10 characteristics of conspiracy theorists

[alienlovechild 75]

First of all I joined the Army way before Bush became President, so to suggest that I resign my commission because of one bad President is beyond ridiculous.

So you carried out policies for 8 years you personally disagreed with and didn't have the nerve to walk? What, needed the money, the awards, the promotion, the benefits or just like MREs? I wasn't an Army lifer but I knew a lot of soldiers who were apolitical or saw it as job.

Secondly Iraq had WMDs at one time (weapons of mass destruction to answer Charles' question... chemical, biological or nuclear... I'm sure he knew that already) but there was strong evidence that he got rid of them prior to 2003 (evidence that the Bush administration ignored).

That's not what Saddam said and ignores years of conflict with UN inspectors and that the inspectors were pulled out for years BEFORE Bush Jr. You were a civic affairs officer, right? You don't know much beyond what most soldiers know about NBC nor did bother to impress us with your military education which apparently didn't teach you squat about other issues you always ignore because you either don't know or don't care to learn. Know how to dispose of NBC weapons or other countries did it successfully? Here's a clue, Saddam don't follow internationally recognized procedures.

Your entire ilk are blatant hypocrites... the right wing (including most of the VJ right) called anyone who disagreed with & disapproved of the Bush administration unpatriotic yet you clowns have been bashing Obama before he even got into office. By your own warped standards that makes you unpatriotic as well.

Hardly, I'm the only one who posted on Obama's "surge' in Afghanistan. You couldn't be bothered to highlight the DIME approach you championed (it was your part of your job,right?) even when it is being used now in Southern Afghanistan.

You calling others unpatriotic when no one (didn't see it anyway) labeled you as such strikes me as pathetic. People can argue policies without lapsing into tropes.

[nowhereman 1]

First of all I joined the Army way before Bush became President, so to suggest that I resign my commission because of one bad President is beyond ridiculous.

So you carried out policies for 8 years you personally disagreed with and didn't have the nerve to walk? What, needed the money, the awards, the promotion, the benefits or just like MREs? I wasn't an Army lifer but I knew a lot of soldiers who were apolitical or saw it as job.

Secondly Iraq had WMDs at one time (weapons of mass destruction to answer Charles' question... chemical, biological or nuclear... I'm sure he knew that already) but there was strong evidence that he got rid of them prior to 2003 (evidence that the Bush administration ignored).

That's not what Saddam said and ignores years of conflict with UN inspectors and that the inspectors were pulled out for years BEFORE Bush Jr. You were a civic affairs officer, right? You don't know much beyond what most soldiers know about NBC nor did bother to impress us with your military education which apparently didn't teach you squat about other issues you always ignore because you either don't know or don't care to learn. Know how to dispose of NBC weapons or other countries did it successfully? Here's a clue, Saddam don't follow internationally recognized procedures.

Your entire ilk are blatant hypocrites... the right wing (including most of the VJ right) called anyone who disagreed with & disapproved of the Bush administration unpatriotic yet you clowns have been bashing Obama before he even got into office. By your own warped standards that makes you unpatriotic as well.

Hardly, I'm the only one who posted on Obama's "surge' in Afghanistan. You couldn't be bothered to highlight the DIME approach you championed (it was your part of your job,right?) even when it is being used now in Southern Afghanistan.

You calling others unpatriotic when no one (didn't see it anyway) labeled you as such strikes me as pathetic. People can argue policies without lapsing into tropes.

1. Officers follow lawful orders. On a personal level I strongly disagreed with many policies of the Bush administration but when my number was called I did my duty. Please don't tell me that you never carried out the instructions of your boss even when you disagreed with his or her decision making or perhaps felt that there was an underlying motive. Now if I was told to gun down innocent civilians that would be an unlawful order, but that isn't the case here.

2. I totally agree that Saddam loved to play a game of chicken with the inspectors. However on your next point you are dead wrong... I am both civil affairs and CBRN qualified (including hazmat technician). I have mentioned more than once that I work in homeland defense and have mentioned the CCMRF (CBRN Consequence Management Response Force).

3. I never saw your post about Obama & Afghanistan... if you made that comment kudos to you. As for the unpatriotic remark it was been made numerous times by Republicans about people who disapproved of Bush's policies & the accusation has been made directly or indirectly many times on VJ. Did you say that specifically? I don't know.

4. I genuinely wish there was less rhetoric on VJ & you will notice that if my views are treated with respect I return the favor (and when they aren't I return fire).

