WantYouToWantMe

Welcome to VJ.  Stick around the MENA forum and learn more. You did yourself well joining.
 
Good Luck with your relationship and please let us know how your journey continues.
 

The litmus test is an obsession, no matter how subtle, with America or the West. Any talk of what he plans to do there if he ever left Egypt and constant references to how bad life is in Egypt and what he's willing to do to escape it.
No matter how smooth or experienced he is, the subconscious cannot be suppressed for too long.
Also, since you know his name, age and family/friends (from Facebook), run a background check on him. I'm sure there's at least one PI in that country of a 100 million.
And most of all, trust your instincts!
Good luck.

Just because he doesn't pay for the plane ticket doesn't mean he isn't serious. It's not like many people just have $1000 to give away.
OP I wouldn't make him waste money on a tourist visa. Chances are he will not get it and he just wasted $165. Wasting money and time doesn't prove he is serious for you.
'My fiancé is from Morocco. He proposed early and didn't pay for my plane ticket any time I went to see him. He did however pay for everything while I was there. I would never have made him try to apply for a B1 visa because it would have just wasted $165 of money he worked hard for. Once you visit and are in person you will get a much better feel for him.

I have been in this exact same situation.  Trust me when I say that a lot of Egyptian men will tell you ANYTHING to get out of their country.  They are very charismatic and are definitely salesmen.  I was married to an Egyptian prior to my current relationship and in retrospect I definitely believe now that his friend who was already here in the states helped him to find someone "me" to help him get here.  That being said, they can only hide their true intentions for so long.  I never caught my ex in a lie before he came either.  I met all his family when I went to Egypt and truly believed he was an honest guy.  He had a college education, a decent job and his family was upper middle class.  Just be super careful.  As you can see I married an Egyptian again but I was fully armed with all the red flags I chose to ignore the first go around.  Be careful.  Protect yourself, your heart and your family.  My ex waited almost two years to show his true colors.  Once he knew he had the green card in the bag his true intentions came out.  I finally threw him out and divorced him after he made a sexual pass at my 18 year old daughter.  I know you will probably still go through with it.  I don't care how well you think you know his friend.  Beware.  From what I experienced it's definitely a Bros before you know what mentality in Egypt.  Just my two sense. 

He shouldn't just offer for your plane ticket, he should pay for it. I know that might sound a little medieval to us American women, but trust me, it means he's serious. And from more traditional cultures, it's just outright odd for the woman to be expected to pay, if you ask me.
Definitely have him apply for the B-1. His chances might be low, but it'll be a sign he's serious, as I mentioned above. Also, he would have to disclose his financial situation in detail....not a bad thing to get out in the open. His financial situation will be a huge part of the visa process later if you do decide to get married, so nothing wrong with getting it out there sooner.
It's good that he wasn't pushy. No reason to end it all out of paranoid and worry, just continue forward with caution. I hope everything ends up well for you, but don't lose sight of yourself. Going slowly and being cautious certainly never harmed anyone. Just as you will learn more about his culture and have to adapt to it, he will do the same for you...it's the two-way street of inter-cultural relationships.

When I met my now husband online in 2008, after the discussion of possible marriage, I did some posts and research, and some on VisaJourney. Why not? It was something new to me, I was not sure if it was even possible. So I sought out information on VJ. How could that possibly make our relationship a scam? We have been together ever since, although VJ viewed our relationship with having 'red flags'. I think it is smart to research BEFORE meeting someone in person. To know what you can and can't do, to know what your limits are, before you get emotionally tied up, before you get finally spent flying back and fourth only to find out your unable to achieve what you started out to do. That, do not make it a scam. As one poster wrote, proposing marriage early on is in their culture. Do all relationships end in rainbows? No. Are their a lot of success stories? Yes! But be smart in the beginning and do your homework.

Honestly trust your gut...if you have a doubt then maybe your answer lays there....

I think you are sorting this all out and giving yourself the answer you need.
Have faith.
Sometimes god puts people in you life to learn a lesson.
If he and you stay together forever great but if not enjoy the time you have.
Personally i dont make future plans live day by day enjoy your partner.

Biggest tips I can give are:
1- definitely understand his culture and understand his religious beliefs. Even if you share the same religion, you can find some large differences in interpretation.
2-spend time with his family. You will get the true sense for how the treat each other and you can see how they treat you.
I will say personally I do not find it as a red flag at all that you have already been discussing marriage. That is not culturally strange for him.

Asking someone to move countries when you haven't met them is a red flag imo. It may be super cute and lovey and it makes you feel warm inside that he wants you to live with him, but no person that isn't trying rush things or do anything fun like that, isn't going to even mention, hey you should come move to my country and meet for first time and the same time.

Some things that seem cute and lovey, have alternate intentions.


Also, unless both state they hate marriage (which would NEVER work for a couple who wanted to be together internationally) all LDR's across the boarder would end in marriage. You -have- to get married to be together when it comes to international marriage, so that will ALWAYS be the end game.


Even if the friend is in Saudi, I still see it as a worry. Why can't the friend teach him English, he must know enough English to come here on a work visa?




With all this said, tbqh you already seem to have your mind set that he's not a scammer. Go meet him and see what happens, but don't be surprised when you're super swoon. Almost all LDR relationships when they meet for the first time, scam or not, are incredibly loving for the first meeting. No amount of warnings anyone may give will change your mind tho, and much like Mille's situation, anything you do catch him in you may just forgive him.

