Sons and middle east culture

[S and S 12]

This has been bothering me for some time and I just had to get it out there and see what other people think who are married to SOs from the middle east. Several times now people have told me to be sure to have sons and that they hope I have many sons. An Iraqi woman I know was telling me how her brother's third child was born and it was a girl. She asked if I wanted to see a picture of the baby girl. I said yes that I would. Well, the picture had her brother's three year old son and the baby girl. The Iraqi woman pointed at the baby girl and barely said a word. Then she started oogling over the boy! This made me upset because she barely acknowledged the girl after going through the trouble to show me the picture. She went on to say she hoped she didn't have girls and only boys!

Sometimes this makes me want to only have girls though that isn't fair to my husband. If I desire to have a boy at all it would be so my husband has a son and so I can raise that son to respect and appreciate women. I told my friend, the Iraqi woman, that daughters are of more benifit because they will help a mother with cooking and cleaning. They don't get into as much trouble (most of the time) as a son either. When parents get old who is it that usually washes and cares for their aging parents? It is usually the daughter. At least this has always been my experience. I even pointed out to this woman how she sends money to her mother in Iraq. Does that not make her benificial to her mother regardless of gender?

Why is there so much value placed in a boy? What makes them better than a girl?

Sorry, but this has been bothering me and I just had to get it out there. Maybe someone can explain it to me in a way that can calm me down. If anyone is offended by my post, please don't. I only wrote about this in the hope of expressing my concerns and hearing what other think on this matter.

[Jenn! 918]

Not exactly the same thing, but kind of related...

I just posted this about the concept of the "mammone" in Italy. It's not too far off from some of the MENA stories I've heard here.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=132255

[S and S 12]

Not exactly the same thing, but kind of related...

I just posted this about the concept of the "mammone" in Italy. It's not too far off from some of the MENA stories I've heard here.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=132255

Thanks for letting me know. Good post!

[sarahaziz 0]

I sometimes felt like that also how you feel but the more you meet arab people you will see that some people think modern and understand the girls worth. They end up loving their daughters and daughter in laws a little bit more than the boys. What I've heard alot of times is the daughter back home is a burden because the mother and father will have to work like crazy to give a grand wedding and find a bachelor it's the girls side who is mostly responsible for the money arrangements and etc.. Also sometimes parents can't find suitable men to match up to some girls if they've exceeded in education or working vs a boy who can work twice as much as the girl, build a house or buy one on his own, and openly is accepted to further his education and all that stuff. There's an old arab proverb I can't think of it at the top of my head but it's something from a father speaking that his daughters will all forget him and put their husbands/kids first but his son will always keep his parents on his head (high respect and never abandon them). This kind of thinking is just for old fashioned thinkers which we have alot of. I think these days you will find more open minded people though. Maybe her daughter did something bad or against their will that she's not able to express what a mother should.

[kerewin21 2]

I guess I haven't noticed this that much. What I have noticed in Morocco is that the boys are free to sit on their butts while their sisters cook and clean.

[S and S 12]

I sometimes felt like that also how you feel but the more you meet arab people you will see that some people think modern and understand the girls worth. They end up loving their daughters and daughter in laws a little bit more than the boys. What I've heard alot of times is the daughter back home is a burden because the mother and father will have to work like crazy to give a grand wedding and find a bachelor it's the girls side who is mostly responsible for the money arrangements and etc.. Also sometimes parents can't find suitable men to match up to some girls if they've exceeded in education or working vs a boy who can work twice as much as the girl, build a house or buy one on his own, and openly is accepted to further his education and all that stuff. There's an old arab proverb I can't think of it at the top of my head but it's something from a father speaking that his daughters will all forget him and put their husbands/kids first but his son will always keep his parents on his head (high respect and never abandon them). This kind of thinking is just for old fashioned thinkers which we have alot of. I think these days you will find more open minded people though. Maybe her daughter did something bad or against their will that she's not able to express what a mother should.

I see what you are saying sarahaziz though it is the man who pays the dowry in the middle east or atleast that is what is required under Islam. My husband's family also bought me Gold and clothing. Maybe I need to see a wedding that is more traditional since my family did not have any participation in my marriage. As for my mother and father in law, there was some difficulties at first and they did not accept me, but after I met them in person we got along great. They often take my side against their son, lol. Also, I noticed they treat their daughters great and with respect and do a lot for them including sending them to college. Though it is the daughters doing all the housework. It is difficult for my parents in law to find husbands for their daughters, especially considering they are refugees and the situation in their own country is not good. Many Iraqi women lost their husbands to the violence within months of getting married. It is so sad. It has just been mentioned a couple times by my husband's family that they hope I have sons that bothered me though I see their women are treated well in the family.