[Ban Hammer 12,861]

1. Officers follow lawful orders.

they are not the only ones to do so.

[alienlovechild 75]

1. Officers follow lawful orders. On a personal level I strongly disagreed with many policies of the Bush administration but when my number was called I did my duty. Please don't tell me that you never carried out the instructions of your boss even when you disagreed with his or her decision making or perhaps felt that there was an underlying motive.

No problem there. I didn't say you should disobey lawful orders, go AWOL or desert. I followed orders I didn't agree with but I could understand why they were made without assuming my superiors were all evil or corrupt. Wars are never clear cut affairs and there are plenty of reasons why FUBAR and SNAFU came from the military.

2. I totally agree that Saddam loved to play a game of chicken with the inspectors. However on your next point you are dead wrong... I am both civil affairs and CBRN qualified (including hazmat technician). I have mentioned more than once that I work in homeland defense and have mentioned the CCMRF (CBRN Consequence Management Response Force).

Missed your other qualifications but also missed how WMD was certified as accounted for and destroyed. The U.S., USSR/Russia, Ukraine and South Africa went through the entire process but Saddam didn't and he want Iran to believe he had the weapons to deter an attack.

3. I never saw your post about Obama & Afghanistan... if you made that comment kudos to you. As for the unpatriotic remark it was been made numerous times by Republicans about people who disapproved of Bush's policies & the accusation has been made directly or indirectly many times on VJ. Did you say that specifically? I don't know.

You already commented on that thread about the Marines' deployment.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...;hl=afghanistan

I doubt I threw the unpatriotic label as freely as some I've seen it used by people of different political orientations. If you don't like the term, don't use it yourself beyond quoting someone.

4. I genuinely wish there was less rhetoric on VJ & you will notice that if my views are treated with respect I return the favor (and when they aren't I return fire).

Fair enough.

[Danno 1,228]

Remarks by US Senator Robert C. Byrd

What I heard the President say also disturbed me. It may make for grand theater to describe Saddam Hussein as an ally of al Qaeda or to characterize the fall of Baghdad as a victory in the war on terror, but stirring rhetoric does not necessarily reflect sobering reality. Not one of the 19 September 11th hijackers was an Iraqi. In fact, there is not a shred of evidence to link the September 11 attack on the United States to Iraq. There is no doubt in my mind that Saddam Hussein was an evil despot who brought great suffering to the Iraqi people, and there is no doubt in my mind that he encouraged and rewarded acts of terrorism against Israel. But his crimes are not those of Osama bin Laden, and bringing Saddam Hussein to justice will not bring justice to the victims of 9-11. The United States has made great progress in its efforts to disrupt and destroy the al Qaeda terror network. We can take solace and satisfaction in that fact. We should not risk tarnishing those very real accomplishments by trumpeting victory in Iraq as a victory over Osama bin Laden.

Link

Odd Byrd was taking the moment to "set the record straight" on bush, yet he fails to mention... even hint at WMD as the reason we went there and how none will be found. (This speech was made just a few months after operations began).

Now why would Byrd who hates Bush more than anyone.... fail to strike at Bush over WMDs?

Lean close and I'll tell ya why..... *He thought there would be found too*

So slick was Bush, that he had everyone in Washington who read the intel believing WMDS were there.

Bush was so good he not only duped the Republicans... and Democrats, he even had Bill clinton and Al Gore swearing Sadam had WMDs and he needed to be dealt with.

Don't ask me how but,,,, he even Got Foreign Governments to come to the same conclusion.... Sadam has WMD's, the only thing they dared disagree on was, what to do about it.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

You didn't get the Downing Street Memo or the Dodgy Dossier

[ready4ONE 5,400]

Why don't you highlight the part where Bush Claims Iraq was in on the planning and execution of 9/11, you can't because it's not there.

And this is your evidence to base a conspiracy?

I never claimed any such conspiracy. I do claim, and the record is rich and clear, right down to Bush' own words at the time, he wanted war with Iraq, and used 9/11 and Bin Ladin and company as part of his justification. There is no secret conspiracy, just historical record Bush linked Iraq to Al Queda.

Proof you say? Bush said:

WASHINGTON (CNN) --

The following is the text of a letter from President Bush to the speaker of the House and the president pro tempore of the Senate, dated March 21, 2003:

Dear Mr. Speaker: (Dear Mr. President:)

On March 18, 2003, I made available to you, consistent with section 3(B) of the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002 (Public Law 107-243), my determination that further diplomatic and other peaceful means alone will neither adequately protect the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq, nor lead to enforcement of all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq.

