Jump to content

34 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

Filed: Timeline
Posted (edited)

I have one more thing that I've always wondered. Let's say we become US citizen after the oath. But how does the country of birth knows that we are now citizens of another country? Do we automatically abandon our old citizenship once we become a US citizen? I mean many of us are still having the passports from the birth country. I just wonder how would this all work out by itself.

Edited by fedupme
Filed: AOS (pnd) Country: Iceland
Timeline
Posted

I have one more thing that I've always wondered. Let's say we become US citizen after the oath. But how does the country of birth knows that we are now citizens of another country? Do we automatically abandon our old citizenship once we become a US citizen? I mean many of us are still having the passports from the birth country. I just wonder how would this all work out by itself.

In most cases your home country will never know unless you tell them.

Passports are the property of the countries that issue them, not the property of you as the passport holder.

The US does not confiscate your old passport, and even if they would you would in most cases be able to contact the embassy of your home country and ask to get it back or get a new one.

--

See my Profile -> Signature&Story -> Story for further timeline info.

I-131 AP - Status: Completed (Expires Nov. 2008)

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-November-16 - Application Approved

I-485 AOS - Status: Completed

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-September-20 - Delivered in Chicago

2007-September-25 - Date of NOA1 for Application

MORE DETAILED TIMELINE INFO MY PROFILE UNDER "SIGNATURE & STORY"

2008-January-31 - Green Card Production Ordered

2008-February-01 - Welcome Notice Mailed

I-765 EAD - Status: Completed (Expires Nov. 2008)

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-November-20 - Application Approved

Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: Canada
Timeline
Posted (edited)

When you take your US citizenship oath, you orally renounce your allegiance to any other country. Whether you retain your old citizenship (once the old country becomes aware of your US citizenship) depends on the country.

China and India, among others [possibly Ukraine and/or Russia] , do not allow their citizens to hold any other citizenship. They will revoke your old citizenship when/if they become aware of the new once.

Germany will revoke your German citizenship unless you went through a paperwork process beforehand to get permision from the German government to get another citizenship.

Canada ignores the oral renunciation you made in your US citizenship oath. They will still consider you a Canadian citizen until and unless you fill out special paperwork at a Canadian embassy, formally renouncing your Canadian citizenship. I believe, but am not absolutely certain, that a good sized chunk of western Europe (but not Germany, see above) have the same position.

As you can see, this varies radically from country to country. You'll have to check with the consulates of the specific countries, unless someone in the region-specific forums here knows.

(I should point out that you cannot automatically lose your old citizenship. Even in cases where they summarily [and retroactively to the date of your US naturalization] revoke it upon learning of your US citizenship, you will be formally notified, and if you have not been notified, you are almost certainly still a citizen of that country.)

Edited by HeatDeath

DON'T PANIC

"It says wonderful things about the two countries [Canada and the US] that neither one feels itself being inundated by each other's immigrants."

-Douglas Coupland

Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: Germany
Timeline
Posted

(I should point out that you cannot automatically lose your old citizenship. Even in cases where they summarily [and retroactively to the date of your US naturalization] revoke it upon learning of your US citizenship, you will be formally notified, and if you have not been notified, you are almost certainly still a citizen of that country.)

That's not necessarily true. In the case of Germany, for example, you automatically lose your German citizenship the minute you accept the naturalization certificate of another country unless you have obtained advance permission (Beibehaltungsgenehmigung) bei the German authorities to do so. Now, of course, whether the German authorities will ever become aware that you have obtained another citizenship is another matter, but legally the situation is quite clear. If you still pretend to be a German citizen and/or use your German passport without being in possession of your Beibehaltungsgenehmigung, you are committing fraud (or whatever they call this particular case of misrepresenting the truth). And they will find out the next time you want your passport renewed at the embassy because they require proof of your legal presence in the country. -- I know this for a fact because my wife wants to retain her German citizenship and she had to obtain the Beibehaltungsgenehmigung to be able to do so legally.

So, fedupme, if you're thinking of retaining your old citizenship, you should find out if, and if yes, under what circumstances, your country allows you to do so.

