I'm in UK, pregnant but fiance is a permanent resident. I want to have my child in USA. What are my options.

[zauberblume 0]

Z...

Immigration does not need to prove that you had immigrant intent... the burden of proof is on the petitioner. This means that the petitioner has to provide the necessary evidence that would convince a USCIS adjudicator that there was no immigrant intent upon their entry to the US.

Your logic does not work in the world of US Immigration. It's pretty clear that everywhere in the universe that if one has the intention to immigrate, then a visa is required for that option. That's the way it is for everywhere. ALso, when you get an non-immigrant visa it is clearly spelled out what the visa allows you to do. Also for those who enter on VWP, when you fill out the I-94W, it clearly states that you entry is based on a non-immigrant intent and the consequences for not following the rules of VWP. So to state that there was no way of knowing what the rules of your entry were is also false. There is plenty of notice on what the rules are.

Next, if she did what you suggested, there are a couple of issues..

1) She is not eligible to adjust her status from a visitor status to a PR becuase as the spouse of a PR, she is not eligible for an immediate immigrant visa number. THe I-485 is only available for spouses of US CItizens who have an immediate visa number available.

2) If she did stay, she would not be in status for more than about 4 years of so while she waited for an immigrant visa number to be available. While she is here, she would have no status.. so no health care, no driver license, no nothing.

3) Just because she has a baby here, there have been cases where even though the baby is a US Citizen and the parents are illegals, the Immigration courts have had no problems with removing the parents. In this case, since the father is legal, the Immigration Courts have even a larger standing to remove the mother as the father is legal.

4) By harboring a illegal, her husband would be violating US Immigration law and would put both his permanent resident status and his subsequent opportunity for Naturalization in jeopardy.

In my first paragraph, I said, "I wonder how the immigrant manages to prove that she or he had absolutely no intentions of coming to the United States with the intent of marrying and remaining." I know that the immigrant must provide the necessary evidence to prove that he or she had no immigration intent. I posed that question to Kezzie since she went through that process and was successful.

What logic doesn't work? I'm actually trying to understand how a person can adjust status on VWP, by way of marriage to a U.S. Citizen, without it looking like he or she had some immigrant intent prior to his or her entry into the United States. How does the immigrant go about proving that? In trying to prove that, don't you have to claim some ignorance to the law prior to your entry? That's my question. Kezzie explained her situation, so I've got a bit more understanding on it now, but it seems to be a slippery slope and rightfully so.

Maybe I'm not making myself clear... It seems as if a person with VWP privileges could come into the U.S., marry a U.S. citizen, and adjust status as long as that person can prove that no immigrant intent was there. That person's success (to adjust status) is not guaranteed unless they provide the necessary evidence to the USCIS adjudicator that s/he had no immigration intent. This evidence, though, can be fabricated as I've seen firsthand with a friend of mine. Also, a rather irritating poster came on this forum and posted about his illegal maneuvering.

My question is: Why didn't that person ask before doing it while they were still in another country? Well, that would be because they had no intent on doing it, right? Does that mean, then, that you claim ignorance, in part, to prove your case? Or, do you say, "Well I know about the law and I didn't intend to immigrate this time, but at a later date?" Is that, in the eyes of the USCIS adjudicator, okay? To some extent, you can't have prior knowledge of this law prior to your entry into the U.S. or can you? That's what I'm trying to understand.

Because it seems to me that if you ask the question on a forum such as this one and you see or are told that it is illegal to go the US on VWP, marry a USC, and adjust (immigration intent), then wouldn't that mean you "shouldn't" do it, legally speaking? Does that mean, then, that you shouldn't do it at all, ever? Or is it confined to an isolated incident?

My thoughts to the OP consist of her fiance filing for citizenship now, as along as he is eligible, and waiting out the process. If there is some luck with timing, then it is possible for his citizenship to be processed in four to five months. Then, her fiance can file for the K-1 visa, which, with a little luck with timing again, could have her and her baby in the U.S. in a little over a year. That is ALL I'm suggesting because that is the SMART and LEGAL way in HER SITUATION. I suggest that she look at all of the timelines so she can prepare herself for the best case scenario and the worst case.

I'm not advocating that anybody do anything illegal nor am I implying it or suggesting it. Right now, all I'm trying to do is discuss it, which may mean that it would better to post it on another thread.

I merely trying to understand the AOS process on VWP via marriage to a U.S. citizen vs. AOS on VWP via marriage to a U.S. permanent resident.

