The real target of the 6 imams' 'discrimination' suit

[Caladan 19]

The fact that they were led away in handcuffs just means that the authority followed normal procedures when someone has a suspicion of terrorism and says nothing about what they knew, or the party's guilt. They'd already made it through security, and all the extra implementations post 9/11.

Sorry, but 'they musta done somethin'' just isn't good enough. Musta done something seems to be Flying While Looking Unacceptably Foreign. And praying in public without invoking Baby Jesus. Anyone think it through and recognize that the 9/11 guys did everything they could *not* to advertise their intentions? Clean-shaven, respectful, flew early, young men? Didn't pray in the airport?

G-E G, no, one article isn't proof. The original reports -- when this thing buzzed around a few weeks ago -- confirm what these guys are saying. And color me unconvinced that we discover later it was a stunt when the guys themselves are saying it wasn't, just because usual lawsuit stunts have the organization doing it taking credit. (cf., nearly every abortion decision.)

[GaryC 7]

So you think this was all a misunderstanding resulting from irrational bias and racism? Sorry, I don't agree. In our PC world that we live in I really doubt that the air crew would have over reacted like this. Just because the passengers may be ignorant bigoted azzhats (apparently in your opinion) does not mean the air crew would have snapped to and called the cops. There is more here than meets the eye. The fact that they are so quick to file a lawsuit supports my contention that this was a stunt. And the fact the airline didn't issue a public apology and offer restitution also says they still think it was the right thing to do.

It looks as though someone has targeted Minneapolis for some sort of special treatment. I mean really. So far we have three stories coming out of there about culture clashes with Muslims. The taxi drivers, the grocery check out clerk and now this. It's a lot more than coincidence.

It seems that their spokesman may have ties to Hamas.

Omar Shahin, spokesman for the humiliated imams, is affiliated with Kind Hearts for Charitable Human Development...

KindHearts officials and fundraisers have coordinated with Hamas leaders and made contributions to Hamas-affiliated organizations. Specially Designated Global Terrorist (SDGT) Usama Hamdan, a leader of Hamas in Lebanon, reportedly phoned a top fundraiser for KindHearts during a September 2003 KindHearts fundraiser.

http://www.shinesforall.com/archives/2006/...mams_remov.html

I still say this thing stinks. Call me a bigot if you want but I would rather err on the side of caution.

[Otto 83]

Plain and simple a form of protest AND antagonism. And don't think they chose US Airways for the frequent flier mileage offers either..it's the name.

Rather than educate the supposed ignorant western world on the peacefulness of Islam, this is the path they chose.

~Rant

[UmmSqueakster 54]

I'm sorry, I just had to log back in for this.

Has anyone here actually read the complaint (07-01513)? The imams make 98 (paragraphs 24-122 in the complaint) allegations, laying out what they say happened. Now, since this is in court, we'll see how the defendants answer, then we'll have discovery, each side will gather evidence to support the facts, it will be put before a judge and jury, who will weigh the evidence, and then we'll see what really happened.

The allegations in the complaint counter many of the rumors that flew around the media and that have been repeated ad nasium on this board.

Among these allegations is that one of the imams is a gold member, a frequent flyer on US Airways, who was intitled to sit in first class because he flew the airlines so often (paragraph 26). Hmm, wonder if that's why they chose to fly on US Airways. He also was entitled to have two of his companions sit with him in first class (paragraph 29).

Since there weren't open seats available in first class, when they got onboard, they moved around the plane and asked for seat reassignments so that someone could sit next to their blind friend and help them (paragraph 44). They had previously asked to be seated next to each other. Has no one on this board ever moved around the plane after boarding, or asked to switch seats to sit next to friends or family?

Another allegation is that they bought their round trip tickets via credit card, not paying in cash for one way tickets (paragraph 25).

Another allegation is that they never spoke about politics, Sadaam Hussein or President Bush (paragraph 33).

I wonder why after the FBI told these plaintiffs that they were no security threat at all and let them go (paragraph 97), the airline didn't allow them to fly on another flight.

Now, I'm eagerly awaiting the answer of the defendants and the discovery period. I'd like to see how these allegations hold up.

But, from my perspective as a muslim traveler, I can't see anything that these men did wrong. I have prayed in the terminals at Minneapolis/Saint Paul airport. I've asked to move seats so I could sit next to friends. I read my arabic quran and use my prayer beads on the plane. And I sure as heck dress more "muslim" then these guys have. Forgive my ranting, but this just P*sses me off to no end.

[GaryC 7]

I'm sorry, I just had to log back in for this.

Has anyone here actually read the complaint (07-01513)? The imams make 98 (paragraphs 24-122 in the complaint) allegations, laying out what they say happened. Now, since this is in court, we'll see how the defendants answer, then we'll have discovery, each side will gather evidence to support the facts, it will be put before a judge and jury, who will weigh the evidence, and then we'll see what really happened.

The allegations in the complaint counter many of the rumors that flew around the media and that have been repeated ad nasium on this board.

