Getting over the "shoulds"

[KarenCee 3]

I never feel like I have to "defend" the age difference. We both want children, even though I'm older than he is, and I have no children for him to take care of - that's kind of funny. It's not the big deal that people seem to THINK that WE think it is.

You know...when someone wants to gripe about something they'll find anything. Only in America!

[Fandango 1,440]

My thinking on this is that if you want to marry young, old..whatever...that's your choice. But I find it strange to see the need of qualifying the relationship to others. If one doesn't care about what other people think...why dicuss it then? I don't say 'hey I like the same age or slightly older man because...........' it's just there. It's my choice so justifying it to someone else is pointless cos I couldn' give a sh!t about what anyone else has to say about it.

I don't think there's need, like in this article, for everything to be discussed so generally as being so opposed to each other. 'I like older women cos I don't want to be with a ditz'...well like Shonnie said, that doesn't mean all younger women are ditzes. But we see this mentality on VJ all the time, and I'm not referring to the 'young/old' debate, but the 'foreign women cos all Amerian women have no family values' argument. Just make your choice without having the need to cast aspersions about the rest. For instance, I fell in love with D for all the wonderful qualities he possesses. Not because 'British men do this and American men are azzholes' (<---I don't believe that btw) or summat like that.

Edited April 29, 2007 by LisaD

[brnidokiegurl 1]

I never feel like I have to "defend" the age difference. We both want children, even though I'm older than he is, and I have no children for him to take care of - that's kind of funny. It's not the big deal that people seem to THINK that WE think it is.

You know...when someone wants to gripe about something they'll find anything. Only in America!

isnt that the truth its kinda like a sign my boss has "I can't please everyone everyday and todays not your day either" or something similar

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I realized something today reading this thread, the ONLY time I think of our difference, is when I am on VJ.

As we age together, it is less and less a factor. We are both very active with work and the house. We appreciate the same things and find fun where we can. I can't figure out for the life of me why this is such a hot topic on this site. A marriage, an immigration, the adjustment of it all, there are soooooooo many issues we all face, age, in my opinion, is the least of a couples worries.

Jackie

This is a hot issue on the MENA board; two threads started there were locked recently where the issue was raised. I, too, only come across people openly hostile to age difference couples when I'm on VJ. Probably many of those same folks would be offended by the same kinds of insults being directed at race difference couples or same sex couples, but, here, particularly when the woman is older than the man, it gives some the creeps. Late last week, an insult hurled at me was that because I was so undesirable, I had no choice but to look overseas for a man, because no one here would want me. Then, most likely, my husband will leave me anyway due to my age. Jackie has also been told the same sort of thing.

I read that article years ago when I was looking for validation that it was ok to love and marry a much younger man, for time and experience told me he was the best man for me out of all I had considered. If I listened to all the naysayers here, I'd be having anxiety attacks, but confidence carries the day.

Marriages end fpr a variety of reasons. Sometimes life is often more durable than love. It is quite possible that some of the ageists will find themselves alone again. Insha'allah, their minds will open to what can certainly be a wonderful match with a younger man, and, by that time, such couplings will be de rigor so they will not have to deal with the nastiness they thoughtlessly hurl at others in their youth.

Edited April 29, 2007 by Green-eyed girl

[babybunny 2]

if someone gets upset because, someone is married to a younger man or younger lady. tell them this....

"DONT BE SO JEALOUS".....

Face it if you are 60 years old and can capture the heart of a younger man< the bearly legal kind > .lol ..

GIRL hats off to you- because, you still "GOT IT". and everyone that complains is just Jealous..lol

[Caladan 19]

I'd be very surprised if anyone said anything in real life, but I'd be even more surprised if no one found a large age gap relationshiph unusual. They're writing articles and books on the 'hot new trend!11!one!': that makes it unusual and noteworthy.

I suspect that people who find May-December relationships strange in real life a) aren't thinking about potential red flags and a country with a growing history of fraud b ) are polite enough to keep their mouth shut (yes, yes, we're all exactly the same in person, I know, I know, think of the children) c) aren't in a forum where discussing relationships and fraud is pretty much the most common thing and d) can see your day-to-day relationship.

It's not really surprising it would come up more here. You'll probably find people more accepting and knowledgeable about international relationships, too. Potato, potahto.

