Why Marriage Has Become a Raw Deal for Men

[thetreble 19]

Are there stupid, selfish, lazy women out there like this man described? Of course but its your fault if you marry one. You know what you're getting into, so be a man and stop whining. And really, how many deadbeat dads are there out there? LOTS. THere are always going to be lazy, selfish, stupid people of both genders out there, so that's why one should actually get ot know their future spouse and not marry ASAP.

And WHY is he talking about her mess becomes your mess, blah blah blah. I'm sorry, but you should know how much your spouse has in debt BEFORE marriage, as once the marriage is completed it becomes your prob, not when the woman stops working.

Precisely. It is the fault of both parties if they are suddenly overwhelmed by their each others big debts and laziness! How do you not know someone is $60k in debt before you marry them? We live in a world where we have the ability to know everything about any one.

You know what this article makes me say? boo-fuc*king-hoo. Most of us women are working our asses off just trying to help out our husbands. There are not too many places around here anymore where a married couple can even AFFORD to be a one income household. Where I live, it would be practically impossible unless your significant other made at least 6 figures.

While he said he was making generalizations, he still said a lot of unfounded things. I'm in my mind 20s and I do not know any of my female friends to be spending money lavishly. Most of us are still putting ourselves through school or scrimping and saving to get by. There is not one woman that comes to my mind that is living some sort of lifestyle known only to rich elites.

As for the ring, I will say that my brother in law IS going through that. Do not get me wrong, there are some women out there like that. He just spend $13,000 on a ring he really couldn't afford because she wanted it. She's also going to have a huge wedding that mom and dad wont be able to foot the entire bill for. So I do understand what the author is saying to some degree. But she is the only person I know like this.

[Jenn! 918]

While he said he was making generalizations, he still said a lot of unfounded things. I'm in my mind 20s and I do not know any of my female friends to be spending money lavishly. Most of us are still putting ourselves through school or scrimping and saving to get by. There is not one woman that comes to my mind that is living some sort of lifestyle known only to rich elites.

As for the ring, I will say that my brother in law IS going through that. Do not get me wrong, there are some women out there like that. He just spend $13,000 on a ring he really couldn't afford because she wanted it. She's also going to have a huge wedding that mom and dad wont be able to foot the entire bill for. So I do understand what the author is saying to some degree. But she is the only person I know like this.

You know, you're right. There are probably far fewer of these women than the article would lead you to believe. I think I watch too much reality TV.

[LuckyDucky 0]

I would have to say the author of the article must have been burned pretty badly (or have had loved ones burned) to write such an article.

While I know some women who fit some of the traits he's mentioned, I also know plenty of men who are equally jerky to their wives.

On housework: I can attest to the fact that housework can take longer than he states. I should amend that to good housework. Vacuuming the house only takes 1 hour if you ignore vacuuming corners, the floorboards, etc. Doing laundry is relatively easy - unless your wife has shirts with a ridiculous number of sequens that are shaped in an apple or a heart or a star that requires your husband to wash by hand. (Grrr! I need to 'encourage' her to stop buying those.) Then after you take the laundry out you need to, gasp, fold the clothes. Yeah, when I was a bachelor I would just take them out and stuff them back into the laundry basket. When I needed to wear them, I'd just shake/snap it out so that it wasn't as wrinkly. Apparently that method doesn't fly with the wife.

Grocery shoping only takes 1 hour if you buy a) hot dogs B) tortillas and c) microwave meals. My wife has spent 10 minutes thumping cantelope and asking me what I thought. (Neither of us knew what we were listening for ... we just saw others do it.)

On spending. Frankly, men buy things that women think are stupid and a waste of money: video games, a small nerf football to toss around, a stereo system that will blow clothes off. Women buy things men can't understand: Chanel No. 5 perfume ($160 / bottle), 14 pairs of shoes of various heights and styles, and seemingly more clothes than the Gap. Before I get jumped on, I realize that women like to mix and match outfits and shoes and it makes it seem like she's wearing something new. My wife always asks me "Again?" when I wear the same shirt every week. (I have about 12 shirts that I cycle through and that's all I feel I need since I wash clothes regularly.)

On working longer: Now I will say that I know I'll be retiring a lot later than I originally thought. Bringing my wife over and taking care of her while she can't work has put a huge strain on our budget. I mean, HUGE. But at least I'll statistically live longer so I guess I can put those years to good use, eh? (Budget is actually a point of contention in my marriage, though we're working through it.)

On staying home and taking care of the kids: I have no direct knowledge of this, but my friend has a 3-year old at home. He's spent a few days home with him when his son was sick and he told me he couldn't wait to get back to work. Apparently staying home with the kids isn't the "life of leisure" the author believes it to be.

On the engagement ring: My friend's sister did make a, in my opinion, crazy comment to me. She told me that if I didn't get my wife a minimum 1 carat diamond, I don't love her enough. I argued that a really good < 1 carat diamond can cost more than a 1 carat diamond ... and how do you equate diamond size with love? Her husband apparently spent $12,000 on her diamond. Good for him.

