Western Union receipt - big mistake?

[Steve S 2]

Well, phooey. When I submitted my I-129F packet, I thought at the time that a Western Union receipt for $600 I sent to Russia would be good evidence of ongoing relationship, along with other various things like boarding passes and photos. Now, a discussion from the K1 procedures forum would suggest that it was a blunder for me to include this -- that it could raise suspicion of bartering or fraud. I want to know if anyone from this regional group has done the same sort of thing, and what was the outcome? Am I screwed, or can someone reassure me that I am probably ok as long as the rest of the packet was strong?

The whole process is very anxiety-provoking.

[happywifeymom 4]

Well, phooey. When I submitted my I-129F packet, I thought at the time that a Western Union receipt for $600 I sent to Russia would be good evidence of ongoing relationship, along with other various things like boarding passes and photos. Now, a discussion from the K1 procedures forum would suggest that it was a blunder for me to include this -- that it could raise suspicion of bartering or fraud. I want to know if anyone from this regional group has done the same sort of thing, and what was the outcome? Am I screwed, or can someone reassure me that I am probably ok as long as the rest of the packet was strong?

The whole process is very anxiety-provoking.

Western Union receipts are not good proof of relationships for K1 applicants.

[Chris_Жанна 11]

Well, phooey. When I submitted my I-129F packet, I thought at the time that a Western Union receipt for $600 I sent to Russia would be good evidence of ongoing relationship, along with other various things like boarding passes and photos. Now, a discussion from the K1 procedures forum would suggest that it was a blunder for me to include this -- that it could raise suspicion of bartering or fraud. I want to know if anyone from this regional group has done the same sort of thing, and what was the outcome? Am I screwed, or can someone reassure me that I am probably ok as long as the rest of the packet was strong?

The whole process is very anxiety-provoking.

Not to pry but what was the money order for a plane ticket? Maybe your SO could show the receipt for what she bought??? I mean some ppl on this site are ultra paranoid and think doing anything is a bad idea, I have second guessed my petition a million times. Just be prepared to defend it if need be and have your SO be able to explain it to the consul when the time comes. Think about this..... A Gajillion ppl have gone through this process do you think you are the first to make a little mistake? Prob not. I know how you feel, this is a roller coaster I want to get off soon. Stay tough, you'll make it. Just be prepared is all you can do.

[slim 1,514]

From this point on - STAY OUT OF THE K-1 FORUM!

If you have a question, post it in the Russia forum. We've been through this process and we know what you have to submit and don't have to submit. You don't have to heed our advice, but since my wife is here already, I think that pretty much qualifies me (and a lot of others on this forum) to answer any K-1 questions you may have. Posting (and even reading) the K-1 forum is only going to cause you grief and waste your time with non-Russia-specific answers.

We also understand things in Russia are not the same as things in the P.I. or Canada or anywhere else, for that matter. What folks from the P.I. or Canada or whatever don't seem to understand is things in Russia are often Russia-specific and don't follow the general K-1 flow. Not to say they can't help or won't try to help, but from what I've seen, they're more than willing to tell you the 15,000,000 possible bad things that can happen than the proper way to do it. Notice I said proper. Not legal, not required, but proper. Why? Because that's Russia-specific. There's the way it should be done, and then there's the way it's done in Russia. The way you want to do it is up to you, but I'd recommend using your time to acquire whatever info you can from guys who've already wrapped up the process than from those who are "still waiting" on their S/Os to arrive from a country where they don't even need a visa to travel to.

Choice is yours, not implying they're a bad crowd and they really will try to help you out, but if you don't want to waste your time or have to second guess every single thing you read, stick to the Russia forum only. It irks me something fierce when I see things like this. It's just a normal day for the K-1 lurkers though.

For the record, the only forum you need to visit is this one. When "outsiders" (and I'm not talking FSU folks, I'm talking other Europe, N.A., etc.) drop by, I tend to take their posts as nothing more than feeble attempts at entertaining themselves. I can count the "non-Russia/FSU" posters here on VJ that've actually helped me on one hand. The list is that short.

