HillaryCare- The Dark Side

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

the more you make, the more you'll pay. odds are you'll be paying more to make up for those who make less.

You should like that. Progressive taxation on an ational scale is just another way for high-income high-productivity states (CA, NY) to be leached off of by low-income low-productivity states (AR, KS).

Word! NY and CA are the biggest donor states in the country and all the flyover states deride us as communists while they take more from the federal coffers than they contribute!

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

the more you make, the more you'll pay. odds are you'll be paying more to make up for those who make less.

You should like that. Progressive taxation on an ational scale is just another way for high-income high-productivity states (CA, NY) to be leached off of by low-income low-productivity states (AR, KS).

Word! NY and CA are the biggest donor states in the country and all the flyover states deride us as communists while they take more from the federal coffers than they contribute!

Exactly.

They are the big-government nanny-state tax-and-spend liberals.

[kaydee457 13]

Ironically, we already have universal health care. But its very inefficient and not everyone pays for it.

Go to the emergency room. Ring up several hundred thousand in bills. Declare bankruptcy. All those who currently pay for health insurance have to pay for it.

The fake name and address option is even better.

Don't forget the fake SS card and drivers license......

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Maybe her plan for universal healthcare is flawed but that doesn't mean all plans are or have to be. I still believe we'd be better off with some type of universal healthcare even if it's not under her plan.

To "stay on topic" - I think this sums up the argument pretty well...

[Don_Joy's Prince 0]

Sure, and who needs so many places to shop for food?

Why we can roll the cost of food into the taxes we pay and then we can create a bureaucracy to distribute food to the masses based on who’s most needy……

It could be like the “soup Nazi” in that old Seinfeld episode.

Everyone would get in line and some bureaucrat, with ladle in hand would decide how much you get. “No soup for you! Too fat! NEXT!”.

The topic’s about Health Care- please stay on topic!

Exactly! If health care is a so called "right". Then what about food, it is arguably more important than health care. So instead of letting people go hungry let's close all the restaurants and all the super markets and we give our money to the government then everyday they drop off the same food box to each and every American. We would all be equal, nobody would be obese, you would eat your ration each and every day just like everyone else.No diet related illness because you would not be allowed to eat any unhealthy foods. Beans, rice for all! Just think it would be Utopia!

Truth is health care is not a right and neither is food. The same way they would make you only eat beans and rice in a national food system, they will do the same with a national health care system.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

If people had as much trouble getting access to quality food, then that would be an issue.

[Alex+R 0]

Exactly! If health care is a so called "right". Then what about food, it is arguably more important than health care. So instead of letting people go hungry let's close all the restaurants and all the super markets and we give our money to the government then everyday they drop off the same food box to each and every American. We would all be equal, nobody would be obese, you would eat your ration each and every day just like everyone else.No diet related illness because you would not be allowed to eat any unhealthy foods. Beans, rice for all! Just think it would be Utopia!

Truth is health care is not a right and neither is food. The same way they would make you only eat beans and rice in a national food system, they will do the same with a national health care system.

Food is a right, just like health care. That's why we have food stamps and other programs. Obviously, we seem to have made this work without rationing everyone's food. Weird, huh?

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Between my employer and me, healthcare premiums for my family of three exceeds 12K p.a. There's got to be a better solution out there. This virus of a red-tape laden, wasteful and solely profit oriented private system we keep alive here cannot be the answer.

ETA: As to the subtitle of this thread, one might want to remember that nobody is skilled in squandering our money like the administration we had over the past 7 years.

Really, we'll see if that remains true if the improbable happens and HillBilly is elected........

Well, while we don't know what the future holdsm W outpaced Bill in squandering our money hands down. Bill could not even begin to compete with big spender W. That much we know.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Exactly! If health care is a so called "right". Then what about food, it is arguably more important than health care. So instead of letting people go hungry let's close all the restaurants and all the super markets and we give our money to the government then everyday they drop off the same food box to each and every American. We would all be equal, nobody would be obese, you would eat your ration each and every day just like everyone else.No diet related illness because you would not be allowed to eat any unhealthy foods. Beans, rice for all! Just think it would be Utopia!

Truth is health care is not a right and neither is food. The same way they would make you only eat beans and rice in a national food system, they will do the same with a national health care system.

Food is a right, just like health care. That's why we have food stamps and other programs. Obviously, we seem to have made this work without rationing everyone's food. Weird, huh?

Strangely even in the evil socialist empire that is Europe, the Government's don't run the restaurants, nor do we have a single national menu, consisting of various consistencies and color shades of Gulag-Gruel

I must write some letters to my UK MP to remedy the situation.

[Empress of Groovy 373]

Sure, and who needs so many places to shop for food?

Why we can roll the cost of food into the taxes we pay and then we can create a bureaucracy to distribute food to the masses based on who’s most needy……

It could be like the “soup Nazi†in that old Seinfeld episode.

Everyone would get in line and some bureaucrat, with ladle in hand would decide how much you get. “No soup for you! Too fat! NEXT!â€.

The topic’s about Health Care- please stay on topic!

Exactly! If health care is a so called "right". Then what about food, it is arguably more important than health care. So instead of letting people go hungry let's close all the restaurants and all the super markets and we give our money to the government then everyday they drop off the same food box to each and every American. We would all be equal, nobody would be obese, you would eat your ration each and every day just like everyone else.No diet related illness because you would not be allowed to eat any unhealthy foods. Beans, rice for all! Just think it would be Utopia!

