PirateLiker

I've done a lot of searching from different sources but I'm hoping someone might have a personal experience. Are you from a red zone country (USA for example) and if so In your travels have you recently had a layover in an EU country? I hope to have a layover in Rome for 11 hours and another of similar length in Vienna in the next few days. I've read conflicting info as to whether this is possible if I remain on the travel side of the airport. I do know of  a guy who did it in Amsterdam last week. 

12 hours ago, geowrian said:

 

Not quite. The I-864 is rarely enforced, but is enforceable. There's a number of cases won VJ where this has happened regarding public benefits with the government, and a number where it has been pursued for 125% income level maintenance as a private civil lawsuit.

Enforcement could change on a dime.

 

 

I researched this a little. There are law firms that advertise that they will help beneficiaries with enforcement of this. I agree, it could change on a dime.

13 hours ago, Hypnos said:

 

 

This is what you would voluntarily subject someone you purport to care for to? From reading your replies I am going to draw the conclusion that you do not love her. Care for her a great deal? Perhaps. But not love. If it were love you would have signed your soul away to be with her and damn the consequences. So, if there is any part of you that does care for her, either get fully on board or let her go. This half-in half-out bullshit is not fair on her or you, but she is the one that's uprooted her life to come here for you. So if you cannot commit to filing for her AoS and letting her begin to have a normal life here (and coming from Ukraine it's going to take some time to adjust to US culture), let her know that it's time for you both to move on (unsure if you're married yet, so divorce may or may not be necessary). There is enough cruelty in this world; you should not aim to add to it.

You are exactly right. I'm sure some would estimate you are being generous by suggesting I care for her at all. But I do care for her. And yes you are right, I do not love her. I was married for 16 years and I think I loved her for much of that time. That was 10 years ago. I'm now in my mid 50s and question whether I am capable of love. I'm not like other people. You may not be able to understand me by thinking how you or others would handle this. I've spent a lot of time and money on therapists and haven't figured out how to be better. In fact, I am 75% finished with a graduate degree in psychology, trying to learn how the human mind works (and, presumably my mind as well).

This girl, who is 20 years younger than me, is very sweet and smart. She is not at her best now, because of the stress of the situation. She has lost weight and has stomach pain. So I get to watch this wonderful person suffer due to what I've done. It kills me. I look at her and think "I want her, I want this relationship, but I can't have it". What I have is sitting right there, in my house, available to me. But I can't have it. Because I'm 90% sure that if I move forward and marry her I'll change my mind. So how is that fair to her??? 

Some people look at themselves and their behavior and say "I don't want to be like that anymore" and they change. It doesn't seem to be that simple for me. Or maybe it is, and I don't actually want to change.

16 hours ago, dnyal said:

The instructions for the AOS from K-1 are clear in that the fiancée "will always have a green card available to" her as long as the marriage had happened within the 90 days after arrival. So, you could marry her before her I-94 expires and simply do nothing. After that period, she would be in an irregular immigration situation, but you guys could start the process of AOS at any moment later on (as long as the marriage had taken place within the 90-day period). Don't even try to submit the AOS package without the affidavit of support or without signing it; the lockbox facility would simply return the application.

Now, you signed an affidavit of support for the form I-129F: form I-134. If she got her K-1 visa approved, that means that for the embassy interview a signed form I-134 was presented. That means you are not off the hook with her. Even if you don't marry her and she stays irregularly in the US, if for some reason she applies for section 8 or receives food stamps or some other assistance, the US government will collect the money from you regardless. They can even take the money from your tax refund or even garnish your wages.

In any case, whether you sign the I-864 form or not, you already did sign an affidavit for the K-1 visa and if she stays, you will have the responsibility to support her. So, if you wanna be totally off the hook, your only option is to send her back.

Hmmm. This contradicts what others have said but it makes sense.

17 hours ago, ineedadisplayname said:

And she didn't leave?

If you did that then you have to tell her to go home or move out or whatever. After that, it is her problem if she wants to stay illegally in the US, but  the two of you need an official breakup and somebody to move out from the place where the two of you are staying. Or if you want all the "benefits" she is brings then marry her and sign the papers and adjust her status...