I have reluctantly concluded, along with other coalition leaders, that only the use of armed force will accomplish these objectives and restore international peace and security in the area. I have also determined that the

use of armed force against Iraq is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001.

United States objectives also support a transition to democracy in Iraq, as contemplated by the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 (Public Law 105-338).

Consistent with the War Powers Resolution (Public Law 93-148), I now inform you that pursuant to my authority as Commander in Chief and consistent with the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution (Public Law 102-1) and the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002 (Public Law 107-243), I directed U.S. Armed Forces, operating with other coalition forces, to commence combat operations on March 19, 2003, against Iraq.

These military operations have been carefully planned to accomplish our goals with the minimum loss of life among coalition military forces and to innocent civilians. It is not possible to know at this time either the duration of active combat operations or the scope or duration of the deployment of U.S. Armed Forces necessary to accomplish our goals fully.

As we continue our united efforts to disarm Iraq in pursuit of peace, stability, and security both in the Gulf region and in the United States, I look forward to our continued consultation and cooperation.

Sincerely,

GEORGE W. BUSH

http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/03/21/sprj.irq.letter/

[nowhereman 1]

1. Officers follow lawful orders. On a personal level I strongly disagreed with many policies of the Bush administration but when my number was called I did my duty. Please don't tell me that you never carried out the instructions of your boss even when you disagreed with his or her decision making or perhaps felt that there was an underlying motive.

No problem there. I didn't say you should disobey lawful orders, go AWOL or desert. I followed orders I didn't agree with but I could understand why they were made without assuming my superiors were all evil or corrupt. Wars are never clear cut affairs and there are plenty of reasons why FUBAR and SNAFU came from the military.

2. I totally agree that Saddam loved to play a game of chicken with the inspectors. However on your next point you are dead wrong... I am both civil affairs and CBRN qualified (including hazmat technician). I have mentioned more than once that I work in homeland defense and have mentioned the CCMRF (CBRN Consequence Management Response Force).

Missed your other qualifications but also missed how WMD was certified as accounted for and destroyed. The U.S., USSR/Russia, Ukraine and South Africa went through the entire process but Saddam didn't and he want Iran to believe he had the weapons to deter an attack.

3. I never saw your post about Obama & Afghanistan... if you made that comment kudos to you. As for the unpatriotic remark it was been made numerous times by Republicans about people who disapproved of Bush's policies & the accusation has been made directly or indirectly many times on VJ. Did you say that specifically? I don't know.

You already commented on that thread about the Marines' deployment.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...;hl=afghanistan

I doubt I threw the unpatriotic label as freely as some I've seen it used by people of different political orientations. If you don't like the term, don't use it yourself beyond quoting someone.

4. I genuinely wish there was less rhetoric on VJ & you will notice that if my views are treated with respect I return the favor (and when they aren't I return fire).

Fair enough.

Thanks ALC... I definitely prefer a respectful exchange of ideas vs mud slinging back & forth.

[Danno 1,228]

use of armed force against Iraq is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001.

My friend Including does not mean exclusive..

But again, you claim the President hoodwinked the Country into going to war by blaming 9/11 on Iraq, yet you have to dig through notes the public never read and twist them to mean what you want to make your case.

I think you have had ample time to prove the conspiracy you believe in (You said it was the one you DO agree with).

Here's another I am uncertain about perhaps you can help me.

Bush: if you disagree with me, you are unamerican or unpatriotic.

Where did bush say this?

[Marilyn. 340]

use of armed force against Iraq is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001.

My friend Including does not mean exclusive..

But again, you claim the President hoodwinked the Country into going to war by blaming 9/11 on Iraq, yet you have to dig through notes the public never read and twist them to mean what you want to make your case.

I think you have had ample time to prove the conspiracy you believe in (You said it was the one you DO agree with).

Here's another I am uncertain about perhaps you can help me.

Bush: if you disagree with me, you are unamerican or unpatriotic.

Where did bush say this?

no one said he did...

[Peikko 1,575]

You didn't get the Downing Street Memo or the Dodgy Dossier

It must be partly down to the idiocy of the US media, this trenchant belief that there was no hoodwinking going on. It's sort of cute in a way, that some people believe in their Republican president, no matter what contrary evidence is put forward as to their duplicity. At least it would be, were the same courtesy extended to presidents from the 'other' party.