Back OT - So you sent a receipt? So what. I don't think they really care what you send with the I-129F, it's what she takes to the interview that really matters. Whether or not to file the request isn't really optional on their part. You as a U.S. Citizen have requested a fiancee come join you. Now it's their job to type up the paperwork and get the ball rolling. The only "judgement" in this entire process is when she sits in front of the Interviewing Officer at the embassy and they "decide" whether or not it's real or if she's just using you to get a green card. Sending a receipt with the I-129f packet shouldn't matter at all. As said by one of the Russia posters above (Hmmm. Russia poster making sense. Gee. Wonder why?) the receipt goes hand in hand with plane ticket purchases and travel-related expenses, and even if it didn't, it could look like it, right?

On an unrelated note, if you're sending $600 as part of the "ongoing relationship" (as in - you're sending her money to continue the relationship: mom needs surgery, she can't pay rent, kid needs money for school, etc., etc., etc.,) there are plenty of topics out there on what we like to call a RED FLAG! Not saying that's what's going on because you haven't posted enough to really be able to tell yet, but, seriously, take a step back from the situation, look at it real hard, and call it what it is. If you're sending her $600 on any kind of regular basis, you have bigger problems than a possible RFE. As a matter of fact, you don't need to worry about the paperwork at all because it's highly unlikely she'll ever make it to an interview. Unless she's good. Real good. A real pro.

Anyway, that's all another topic for another time. And hopefully, that's another dude anyway and not you, Steve. Don't sweat the receipt, stay outta the K-1 forum, and post some more on the Russia forum. Glad to have you aboard, and see you around.

By the way, Chris, all of the above goes for you too! See you on the Russia forum sometime soon!

[L179 1]

you can always support that by saying that you were supporting your fiance, they might ask for more documentary proof, so make sure you have enough to prove your relationship.

no worries.

not the end of the world

[brnidokiegurl 0]

its not the end of the world, alot depends on the agency location and the normal way they are known to look at this. Stay in contact with others going thru your location and learn from them it can be alot different to another location. Thru Morocco it is consider not a good thing and at interview questions are ask on money subject

[Steve S 2]

OK, I am going to stay out of the K-1 forum, because it is just raising my anxiety level and there are too many posts to weed through anyway. Good advice.

As for the issue of sending money, it was a one-time gift that was three years after the start of our penpal relationship, after two trips to Russia and after she mailed the letter of intent. She earns a meager salary over there, and was often taking public transport followed by walk down dark alley home from work, rather than spending the extra 30 rubles on a taxi to her door. I have walked it myself. I wanted to share and start providing for her now rather than waiting for her to get here. It was easy for me to send this amount. I trust her completely and do not believe there is any red flag. If she were trying to take advantage of me, this would be one of the longest cons I could imagine. This being said, I will probably not wire money again, because it starts to set up an unpleasant "sugar-daddy" element to the relationship, or it can seem that I am paying her to wait for me. We will talk about it, and agree on what we should tell the interviewer if the issue comes up. Maybe she can say it was travel money, for the Moscow trip.

[Chris_Жанна 11]

From this point on - STAY OUT OF THE K-1 FORUM!

If you have a question, post it in the Russia forum. We've been through this process and we know what you have to submit and don't have to submit. You don't have to heed our advice, but since my wife is here already, I think that pretty much qualifies me (and a lot of others on this forum) to answer any K-1 questions you may have. Posting (and even reading) the K-1 forum is only going to cause you grief and waste your time with non-Russia-specific answers.

We also understand things in Russia are not the same as things in the P.I. or Canada or anywhere else, for that matter. What folks from the P.I. or Canada or whatever don't seem to understand is things in Russia are often Russia-specific and don't follow the general K-1 flow. Not to say they can't help or won't try to help, but from what I've seen, they're more than willing to tell you the 15,000,000 possible bad things that can happen than the proper way to do it. Notice I said proper. Not legal, not required, but proper. Why? Because that's Russia-specific. There's the way it should be done, and then there's the way it's done in Russia. The way you want to do it is up to you, but I'd recommend using your time to acquire whatever info you can from guys who've already wrapped up the process than from those who are "still waiting" on their S/Os to arrive from a country where they don't even need a visa to travel to.

Choice is yours, not implying they're a bad crowd and they really will try to help you out, but if you don't want to waste your time or have to second guess every single thing you read, stick to the Russia forum only. It irks me something fierce when I see things like this. It's just a normal day for the K-1 lurkers though.