Among these allegations is that one of the imams is a gold member, a frequent flyer on US Airways, who was intitled to sit in first class because he flew the airlines so often (paragraph 26). Hmm, wonder if that's why they chose to fly on US Airways. He also was entitled to have two of his companions sit with him in first class (paragraph 29).

Since there weren't open seats available in first class, when they got onboard, they moved around the plane and asked for seat reassignments so that someone could sit next to their blind friend and help them (paragraph 44). They had previously asked to be seated next to each other. Has no one on this board ever moved around the plane after boarding, or asked to switch seats to sit next to friends or family?

Another allegation is that they bought their round trip tickets via credit card, not paying in cash for one way tickets (paragraph 25).

Another allegation is that they never spoke about politics, Sadaam Hussein or President Bush (paragraph 33).

I wonder why after the FBI told these plaintiffs that they were no security threat at all and let them go (paragraph 97), the airline didn't allow them to fly on another flight.

Now, I'm eagerly awaiting the answer of the defendants and the discovery period. I'd like to see how these allegations hold up.

But, from my perspective as a muslim traveler, I can't see anything that these men did wrong. I have prayed in the terminals at Minneapolis/Saint Paul airport. I've asked to move seats so I could sit next to friends. I read my arabic quran and use my prayer beads on the plane. And I sure as heck dress more "muslim" then these guys have. Forgive my ranting, but this just P*sses me off to no end.

Of course they are going to soft soap what happened. They want to get a big pot of money. There were plenty of witnesses that tell the same story and it disagrees with what these guys are saying.

Your right, lets wait for the trial. See what comes out then. I still don't think this was a case of ignorance or bias. I think these guys were making an azz of themselves to make some sort of point or to set up this lawsuit.

[GaryC 7]

But, from my perspective as a muslim traveler, I can't see anything that these men did wrong. I have prayed in the terminals at Minneapolis/Saint Paul airport. I've asked to move seats so I could sit next to friends. I read my arabic quran and use my prayer beads on the plane. And I sure as heck dress more "muslim" then these guys have. Forgive my ranting, but this just P*sses me off to no end.

I don't think you realize this but you have made a case for the prosecution with this statement. You say that you are a traveler. You say that you have done everything that these guys did and you didn't say you were ever hassled over it. You even said that you dress more "Muslim" than these guys. So why were you not given a problem? Because people see that you were no threat and you were minding your own business. So if you do all the things that these guys did and they were arrested when you were not that begs a question. What was different about these imams? Maybe they were doing all these things in a threatening manner? You see we are not all bigoted azz hats. We know when someone is acting in a threatening manner. These guys were. That is why they were taken off the plane. The bias you accuse us of is being demonstrated by you. You assume that when we see an Arab looking person praying we assume they are terrorists. Most of us are smart enough to not assume that. So please leave your bias out of this also.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

If there is a trial, then more evidence will come out. A white American woman dressed in hijab is not analygous to an Arab man praying in Arabic while traveling. Being Arab myself, flying with Arab sons and brothers, I can see how one can draw attention, but still, Muslims, male and female, fly every single day without a problem. I'm not sure what's gone on here, but I am not so sure it's all one sided.

Edited March 18, 2007 by Green-eyed girl

[UmmSqueakster 54]

LOL! This is a civil case. There isn't any prosecution. What I see here is people repeating unsubstantiated claims and rumors as if they were fact. That is what pisses me off, not people's bigotry and bias.

They sat in the formation of the 9/11 hijackers? Proof?

They said anti american statements? Proof?

One of the imams was faking his blindness? Proof?

They moved around to scare people? Proof?

They chose US Airways to make a statement? Proof?

The Complaint alleges that the imams acted in a perfectly normal manner and that the FBI determined they posed no threat and let them go.

I can see how they had no choice but to file a suit. There are so many conflicting "facts" going around about what did happen, so they state their case, the defendants will state theirs, and we'll see what evidence supports which facts.

God I love the american judicial system. I may just have to go to law school after all. I do wonder if my law firm will be MAC's defense team though, since we'rve represented them on a number of occasions. This could get interesting

[mybackpages 0]

Bravo Rahma!

[GaryC 7]

LOL! This is a civil case. There isn't any prosecution. What I see here is people repeating unsubstantiated claims and rumors as if they were fact. That is what pisses me off, not people's bigotry and bias.

They sat in the formation of the 9/11 hijackers? Proof?Who know and who cares.

They said anti american statements? Proof?Testimony from other passengers.

One of the imams was faking his blindness? Proof?I don't think anyone is disputing that.

They moved around to scare people? Proof?It depends on how they were doing it.

They chose US Airways to make a statement? Proof?I didn't say that. Take it up with whoever did.

The Complaint alleges that the imams acted in a perfectly normal manner and that the FBI determined they posed no threat and let them go.

I can see how they had no choice but to file a suit. There are so many conflicting "facts" going around about what did happen, so they state their case, the defendants will state theirs, and we'll see what evidence supports which facts.

