild, and yet you aren't upset with their outrageousness.

Here's just a few quotes that I'm sure you'll defend as not being outrageous.

From the Rev. Jerry Falwell (founder of the Moral Majority)

"AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals; it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals"

"If you're not a born-again Christian, you're a failure as a human being"

"I hope I live to see the day when, as in the early days of our country, we won't have any public schools. The churches will have taken them over again and Christians will be running them. What a happy day that will be!"

"Billy Graham is the chief servant of Satan in America."

......

Rev. Pat Robertson (former Republican presidential candidate)

"Well, I totally concur." –Pat Robertson to Jerry Falwell following the Sept. 11 attacks, after Falwell said, "I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way -- all of them who have tried to secularize America -- I point the finger in their face and say: "You helped this happen."

"Just like what Nazi Germany did to the Jews, so liberal America is now doing to the evangelical Christians. It's no different. It is the same thing. It is happening all over again. It is the Democratic Congress, the liberal-based media and the homosexuals who want to destroy the Christians. Wholesale abuse and discrimination and the worst bigotry directed toward any group in America today. More terrible than anything suffered by any minority in history."

...

There's plenty more....but I know that you find such outrageous statements more palatable coming from White Protestants.

Steve nice try at dodging the issue (The one you started this thread with).

The piece you posted when you opened up this conversation, has no logic and I used "it" to make my point.

You on the other hand post a bunch of irrelevant quotes which may or may never have even been made.... by people who have nothing to do with this topic........ so why dodge my points by throwing them out there?

Let me repeat my point.... Where is the evidence of a "rise" in the religious left"?

Look in your neighborhood, Danno. They're probably your neighbors that you don't like to talk to.

Steven, I never said "They weren't there".

I simply asked where is the evidence of "The rise of the religious left"?

I know of many liberal Churches around here even a few Homosexual ones but I fail to see any reason to think they are suddenly gaining in number or influence.

... and to be honest, neither you nor the article has posted one bit of reason why you believe it.

[The_Dude 1,142]

I know it was just an Opinion piece but she could have posted just a few "facts"... to back up this

story of hers.

The fact that she used REV Wright as the shining example, tells us

1. where she is coming from

2. how desperate she is to make her case

3. How mistaken she truly is as even the Racist REV wright has been around for a long long time... nothing new here.

I'll let you in on a secret...., religious liberals raise "non-believing" children.

So even if there were a sudden rush of Liberals to the Church house, it's an impotent future.

The author was pointing out the good things that the Rev. Wright has done. Although he has said some outrageous things, compared to what some of the most prominent preachers of the Right have said - he's mild, and yet you aren't upset with their outrageousness.

Here's just a few quotes that I'm sure you'll defend as not being outrageous.

From the Rev. Jerry Falwell (founder of the Moral Majority)

"AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals; it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals"

"If you're not a born-again Christian, you're a failure as a human being"

"I hope I live to see the day when, as in the early days of our country, we won't have any public schools. The churches will have taken them over again and Christians will be running them. What a happy day that will be!"

"Billy Graham is the chief servant of Satan in America."

......

Rev. Pat Robertson (former Republican presidential candidate)

"Well, I totally concur." –Pat Robertson to Jerry Falwell following the Sept. 11 attacks, after Falwell said, "I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way -- all of them who have tried to secularize America -- I point the finger in their face and say: "You helped this happen."

"Just like what Nazi Germany did to the Jews, so liberal America is now doing to the evangelical Christians. It's no different. It is the same thing. It is happening all over again. It is the Democratic Congress, the liberal-based media and the homosexuals who want to destroy the Christians. Wholesale abuse and discrimination and the worst bigotry directed toward any group in America today. More terrible than anything suffered by any minority in history."

...

There's plenty more....but I know that you find such outrageous statements more palatable coming from White Protestants.

Steve nice try at dodging the issue (The one you started this thread with).