I have to disagree with this. THIS is the kind of mindset that gets you scammed. The "well I love them, so I'm going to do it!" mindset. Love is NOT an objective feeling, it can completely blind someone from seeing that maybe the person they love isn't very genuine. That "gut" feeling you could have, could end up being completely over ridden by the love you have for someone.
That's how you get so many people who send incredible amounts of money to their boyfriend/girlfriend/fiance and don't realize something might be up. While some people may say that they were stupid for doing so, at the time of doing it, the USC did it out of love.
We've had people on VJ who have done things out of love, only to be ditched before K-1 interview, or even in one case in the Philippines, the foreign fiance told her USC that their interview was denied based on not enough evidence, a couple of weeks later the USC contacted the embassy asking what more would they need, he thought their case was solid, only to be told that the foreign fiance NEVER showed up to the interview, so it was denied. When he confronted her, she pretty much said bye and blocked him out for no more communication.
People can tell her what red flags to look for, she can state her story and people can tell her what things might be red flags that she might be too love spelled to see.
With all that said, there are plenty of people here on VJ that will and have attested to their fiances/spouses being the most amazing thing to ever happen to them. Not all of VJ is scams and sadness, but those scams and sadness should help people be aware of what's out there and NOT just rely on the "But I love them!" feeling. That's what got those sad post people into the situation in the first place.

It's hard to tell whether it's a scam or not, the stories you read here are the sad scam ones. I mean the US spouse will not come to a forum just to write that their foreign spouse is genuine, people come here to ask question about their situation.
As the foreign spouse of a US citizen, I know that I really love my wife, she loved me too. We both wanted to live together and we are still together. Many people including her family and friends told her that this might be a scam, and that I am using her to get here to the states. I think this is how it is, the US citizen will always feel that he is being used and the foreigner spouse will always feel from the people around them, that they are scammers. I know some people are scammers, some not.
Eventually, no one can answer your question whether this is a scam or not, it's all about you and what you feel and what you decide to do.

I'd be careful.

If the mutual friend you met him through is related to him or from his home country, this could just be a set up to get him here.

Marriage talk before meeting should be a red flag. How long have you guys been talking or dating?



As for scams, anyone at this point can be scammed. You have to look at the sum of all the things.

One of the reasons that women get scammed a lot by MENA country men, is usually because of money. The men usually can't get a tourist visa to visit, or don't have enough money to be the one visiting, so it goes onto the woman to be the one to meet the man, then eventually she finds out that it's quite costly to keep doing all of this, to the point that some people will just meet ONCE because the cost is too high, but then, she misses him too much, he tells her how much he misses her and would do anything to be with her, and then viola, K-1 visas get talked about and a while later he's here in the US.

You could go meet him and see how you feel. But remember, if he's TRYING to scam you and he's good at it, you'll probably just end up love smitten and not realize that you were essentially seduced into playing the role of the person who will get him into the US. Some people scam and keep it going until naturalization or their 10 year green cards, so they spend YEARS upholding the facade. Usually the person being scammed is either floored by it because they had no idea, or they're able to piece together why it all made sense when it happened.


I agree with trusting your gut. I don't think I've ever once thought my husband was out for a scam or anything like that. I think maybe I made jokes about it, but never put any true thought into it.

If you are worried, then take it slow. If he agrees to take it slow as well, maybe even have a Long distance relationship for a while AND NOT at some point try to speed it up, then you're good. You can be in control on how fast the relationship moves and DO NOT let him try to convince you that it needs to move faster. Some guys will say "Oh yeah, sure let's wait a while" and then after just a whole month, start sweet talking their way into that long while being sooner than thought.

How well do you know/trust his friend? How did he immigrate to the US (if he did)? Are there other friends/family members of him that have immigrated to the US? If so, how?
What's his education/job and quality of life in Egypt? How quickly did he (or you) bring up moving to the US? DId you discuss/entertain the idea of moving to Egypt instead?
Just some ideas, food for thought. You can certainly never be sure what another persons intentions are, but take your time and visit as often as you can. Don't rush it, and don't go through with any commitments if you feel unsure.

Well sounds straight forward enough. Only thing is maybe being introduced by a mutual friend; but since you have known this friend for 11 years, that is a good sign. Not like you just met and he introduced you to his brother haha.
This friend and your man are not related?
If not, then I say go for it, go meet him and see how you two feel together. Sometimes you have to just go for it!

A couple things here,
We were just discussing the future (for sh**s and giggles I guess), I of course was going to visit Egypt first before moving there! Sorry if I was unclear, we definitely didn't intend for me to move there on my first visit.
And yes, as you mentioned, any LDR that work out in end in marriage, so that is kind of why I wasn't SO alarmed at talking about marriage.... because ultimately if we are going to be together, that would be the end result; you are right that international relationships aren't going to work out without a marriage!
As far as teaching him English, I guess the friend thought that speaking with a native English speaker would help him out, and also improve his accent. He's still helping his as well, I guess he didn't think it would hurt anything just to talk to me a little bit.
You are right, that I had my mind set he wasn't a scammer before I came here; But I posted this thread looking for advice and I plan to take all of the advice into honest consideration. If there are some red flags, I'm going to look into it. And if I find some things I don't like, it might change my mind. And I haven't caught him in anything yet, but if I did, I am not going to just forgive him. I know how much is at risk here and I'm trying to take it easy and look at everything I can. I'm posting asking for advice, and I appreciate the advice people are giving me. I hope people don't think I'm here asking for advice just to refuse it and not consider it, or that I'm the type of person that is going to forgive a man for everything he does even if I catch him doing ridiculous things!