Why does the Left hate Israel?

[mawilson 2,133]

Its not really "War" though is it. Its a bunch of irregular guerila fighters of varying degrees of experience Vs. a well armed, experienced regular military.

Sure it is. Hamas' military wing is a proper army, not a bunch of "irregular guerilla fighters".

They certainly want to be treated as such:

Abu Abdullah, a leader of Hamas' military wing said his group is preparing for war against Israel.

"In the last 15 months, even though the fighters of Hamas kept the cease-fire, we did not stop

making important advancements and professional training on the military level. In the future,

after Hamas is obliged to stop the cease-fire, the world shall see our new military capabilities,"

said Abu Abdullah, who is considered one of the most important operational members of Hamas'

Izzedine al-Qassam Martyrs Brigades, Hamas' declared "resistance" department.

Al Aqsa's Abu Ahmed said his group is receiving help from Hezbollah to import long-range rockets

and train in guerrilla warfare tactics.

"We have warm relations with Hezbollah, which helps with some of the training programs," Abu Ahmed

said. "We don't have anything to be ashamed of – that we are dealing with Hezbollah and that we

are receiving training and information from them."

He said Hezbollah maintains cells in the Sinai.

"The Sinai is an excellent ground for training, the exchange of information and weapons and for

meetings on how to turn every piece of land into usable territory for a confrontation with Israel,"

Abu Ahmed said.

[joelunchbox 0]

rockets= wrong Israel's reaction to those rockets= wrong

wrong + wrong not equal right.

easy to say when one is armchair quarterbacking instead of having those rockets shot at you.

My opoinion is that ALL americans are armchair quarterbacks.

What are the odds of me going to Israel much less having a say when I get there?

Just because I don't live there doesn't make a wrong a right.

When I first visited Tashkent, I came away with a fairly glowing picture about the government.

Hey! I was there! I lived it.

Low and behold, a couple of months later I read where that government is considered one of the ten worst in the world. I asked my fiance about it and, well, there went my glowing picture.

We do need to get off our arses, get educated and think about the people there--both sides.

There have been so many things done--military and politcal-that I am not sure what accord is in effect and if anyone is left to agree to it.

My understanding--and I will have to go back and do some reading--is that Israel has failed to honor the last agreement. I know that hurts us americans but that is where the peace process stands.

Oh, how many factions are within Israel? How many factions are within the palestinians??

Who are the good guys and who are the bad guys--there are both on both sides.

[DeadPoolX 9]

Its not really "War" though is it. Its a bunch of irregular guerila fighters of varying degrees of experience Vs. a well armed, experienced regular military.

As I said yesterday - much of the condemnation of Israel has to do with what is perceived to be a massively disproportionate response to the original problem; a tactic that's been tried several times before to little effect.

Screw the factions - surely the only sympathy here should be with those who are caught in the middle.

So... I guess the Revolutionary War (i.e. The American War of Independence) wasn't "really a war?" Funny. Seems like it to me.

You had your rag-tag colonists using guerrilla warfare tactics against the British, who at the time had most powerful army in the world.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Its not really "War" though is it. Its a bunch of irregular guerila fighters of varying degrees of experience Vs. a well armed, experienced regular military.

As I said yesterday - much of the condemnation of Israel has to do with what is perceived to be a massively disproportionate response to the original problem; a tactic that's been tried several times before to little effect.

Screw the factions - surely the only sympathy here should be with those who are caught in the middle.

So... I guess the Revolutionary War (i.e. The American War of Independence) wasn't "really a war?" Funny. Seems like it to me.

You had your rag-tag colonists using guerrilla warfare tactics against the British, who at the time had most powerful army in the world.

I think you can tell the difference.

[DeadPoolX 9]

Its not really "War" though is it. Its a bunch of irregular guerila fighters of varying degrees of experience Vs. a well armed, experienced regular military.

As I said yesterday - much of the condemnation of Israel has to do with what is perceived to be a massively disproportionate response to the original problem; a tactic that's been tried several times before to little effect.

Screw the factions - surely the only sympathy here should be with those who are caught in the middle.

So... I guess the Revolutionary War (i.e. The American War of Independence) wasn't "really a war?" Funny. Seems like it to me.

You had your rag-tag colonists using guerrilla warfare tactics against the British, who at the time had most powerful army in the world.

I think you can tell the difference.

What difference? Because the colonists won so we see history through a decidedly American viewpoint? Big deal. The situation is virtually the same.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Its not really "War" though is it. Its a bunch of irregular guerila fighters of varying degrees of experience Vs. a well armed, experienced regular military.

As I said yesterday - much of the condemnation of Israel has to do with what is perceived to be a massively disproportionate response to the original problem; a tactic that's been tried several times before to little effect.