The piece you posted when you opened up this conversation, has no logic and I used "it" to make my point.

You on the other hand post a bunch of irrelevant quotes which may or may never have even been made.... by people who have nothing to do with this topic........ so why dodge my points by throwing them out there?

Let me repeat my point.... Where is the evidence of a "rise" in the religious left"?

Look in your neighborhood, Danno. They're probably your neighbors that you don't like to talk to.

Steven, I never said "They weren't there".

I simply asked where is the evidence of "The rise of the religious left"?

I know of many liberal Churches around here even a few Homosexual ones but I fail to see any reason to think they are suddenly gaining in number or influence.

... and to be honest, neither you nor the article has posted one bit of reason why you believe it.

So nice to see you progress so much Danno. You've refrained from referring to homosexuals as "homos" or whatever other derogatory term you love using. Are you becoming more tolerant, or did someone receive a warning about bigoted language?

[Danno 1,228]

I know it was just an Opinion piece but she could have posted just a few "facts"... to back up this

story of hers.

The fact that she used REV Wright as the shining example, tells us

1. where she is coming from

2. how desperate she is to make her case

3. How mistaken she truly is as even the Racist REV wright has been around for a long long time... nothing new here.

I'll let you in on a secret...., religious liberals raise "non-believing" children.

So even if there were a sudden rush of Liberals to the Church house, it's an impotent future.

The author was pointing out the good things that the Rev. Wright has done. Although he has said some outrageous things, compared to what some of the most prominent preachers of the Right have said - he's mild, and yet you aren't upset with their outrageousness.

Here's just a few quotes that I'm sure you'll defend as not being outrageous.

From the Rev. Jerry Falwell (founder of the Moral Majority)

"AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals; it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals"

"If you're not a born-again Christian, you're a failure as a human being"

"I hope I live to see the day when, as in the early days of our country, we won't have any public schools. The churches will have taken them over again and Christians will be running them. What a happy day that will be!"

"Billy Graham is the chief servant of Satan in America."

......

Rev. Pat Robertson (former Republican presidential candidate)

"Well, I totally concur." –Pat Robertson to Jerry Falwell following the Sept. 11 attacks, after Falwell said, "I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way -- all of them who have tried to secularize America -- I point the finger in their face and say: "You helped this happen."

"Just like what Nazi Germany did to the Jews, so liberal America is now doing to the evangelical Christians. It's no different. It is the same thing. It is happening all over again. It is the Democratic Congress, the liberal-based media and the homosexuals who want to destroy the Christians. Wholesale abuse and discrimination and the worst bigotry directed toward any group in America today. More terrible than anything suffered by any minority in history."

...

There's plenty more....but I know that you find such outrageous statements more palatable coming from White Protestants.

Steve nice try at dodging the issue (The one you started this thread with).

The piece you posted when you opened up this conversation, has no logic and I used "it" to make my point.

You on the other hand post a bunch of irrelevant quotes which may or may never have even been made.... by people who have nothing to do with this topic........ so why dodge my points by throwing them out there?

Let me repeat my point.... Where is the evidence of a "rise" in the religious left"?

Look in your neighborhood, Danno. They're probably your neighbors that you don't like to talk to.

Steven, I never said "They weren't there".

I simply asked where is the evidence of "The rise of the religious left"?

I know of many liberal Churches around here even a few Homosexual ones but I fail to see any reason to think they are suddenly gaining in number or influence.

... and to be honest, neither you nor the article has posted one bit of reason why you believe it.

So nice to see you progress so much Danno. You've refrained from referring to homosexuals as "homos" or whatever other derogatory term you love using. Are you becoming more tolerant, or did someone receive a warning about bigoted language?

Awwe, don't give me too much credit, sometimes I even slip and call'em Gays.

But no matter how you slice it.... a Rose is still a rose by any other name.

[HAL 9000 96]

Yep. A bent tree trunk is still a bent tree trunk- so stop trying to straighten it unless you like touching it.