For the record, the only forum you need to visit is this one. When "outsiders" (and I'm not talking FSU folks, I'm talking other Europe, N.A., etc.) drop by, I tend to take their posts as nothing more than feeble attempts at entertaining themselves. I can count the "non-Russia/FSU" posters here on VJ that've actually helped me on one hand. The list is that short.

Back OT - So you sent a receipt? So what. I don't think they really care what you send with the I-129F, it's what she takes to the interview that really matters. Whether or not to file the request isn't really optional on their part. You as a U.S. Citizen have requested a fiancee come join you. Now it's their job to type up the paperwork and get the ball rolling. The only "judgement" in this entire process is when she sits in front of the Interviewing Officer at the embassy and they "decide" whether or not it's real or if she's just using you to get a green card. Sending a receipt with the I-129f packet shouldn't matter at all. As said by one of the Russia posters above (Hmmm. Russia poster making sense. Gee. Wonder why?) the receipt goes hand in hand with plane ticket purchases and travel-related expenses, and even if it didn't, it could look like it, right?

On an unrelated note, if you're sending $600 as part of the "ongoing relationship" (as in - you're sending her money to continue the relationship: mom needs surgery, she can't pay rent, kid needs money for school, etc., etc., etc.,) there are plenty of topics out there on what we like to call a RED FLAG! Not saying that's what's going on because you haven't posted enough to really be able to tell yet, but, seriously, take a step back from the situation, look at it real hard, and call it what it is. If you're sending her $600 on any kind of regular basis, you have bigger problems than a possible RFE. As a matter of fact, you don't need to worry about the paperwork at all because it's highly unlikely she'll ever make it to an interview. Unless she's good. Real good. A real pro.

Anyway, that's all another topic for another time. And hopefully, that's another dude anyway and not you, Steve. Don't sweat the receipt, stay outta the K-1 forum, and post some more on the Russia forum. Glad to have you aboard, and see you around.

By the way, Chris, all of the above goes for you too! See you on the Russia forum sometime soon!

Thank Slim! Good advice.

I wanted to ask what you you think about a certain situation. Janna is planning on visiting me at the end of July. She has a multiple entry B2 visa that is valid until April of 2010. I know that she may encounter more resistance at the PoE and was just wondering what you thought. I am going to send her my NoA1, a notarized letter from myself and my parents stating that she will be staying with both of us and her visit is for tourism purposes only and that we will see to it that she will return to Russia before the stamp on her visa has expired. Also, she will bring with her a letter from her landlord for her flat, bank statements, car payments, etc.... (all translated). We would like to spend some time while we wait, plus it's hard for me to travel because I have just relocated and started a new job. Plus we both think it is a good idea to have spend more time together for when she goes on her interview as solid proof of an on-going relationship. Let me know what you think. She had really no problem entering the country last time so, I am hoping that we will have luck again this time. Thanks in advance.

Спасибо!

[baron555 934]

and was often taking public transport followed by walk down dark alley home from work, rather than spending the extra 30 rubles on a taxi to her door. I have walked it myself. I wanted to share and start providing for her now rather than waiting for her to get here.

Just tell the truth. This sounds like a good idea and also sounds like the future husband is providing for his future wife just as he will for his future family.

I did not include any money receipts in my filing but did include pictures and FedEx receipts of the electronic translator, a calendar and some DVDs that I sent. I have since the filing sent my Alla money, we use iKobo. One batch was used for new clothes and shoes for the little one and this last batch will help replace her mobile phone that got fried when the little one threw it into the water. Hopefully you have tons of other evidence of the on-going relationship. How can we have a relationship if we don't share, including providing assistance?

stating that she will be staying with both of us and her visit is for tourism purposes only

I wouldn't say this. She's actually going to stay with her fiance and do some tourist stuff. Do be prepared for a denial but I think the documentation you have mentioned will help. What strong ties can she show?

[mox 298]

Slim is correct...so much of what passes for advice in the K-1 forum is effing garbage. It wasn't always that way, and even a year ago or so it was pretty good. But now it seems to be filled with armchair lawyers who seem to think that you will get an RFE if you don't send your packet via FedEx Weekend Express in a lead-lined gold-plated envelope.