Screw the factions - surely the only sympathy here should be with those who are caught in the middle.

So... I guess the Revolutionary War (i.e. The American War of Independence) wasn't "really a war?" Funny. Seems like it to me.

You had your rag-tag colonists using guerrilla warfare tactics against the British, who at the time had most powerful army in the world.

I think you can tell the difference.

What difference? Because the colonists won so we see history through a decidedly American viewpoint? Big deal. The situation is virtually the same.

Except the colonists had geography on their side.

[DeadPoolX 9]

Its not really "War" though is it. Its a bunch of irregular guerila fighters of varying degrees of experience Vs. a well armed, experienced regular military.

As I said yesterday - much of the condemnation of Israel has to do with what is perceived to be a massively disproportionate response to the original problem; a tactic that's been tried several times before to little effect.

Screw the factions - surely the only sympathy here should be with those who are caught in the middle.

So... I guess the Revolutionary War (i.e. The American War of Independence) wasn't "really a war?" Funny. Seems like it to me.

You had your rag-tag colonists using guerrilla warfare tactics against the British, who at the time had most powerful army in the world.

I think you can tell the difference.

What difference? Because the colonists won so we see history through a decidedly American viewpoint? Big deal. The situation is virtually the same.

Except the colonists had geography on their side.

The Confederate military during the Civil War had "geography on their side." That didn't do them a whole lot of good, now did it?

The Palestinians have the ability to blend in with the populace. Israel uses military uniforms (just as we do) while a Palestinian assailant could come from anyone standing around. I'd say that's better than having geography on your side.

[HAL 9000 96]

Its not really "War" though is it. Its a bunch of irregular guerila fighters of varying degrees of experience Vs. a well armed, experienced regular military.

As I said yesterday - much of the condemnation of Israel has to do with what is perceived to be a massively disproportionate response to the original problem; a tactic that's been tried several times before to little effect.

Screw the factions - surely the only sympathy here should be with those who are caught in the middle.

So... I guess the Revolutionary War (i.e. The American War of Independence) wasn't "really a war?" Funny. Seems like it to me.

You had your rag-tag colonists using guerrilla warfare tactics against the British, who at the time had most powerful army in the world.

I think you can tell the difference.

What difference? Because the colonists won so we see history through a decidedly American viewpoint? Big deal. The situation is virtually the same.

So the Continental Army didn't really exist. The War of Independence was really won by Benjamin Martin and his Colonial Militia.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

The Confederate military during the Civil War had "geography on their side." That didn't do them a whole lot of good, now did it?

Or perhaps they just had crappier commanders (and bad luck)

The Palestinians have the ability to blend in with the populace. Israel uses military uniforms (just as we do) while a Palestinian assailant could come from anyone standing around. I'd say that's better than having geography on your side.

Rockets and bombs don't wear uniforms though

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The wisdom of Orwell...

"All nationalists have the power of not seeing resemblances between similar sets of facts.

A British Tory will defend self-determination in Europe and oppose it in India with no feeling of inconsistency. Actions are held to be good or bad, not on their own merits, but according to who does them, and there is almost no kind of outrage -- torture, the use of hostages, forced labour, mass deportations, imprisonment without trial, forgery, assassination, the bombing of civilians -- which does not change its moral colour when it is committed by 'our' side ... The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them" -- George Orwell

[DeadPoolX 9]

So the Continental Army didn't really exist. The War of Independence was really won by Benjamin Martin and his Colonial Militia.

The Continental Army consisted of colonial militia. They were not professional soldiers. Some of their commanders (such as George Washington) had served in the British Army, but the majority of troops lacked any real experience and at best, were militia-grade.

The Palestinians have the ability to blend in with the populace. Israel uses military uniforms (just as we do) while a Palestinian assailant could come from anyone standing around. I'd say that's better than having geography on your side.

Rockets and bombs don't wear uniforms though

So I guess it doesn't matter who's firing off what, right?

[MsMariah 0]

LAND, AIR, SEA, MONEY and MILITARY control......

Hamas might verbally say they won't recognize Israel, but Israel is a country who is actively proving to not recognize Gaza and it's inhabitants rights. When you say Israeli's=men; I'd say I have to agree if you go for well past post pubescent wildly abusive 'men' and Palestine is a man who was tied up and dressed like a woman and RAPED, tortured, and starved. Amazing he's still kicking

I hope a 'man' like your ideation of Israel moves in next door to you (here in small town america) and encroaches your land, blocks your driveway will bulldozers while he reroutes the stream onto 'his' property (which he didn't pay for), cuts your electric and builds a fence to hide your satellite service. His 300 lb wife can prance naked in the yard and his children can beat the sh*t out of yours, for goodness sakes, plus he has a clandestine drug operation with the local law enforcement and is a well paid part of the 'good ol' boys' club. You'll be video taped throwing crab apples at him so when he gets the go ahead to demolish part of your house it can all be blamed on you.