I bought her ring, her engagement ceremony, "wedding" celebration (not a real wedding, but something for her family to attend and have fun), gave more money to her family, flew her over here, outfit her with a new wardrobe for the different weather, enrolled her in classes, and am pampering her. (I cook most meals, clean, laundry, and try to make her feel as welcome as possible.) My friend's sister still says I should buy her a diamond necklace now because the ring I bought wasn't big enough.

Now the author did say he doesn't claim this to be in all marriages or even most marriages. Perhaps he meant it as a very extreme way of trying to stop that man with poor impulse control to rush out and get married. Someone I know at work could benefit from this. He's gone from, "I want to spend the rest of my life with her" to "I can't stand her, how do I get her to stop calling me?" in a period of one week of knowing and dating a woman. He definitely does not have his eyes open.

[SpiritAlight 1]

I know more women than men that do not want to nor value marriage.

Sorry they get the "rotten deal" every time in society as it has been set up and followed...

well, by sheeple.

As it turns out the truth is this:

men benefit from being married.

They live longer than single men.

Women do not.

They are happier and healthier single, and live longer when and in close community-living with other women.

I wonder who did that study ..... another one of those generalizations that serve no purpose. To argue the last point, I personally know women and have known women who socially get along better with men. In addition, I have had many women tell me that they also hate working for women bosses. So I just dont buy the last statement at all.

Sly

I totally agree with you about the "woman boss".

The best example of a woman trying to be a man to do her job because that is the only form/example available to her would be someone like Margaret Thatcher.

I find that women who take on the male role (dominant, aggressive) and not sink into their feminine (sharing, giving, communal, supporting, encouraging), lose every time.

We all do.

[DeadPoolX 9]

[Also, contrary to feminist propaganda, women do indeed get paid the same salary as men, given they are willing to work the same types of jobs as men, and work as many hours as their male counterpart.]

Wrong, I have worked in payroll and see the discrepancy first hand. I am bound not to say anything however.

I don't know... paying men more doesn't even make sense (financially-speaking) from an employer's standpoint!

Think of it this way: If I own a business and I can choose to hire men or women, both with similar or equal skill sets and education levels, but... I can pay the women less than the men, why would I ever hire a man? I could get the same work done, but for a lower cost by hiring a woman instead.

So if it's true that women do get paid less for doing the same job (despite having credentials that match up to their male counterparts), employers must be complete morons to hire men, when they could hire women and save money. Maybe that's not a nice way to look at it, but I'd be in it for profit; not to be a charity.

As you can see, I don't really believe in the idea that women get paid less when doing the same job and having equal or similar skill sets and education levels. Perhaps some women (and men) get receive lower pay for having less experience, less education and fewer skills overall. What might also make a difference -- for a woman -- is if she takes time off for maternity leave. While her job should be protected, she could miss out on an evaluation, which may lead to a lost opportunity for a raise in salary.

There are many variables, far more than "he's a man and she's a woman." That's just too simplistic.

[DanielParul 50]

The whole article is exagerated, but there are some points that I do agree with. As an outsider (non USC) I have felt that sometimes a marriage here does seem like an unfair deal to men. No offense to women (I am a woman too) but I do feel that the society here is kind of imbalanced or unfair when it comes to expectations from a man and a woman. Women are mostly portrayed as the victims. Why? In a society where men and women are equal and treated equal, why do women still feel so insecure that they have to push men, bash men or become feminists to feel good about themselves. I am not talking about becoming a submissive slave to men but even saying what I have here will be bashed because most women will feel offended.

[Jenn! 918]

The whole article is exagerated, but there are some points that I do agree with. As an outsider (non USC) I have felt that sometimes a marriage here does seem like an unfair deal to men. No offense to women (I am a woman too) but I do feel that the society here is kind of imbalanced or unfair when it comes to expectations from a man and a woman. Women are mostly portrayed as the victims. Why? In a society where men and women are equal and treated equal, why do women still feel so insecure that they have to push men, bash men or become feminists to feel good about themselves. I am not talking about becoming a submissive slave to men but even saying what I have here will be bashed because most women will feel offended.

You say that like it's a bad thing. I thought feminists just want equality for women - is that so bad?

Anyway, like I said before, I agree that there some valid points that apply to some women. Nothing feminist about demanding an expensive engagement ring as proof of a man's love.

How many times even here on VJ have I read posts that correlate being a "real" man with his financial contributions?

[DanielParul 50]

You say that like it's a bad thing. I thought feminists just want equality for women - is that so bad?

Anyway, like I said before, I agree that there some valid points that apply to some women. Nothing feminist about demanding an expensive engagement ring as proof of a man's love.

How many times even here on VJ have I read posts that correlate being a "real" man with his financial contributions?

