What do you think makes a woman want to have an abortion?

[DavenRoxy 1,073]

The number of women who 'willy - nilly' decide to abort is so miniscule there is no reason to bring it up. It is not up to you, Danno, or anyone else for that matter, to make sure that the abortion only happens for the 'right' reason. If Danno was on a panel that decided if the woman had the proper reason for seeking an abortion, the right to get one would cease to effectively exist.

Abortion as birth control is self limiting. A woman who aborts because she can't afford to have a baby should not be sterilized, it is possible to become pregnant even taking the best modern precautions.

Perhaps we need to further define "willy-nilly".

In December 2013, these facts were put out by Guttmacher:

The reasons women give for having an abortion underscore their understanding of the responsibilities of parenthood and family life. Three-fourths of women cite concern for or responsibility to other individuals; three-fourths say they cannot afford a child; three-fourths say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or the ability to care for dependents; and half say they do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner.

I fully understand why a rape victim would not want a child. And of course, if pregnancy was unhealthy for the mother. But "it will interfere with my job" or "I can't afford it"? How about they use precaution or not engage in sexual activity if their career is more important?

In 2009, 85% of women who had an abortion were unmarried.

Edited January 27, 2014 by DavenRoxy

[JohnR! 5,495]

I fully understand why a rape victim would not want a child. And of course, if pregnancy was unhealthy for the mother. But "it will interfere with my job" or "I can't afford it"? How about they use precaution or not engage in sexual activity if their career is more important?

All of the above are very reasonable causes for a woman to terminate a pregancy.

Last time I checked few and far between are the men who will sacrifice their careers for a child, fewer still are those who will restrain from having sex or abstain, as you suggest, for lack of condoms.

I will believe any of this BS when the pro-lifers fund a campaign promoting vasectomies. Until then it is just a bunch of crock... You want to do something to prevent abortions? Do your part in preventing pregnancies.

If we are to even suggest a woman should carry to term the burden of an unwanted pregnancy, then we should defer the decision to them and their doctors. Their bodies. Their choice. It is really not that complicated.

Edited January 27, 2014 by Gegel

[Danno 1,228]

One other thing: Sentiments like this are those of an "extremist." They are not helpful in rational discussion. The Republican "key base of support" is made up of people that are much more tolerant of opposing views than you are.

Point well made.

I mean here I am a prolife® and I absolutely understand the desire to undue the result of a careless act.

I think most people can sympathize with that.

I know of several persons who carry a lifelong STD. I know of people who have police records which will limit their horizon the rest of their life.

I know of a guy who was a chip-n-dales type dancer who is now in a wheel chair due to a car accident.

So life is full of these burdens, in many cases they fall onto us through no fault of our own, yet we must carry on.

For some reason when it comes to getting knocked-up, a women gets a "get out of jail" card. To hear some talk, she not only has this card but she can wait right up until the moment of her childs birth to cash it in.

Contrary to some, I think I am reasonable on this issue. I think in some cases, the destruction of the unborn might be a regrettable reality that we have to allow.

Using Abortion as a form of birth control is not one of them.

[JohnR! 5,495]

Using Abortion as a form of birth control is not one of them.

That is why it is a decision best left to each individual. There is no one-size-fits-all in this instance. Each person has a story and a reason.

[Danno 1,228]

That is why it is a decision best left to each individual. There is no one-size-fits-all in this instance. Each person has a story and a reason.

No, actually you are again ill informed as to the matter you are posting on.

I want you to start reading up a bit, begin with the Supreme Courts findings and you will realize abortion already has restrictions.

We are simply debating what those should be, both on a legal plane and on a moral plane.

[JohnR! 5,495]

We are simply debating what those should be, both on a legal plane and on a moral plane.

In that case the legal decision has already been made, by the SCOTUS, forty years ago.

As far as the moral restrictions I believe we should let each woman decide on what those should be. You get to choose the restrictions you want for your life, and others do the same. You can have your cake and eat it too, as do everyone else.