God I love the american judicial system. I may just have to go to law school after all. I do wonder if my law firm will be MAC's defense team though, since we'rve represented them on a number of occasions. This could get interesting

All this depends on the way they were doing this. As you said before, you did all these things and no one questioned you. Why would these men be different? Because some of the passengers felt threatened and the flight crew apparently agreed. It was their demeanor that apparently was causing concern and not the actions. Don't be so quick to jump to their defense. I am willing to see what comes out of the lawsuit but I am willing to bet it wasn't as innocent as you are assuming.

[Otto 83]

I can see how they had no choice but to file a suit. There are so many conflicting "facts" going around about what did happen, so they state their case, the defendants will state theirs, and we'll see what evidence supports which facts.

God I love the american judicial system. I may just have to go to law school after all. I do wonder if my law firm will be MAC's defense team though, since we'rve represented them on a number of occasions. This could get interesting

They had the choice of turning the other cheek and moving on with their lives....

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

LOL! This is a civil case. There isn't any prosecution. What I see here is people repeating unsubstantiated claims and rumors as if they were fact. That is what pisses me off, not people's bigotry and bias.

They sat in the formation of the 9/11 hijackers? Proof?

They said anti american statements? Proof?

One of the imams was faking his blindness? Proof?

They moved around to scare people? Proof?

They chose US Airways to make a statement? Proof?

The Complaint alleges that the imams acted in a perfectly normal manner and that the FBI determined they posed no threat and let them go.

I can see how they had no choice but to file a suit. There are so many conflicting "facts" going around about what did happen, so they state their case, the defendants will state theirs, and we'll see what evidence supports which facts.

God I love the american judicial system. I may just have to go to law school after all. I do wonder if my law firm will be MAC's defense team though, since we'rve represented them on a number of occasions. This could get interesting

I would like you to just come out and defend the actions of the terrorists on 9/11. I bet you'll feel better after. Go ahead. I dare you.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

LOL! This is a civil case. There isn't any prosecution. What I see here is people repeating unsubstantiated claims and rumors as if they were fact. That is what pisses me off, not people's bigotry and bias.

They sat in the formation of the 9/11 hijackers? Proof?

They said anti american statements? Proof?

One of the imams was faking his blindness? Proof?

They moved around to scare people? Proof?

They chose US Airways to make a statement? Proof?

The Complaint alleges that the imams acted in a perfectly normal manner and that the FBI determined they posed no threat and let them go.

I can see how they had no choice but to file a suit. There are so many conflicting "facts" going around about what did happen, so they state their case, the defendants will state theirs, and we'll see what evidence supports which facts.

God I love the american judicial system. I may just have to go to law school after all. I do wonder if my law firm will be MAC's defense team though, since we'rve represented them on a number of occasions. This could get interesting

I would like you to just come out and defend the actions of the terrorists on 9/11. I bet you'll feel better after. Go ahead. I dare you.

Personally speaking, I see nothing wrong with waiting until all the facts of the case have come to light before jumping to a knee-jerk conclusion about it and making wild claims about "defending terrorists on 9/11".

Remember the story about Jean Charles de Menezes, the Brazilian electrician who was shot dead as a terrorist suspect by the Metropolitan police in the London Underground? When that story was discussed here - a large number of people defended the police actions based solely on the anecdotal evidence from various news stories. Turned out the facts of the case resulting from the court inquest turned up a rather different interpretation of the events...

Edited March 19, 2007 by erekose

[Otto 83]

But, from my perspective as a muslim traveler, I can't see anything that these men did wrong. I have prayed in the terminals at Minneapolis/Saint Paul airport. I've asked to move seats so I could sit next to friends. I read my arabic quran and use my prayer beads on the plane. And I sure as heck dress more "muslim" then these guys have. Forgive my ranting, but this just P*sses me off to no end.

What pisses me off are 15 men hijacking 4 airliners, flying hundreds of innocent people to their horrific deaths and leading to the death of thousands more on the ground causing the lives of countless families and loved ones to be ruined...

So if you, me, my family or anyone else get's their 'feelings hurt' while responsible people do their best to protect everyone and never let that happen again.......Tough Shi*!

~Rant

(In memory of David, AA Flight 11; Sept. 11, 2001)

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

But, from my perspective as a muslim traveler, I can't see anything that these men did wrong. I have prayed in the terminals at Minneapolis/Saint Paul airport. I've asked to move seats so I could sit next to friends. I read my arabic quran and use my prayer beads on the plane. And I sure as heck dress more "muslim" then these guys have. Forgive my ranting, but this just P*sses me off to no end.

What pisses me off are 15 men hijacking 4 airliners, flying hundreds of innocent people to their horrific deaths and leading to the death of thousands more on the ground causing the lives of countless families and loved ones to be ruined...

So if you, me, my family or anyone else get's their 'feelings hurt' while responsible people do their best to protect everyone and never let that happen again.......Tough Shi*!

~Rant

(In memory of David, AA Flight 11; Sept. 11, 2001)