Could pay-per-mile lead to the state automating speeding tickets?

[bcking 3,157]

3 minutes ago, Umka36 said:

LOL, again it's about a pay per mile system to replace a gas tax and not about speeding or anything else.

...I was responding to you saying a similar system for speeding is not ok.

 

I completely disagree.

[Unidentified 2,930]

I don't like the fact that it's a GPS tracking device meaning they can check where I am at all times. If it was just some kind of sensor I would be totally fine with it. 

[bcking 3,157]

9 minutes ago, Unidentified said:

I don't like the fact that it's a GPS tracking device meaning they can check where I am at all times. If it was just some kind of sensor I would be totally fine with it. 

Well the perfect system would be a speed sensor combined with a GPS that can pick up the speed limit on the road you're driving.

 

That way it could be automated. I realize there are privacy concerns about that but honestly I personally wouldn't care. Driving is a privilege and a public act. Bad driving needs to be punished more, in my opinion.

 

Texas drivers would absolutely explode. They wouldn't know how to function at the speed limit. It would be hilarious.

Edited April 5, 2018 by bcking

[Umka36 781]

We'll have to agree to disagree.

[Unidentified 2,930]

12 hours ago, bcking said:

Well the perfect system would be a speed sensor combined with a GPS that can pick up the speed limit on the road you're driving.

 

That way it could be automated. I realize there are privacy concerns about that but honestly I personally wouldn't care. Driving is a privilege and a public act. Bad driving needs to be punished more, in my opinion.

 

Texas drivers would absolutely explode. They wouldn't know how to function at the speed limit. It would be hilarious.

I'd rather see them educate driver's more than trying to put GPS trackers in their cars. Like driver's ed in this country is a joke. I don't know about the UK but my book about driving in Sweden was like 200 pages long at least and included all kinds of traffic rules and information about useful stuff like how to change a tire. I actually had to take several classes both in driving and actual sitting in a classroom learning practical stuff like changing oil and tires. Had to spend an entire day on a runway practicing avoiding hitting big animals as well as experiencing what hydroplaning is like. I come to the US and they give me a two page pamphlet with basically what the lines in the street means... Great. There's no wonder why Americans make up their own rules and overtake people in turning lanes, cut in front of someone at the red light just to be first in line. It's like dealing with small children in cars. (No offense, I know many Americans can drive but there's a ton of people who never should have been given a DL)

[Dashinka 25,516]

13 hours ago, bcking said:

Well the perfect system would be a speed sensor combined with a GPS that can pick up the speed limit on the road you're driving.

 

That way it could be automated. I realize there are privacy concerns about that but honestly I personally wouldn't care. Driving is a privilege and a public act. Bad driving needs to be punished more, in my opinion.

 

Texas drivers would absolutely explode. They wouldn't know how to function at the speed limit. It would be hilarious.

So you would be fine with cameras and recording devices in your home to make sure you are not doing something nefarious behind your closed doors?

[bcking 3,157]

1 minute ago, Bill & Katya said:

So you would be fine with cameras and recording devices in your home to make sure you are not doing something nefarious behind your closed doors?

Cars aren't an invasion of privacy. 

[Neonred 3,867]

22 minutes ago, Unidentified said:

 There's no wonder why Americans make up their own rules and overtake people in turning lanes, cut in front of someone at the red light just to be first in line. It's like dealing with small children in cars. (No offense, I know many Americans can drive but there's a ton of people who never should have been given a DL)

Ha!  I take it you've never had the driving experience in Russia.  Makes the US drivers look like ultra careful grandmothers.

[Dashinka 25,516]

2 minutes ago, bcking said:

Cars aren't an invasion of privacy. 

So police do not need a warrant to search someone's vehicle?  I believe that all personal property is covered by the 4th amendment unless you want to do away with that as well.  Btw, owning a house is also a privilege.

[bcking 3,157]

2 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

So police do not need a warrant to search someone's vehicle?  I believe that all personal property is covered by the 4th amendment unless you want to do away with that as well.  Btw, owning a house is also a privilege.

The speed you are driving isn't a private thing. They don't need to search the car.

 

A monitor like this would not reveal information that is otherwise hidden. It would just mean that officers themselves wouldn't need to be positioned everywhere in order to catch people.

 

People speed because they know they can get away with it. They are a danger to society. I would support regulations that require all cars have speed monitors. If people don't like it, don't drive a car.

 

 

[Neonred 3,867]

I like to drive fast, but I drive safe. 

 

In Florida the police generally allow 10 mph over the limit.  After that you are fair game.  On the interstates if you are not doing 80 you are in the way.  At least stay to the right.

[bcking 3,157]

56 minutes ago, Neonred said:

I like to drive fast, but I drive safe. 

 

In Florida the police generally allow 10 mph over the limit.  After that you are fair game.  On the interstates if you are not doing 80 you are in the way.  At least stay to the right.

I mean absolutely no disrespect to you, but one of our biggest problems with driving is over-confidence. I'm sure if you asked everyone that speeds on the highway, many of them would say "Yes but I'm a good driver" or something like that.