It is really not that complicated.

Edited January 27, 2014 by Gegel

[Danno 1,228]

In that case the legal decision has already been made, by the SCOTUS, forty years ago.

As far as the moral restrictions I believe we should let each woman decide on what those should be. You get to choose the restrictions you want for your life, and others do the same.

Are you in touch with anything outside the bubble?

You do realize this notion that women control their bodies in the way you fantasize is just that?

Even in things such as getting a silly tattoo, the law can dictate where she can have one and where not.

Are women allowed to sell a kidney?

or even walk topless on a beach where men can?

Oh I know but in your mind "My body my choice" right?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

One other thing: Sentiments like this are those of an "extremist." They are not helpful in rational discussion. The Republican "key base of support" is made up of people that are much more tolerant of opposing views than you are.

How do you know? Do you think I believe that abortion should have no restrictions whatsoever? I certainly don't.

However, the Republican position on this issue IS driven by people who oppose abortion for religious reasons. They do not care about the rights of women to have control over their own bodily processes for any reason whatsoever.

Politicians should not try to legislate articles of religious faith, its backward.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Perhaps we need to further define "willy-nilly".

In December 2013, these facts were put out by Guttmacher:

The reasons women give for having an abortion underscore their understanding of the responsibilities of parenthood and family life. Three-fourths of women cite concern for or responsibility to other individuals; three-fourths say they cannot afford a child; three-fourths say that having a baby would interfere with work, school or the ability to care for dependents; and half say they do not want to be a single parent or are having problems with their husband or partner.

I fully understand why a rape victim would not want a child. And of course, if pregnancy was unhealthy for the mother. But "it will interfere with my job" or "I can't afford it"? How about they use precaution or not engage in sexual activity if their career is more important?

In 2009, 85% of women who had an abortion were unmarried.

People complain about single parent families and having kids that they can't afford, yet it somehow makes sense to deny someone the right to take responsibility for their own lives.

'They should have thought about it before they had sex' is what people like Danno like to say (in fact Danno has explicitly said this in the past), yet this involves someone making a rather patronising moral judgement in a doctors office. Can you imagine someone wagging a finger in your face for having sex with someone you met in a bar on a Friday night? Maybe when every doctors office comes with a catholic priest for 'moral guidance'. Just ridiculous.

The reality is contraception fails, relationships break down, people have one too many drinks or what have you - in short, life happens. The issue is whether women should be punished for that and have control of their lives taken away from them in service of having a child that they don't want or can't care for.

People always seem to assume that abortion is an easy option, almost like then woman is getting her hair and nails done at the same time. It is not. Are there irresponsible women out there who don't use contraception? Absolutely, my question would be 'so what'.

Edited January 27, 2014 by Papa Lazarou

[JohnR! 5,495]

Are you in touch with anything outside the bubble?

You do realize this notion that women control their bodies in the way you fantasize is just that?

Even in things such as getting a silly tattoo, the law can dictate where she can have one and where not.

Are women allowed to sell a kidney?

or even walk topless on a beach where men can?

Oh I know but in your mind "My body my choice" right?

Your argument would be valid if you could compare organ donation to abortion, in a legal context, but you can't do so.

The American justice system is based on jurisprudence, or simply put, precedent. In the case of abortion its legality was already ruled by the SCOTUS. A precedent has been set.

In order to compare abortion to the sale of organs, you would need a similar ruling by the SCOTUS on the specific legality of such endeavor. The closest we ever got to that was Moore v. Regents.

Therefore, in essence, when it comes to the specific issue of abortion, the SCOTUS ruling pretty much determined that 'my body, my choice' applies.

[decocker 7,198]

Danno how many innocent sperms have you killed in your lifetime? Why do you or did you, allow your wife to mercilessly flush away egg after viable egg?