In the general case, there's no evidence to suggest your Western Union receipt is going to help you one way or the other. It *may* mean something to the individual officer handling your case, but only in an incidental sort of way, and certainly nothing official. There's no evidence to suggest that it can ever hurt your filing. I.e., there's no guideline that says "oh you better deny them because Western Union receipts may indicate she's a scammer." The case officers are allowed very little latitude in adjudicating your case, and will only deny when there's overwhelming evidence that suggests they should deny. (there have been exceptions of course, but humans are fallible and I'm sure there are more than a couple bad eggs within USCIS)

Anyway, congrats on filing, and don't sweat it. If you put together a solid packet with all the forms filled out correctly and truthfully, you have nothing to worry about.

[SMR 368]

From this point on - STAY OUT OF THE K-1 FORUM!

If you have a question, post it in the Russia forum. We've been through this process and we know what you have to submit and don't have to submit. You don't have to heed our advice, but since my wife is here already, I think that pretty much qualifies me (and a lot of others on this forum) to answer any K-1 questions you may have. Posting (and even reading) the K-1 forum is only going to cause you grief and waste your time with non-Russia-specific answers.

We also understand things in Russia are not the same as things in the P.I. or Canada or anywhere else, for that matter. What folks from the P.I. or Canada or whatever don't seem to understand is things in Russia are often Russia-specific and don't follow the general K-1 flow. Not to say they can't help or won't try to help, but from what I've seen, they're more than willing to tell you the 15,000,000 possible bad things that can happen than the proper way to do it. Notice I said proper. Not legal, not required, but proper. Why? Because that's Russia-specific. There's the way it should be done, and then there's the way it's done in Russia. The way you want to do it is up to you, but I'd recommend using your time to acquire whatever info you can from guys who've already wrapped up the process than from those who are "still waiting" on their S/Os to arrive from a country where they don't even need a visa to travel to.

Choice is yours, not implying they're a bad crowd and they really will try to help you out, but if you don't want to waste your time or have to second guess every single thing you read, stick to the Russia forum only. It irks me something fierce when I see things like this. It's just a normal day for the K-1 lurkers though.

For the record, the only forum you need to visit is this one. When "outsiders" (and I'm not talking FSU folks, I'm talking other Europe, N.A., etc.) drop by, I tend to take their posts as nothing more than feeble attempts at entertaining themselves. I can count the "non-Russia/FSU" posters here on VJ that've actually helped me on one hand. The list is that short.

Back OT - So you sent a receipt? So what. I don't think they really care what you send with the I-129F, it's what she takes to the interview that really matters. Whether or not to file the request isn't really optional on their part. You as a U.S. Citizen have requested a fiancee come join you. Now it's their job to type up the paperwork and get the ball rolling. The only "judgement" in this entire process is when she sits in front of the Interviewing Officer at the embassy and they "decide" whether or not it's real or if she's just using you to get a green card. Sending a receipt with the I-129f packet shouldn't matter at all. As said by one of the Russia posters above (Hmmm. Russia poster making sense. Gee. Wonder why?) the receipt goes hand in hand with plane ticket purchases and travel-related expenses, and even if it didn't, it could look like it, right?

On an unrelated note, if you're sending $600 as part of the "ongoing relationship" (as in - you're sending her money to continue the relationship: mom needs surgery, she can't pay rent, kid needs money for school, etc., etc., etc.,) there are plenty of topics out there on what we like to call a RED FLAG! Not saying that's what's going on because you haven't posted enough to really be able to tell yet, but, seriously, take a step back from the situation, look at it real hard, and call it what it is. If you're sending her $600 on any kind of regular basis, you have bigger problems than a possible RFE. As a matter of fact, you don't need to worry about the paperwork at all because it's highly unlikely she'll ever make it to an interview. Unless she's good. Real good. A real pro.

Anyway, that's all another topic for another time. And hopefully, that's another dude anyway and not you, Steve. Don't sweat the receipt, stay outta the K-1 forum, and post some more on the Russia forum. Glad to have you aboard, and see you around.

By the way, Chris, all of the above goes for you too! See you on the Russia forum sometime soon!

Thank Slim! Good advice.