Truth is health care is not a right and neither is food. The same way they would make you only eat beans and rice in a national food system, they will do the same with a national health care system.

I think that comparing access to health care with access to education is more accurate. Would you consider basic education a right, or should that be provided only to people who can afford it? Should we shut down all public schools, and if a poor kid's family can't afford to send him to school, should he just stay home?

The underlying issue is whether enough people believe that society in general benefits from universal access to a particular service, be it education, health care, fire and police protection, and the like.

Your scenario comparing health care services with a government-controlled diet is absurd.

Edited January 29, 2008 by AOS despair

[Alhamdulillah 0]

Exactly! If health care is a so called "right". Then what about food, it is arguably more important than health care. So instead of letting people go hungry let's close all the restaurants and all the super markets and we give our money to the government then everyday they drop off the same food box to each and every American. We would all be equal, nobody would be obese, you would eat your ration each and every day just like everyone else.No diet related illness because you would not be allowed to eat any unhealthy foods. Beans, rice for all! Just think it would be Utopia!

Truth is health care is not a right and neither is food. The same way they would make you only eat beans and rice in a national food system, they will do the same with a national health care system.

If food and healthcare (two of the most basic needs that every person needs in order to survive) are not considered "rights" in your book then pray tell what is?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Sure, and who needs so many places to shop for food?

Why we can roll the cost of food into the taxes we pay and then we can create a bureaucracy to distribute food to the masses based on who’s most needy……

It could be like the “soup Nazi” in that old Seinfeld episode.

Everyone would get in line and some bureaucrat, with ladle in hand would decide how much you get. “No soup for you! Too fat! NEXT!”.

The topic’s about Health Care- please stay on topic!

Exactly! If health care is a so called "right". Then what about food, it is arguably more important than health care. So instead of letting people go hungry let's close all the restaurants and all the super markets and we give our money to the government then everyday they drop off the same food box to each and every American. We would all be equal, nobody would be obese, you would eat your ration each and every day just like everyone else.No diet related illness because you would not be allowed to eat any unhealthy foods. Beans, rice for all! Just think it would be Utopia!

Truth is health care is not a right and neither is food. The same way they would make you only eat beans and rice in a national food system, they will do the same with a national health care system.

I think that comparing access to health care with access to education is more accurate. Would you consider basic education a right, or should that be provided only to people who can afford it? Should we shut down all public schools, and if a poor kid's family can't afford to send him to school, should be just stay home?

The underlying issue is whether enough people believe that society in general benefits from universal access to a particular service, be it education, health care, fire and police protection, and the like.

Your scenario comparing health care services with a government-controlled diet is absurd.

Good point.

BTW - That's the trouble with us socialists - our arguments are purely emotional and not intellectual

[Don_Joy's Prince 0]

Exactly! If health care is a so called "right". Then what about food, it is arguably more important than health care. So instead of letting people go hungry let's close all the restaurants and all the super markets and we give our money to the government then everyday they drop off the same food box to each and every American. We would all be equal, nobody would be obese, you would eat your ration each and every day just like everyone else.No diet related illness because you would not be allowed to eat any unhealthy foods. Beans, rice for all! Just think it would be Utopia!

Truth is health care is not a right and neither is food. The same way they would make you only eat beans and rice in a national food system, they will do the same with a national health care system.

If food and healthcare (two of the most basic needs that every person needs in order to survive) are not considered "rights" in your book then pray tell what is?

So why should someone else pay to feed you and keep you healthy? What did you do for them? This is your responsibility not everyone else's! If you can't figure out how to feed and keep yourself in good health then why should it be up to me?

[Alex+R 0]

Exactly! If health care is a so called "right". Then what about food, it is arguably more important than health care. So instead of letting people go hungry let's close all the restaurants and all the super markets and we give our money to the government then everyday they drop off the same food box to each and every American. We would all be equal, nobody would be obese, you would eat your ration each and every day just like everyone else.No diet related illness because you would not be allowed to eat any unhealthy foods. Beans, rice for all! Just think it would be Utopia!

Truth is health care is not a right and neither is food. The same way they would make you only eat beans and rice in a national food system, they will do the same with a national health care system.

If food and healthcare (two of the most basic needs that every person needs in order to survive) are not considered "rights" in your book then pray tell what is?

So why should someone else pay to feed you and keep you healthy? What did you do for them? This is your responsibility not everyone else's! If you can't figure out how to feed and keep yourself in good health then why should it be up to me?

Can you look in the mirror and say you would rather have five dollars while several people die? That's what's at the heart of your opinion (along with a good dose of ignorance and mean-spiritedness about why people sometimes can't support their families). Just about the most selfish thing I've heard this week. Gag.

[Alhamdulillah 0]

So why should someone else pay to feed you and keep you healthy? What did you do for them? This is your responsibility not everyone else's! If you can't figure out how to feed and keep yourself in good health then why should it be up to me?

I truly hope you never find yourself in the position where you may not be able to get food or healthcare for yourself and, if you do, I hope you do not encounter others who view you in the same useless way you view others less fortunate then yourself.