We all know how much you'll love your neighbor....... but at least you're RIGHT!

[SaadBell 0]

Our government supports Israel because it's in our national interests. Are we hypocrites? Absolutely. Do we favor one nation over another? Absolutely. Is it right? Well that depends on what someone's definition of "right" is. We are simply doing what all great nations have done throughout history... protect our interests.

This is a tradition of our human race, we seem to like to have conflicts with each other, and God forbid we lived in peace with each other just the mere thought sends shivers down my spine. We humans love blood baths, just take a peak at history, we can be quit brutal to each other.

I highly doubt peace is really in our interest for the region. Selling them guns is too profitable.

Testify my fellow citizen, good to see at least someone is paying attention.

Can you say that in the cadence of a southern baptist preacher?

I can see brother AJ is spot on today.

You got to love the old southern creepy Baptist preacher

will rain down fire on all, only the flying spaghetti monster is the one true god.

Now this is a God I could believe in right here.

who the cheeseless pizaa?

You know that the cheese less pizza can never or never hold rank of God, maybe saint, but never God

you shall be spared the wrath of the gods brother (they are known to be commies)

The commies, takes me back to the day growing up in ultimate terror for fear of the damn commies dropping their nukes.

alright, everyone knows that god or gods is a socialist and commie

You are correct, if you don’t know that, go back to school NOW.

For balance and fairness we need a thread about "Why are the Right sadistic war mongers?"

It is a family tradition, something passed on from father to son, mother to daughter; let me give you example, like the first time your son’s carves the thanksgiving turkey.

But since those children are the children of a mother that likely voted for Hamas, then they definitely deserve the death they got ordered up by mad Israelis.

Bother Hal,

Death is always deserved, hey who said life was fair. Good to see you making strides with this complicated subject, just remember, they are not real people, it isn’t like an American or Israelis, now that is just called tragic.

What is interesting is that the palestinians are waiting for Israel to fulfill their end of the deal on peace. And have been waiting for years.

choke on that

joelunchbox What you say is very true, Israel has failed to adhere to the law and has yes, gotten away with doing this with America’s backing, but remember, when you are big and strong and have enough money laws don’t really apply to you. When you are America you can damn well do what you want we are gangsters. We get on CNN and look in the camera and “say my name b^&ch, say it three times,” we gangsters. So when you are a gangster and you with your homies Israel, laws don’t mean sh5t, you do what you want. I hope that clears that up for you, people just forget that we don’t always follow the laws that we don’t like. WE ARE THE FREAKING LAW

Solution

I have a brilliant solution, we drug them period, heavy doses of valium in the water system, mandatory blood levels of marijuana and we should see a reduction of violence within a day.

[justashooter 430]

You'll be video taped throwing crab apples at him so when he gets the go ahead to demolish part of your house it can all be blamed on you.

We all know how much you'll love your neighbor....... but at least you're RIGHT!

I am my neighbor, so why don't you go home to jordan, where millitant arabs are more popular?

I know western pennsylvania well, and am sure you are uncomfortable there, already.

[justashooter 430]

sexual and emotional insecurity.

freud said that people afraid of guns (implements of force - projections of capacity to enact force) were sexually and emotionally insecure.

people who walk into a room swinging a gun around for no reason are sociopathic. if they are swinging it because somebody else is shooting at them, then they are men.

people who walk into a room wearing an explosive vest and kill themselves and everybody else in the room are borderline sociopaths. this is a feminised version of sociopathy that does not take responsibility for it's actions and typically blames others for the actions.

israelis = men

palestineans = men who are acting like women

Goodness! I knew you were a bit of a backwards "man", but you never cease to amaze me. Your views on masculinity and femininity must come from reading Cosmopolitan.

i'm a traditionalist. my views on human interaction come from reading maslow, and sometimes freud. you could read harville hendrix and get just about the same thing. i have read and seen enough to know that the DSM4 is only useful within the western culture. borderline personality disorder is regarded as a feminised sociopathy in the western world. from what i understand, this is not the case in the ME. cowardice and veiled aggression are used against superior force in the ME without shame. ME men just don't measure up to westerners.

my wife and i were watching the 5th (?) season of "24" last night. in the opening episode a series of terrorist attacks are occuring in the US. my wife asked me if it was possible that 20 terrorist attacks could occur in the US over a period of weeks. i told her that i could imagine no more than 3 as possible before vigilanteeism solved the problem. this is just how we do it in America. gung ho!