Also, I still cannot find this thread that I keep referencing, but I'm curious to know how that worked out in that other woman's situation who came to the United States on VWP while her husband's citizenship papers were pending. She was advised by her lawyer not to leave the United States. (I believe that she said she had no immigration intent, but after she came, they wanted to get married.) I don't know if she was able to adjust status after he got his citizenship. I'm curious to know. I only mentioned that case on this thread since the issue was similar save the for the fact that the OP, as far as I know, is still in the UK.

My next question is hypothetical. If the OP had no prior knowledge of this law and came to the U.S. and married a U.S. permanent resident, what kind of solution is available in that situation? (Just go back to her country or wait for the U.S. permanent resident's pending citizenship?) On this thread that I can't find, that's the woman stayed in the U.S. while her fiance's citizenship papers were pending, but before she could file her AOS papers, her and her fiance were for two things: 1) his U.S. citizenship and 2) their marriage.

Does that all make sense now? Sorry it's so long.

Edited July 28, 2006 by zauberblume

[Boiler 47,256]

Ignorance of the law is no defence.

Does that answer your question.

And what would she have answered to the usual question at the POE concerning the purpose of your visit?

[seldi 1]

Why is it so important to have your baby here? A pregnancy is stressful enough, why add unnecessary stress?

If your fiance becomes a USC, eventually you and your child will too.

The only thing your child wont be able to do if he isn't born here is run for presidency.

Just my humble opinion.

Has anyone else heard that you have to be a citizen for at least 2 years before you can help someone with AOS?

[zauberblume 0]

Boiler:

I don't think you understood my questions.

My questions are not related to the real situation of the OP.

Would it be clearer if I posted my comment in another separate thread so you do not attach anything I'm saying hypothetically to the question posted by the OP?

I'm asking questions now that are only related by virtue of it being the same subject.

A person who has no intent to immigrate would enter at the POE saying that the purpose of the visit is a vacation or whatever the purpose of the visit is.

Ignorance is not a complete defense. I never said it is. But doesn't it have to be a partial defense for cases where people adjust?

-Z

Ignorance of the law is no defence.

Does that answer your question.

And what would she have answered to the usual question at the POE concerning the purpose of your visit?

[zyggy 9]

Z...

Immigration does not need to prove that you had immigrant intent... the burden of proof is on the petitioner. This means that the petitioner has to provide the necessary evidence that would convince a USCIS adjudicator that there was no immigrant intent upon their entry to the US.

Your logic does not work in the world of US Immigration. It's pretty clear that everywhere in the universe that if one has the intention to immigrate, then a visa is required for that option. That's the way it is for everywhere. ALso, when you get an non-immigrant visa it is clearly spelled out what the visa allows you to do. Also for those who enter on VWP, when you fill out the I-94W, it clearly states that you entry is based on a non-immigrant intent and the consequences for not following the rules of VWP. So to state that there was no way of knowing what the rules of your entry were is also false. There is plenty of notice on what the rules are.

Next, if she did what you suggested, there are a couple of issues..

1) She is not eligible to adjust her status from a visitor status to a PR becuase as the spouse of a PR, she is not eligible for an immediate immigrant visa number. THe I-485 is only available for spouses of US CItizens who have an immediate visa number available.

2) If she did stay, she would not be in status for more than about 4 years of so while she waited for an immigrant visa number to be available. While she is here, she would have no status.. so no health care, no driver license, no nothing.

3) Just because she has a baby here, there have been cases where even though the baby is a US Citizen and the parents are illegals, the Immigration courts have had no problems with removing the parents. In this case, since the father is legal, the Immigration Courts have even a larger standing to remove the mother as the father is legal.

4) By harboring a illegal, her husband would be violating US Immigration law and would put both his permanent resident status and his subsequent opportunity for Naturalization in jeopardy.

In my first paragraph, I said, "I wonder how the immigrant manages to prove that she or he had absolutely no intentions of coming to the United States with the intent of marrying and remaining." I know that the immigrant must provide the necessary evidence to prove that he or she had no immigration intent. I posed that question to Kezzie since she went through that process and was successful.

What logic doesn't work? I'm actually trying to understand how a person can adjust status on VWP, by way of marriage to a U.S. Citizen, without it looking like he or she had some immigrant intent prior to his or her entry into the United States. How does the immigrant go about proving that? In trying to prove that, don't you have to claim some ignorance to the law prior to your entry? That's my question. Kezzie explained her situation, so I've got a bit more understanding on it now, but it seems to be a slippery slope and rightfully so.