I can't imagine a daughter forgeting her own parents. I never noticed that within my husbands family, but I suppose it does happen. As for the Iraqi woman I spoke of, she hasn't had children yet so she doesn't have that experience. I think she just favors boys. She defied her family by marrying an American so maybe she wouldn't want to deal with that with her own daughters. I don't know.

Thanks for your thoughts, I appreciate them.

[sarahaziz 0]

I think your spouses family respects you and your family alot that they didn't ask for any money because he's been accepted by you. Usually for the daughter the father will pay for her wedding costs or if father is not alive the Son/s will pay. If we had a daughter I'm pretty sure she would be spoiled!!!

Honestly speaking if you are living in the middle east and you are from there it's tough being a daughter. That's probably why some women don't want to bring daughters because they know what they are going through. Not all though. I do pray women are respected equally as men there someday. What I love about USA - when men are scared to annoy a woman

[S and S 12]

Considering my marriage was in a courthouse and there was no ceremony outside of it. What money could they have asked for? They weren't even in the same country when we got married and they weren't speaking to me or my husband at the time.

I would be happy to cover my daughter's costs for a ceremony. My husband kept thinking it should be his family paying for all that, but since they wouldn't approve of our marriage at the time there was no way for that. I do see what you are saying, but dowry costs can reach as high as the wedding costs. It is all still confusing for me though.

My husband is afraid to annoy me when I have a knife in my hand, lol.

Edited June 9, 2008 by S and S

[AlHayatZween 2]

I guess I haven't noticed this that much. What I have noticed in Morocco is that the boys are free to sit on their butts while their sisters cook and clean.

ha! ain't that the truth...

not all of them, of course, but i know what you are saying, Kerewin, sometimes it seems that way!

[Aymsgirl 0]

I can only add to this that when we were expecting we wanted a healthy child but I know in my husbands heart at the time he was hoping for a daughter. Now he wouldn't trade our son for the world but I know he had no hard feelings about feeling different from a daughter or a son.

Edited June 9, 2008 by t and a

[Dr. A ♥ O 203]

I guess I haven't noticed this that much. What I have noticed in Morocco is that the boys are free to sit on their butts while their sisters cook and clean.

my husband says he wants all daughters. probably for that reason.

[Henia 11]

Esalaam/Hello ...

The 'want' for sons over daughters is not limited to the Middle East. Culturally, boys are preferred over girls since the boys once grown up stay in the home. While, the idea is that girls get married and leave. The thinking says it harder to "marry off" girls then boys. Plus, with boys you do not have to worry over "keeping her a virgin" Thus, the boys are left to take care of the parents in old age.

Baby girls being buried alive have happened for centuries. In our parents generation, in China, due to the limit of children the government allowed parents to have ... burying or any other means of killing baby girls are common. Just only recently has the government, due to the extreme low rate of women in China started 'helping' families with girls.

Regions of the world with this type of thinking need to rethink it's ideas about women in general - you know, the ideas that a woman is almost useless without a man by her side and her very personhood is defined by the men (of lack thereof) in her life. Something that clearly, Islam was suppose to delete 1400 years ago!

But my inner ****** says that more statistics or context aren't necessary-- we've just spent far too long seeing women as a burden, not a blessing. Stories like this do still send a searing dagger in to my heart ... since in 2008 this is still happening. There will never be a point when we bless someone by saying, “May you be the mother of a hundred daughters”, and we are lesser for it.

Let's not be in denial. There is an underlying issue here, in thi thread that weaves together the garland of dowry, dowry-deaths, widow non-remarriage, infant gynocide, sex-selective abortions, and hell, even apartment rentals.

[AlHayatZween 2]

I guess I haven't noticed this that much. What I have noticed in Morocco is that the boys are free to sit on their butts while their sisters cook and clean.

my husband says he wants all daughters. probably for that reason.

tough break!

well, at least you won't have to do it all?

i'm kidding...

[Dr. A ♥ O 203]

I guess I haven't noticed this that much. What I have noticed in Morocco is that the boys are free to sit on their butts while their sisters cook and clean.

my husband says he wants all daughters. probably for that reason.

tough break!

well, at least you won't have to do it all?

i'm kidding...

I say let the maids do it.

[AlHayatZween 2]

I say let the maids do it.

that'll work, too!!