Good points. You are right

44 minutes ago, aaron2020 said:

My guess is that the OP was previously married and had to give up "his" assets in a divorce and doesn't want to go through that again.  He asked about getting a prenup before she entered the US.

Yes that is true, but it does not justify my actions.

1 hour ago, Jorgedig said:

Piratelicker:  Please do not marry her.  It is perfectly NORMAL for engaged individuals to harbor doubts and even cold feet at times.  What isn't normal is to proceed with a marriage that in your heart you know is WRONG.  You need to let go of the shame and guilt (and possibly the idea that you've come this far, spent this much etc) and let her go so that you both can pursue happiness.  

 

Yes, you let things get *too far* into the process by even bringing her here with such doubts, and yes, it will be painful all round for awhile.  But in the grand scheme of things you will both be better off years from now for having done what was difficult now.

 

And btw, your allusion to the fact that you live in an "undocumented-friendly" area where she could likely get (illegal) work is patently absurd.  If she had a professional job/career in Ukraine, why would she want to come to the US and do the type of work commonly available to undocumented people?

 

You say you're a "horrible person;"  why not make that untrue now and do right by her by being completely honest and sending her home?

All good points. We have already had the break up talk 4 times. Each time, I feel so terrible that I walk it back. If I had stuck to the first breakup 2 months ago, maybe some healing would have already begun to take place. 

She has been getting out and doing some things. She even went out of town with some friends she met for a weekend. This is a rare opportunity for her to visit this part of the world. She is aware of that and trying to make something positive of the situation, which I support. 

Meanwhile, we are spending time together and trying to enjoy each other's company. Of course that is difficult too, because there is this cloud hanging over us.

1 hour ago, R&OC said:

 

 

Your fiancee sounds like she has her stuff together. See it from a different perspective perhaps: if you support her, and she can kickstart a professional future in the US - you both win. She may be your best "investment" you ever had. One of my friends had such a hard working and financially sound wife that upon their divorce, she paid out so much of their mutual savings that he had a nice cushion to fall back on. And yes, both of them are still friends and on talking term. You can't control every outcome of a relationship but at some point just be willing to make that commitment to each other and simply have trust. If you can't, then let her go back home and be fair to her. Pay for her expenses she had to upfront. Give her enough to restart her life back home. But please don't let her hang dry. 

 

First of all, thank you to those of you who pointed out that both A and B result in illegal status. Does anyone know where it is codified that B results in illegal status? What triggers the illegal status? Is it not having I864 signed by a certain number of days after the marriage? Or a certain number of days after the visa was used?

I agree, you can't control everything in life. There are no guarantees. Many times I think I should go ahead and marry and adjust status and let the chips fall where they may. At this point that is still what she wants. I am a terrible person but I do hate the fact that I've hurt her so badly. 

I have already given her money for a plane ticket plus 4 months of her previous wages. 

I don't need anyone's pity, but I do detest what I've done and myself.

My K1 fiance has been in the US for about 2 months. I was very concerned about the open ended/blank check aspect of signing I864 before she arrived, and my misgivings about this haven't changed. I am considering a couple of options.

A. Allow her to stay with me without marriage. I realize that in doing so she would become an undocumented resident.

B. Marry her but not sign I864. In so doing I realize she would not be able to adjust status, but I believe she would be a documented resident.

Am I more or less correct in my understanding of these two paths?

I live in an area of the country that is very friendly to undocumented residents. In fact,  a former GF was an undocumented immigrant. She has a job (albeit low wage), driver's license, access to health care etc. Under either scenario, A or B, I am quite certain she would be able to work and have a driver's license.   

I am completely aware that she is a person with the ability to make her own choices. If I tell her what I am willing to do, she can choose what is best for her. 

Considering reactions to a related post a couple months ago, I am not necessarily expecting very civil comments in this thread. 

On 12/3/2018 at 2:12 PM, gregcrs2 said:

Actually, having a list....seems like a control freak thing!

 

Probably so. I didn't start this thread to prove what a good guy I am. I made a big mistake (several in fact) and I'm trying not to make an even worse one. By the way, she finds the amount of money I have offered to be quite generous. 

