Part 11 Question 9 - Ever been a part of a group/club etc???

[Ms Hogan 295]

OK I know we're supposed to take these questions at face value and answer based on the question itself and not to overthink it. But the only things i'm a member of are the PTA for my kid's school and a bunch of old car clubs I belong to!

Is that REALLY what the question is about?

[Darnell 8,479]

Na, they wanna know if'n you were a member of the communist party or the county-wide wife-swapping club.

[Elf 146]

Especially the county-wide wife-swapping club. They've been looking for a member to sponsor them forever...

Seriously, they're looking for membership of any political organization or party, of professional associations that might indicate that you have knowledge/training in the areas that trigger extra background checks, of paramilitary groups, labor unions, activist groups/campaigns - you get the idea.

I think it helps to understand why they're asking. Here's the rationale behind what seems like an insanely vague question. If I could get USCIS.gov to come up I'd give you a link to it (I believe it's an excerpt from the FAM), but for now I'll just copy it from a post on another site:

"The organizations of which the applicant is or has been a member are important because they may have a bearing upon his/her ability to demonstrate attachment to the principles of the Constitution of the United States and favorable disposition toward the good order and happiness of the United States. See section 316(a)(3) of the Act and 8 CFR 316.11 . The term "attachment" is a stronger term than "well disposed" and implies a depth of conviction that would lead to active support of the Constitution. See Interpretations 316.1(h)(3)(i) . A membership or an affiliation with any organization or group should not affect the applicant’s ability to demonstrate:

• An acceptance of the democratic, representational process established by the Constitution,
• A willingness to obey the laws which may result from that process, and
• An understanding of the means for change which are set by the Constitution.

The right to work for peaceful, political change is acceptable as long as the changes advocated do not abolish the current Government and establish an entirely different form of government. Advocacy of government overthrow by force and violence is not within any interpretation of the right to work for change, nor is the advocacy of Nazism. See Interpretations 316.1(h)(3)(ii) .

It is important that when conducting the examination, you question the applicant as to whether he/she was ever a member of or in any way associated (either directly or indirectly) with:

• The Communist Party,
• Any other totalitarian party, or
• A terrorist organization" (the list continues)

Edited November 22, 2015 by Elf

[Darnell 8,479]

Eh, really the bad club memberships are those that have a manifesto of overthrowing the usa. And thats what uscis is seeking. Unsure if La Raza counts anymore, or Farrakan's group, but hey.

[Ms Hogan 295]

Eh, really the bad club memberships are those that have a manifesto of overthrowing the usa. And thats what uscis is seeking. Unsure if La Raza counts anymore, or Farrakan's group, but hey.

Especially the county-wide wife-swapping club. They've been looking for a member to sponsor them forever...

Seriously, they're looking for membership of any political organization or party, of professional associations that might indicate that you have knowledge/training in the areas that trigger extra background checks, of paramilitary groups, labor unions, activist groups/campaigns - you get the idea.

I think it helps to understand why they're asking. Here's the rationale behind what seems like an insanely vague question. If I could get USCIS.gov to come up I'd give you a link to it (I believe it's an excerpt from the FAM), but for now I'll just copy it from a post on another site:

"The organizations of which the applicant is or has been a member are important because they may have a bearing upon his/her ability to demonstrate attachment to the principles of the Constitution of the United States and favorable disposition toward the good order and happiness of the United States. See section 316(a)(3) of the Act and 8 CFR 316.11 . The term "attachment" is a stronger term than "well disposed" and implies a depth of conviction that would lead to active support of the Constitution. See Interpretations 316.1(h)(3)(i) . A membership or an affiliation with any organization or group should not affect the applicant’s ability to demonstrate:

• An acceptance of the democratic, representational process established by the Constitution,

• A willingness to obey the laws which may result from that process, and

• An understanding of the means for change which are set by the Constitution.

The right to work for peaceful, political change is acceptable as long as the changes advocated do not abolish the current Government and establish an entirely different form of government. Advocacy of government overthrow by force and violence is not within any interpretation of the right to work for change, nor is the advocacy of Nazism. See Interpretations 316.1(h)(3)(ii) .

It is important that when conducting the examination, you question the applicant as to whether he/she was ever a member of or in any way associated (either directly or indirectly) with:

• The Communist Party,

• Any other totalitarian party, or

• A terrorist organization" (the list continues)

Na, they wanna know if'n you were a member of the communist party or the county-wide wife-swapping club.