My wife's USCIS journey:

I-130 (IR1) Timeline

03-26-07 -- I-130 sent to VSC

09-20-07 -- Permanent Resident

N-400 Timeline

09-20-10 -- N-400 sent to Dallas lockbox

09-24-10 -- Check cashed

09-27-10 -- NOA received

10-07-10 -- Biometrics letter rec'd (appointment for 10/19/2010)

10-15-10 -- Biometrics done (walk-in at Alexandria, VA facility)

10-23-10 -- Another Biometrics letter rec'd (1st fingerprint set unusable according to FBI; appointment for 11/19/2010)

10-25-10 -- 2nd Biometrics done (walk-in at Alexandria, VA facility)

10-26-10 -- Called FBI: Second fingerprint set okay

11-20-10 -- Yellow letter received

01-26-11 -- Interview letter received

03-01-11 -- Interview (Civics test passed, but "Decision cannot yet be made" -- Docs missing)

03-25-11 -- Oath letter received

04-18-11 -- Oath Ceremony -- USC

Filed: Other Timeline
Posted

I have a friend in a German jail. He became a US citizen before the German law change of 01/01/2000 allowed for dual citizenship, provided a BBG had been applied for and issued before taking the oath. He assumed that nobody would ever know and continued to use his German passport when entering Germany. He temporarily moved back 18 months ago, and got a job. About 8 months ago he was arrested and prosecuted as an illegal alien who worked without authorization, pretending to be a German citizen. One of the charges was document fraud. He was sentenced to 1 year in prison and will be deported to the US once time is served. He will also never be allowed to visit his old country again.

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism. When I refer to hyphenated Americans, I do not refer to naturalized Americans. Some of the very best Americans I have ever known were naturalized Americans, Americans born abroad. But a hyphenated American is not an American at all . . . . The one absolutely certain way of bringing this nation to ruin, of preventing all possibility of its continuing to be a nation at all, would be to permit it to become a tangle of squabbling nationalities, an intricate knot of German-Americans, Irish-Americans, English-Americans, French-Americans, Scandinavian-Americans or Italian-Americans, each preserving its separate nationality, each at heart feeling more sympathy with Europeans of that nationality, than with the other citizens of the American Republic . . . . There is no such thing as a hyphenated American who is a good American. The only man who is a good American is the man who is an American and nothing else.

President Teddy Roosevelt on Columbus Day 1915

Filed: Timeline
Posted

I see. The reason why I was asking is because I wanted to make sure everything is clear and final. I mean I am not trying to possess two citizenship or anything. I'm a Chinese at birth. And I believe neither US nor China allows dual citizenship. I guess next time when I revisit China, I will definitely apply for a visa to enter. Also I respect both countries dearly. While I'm taking the oath to America, I want to make sure that I say my most respectful farewell to my birth country as well, so I hope there is a formal way of letting the birth country know that I actually did become a citizen of another country. That's just my thought. I think I will ask some Chinese-American later about their experience. But thanks guys for your replies.

Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: Germany
Timeline
Posted

... I'm a Chinese at birth. And I believe neither US nor China allows dual citizenship. ...

It seems that China indeed does not allow dual citizenship and that the loss of citizenship will be automatic if you get naturalized in another country. If you google "does China allow dual citizenship", you'll find plenty of information online.

My wife's USCIS journey:

I-130 (IR1) Timeline

03-26-07 -- I-130 sent to VSC

09-20-07 -- Permanent Resident

N-400 Timeline

09-20-10 -- N-400 sent to Dallas lockbox

09-24-10 -- Check cashed

09-27-10 -- NOA received

10-07-10 -- Biometrics letter rec'd (appointment for 10/19/2010)

10-15-10 -- Biometrics done (walk-in at Alexandria, VA facility)

10-23-10 -- Another Biometrics letter rec'd (1st fingerprint set unusable according to FBI; appointment for 11/19/2010)

10-25-10 -- 2nd Biometrics done (walk-in at Alexandria, VA facility)

10-26-10 -- Called FBI: Second fingerprint set okay

11-20-10 -- Yellow letter received

01-26-11 -- Interview letter received

03-01-11 -- Interview (Civics test passed, but "Decision cannot yet be made" -- Docs missing)

03-25-11 -- Oath letter received

04-18-11 -- Oath Ceremony -- USC

Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: Canada
Timeline
Posted (edited)

Wow. I would have thought that being stripped of one's citizenship would be accompanied by a lot more due process, especially in Western Europe. I stand corrected.