What you fail to understand is that the overwhelming majority of humanity 'gets' how the religious zealot Rights 'think' about conception, but the majority reject your point of view. The majority of people fully understand the very clear difference between having an early abortion and strangling an 18 month old child. That you cannot isn't a big surprise.

you win the internets forever.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

If I was head of the Pub party

I would call all prospective candidates together and issue one firm proclamation

" The first one of you who says the words abortion or rape for the next 4 years will be thrown out of the party.

Our Country is failing fast and you are making one of the most polarizing issue in the Nation your Main topic

Freaking morons

But this is what the Republican party is. It's the sole legislative agenda and achievement they can present. Abortion and gay marriage and repealing Obamacare. That's all they have dealt with for the past half decade. Successes they could book only on the former two. And that deserves discussion. Sure, they're trying to put some lipstick on that pig right now but that does not change the fact that it's still a pig. They shorten the GOP primary process for 2016 so that these little gems don't have to come out in the open as Republican candidates compete for the vote of the base. I, for one, welcome honest and open Republican politicians for telling it like it is. Keep it coming, I say, Keep it coming.

[sharky-rex 76]

I'm anti-abortion, but I am also pro-choice. It seems to me that sometimes, pro-life people need to realize two things:

1. You have no idea what each woman's individual circumstances are. Some women are raped. Some woman are in abusive relationships. Some women want the baby, but the pregnancy has put her life at risk. Yes, some women are simply irresponsible or under-educated, but to put a blanket "women who have abortions are evil" statement on every situation shows that you are incapable of critical thought and reasoning.

2. Once you realize #1, you will begin to understand that the best way to reduce abortions is not to restrict access for the women who truly need them, but rather, to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies.

Two ways we could accomplish this are to increase funding for sex education (especially in low-income communities), and to subsidize birth control. For everyone. Birth control should be totally 100% free. We all should have the right to safe sex, and it shouldn't matter whether you can afford a pack of condoms or a doctor's visit to get the pill.

Increase access to contraception, increase education, reduce the number of abortions. It's that simple.

[elmcitymaven 9,711]

Two-time, unrepentant, within the bounds of matrimony terminator here! (As I'm sure you all know, since we've been down this road many times.) My ex and I believed we were too young and not at a point in our careers where we could provide for a child the way we believed our child should be cared for. It happened twice and we gave much thought to our decision both times. We had reasons for and against pursuing the path we did, especially the second time when we were a little older (but not much). We were nice middle-class people climbing the corporate ladder. We had and continue to have no regrets.

These weren't decisions made willy-nilly. We considered our options and chose the path best for us as a couple. In fact we believed our decisions to be deeply moral. Your approval or disapproval is immaterial.

[Teddy B 17,251]

I'm anti-abortion, but I am also pro-choice. It seems to me that sometimes, pro-life people need to realize two things:

1. You have no idea what each woman's individual circumstances are. Some women are raped. Some woman are in abusive relationships. Some women want the baby, but the pregnancy has put her life at risk. Yes, some women are simply irresponsible or under-educated, but to put a blanket "women who have abortions are evil" statement on every situation shows that you are incapable of critical thought and reasoning.

2. Once you realize #1, you will begin to understand that the best way to reduce abortions is not to restrict access for the women who truly need them, but rather, to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies.

Two ways we could accomplish this are to increase funding for sex education (especially in low-income communities), and to subsidize birth control. For everyone. Birth control should be totally 100% free. We all should have the right to safe sex, and it shouldn't matter whether you can afford a pack of condoms or a doctor's visit to get the pill.

Increase access to contraception, increase education, reduce the number of abortions. It's that simple.

As logical and financially responsible this is in the long run, you'll still have a very large group of people who will scoff at the very idea simply because it goes against their religious beliefs. Instead of being pro-active, they would rather spend all of their time pointing fingers at minorities and blaming single mothers for having babies and then crying about having to pay for their welfare.