I wanted to ask what you you think about a certain situation. Janna is planning on visiting me at the end of July. She has a multiple entry B2 visa that is valid until April of 2010. I know that she may encounter more resistance at the PoE and was just wondering what you thought. I am going to send her my NoA1, a notarized letter from myself and my parents stating that she will be staying with both of us and her visit is for tourism purposes only and that we will see to it that she will return to Russia before the stamp on her visa has expired. Also, she will bring with her a letter from her landlord for her flat, bank statements, car payments, etc.... (all translated). We would like to spend some time while we wait, plus it's hard for me to travel because I have just relocated and started a new job. Plus we both think it is a good idea to have spend more time together for when she goes on her interview as solid proof of an on-going relationship. Let me know what you think. She had really no problem entering the country last time so, I am hoping that we will have luck again this time. Thanks in advance.

Спасибо!

This is tricky. Marina and I had much the same situation. Marina had a multiple entry B-2 visa good for one year (probably the same as you have). The first time she came to visit me before we were engaged, she came through the POE without any problems. While she was here, we got engaged and started the K-1 visa process. She traveled back to Russia to wait. After a couple months, we wanted to spend some more time together. I went to St. Petersburg for Christmas and Новый Год.

We decided to have her fly back and spend some more time here (we flew seperately because we bought the tickets at different times). When she got here to the POE, she had some problems. They started to ask her questions (What's the engagement ring?, Why are you coming back so soon?). In the end they gave her I-94 for one month.

By having her fly here, the main risk you are taking is that they can deny her at the point of entry and she will have to fly right back (you will lose the airfare). The visa isn't a guarantee of entry, it's just necessary for consideration. You aren't hurting your K-1 petition (as long as you don't lie or break any laws) and will probably be helping by providing evidence that the relationship is real.

You have two options: declare everything and hope they believe that she is planning on returning to Russia or just pretend that she is a tourist and don't mention K-1 if they don't ask about it. My recommendation is that you have all of the evidence ready that you mentioned but don't give any information that you aren't asked for. Also, I recommend buying a round-trip ticket. Once they give her the I-94, you will know how long she can stay and can change the ticket to further out if the I-94 allows. If she has a return ticket in 1-month, they may give her a 3-month 1-94 anyways.

This is all just based on my judgement but since the decision is just based on the discretion of the officer at the POE, that is the best anyone can do. Like I said, the most you can lose is the airfare, which you will spend whether she gets in or not.

[mox 298]

My recommendation is that you have all of the evidence ready that you mentioned but don't give any information that you aren't asked for. Also, I recommend buying a round-trip ticket. Once they give her the I-94, you will know how long she can stay and can change the ticket to further out if the I-94 allows. If she has a return ticket in 1-month, they may give her a 3-month 1-94 anyways.

This is all just based on my judgement but since the decision is just based on the discretion of the officer at the POE, that is the best anyone can do. Like I said, the most you can lose is the airfare, which you will spend whether she gets in or not.

Seconded on this advice. Rule number one is to never lie to the POE officer. But if they don't ask it, don't volunteer it. Have all the evidence ready and available, but chances are you won't need it.

[bobb 0]

I sent a WU receipt with my I-129F and had no problems. I sent another with my documentation of ongoing relationship which is part of the required info she will give them next week at her interview.

Slim made the best statement - Stay away from the K-1 forum. Sometimes, when bored, I go look at the inane answers to questions on that forum. It is not worth the effort to try and correct the numerous incorrect replies - it would be a full-time job.

Edited June 18, 2009 by bobb

[slim 1,514]

She earns a meager salary over there, and was often taking public transport followed by walk down dark alley home from work, rather than spending the extra 30 rubles on a taxi to her door.

That's pretty normal. But if you think she used the money you sent her for a taxi, you'd better think again! Ask her about the new shoes she bought with your "taxi money."

I wanted to share and start providing for her now rather than waiting for her to get here. It was easy for me to send this amount. I trust her completely and do not believe there is any red flag. If she were trying to take advantage of me, this would be one of the longest cons I could imagine. This being said, I will probably not wire money again, because it starts to set up an unpleasant "sugar-daddy" element to the relationship, or it can seem that I am paying her to wait for me.