Maybe I'm not making myself clear... It seems as if a person with VWP privileges could come into the U.S., marry a U.S. citizen, and adjust status as long as that person can prove that no immigrant intent was there. That person's success (to adjust status) is not guaranteed unless they provide the necessary evidence to the USCIS adjudicator that s/he had no immigration intent. This evidence, though, can be fabricated as I've seen firsthand with a friend of mine. Also, a rather irritating poster came on this forum and posted about his illegal maneuvering.

My question is: Why didn't that person ask before doing it while they were still in another country? Well, that would be because they had no intent on doing it, right? Does that mean, then, that you claim ignorance, in part, to prove your case? Or, do you say, "Well I know about the law and I didn't intend to immigrate this time, but at a later date?" Is that, in the eyes of the USCIS adjudicator, okay? To some extent, you can't have prior knowledge of this law prior to your entry into the U.S. or can you? That's what I'm trying to understand.

I don't know about ignorance.. but the way the law is written is this... one must not have immigrant intent at the time of their entry to the US. If one subsequently changes their mind while they are in the US and wishes to stay.. that is fine... but they cannot have preconceived immigrant intent at the time of their entry on a non-immigrant visa that does not allow for that. (We know that the K visa and also an H1-B visa does allow for that). So the scanario that you describe above is okay and within the law...

What is not okay is for someone to decide outside the US that they do indeed intend to enter the US to get married and stay and try to use an improper visa to meet that end. That is not okay... if it comes out that it is the case, then some pretty severe consequences will result.

On the subject of fabricating evidence... well ... the way I see it, lieing to meet their own ends eventually comes back to haunt you. THey have just left the door open to having the PR status and even their US Citizenship revoked if it ever came to that because their whole house of cards was built on a misrepresentation. Once that misrepresentation is found out, the house of cards comes crashing down. If they want to take that risk... well I wouldn't want to be in their shoes...

Because it seems to me that if you ask the question on a forum such as this one and you see or are told that it is illegal to go the US on VWP, marry a USC, and adjust (immigration intent), then wouldn't that mean you "shouldn't" do it, legally speaking? Does that mean, then, that you shouldn't do it at all, ever? Or is it confined to an isolated incident?

What answer that should be given depends on the specific circumstances of their case. It all is about the details. That is why if the individual is already in the US and posts about this type of issue, one should always send them to an immigration attorney who can find out the pertinent facts and then give a course of action. There are a lot of issues that could impact the issue of success... things such as what they left in their home country, what was said to the CBP officer when they arrived, the circumstances of what has happened since they have been in the US, etc.

If the individual isn't in the US at all, the answer is clear.. it's illegal.

My thoughts to the OP consist of her fiance filing for citizenship now, as along as he is eligible, and waiting out the process. If there is some luck with timing, then it is possible for his citizenship to be processed in four to five months. Then, her fiance can file for the K-1 visa, which, with a little luck with timing again, could have her and her baby in the U.S. in a little over a year. That is ALL I'm suggesting because that is the SMART and LEGAL way in HER SITUATION. I suggest that she look at all of the timelines so she can prepare herself for the best case scenario and the worst case.

I'm not advocating that anybody do anything illegal nor am I implying it or suggesting it. Right now, all I'm trying to do is discuss it, which may mean that it would better to post it on another thread.

I merely trying to understand the AOS process on VWP via marriage to a U.S. citizen vs. AOS on VWP via marriage to a U.S. permanent resident.

Also, I still cannot find this thread that I keep referencing, but I'm curious to know how that worked out in that other woman's situation who came to the United States on VWP while her husband's citizenship papers were pending. She was advised by her lawyer not to leave the United States. (I believe that she said she had no immigration intent, but after she came, they wanted to get married.) I don't know if she was able to adjust status after he got his citizenship. I'm curious to know. I only mentioned that case on this thread since the issue was similar save the for the fact that the OP, as far as I know, is still in the UK.

Well, one can change the priority of the I-130 if there is a change in status of the petitioner. In this case, if the individual is near gaining citizenship, then once citizenship is established, they can write to the Service Center with a copy of their Natz Cert asking for a priority class change... or file a new I-130 with an I-485 to the Chicago lockbox... Questions about the legality of the timing, harboring an illegal, etc. are best left to an attorney.. it appears in this case, the attorney probably felt that the date between citizenship and her being out of status were close enough to go ahead with it...

My next question is hypothetical. If the OP had no prior knowledge of this law and came to the U.S. and married a U.S. permanent resident, what kind of solution is available in that situation? (Just go back to her country or wait for the U.S. permanent resident's pending citizenship?) On this thread that I can't find, that's the woman stayed in the U.S. while her fiance's citizenship papers were pending, but before she could file her AOS papers, her and her fiance were for two things: 1) his U.S. citizenship and 2) their marriage.