I'm glad I'm Canadian.

Edited by HeatDeath

DON'T PANIC

"It says wonderful things about the two countries [Canada and the US] that neither one feels itself being inundated by each other's immigrants."

-Douglas Coupland

Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: Germany
Timeline
Posted (edited)

Wow. I would have thought that being stripped of one's citizenship would be accompanied by a lot more due process, especially in Western Europe. I stand corrected.

But you are not being stripped of your citizenship. The law says that you gave it up voluntarily the moment you accepted another citizenship. That does not require due process. In other words, the authorities are not going to come and ask you whether you really wanted to do that; the assumption is that you really did want to do that if you are of sound mind. Due process still applies if the authorities try to establish the fact that you hold a foreign citizenship. You may appeal their decision and fight it in the courts. But in the end it hinges on a simple fact: Did you or did you not accept being naturalized in another country. And if you did, then you have been a foreign citizen from the moment you accepted the other citizenship and all consequences flow from that.

Edited by hhN400

My wife's USCIS journey:

I-130 (IR1) Timeline

03-26-07 -- I-130 sent to VSC

09-20-07 -- Permanent Resident

N-400 Timeline

09-20-10 -- N-400 sent to Dallas lockbox

09-24-10 -- Check cashed

09-27-10 -- NOA received

10-07-10 -- Biometrics letter rec'd (appointment for 10/19/2010)

10-15-10 -- Biometrics done (walk-in at Alexandria, VA facility)

10-23-10 -- Another Biometrics letter rec'd (1st fingerprint set unusable according to FBI; appointment for 11/19/2010)

10-25-10 -- 2nd Biometrics done (walk-in at Alexandria, VA facility)

10-26-10 -- Called FBI: Second fingerprint set okay

11-20-10 -- Yellow letter received

01-26-11 -- Interview letter received

03-01-11 -- Interview (Civics test passed, but "Decision cannot yet be made" -- Docs missing)

03-25-11 -- Oath letter received

04-18-11 -- Oath Ceremony -- USC

Filed: AOS (pnd) Country: Iceland
Timeline
Posted

I have a friend in a German jail. He became a US citizen before the German law change of 01/01/2000 allowed for dual citizenship, provided a BBG had been applied for and issued before taking the oath. He assumed that nobody would ever know and continued to use his German passport when entering Germany. He temporarily moved back 18 months ago, and got a job. About 8 months ago he was arrested and prosecuted as an illegal alien who worked without authorization, pretending to be a German citizen. One of the charges was document fraud. He was sentenced to 1 year in prison and will be deported to the US once time is served. He will also never be allowed to visit his old country again.

Wow, I guess it´s good to be from a small country then...

Today Iceland does officially not care if you have another citizenship, or 10, but back when it was illegal to have another one it was one of those 'naughty, naughty´ slap on the wrist kind of offenses.

Just out of curiosity, this BBG process, is it relatively hard to get approved or relatively easy?

--

See my Profile -> Signature&Story -> Story for further timeline info.

I-131 AP - Status: Completed (Expires Nov. 2008)

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-November-16 - Application Approved

I-485 AOS - Status: Completed

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-September-20 - Delivered in Chicago

2007-September-25 - Date of NOA1 for Application

MORE DETAILED TIMELINE INFO MY PROFILE UNDER "SIGNATURE & STORY"

2008-January-31 - Green Card Production Ordered

2008-February-01 - Welcome Notice Mailed

I-765 EAD - Status: Completed (Expires Nov. 2008)

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-November-20 - Application Approved

Posted
Wow. I would have thought that being stripped of one's citizenship would be accompanied by a lot more due process, especially in Western Europe. I stand corrected.

I'm glad I'm Canadian.

Western Europe has several countries, each of which has different laws on this subject. Germany (subject of hhN400) doesn't allow duality, where UK does (exactly like Canada, but different fees/forms).
Wow, I guess it´s good to be from a small country then...