There's nothing wrong with sending her money, especially for something like what you described above with the taxis (but I bet she bought shoes!) and it is nice to be able to send some help/support and just share what you have with her. Since I hadn't seen you post on here a whole bunch and didn't know your story, I didn't know if this was something you've done a lot of or not. Sometimes we get the new guys on here who ask about something financial, and come to find out, they've sent her several thousand dollars worth of "help" over the last six months or so. Sending your fiancee (of several years) a little cash here and there is no big deal.

The biggest indicator of this is if she asks for it. If she needs help to pay for mom's hospital bills or her kitchen caught fire or her kid needs school money, etc., then you know you're walking a fine line. Sending her a gift is just being a nice guy. Sending her "support payments" is beeing a dumb@$$. If you send her money because you want to, you're OK. If you send her money because she's constantly asking for it, then you'd better reassess the situation. (And find a new one.)

You appear to be OK!

We will talk about it, and agree on what we should tell the interviewer if the issue comes up. Maybe she can say it was travel money, for the Moscow trip.

It shouldn't come up at all. The interview is still months away and if they do happen to ask about it (I don't see why they would) she should tell the truth. "My fiance sent for me money because he scary I walk from dark street at night. I buy whis this money new shoes. *pointing to feet* See!"

I wanted to ask what you you think about a certain situation. Janna is planning on visiting me at the end of July. She has a multiple entry B2 visa that is valid until April of 2010. I know that she may encounter more resistance at the PoE and was just wondering what you thought. I am going to send her my NoA1, a notarized letter from myself and my parents stating that she will be staying with both of us and her visit is for tourism purposes only and that we will see to it that she will return to Russia before the stamp on her visa has expired. Also, she will bring with her a letter from her landlord for her flat, bank statements, car payments, etc.... (all translated). We would like to spend some time while we wait, plus it's hard for me to travel because I have just relocated and started a new job. Plus we both think it is a good idea to have spend more time together for when she goes on her interview as solid proof of an on-going relationship. Let me know what you think. She had really no problem entering the country last time so, I am hoping that we will have luck again this time. Thanks in advance.

That sounds a little overkill. The one has nothing to do with the other. If the POE guy tries to establish a connection between a K-1 and the tourism, all she has to say is, "I'm here to see my fiance, visit with his family, talk about our wedding.... and then I must go back to finish all business. It is not possible for me to stay in U.S. right now. I have lotta life to finish first in Russia."

Your NOA 1, letters, etc. have nothing to do with her "visit" to the U.S. And anyway, how are you going to "see to it that she returns to Russia?" Are you going to escort her to the airport and walk her through security if her I-94 expires and she wants to stay?

Bottom line is if she comes here and you guys get married (nothing illegal about that, you could do it if you wanted to) she has a legal right to stay. The POE guys know that. She has to convince them that she "doesn't want to get married.... yet" and she'll be just fine. I would recommend having her tell the story at the POE of a girl coming to make sure that everything will be set up just right for her wedding (that's taking place way down the road after the K-1 goes through) and double checking that her idiot fiance isn't just blowing smoke up her @$$ about the whole situation. Guys can laugh about it, and if she has a woman POE officer, she'll get the, "um hm, girl, I know that's right. Go head and go check him out. Handle your weddin plans." She might even get a high five on the way through!

How can we have a relationship if we don't share, including providing assistance?

Providing assistance now sets you up to provide EVEN MORE assistance later. Just saying. She's lived on her own for a long time over there before you (or any of us) came into the picture. She's a big girl and she can take care of herself.

As said above, there's nothing wrong with sending a little cash "gift" here and there. But, if it's one of those things where it becomes an expectation that every little pitfall in her life over there will be "rescued" by her American petitioner, just wait til she gets here. (If she ever gets here.) Not saying this is your situation, baron, just putting it out there for everyone to consider.

Be careful with how much "assistance" you provide. Send gifts if you're so inclined, but do not set it up to where you are the benefactor. (Unless you want to be. Hell, if you can afford it, more power to you!)

Also, I recommend buying a round-trip ticket. Once they give her the I-94, you will know how long she can stay and can change the ticket to further out if the I-94 allows. If she has a return ticket in 1-month, they may give her a 3-month 1-94 anyways.

It's almost guaranteed if they see a return ticket they'll give her an extra month or so after the return ticket date. Goes well with the story of "I'm here for X number of days then I'm going home. See this return ticket? That's when I'm leaving."