Does that all make sense now? Sorry it's so long.

In this case all that can be done is to file an I-130 and either a) wait for the priority date to come up and then get an Immigrant Visa in the home country. Of course, if the alien had been in the US for more than 180 days, then a waiver would be required in order for the Immmigrant Visa to be issued. or

b) Wait until naturalization and then upgrade to an immediate visa number and apply for AOS. This may or may not be a good idea depending on many factors and should be left to an attorney...

Hope that answered your questions...

[zauberblume 0]

Thanks for taking the time to respond, Ziggy.

I've got some understanding on the AOS process in that situation now.

[zyggy 9]

Thanks for taking the time to respond, Ziggy.

I've got some understanding on the AOS process in that situation now.

My pleasure... As Sir Francis Bacon stated best: Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est : Knowledge itself is power...

Thank you for trying to get the knowledge..

[akdiver 3]

But I WILL NOW GIVE BIRTH IN UK!!!.

I think you should try to give birth in France. Maybe that way, the baby could be a French citizen by birth, and we all know how COOL the French are. Then, the baby could be a British citizen by parentage. Finally, move to the U.S. and hook up with this LPR, get him to adopt the baby - then the baby could be a u.s. citizen too. Do, little baby could have THREE different passports, and as the civilized world goes to hell in a handbasket, this baby could choose to travel as anyone one of the three, choosing whichever was advantageous at the time.

[Lady S 0]

Now why would my fiance have to adopt the baby when he is the father???? Explain.

[akdiver 3]

Now why would my fiance have to adopt the baby when he is the father???? Explain.

Well, it wasn't clear to me that this was the case, as this information is not available in the original post:

I have been with my fiance since May 2005. I am a british citizen and live in UK. My fiance is a lawful permanent resident. I am currently 6 weeks pregnant and would like to have my child in USA. What are my options on obtaining a visa? I can travel freely to USA on my british passport as a tourist.

But since he IS the father of this future tax deduction (subsidized by the rest of us of course), the spawn of your loins could be born on Neptune and still have U.S. citizenship at birth. This being the case, being born here has no advantages and plenty of disadvantages.

Stick with the France plan, man. Tell 'em Lance Armstrong sent you.

Cheers!

AKDiver

Edited August 1, 2006 by akdiver

[Boiler 47,256]

Now why would my fiance have to adopt the baby when he is the father???? Explain.

Well, it wasn't clear to me that this was the case, as this information is not available in the original post:

I have been with my fiance since May 2005. I am a british citizen and live in UK. My fiance is a lawful permanent resident. I am currently 6 weeks pregnant and would like to have my child in USA. What are my options on obtaining a visa? I can travel freely to USA on my british passport as a tourist.

But since he IS the father of this future tax deduction (subsidized by the rest of us of course), the spawn of your loins could be born on Neptune and still have U.S. citizenship at birth. This being the case, being born here has no advantages and plenty of disadvantages.

Stick with the France plan, man. Tell 'em Lance Armstrong sent you.

Cheers!

AKDiver

Just wondering how the child would be a USC if not born in US or to a USC parent.

Could you explain?

[Kez/JWolf 6]

Mother UKC ...... Father LPR of USA..... Baby will not be a USC, baby will be UKC and may have claim to citizenship from Fathers home country....

Kezzie

[akdiver 3]

Mother UKC ...... Father LPR of USA..... Baby will not be a USC, baby will be UKC and may have claim to citizenship from Fathers home country....

Just wondering how the child would be a USC if not born in US or to a USC parent.

The OP mentioned the LPR applying for citizenship. If he does, and it goes through before the tax deduction is born, then said tax deduction will be a child of a USC and therefore, also a USC.

Given that OP is only 6 weeks into her biological process, it seems like their plan here may work. I dunno what the timelnie for the citizenship tract is, but we got AOS to PR status in only 4 months start to finish, so it seems like there is at least a remote chance the LPR could get USC status in the 8 months or so they have remaining.

Cheers!

AKDiver

[yogib37 3]

well people are saying the time frames..like 9 mos. that is if they are USC. He can file for you for reletive cr1 but not the K visas..

also if he is just a Permenant Resident, that petition gets lower prioity. which can be a couple years before they get to it. If he then becomes a USC, then that petiton gets Upgraded.

so maybe get married soon and he can file the petition and then after he gets his USC it will be upgraded.

I dont see it worth it to wait cause it can take a year, then you will then have to wait some more time.

it is just getting a jump on your petition