On 12/3/2018 at 1:14 PM, afortunada said:

Well, this is the second time it's happened to you, so I'm going to go ahead and say you should do everything necessary to get that woman back to her home country and then stop making hasty decisions and maybe avoid relationships until you can work on whatever personal struggles you are dealing with. This isn't a game.

 

 

You are right

On 12/3/2018 at 8:11 AM, boris64 said:

She gave up her career and you gave up what? Some time and two months wages in her country which is chump change for most of us. Put yourself in her shoes...Anyway if she must go back do it quickly before the resentment sinks in...and it will...

OK and after I put myself in her shoes, do what? Give her more money? How much is enough? 

On 12/3/2018 at 7:54 AM, CEE53147 said:

 

Do NOT remain in the same residence.  This can be a setup for VAWA filing. 

It's a good point and it's been mentioned to me by others. I don't see that happening, but I'm not clairvoyant, or even very smart. When I started this thread, I was ready to end it right then and had already told her. As suggested, if there was any hope of getting her job back, I wanted to make it so that she could keep that option open. She said there was no hope, a statement with which I disagreed. Nevertheless, I wasn't going to belabor the point. She was devastated by the news of my feelings. 

The next day I told her that if she wanted to stay and try, that we could do that. I said I didn't think there was a very good chance. She thought about it for a day and decided to give it a shot. So we are kind of playing house. I decided that if we split up after a couple of months, it will be harder than right now. But then I reasoned that when she looks back on this 5 years from now, it will be better if she has some memories of doing some fun things in the US.

She hooked up with some ex-pats today that showed her around a little, so that was cool. Things have been pleasant the last couple of days. 

On 12/3/2018 at 4:32 AM, PaulMac said:

Okay, i'm gonna be as unbiased and truthful as i can, please bear with me.
Don't blame yourself. I marked the KEY point in your explanation. In my view, she knew what she signed up for when you told her about big changes and i assume you told her that you don't feel the same way anymore. Her giving up her career to come to US wasn't entirely YOUR fault. She did it, knowing that it MIGHT NOT work out, and took a blind gamble instead of waiting for some more time (having 6months to come into US). So i don't see how it's only your fault in any way. 
Further, i'd buy her tickets back to her country, and that's about it. You can give her pocket money to support herself once she goes back there. Meaning a taxi ride, some cash for food and necessities, if she needs more, buy her everything here. Clothes, etc. Let her stay, but give her a separate room until she departures.
She clearly knew that it's a risk at that point to move to USA, especially that you told her about it. I'm not implying for you to be a cold hearted and kick her out. But she has to be reasonable as well, as she was told the possibilities ahead of time.

Wow that sounds insensitive of me. I apologize if that does, i don't mean to, but i'm giving my opinion on the situation.
DO NOT get married. You will complicate your and her's life's even more than it is now. As heart breaking it is, you have to keep your head straight, and think clearly. 

I appreciate the pragmatic view. 

Because of the sensitive nature of this matter, I changed some of our information as a gesture toward privacy. She is not from Colombia. 

My fiance just arrived on a K1 visa last week. To say the least, for the last 6 months I have had very cold feet. I informed her of several big things that I thought would be deal breakers. (I choose not to share the list, but if I did I think most people would see the folly in moving forward, on both our parts). She discussed some of them and even negotiated a bit, but in the end she decided to still come.

I didn't think things would work out but I decided to proceed. This was very foolish of me. I knew my heart wasn't fully in it. Predictably, things are not working out. We had a big discussion yesterday, which was partially resolved.

I believe she knows something is not right but is trying to pretend things will work out. One of the worst parts of this whole thing is that she gave up a very good job/career to come here.

I am looking for feedback on my exit strategy. Here is my plan:

1. Give her enough money for a plane ticket home (for her and her cat), for a hotel here for a few days, and two months of her wages in her home country. 

2. I have a friend an hour away, closer to the airport, who speaks her language. He and his wife are close to my beneficiary's age. I asked him and his wife if they are will help her walk through the process of getting a ticket back and finding a hotel to stay in for the next few days. He agreed to do what he could, as an immigrant from her country and a bilingual speaker of her language.