Thanks, guys! When I read it I answered NO and then moved on but then went back to it a couple days later and stared at it and started over-thinking it. There are questions before and after relating specifically to AWFUL GROUPS and activities that I obviously said no to.

Do I just leave it as NO and move on!? Or do I still put YES and embarrassingly share my clubs?

Edited November 22, 2015 by Ms Hogan

[Elf 146]

I overthought it too, so I included any professional memberships I'd ever had, volunteer/charitable organizations, local community/activity groups I'm involved with and the fact that I've been a member of the local YMCA for a decade (it's the nearest gym to my house ). I left out trivia like the school debating club, even though it asks for everything you've ever been a member of since the age of 16. Our attorney didn't suggest leaving out anything I'd listed or adding anything I mentioned to him as having been left out, so I think that was an acceptable level of disclosure. I actually found it really interesting to look at the completed list and see what sort of picture it might present to someone who didn't know me.

[kovacs 20]

And in the end, my interviewer just barely looked at the list before putting a red check mark to idicate he had reviewed it :-/

I overthought it too, so I included any professional memberships I'd ever had, volunteer/charitable organizations, local community/activity groups I'm involved with and the fact that I've been a member of the local YMCA for a decade (it's the nearest gym to my house ). I left out trivia like the school debating club, even though it asks for everything you've ever been a member of since the age of 16. Our attorney didn't suggest leaving out anything I'd listed or adding anything I mentioned to him as having been left out, so I think that was an acceptable level of disclosure. I actually found it really interesting to look at the completed list and see what sort of picture it might present to someone who didn't know me.

[Elf 146]

And in the end, my interviewer just barely looked at the list before putting a red check mark to idicate he had reviewed it :-/

That'll be because you didn't list the county-wide wife-swapping club

Believe it or not, my interviewer asked me the "have you been a member of any organizations, associations, clubs etc since the age of 16"? question at the interview. That would have flustered me a lot more if I hadn't been aware of the intent behind the question, because who hasn't been a member of many different groups over the years? And for some of us, 16 was a very long time ago

As it was, because I'd thought about that question for a long time wile completing the application, I only stumbled a little bit when asked it again at interview. I missed out one or two of the groups I'd listed on the form, but the interviewer put a checkmark on the list anyway.

[NikLR 13,232]

I'm pretty sure I put no, even thought I was in 4H from age 9-18.... I figured they meant political parties, gun toting clubs, satanist groups... that sort of thing.

[moekaroit 1]

Na, they wanna know if'n you were a member of the communist party or the county-wide wife-swapping club.

cant stop

OK I know we're supposed to take these questions at face value and answer based on the question itself and not to overthink it. But the only things i'm a member of are the PTA for my kid's school and a bunch of old car clubs I belong to!

Is that REALLY what the question is about?

better they say '' why did he mention those groups? we didnt even ask about them'' than saying ''he didnt mention those groups, he is a liar'' so mention them, you are not going to lose anything

Edited November 23, 2015 by moekaroit

[Ms Hogan 295]

I'm pretty sure I put no, even thought I was in 4H from age 9-18.... I figured they meant political parties, gun toting clubs, satanist groups... that sort of thing.

When did you have to answer about being a part of clubs? Did we do this on something else previously? I don't remember anything on our previous stuff like what I'm looking at on the citizenship paperwork!?!?!? I don't want to contradict anything I wrote before.

[NikLR 13,232]

I thought there was something on the DS260. And because I'm a dork and cannot pay attention to forums... yup now we're here.

[Elf 146]

When did you have to answer about being a part of clubs? Did we do this on something else previously? I don't remember anything on our previous stuff like what I'm looking at on the citizenship paperwork!?!?!? I don't want to contradict anything I wrote before.

Those of us who did AOS had that question on the I-485.

[Ms Hogan 295]

I thought there was something on the DS260. And because I'm a dork and cannot pay attention to forums... yup now we're here.

Well now you KNOW what I'm doing... going digging through the DS-260. I didn't find anywhere to list clubs but had to say yes or no to a pile of questions making them aware that i was not a communist, or prostitute or coming to America to engage in espionage or polygamy... etc etc etc...

But didn't have to list that I was a member of a club... I'm going to bore them with my answers but I'll include my previous club affiliations lol

NLR... are you still going to wait for the 5 year mark or go for it? I want to be able to vote next year!

[NikLR 13,232]

I refuse to send relationship evidence to the USCIS anymore. I've had to prove to them twice I have a genuine relationship. Sigh... I prefer not to do it again.

My husband laughs of course, and says I'll never become a citizen because I don't think the USA is the best country in the world. LOL