Today Iceland does officially not care if you have another citizenship, or 10, but back when it was illegal to have another one it was one of those 'naughty, naughty´ slap on the wrist kind of offenses.

Just out of curiosity, this BBG process, is it relatively hard to get approved or relatively easy?

depends on your definition of "small"--UK is small in area, but substantial (about 1/5 US, and about twice Canada) population, and allows dual-citizenship.

2005/07/10 I-129F filed for Pras

2005/11/07 I-129F approved, forwarded to NVC--to Chennai Consulate 2005/11/14

2005/12/02 Packet-3 received from Chennai

2005/12/21 Visa Interview Date

2006/04/04 Pras' entry into US at DTW

2006/04/15 Church Wedding at Novi (Detroit suburb), MI

2006/05/01 AOS Packet (I-485/I-131/I-765) filed at Chicago

2006/08/23 AP and EAD approved. Two down, 1.5 to go

2006/10/13 Pras' I-485 interview--APPROVED!

2006/10/27 Pras' conditional GC arrives -- .5 to go (2 yrs to Conditions Removal)

2008/07/21 I-751 (conditions removal) filed

2008/08/22 I-751 biometrics completed

2009/06/18 I-751 approved

2009/07/03 10-year GC received; last 0.5 done!

2009/07/23 Pras files N-400

2009/11/16 My 46TH birthday, Pras N-400 approved

2010/03/18 Pras' swear-in

---------------------------------------------------------------------

As long as the LORD's beside me, I don't care if this road ever ends.

Posted

To answer the original question - you have to notify you current country of your status changes - actually even when you become a resident of a different country. Each country handles it differently. Some countries allow dual citizenship and others don't. Some, as JustBob said, take it to extreme measures since you did not do your duty as a citizen of X country, and notified the authorities of your status changes. Others could care less.

For the US, they do not recognize dual citizenship - but they do not force you to give up other citizenships. The way they look at it is that you are a US citizen and a US citizen only. You MUST leave/enter the US with a valid US passport and that's all they care about.

N-400 Naturalization Timeline

06/28/11 .. Mailed N-400 package via Priority mail with delivery confirmation

06/30/11 .. Package Delivered to Dallas Lockbox

07/06/11 .. Received e-mail notification of application acceptance

07/06/11 .. Check cashed

07/08/11 .. Received NOA letter

07/29/11 .. Received text/e-mail for biometrics notice

08/03/11 .. Received Biometrics letter - scheduled for 8/24/11

08/04/11 .. Walk-in finger prints done.

08/08/11 .. Received text/e-mail: Placed in line for interview scheduling

09/12/11 .. Received Yellow letter dated 9/7/11

09/13/11 .. Received text/e-mail: Interview scheduled

09/16/11 .. Received interview letter

10/19/11 .. Interview - PASSED

10/20/11 .. Received text/email: Oath scheduled

10/22/11 .. Received OATH letter

11/09/11 .. Oath ceremony

Filed: Other Timeline
Posted

Yes. For now.

But here's the thing. When taking the Oath of Allegiance, one really swears off any loyalty to any other country. But, and it's a big BUT, it is possible, just possible, that one day an elected President of the United States will say . . . ####### . . . I don't accept that. That's hogwash. These new Americans have sworn and I will hold them accountable for their oath. This ain't Disneyland, after all.

Whoops, 1 signature on 1 Executive Order and every naturalized citizen has to provide proof within a certain time frame that they did indeed say goodbye to their former past.

Is it likely? I don't know. But it sure as heaven is possible.

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism. When I refer to hyphenated Americans, I do not refer to naturalized Americans. Some of the very best Americans I have ever known were naturalized Americans, Americans born abroad. But a hyphenated American is not an American at all . . . . The one absolutely certain way of bringing this nation to ruin, of preventing all possibility of its continuing to be a nation at all, would be to permit it to become a tangle of squabbling nationalities, an intricate knot of German-Americans, Irish-Americans, English-Americans, French-Americans, Scandinavian-Americans or Italian-Americans, each preserving its separate nationality, each at heart feeling more sympathy with Europeans of that nationality, than with the other citizens of the American Republic . . . . There is no such thing as a hyphenated American who is a good American. The only man who is a good American is the man who is an American and nothing else.