We also over-estimate our reaction times. We all think we could respond quicker than we can. We may imagine ourselves at our peak when the reality is many times you are driving not at your peak, or the conditions on the road reduce your ability to respond.

 

If everyone were good drivers the speed limits could be much higher than they are. Without erratic lane changes, and with safe following distances, we could all drive 90 or 100 and be just fine. The fact is that will never be the case. Individuals may think they are good drivers (and some, including yourself, maybe are) but that doesn't mean speeding is appropriate. You may be the safest driver on the road but if you are going 90 miles of hour and someone else does something stupid, you may not react quickly enough. The accident may not be your fault, but you won't care about judgment if you are dead.

 

1 hour ago, Unidentified said:

I'd rather see them educate driver's more than trying to put GPS trackers in their cars. Like driver's ed in this country is a joke. I don't know about the UK but my book about driving in Sweden was like 200 pages long at least and included all kinds of traffic rules and information about useful stuff like how to change a tire. I actually had to take several classes both in driving and actual sitting in a classroom learning practical stuff like changing oil and tires. Had to spend an entire day on a runway practicing avoiding hitting big animals as well as experiencing what hydroplaning is like. I come to the US and they give me a two page pamphlet with basically what the lines in the street means... Great. There's no wonder why Americans make up their own rules and overtake people in turning lanes, cut in front of someone at the red light just to be first in line. It's like dealing with small children in cars. (No offense, I know many Americans can drive but there's a ton of people who never should have been given a DL)

I'd love to see more education, and stricter testing to get the license. The UK failure rate for the driving portion of the test is commonly greater than 50 or 60 percent. The US failure rate for the driving portion is negligible. Most people who fail in the US do so on the written test (which itself is a joke so I have no idea how that is the case).

 

However, I'm not convinced that better testing/education would really change behavior. I think it is human nature to under-estimate risk. Accidents may be very common but to an individual they are unlikely to occur. Not only are accidents "uncommon" from an individual perspective, so are tickets and punishment. It may seem like there are lots of cops on the road but compared to the number of drivers they really isn't. You can "get away" with bad behavior 80-90% of the time. That makes it easy for people to think they will get away with it "just this one time" every time they do.

[Dashinka 25,516]

1 hour ago, bcking said:

The speed you are driving isn't a private thing. They don't need to search the car.

 

A monitor like this would not reveal information that is otherwise hidden. It would just mean that officers themselves wouldn't need to be positioned everywhere in order to catch people.

 

People speed because they know they can get away with it. They are a danger to society. I would support regulations that require all cars have speed monitors. If people don't like it, don't drive a car.

 

 

Why not simply require motorists to report the mileage they drive annually, or quarterly?  No sure I want any form of a government tracking device in my car.  Regardless, I am sure if they actually attempt to move forward with this, they will face legal challenges.

[bcking 3,157]

1 minute ago, Bill & Katya said:

Why not simply require motorists to report the mileage they drive annually, or quarterly?  No sure I want any form of a government tracking device in my car.  Regardless, I am sure if they actually attempt to move forward with this, they will face legal challenges.

How would just mileage identify unsafe driving practices? You could safely drive 10,000 miles a quarter, and you could unsafely drive 2,000 miles a quarter.

 

Most (Many?) cars already have GPS. If we want to go the conspiracy theorist route they could be tracking your car already.

 

What legal challenges would there be? If it was a regulation of the entire auto industry. It is a safety measure, like requiring seat belts in cars. If you want it "unplugged" you could have require a yearly "safety check" inspection (like our current "smog checks") where the information from the past year is downloaded. Then you get a bill at the end of the year for all the times you were above the speed limit in the area you were driving.

[Dashinka 25,516]

1 minute ago, bcking said:

How would just mileage identify unsafe driving practices? You could safely drive 10,000 miles a quarter, and you could unsafely drive 2,000 miles a quarter.

 

Most (Many?) cars already have GPS. If we want to go the conspiracy theorist route they could be tracking your car already.

 

What legal challenges would there be? If it was a regulation of the entire auto industry. It is a safety measure, like requiring seat belts in cars. If you want it "unplugged" you could have require a yearly "safety check" inspection (like our current "smog checks") where the information from the past year is downloaded. Then you get a bill at the end of the year for all the times you were above the speed limit in the area you were driving.

The main reason for this "tracking" device is to record the mileage driven with respect to assessing road taxes.  The author and others in this thread are only speculating on the slippery slope aspect of any government putting a tracking device in a personal vehicle.  If we want to make driving safer, why not simply restrict all cars to a maximum speed of 15 mph regardless and make that a regulatory requirement for all car makers.  Requiring a vehicle owner to purposefully put a government tracking device in a vehicle is wrong in many ways, but mostly, it is just another invasion of privacy.  If the state of Washington wants to increase their road taxes since revenues are falling because of increased fuel economy, then require the owners to self report the mileage.  This can be done online, would most likely take just a few minutes, and not require a big brother device in anyone's car.

 

As to government recording anyone in their home, I think Amazon is already taking care of that with Alexa.