No, nothing wrong with it. I just don't get it when its taken to the extreme - when being a man and just expecting certain things from women is termed bad.

[Ban Hammer 14,290]

The best example of a woman trying to be a man to do her job because that is the only form/example available to her would be someone like Margaret Thatcher. is a lesbian.

fixxored

[sly_wolf 199]

The best example of a woman trying to be a man to do her job because that is the only form/example available to her would be someone like Margaret Thatcher. is a lesbian.

fixxored

Lol, thats so bad

Lets not forget the women that become men and the men that became women. And then there are also the trans gender ... oh what a complicated world.

Sly

[DeadPoolX 9]

The whole article is exagerated, but there are some points that I do agree with. As an outsider (non USC) I have felt that sometimes a marriage here does seem like an unfair deal to men. No offense to women (I am a woman too) but I do feel that the society here is kind of imbalanced or unfair when it comes to expectations from a man and a woman. Women are mostly portrayed as the victims. Why? In a society where men and women are equal and treated equal, why do women still feel so insecure that they have to push men, bash men or become feminists to feel good about themselves. I am not talking about becoming a submissive slave to men but even saying what I have here will be bashed because most women will feel offended.

You say that like it's a bad thing. I thought feminists just want equality for women - is that so bad?

Anyway, like I said before, I agree that there some valid points that apply to some women. Nothing feminist about demanding an expensive engagement ring as proof of a man's love.

How many times even here on VJ have I read posts that correlate being a "real" man with his financial contributions?

That's the "classical" definition of the word, Jenn. Today's "modern" feminist is more closely related to what's referred to as a "Feminazi." Even the original classical feminists prefer to distance themselves from the modern feminist, since most of what's said involves hate-filled commentary for men.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

I don't think Ruch Limbaugh with his feminazi label is the standardbearer of what modern feminism means.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I don't think Ruch Limbaugh with his feminazi label is the standardbearer of what modern feminism means.

I wouldn't have thought so..

[morocco4ever 63]

[Also, contrary to feminist propaganda, women do indeed get paid the same salary as men, given they are willing to work the same types of jobs as men, and work as many hours as their male counterpart.]

Wrong, I have worked in payroll and see the discrepancy first hand. I am bound not to say anything however.

So, you are saying that in a company with a male and female employee who are both doing the same work, the same position, the same number of hours, who brought the same work experience and the same skill set to the job, that the woman is getting a smaller salary??

[For starters, men are forced (yes, forced) to spend their hard earned savings (or take a loan) on a diamond ring.]

And if you are talking a traditional wedding, well the bride or her family is paying huge bucks for the reception.

Someone forgot to inform my inlaws of that one.

Yes, I can testify that the women were doing equal work, equal hours, and were equally qualified. The only thing different was that the woman had senority. These people were sales reps. And I was also able to see what they brought in. It was equal as well.

As for the wedding, that is why I stated "traditional". I am well aware of the fact that this will not be the case in all marriages.

[Also, contrary to feminist propaganda, women do indeed get paid the same salary as men, given they are willing to work the same types of jobs as men, and work as many hours as their male counterpart.]

Wrong, I have worked in payroll and see the discrepancy first hand. I am bound not to say anything however.

I don't know... paying men more doesn't even make sense (financially-speaking) from an employer's standpoint!

Think of it this way: If I own a business and I can choose to hire men or women, both with similar or equal skill sets and education levels, but... I can pay the women less than the men, why would I ever hire a man? I could get the same work done, but for a lower cost by hiring a woman instead.

So if it's true that women do get paid less for doing the same job (despite having credentials that match up to their male counterparts), employers must be complete morons to hire men, when they could hire women and save money. Maybe that's not a nice way to look at it, but I'd be in it for profit; not to be a charity.

As you can see, I don't really believe in the idea that women get paid less when doing the same job and having equal or similar skill sets and education levels. Perhaps some women (and men) get receive lower pay for having less experience, less education and fewer skills overall. What might also make a difference -- for a woman -- is if she takes time off for maternity leave. While her job should be protected, she could miss out on an evaluation, which may lead to a lost opportunity for a raise in salary.

There are many variables, far more than "he's a man and she's a woman." That's just too simplistic.

That is a very valid question, and I agree. I can only make a guess. But I did work for a man when I was in corporate accounting. He had the "man's club" attitude. I have since returned back into the payroll department, since I love the work I did in here more. Corporate accounting is boring! Well now I can see the pay between those in corporate accounting. I also see the percentage of bonuses paid. There is one lady in there that has equal qualifications as the others. I know from working with her that she puts in more hours than all of the others. She is obviously his doormat because she earns less than the others, and her bonuses are substantially less. On the other hand we had one male employee that we called "huey". Not to bright. I swear he just didn't get it. Although he got the least of all of them men (as he should have) he was making more than the woman that did a much better job. Go figure!

Although the author tried to point out that not all women are that way you could read that he has a chip on his shoulder. And like many have stated, this type of attitude is not gender related.