President Teddy Roosevelt on Columbus Day 1915

Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: England
Timeline
Posted

Until the U.S. has free universal health care, there is no way I would give up my U.K. Citizenship. It could mean the difference between life and death or at least being reduced to abject poverty. My red passport guarantees that can never happen to me.

I like life in the U.S. but only so long as I am reasonably healthy and the insurance is paying up. I feel sorry for Americans who have no safety net were things to go badly wrong with their health and the insurance company stops coverage or wriggles out of the contract...

Most Americans simply refuse to think about it. My USC wife is deeply aware of this reality and plans on doing 3 years in the U.K. and getting a red passport when she early retires. She lived there for a year and didn't pay a cent - or even a penny. It is worth literally millions of dollars or even life itself in some circumstances.

If the U.K. started to refuse dual citizenship I would withdraw my U.S. Citizenship application right now. I reckon a lot of Canadians would too from what I have read.

moresheep400100.jpg

Filed: AOS (pnd) Country: Iceland
Timeline
Posted

Until the U.S. has free universal health care, there is no way I would give up my U.K. Citizenship. It could mean the difference between life and death or at least being reduced to abject poverty. My red passport guarantees that can never happen to me.

I like life in the U.S. but only so long as I am reasonably healthy and the insurance is paying up. I feel sorry for Americans who have no safety net were things to go badly wrong with their health and the insurance company stops coverage or wriggles out of the contract...

Most Americans simply refuse to think about it. My USC wife is deeply aware of this reality and plans on doing 3 years in the U.K. and getting a red passport when she early retires. She lived there for a year and didn't pay a cent - or even a penny. It is worth literally millions of dollars or even life itself in some circumstances.

If the U.K. started to refuse dual citizenship I would withdraw my U.S. Citizenship application right now. I reckon a lot of Canadians would too from what I have read.

That's exactly how I feel. If I, my wife (who was born here) or any of our children ever get terminally ill I/we are out of here ASAP. I'm not bankrupting myself here because this country has a lot of silly people that don't get it how universal coverage gives a peace of mind and simply for the most part takes healthcare concerns out of the picture.

--

See my Profile -> Signature&Story -> Story for further timeline info.

I-131 AP - Status: Completed (Expires Nov. 2008)

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-November-16 - Application Approved

I-485 AOS - Status: Completed

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-September-20 - Delivered in Chicago

2007-September-25 - Date of NOA1 for Application

MORE DETAILED TIMELINE INFO MY PROFILE UNDER "SIGNATURE & STORY"

2008-January-31 - Green Card Production Ordered

2008-February-01 - Welcome Notice Mailed

I-765 EAD - Status: Completed (Expires Nov. 2008)

2007-September-18 - Mailed to Chicago

2007-November-20 - Application Approved

 
Didn't find the answer you were looking for? Ask our VJ Immigration Lawyers.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
- Back to Top -

Important Disclaimer: Please read carefully the Visajourney.com Terms of Service. If you do not agree to the Terms of Service you should not access or view any page (including this page) on VisaJourney.com. Answers and comments provided on Visajourney.com Forums are general information, and are not intended to substitute for informed professional medical, psychiatric, psychological, tax, legal, investment, accounting, or other professional advice. Visajourney.com does not endorse, and expressly disclaims liability for any product, manufacturer, distributor, service or service provider mentioned or any opinion expressed in answers or comments. VisaJourney.com does not condone immigration fraud in any way, shape or manner. VisaJourney.com recommends that if any member or user knows directly of someone involved in fraudulent or illegal activity, that they report such activity directly to the Department of Homeland Security, Immigration and Customs Enforcement. You can contact ICE via email at Immigration.Reply@dhs.gov or you can telephone ICE at 1-866-347-2423. All reported threads/posts containing reference to immigration fraud or illegal activities will be removed from this board. If you feel that you have found inappropriate content, please let us know by contacting us here with a url link to that content. Thank you.
×
×
  • Create New...