3. Put her in touch with the consulate from her country.

If all you have to offer is criticism of what I have done, I don't blame you. In fact, it might make me feel somehow better (like penance somehow) to be insulted. But what I am looking for is ideas on ways that I can make this horrible situation a little bit better.

I don't suppose VJ has a subforum where people talk about divorces involving immigrants.

9 hours ago, gregcrs2 said:

If you are so concerned about it, then perhaps you shouldn't get married.  If things go the wrong way, that could be the least of your financial concerns.  

What are the other financial concerns?

12 hours ago, NikLR said:

Of course its a serious contract.  I wouldnt sign one for a sibling or a friend.  My kid would likely be the only recipient of an I-864 from me.  

~~moved to general immigration discussion from off topic.  Topic is about affidavit of support~~

Are you an American marrying a foreign person? If so, I think you have to sign one or your marriage cannot continue and your spouse must return to Canada. Am I right about this?

What do you mean you have "seen cases"? Are you an attorney, or have you just read about them?

I know VJ is generally meant to be a happy place for those who are all in on their marriage. But what if something goes wrong? I have been doing a little reading on I-864 and I find it to be troubling if not terrifying. By signing this binding document, which is essentially a contract between you and the federal government, you agree to support the beneficiary for life at 125% of the poverty level. Yes you read that right. There are a few specific things which can absolve you of this responsibility, most notably the beneficiary decides to abandon residency status or the beneficiary works for 10 years. However, the beneficiary is obligated to do neither. It is not like normal alimony where you can have imputed income or other court ordered motivation to have the person work. 

I have read reports that say this is not enforced very often but further reading seems to suggest that enforcement is on the rise. Does anyone have any firsthand knowledge of this? I read a recent VJ thread where a sponsor was very worried that it was going to be enforced on him. Have you been on either end of an enforced I-864? If so, can you detail what happened? I appreciate other comments but firsthand knowledge is so valuable.  Please avoid replies that are not directly relevated to the question.

I looked on Craigslist New York and found someone who teaches the language that my fiance speaks. I contacted this person and she agreed to assist my fiance at the airport. I will pay her $100 for 5 hours. Not sure if there is a better/cheaper way, but this option didn't seem too bad.

Well, you have 90 days. If you still are not comfortable going through with the marriage, she can return home and you two can take some more time to get to work on the relationship or go your separate ways.

True. In her case, however, she is giving up a career of 8 years to come here. She has a lot at stake. I spoke with a couple of prenup attorneys. I think I'm going to go that route. Some particulars are that she needs to retain her own California attorney to help her with it. And it will need to be translated into Russian before she signs is. Furthermore, it must be in each party's posession for 7 days before it can be signed.

My fiance has an approved K1 and a plane ticket. I have been thinking about a getting a prenup but haven't put any effort into it until now. After doing a little research this morning I'm pretty nervous. First of all, I read that a prenup is unlikely to hold up if it is established after POE. This makes sense to me. If it was shown to be signed under duress, it can be invalidated. The beneficiary is motivated to sign it in that circumstance because s/he wants the marriage to occur.

I am thinking maybe I should try to get it taken care of before arrival. Maybe have an attorney send it to her then she could get her Ukrainian attorney to look it over. This still might be considered duress, however, since the ticket is already purchased and the timeline is tight. But an advantage 

I own my house outright and have considerable other assets (and a young adult daughter) which I wish to protect in the event of the marriage ending.

In case you're wondering if I am uncertain about this relationship, that is most certainly true. We have considerable differences which we have discussed. It looked like things were not going to work out a month ago, but now we are moving forward. I think we both know about our issues but have decided to try. I will concede that she might be seeing things through rose colored glasses to some extent.

1 hour ago, Ksenia_O said:

And you are right - it's always good to have one ticket for entire trip. Even if flights are operated by different airlines, they are partners, and usually have the same/similar requirements for pets transportation.

The very first flight will determine and provide you with requirements.

YOu would think so, but that approach cost me a cancelled ticket and a loss of $250. I bought one ticket on 2 other airlines. One allowed the cat addition, the other didn't. The ticket was useless at that point. The booking agency refuned $550 and kept $250.