[Alex+R 0]

I'd be very surprised if anyone said anything in real life, but I'd be even more surprised if no one found a large age gap relationshiph unusual. They're writing articles and books on the 'hot new trend!11!one!': that makes it unusual and noteworthy.

I suspect that people who find May-December relationships strange in real life a) aren't thinking about potential red flags and a country with a growing history of fraud b ) are polite enough to keep their mouth shut (yes, yes, we're all exactly the same in person, I know, I know, think of the children) c) aren't in a forum where discussing relationships and fraud is pretty much the most common thing and d) can see your day-to-day relationship.

It's not really surprising it would come up more here. You'll probably find people more accepting and knowledgeable about international relationships, too. Potato, potahto.

VJ is a strange place. Nobody is going to ask you how you can still say you're in a relationship when you haven't seen your SO for 3 months, either.

I think while people should never feel like they can't love someone because society says they shouldn't (with obvious exceptions of minors, goats, etc.) I also think it's good for people to discuss it here on VJ. It shouldn't be a taboo subject, because maybe frank discussion about it can save some people from getting used and ending up miserable. Just my .02.

[Fandango 1,440]

I'd be very surprised if anyone said anything in real life, but I'd be even more surprised if no one found a large age gap relationshiph unusual. They're writing articles and books on the 'hot new trend!11!one!': that makes it unusual and noteworthy.

I suspect that people who find May-December relationships strange in real life a) aren't thinking about potential red flags and a country with a growing history of fraud b ) are polite enough to keep their mouth shut (yes, yes, we're all exactly the same in person, I know, I know, think of the children) c) aren't in a forum where discussing relationships and fraud is pretty much the most common thing and d) can see your day-to-day relationship.

It's not really surprising it would come up more here. You'll probably find people more accepting and knowledgeable about international relationships, too. Potato, potahto.

VJ is a strange place. Nobody is going to ask you how you can still say you're in a relationship when you haven't seen your SO for 3 months, either.

I think while people should never feel like they can't love someone because society says they shouldn't (with obvious exceptions of minors, goats, etc.) I also think it's good for people to discuss it here on VJ. It shouldn't be a taboo subject, because maybe frank discussion about it can save some people from getting used and ending up miserable. Just my .02.

Ooooh now there's a comment

I personally think that no amount of discussion will stop anyone from doing what (s)he wants to do, regardless of the circumstances

[Alex+R 0]

I personally think that no amount of discussion will stop anyone from doing what (s)he wants to do, regardless of the circumstances

Yeah, you're probably right... but if someone doesn't know that a huge age gap is not normal in their SO's culture, they might find out here. But you're right, people are stubborn about not taking advice.

[Caladan 19]

Alex, that's a good point. No one ever says "Your relationship can't be real solely because you're long distance" here. I've heard that, and C.'s Canadian (or as one of my friends jokes "America Jr."), and that's after three years of several visits a year, a common language, a standard age gap, a similar religion, and a nearly identical culture. Either everyone else is surrounded with perfectly supportive people, or people are prudently keeping their mouths shut and being polite. My vote's for polite indifference.

I don't think VJ can talk anyone into or out of a relationship. You just end up with weirder and weirder justifications once the relationship is started. And it's not really relationship therapy here, anyway, it's a bloody immigration board.

[Jenn! 918]

My thinking on this is that if you want to marry young, old..whatever...that's your choice. But I find it strange to see the need of qualifying the relationship to others. If one doesn't care about what other people think...why dicuss it then? I don't say 'hey I like the same age or slightly older man because...........' it's just there. It's my choice so justifying it to someone else is pointless cos I couldn' give a sh!t about what anyone else has to say about it.

I don't think there's need, like in this article, for everything to be discussed so generally as being so opposed to each other. 'I like older women cos I don't want to be with a ditz'...well like Shonnie said, that doesn't mean all younger women are ditzes. But we see this mentality on VJ all the time, and I'm not referring to the 'young/old' debate, but the 'foreign women cos all Amerian women have no family values' argument. Just make your choice without having the need to cast aspersions about the rest. For instance, I fell in love with D for all the wonderful qualities he possesses. Not because 'British men do this and American men are azzholes' (<---I don't believe that btw) or summat like that.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

My thinking on this is that if you want to marry young, old..whatever...that's your choice. But I find it strange to see the need of qualifying the relationship to others. If one doesn't care about what other people think...why dicuss it then? I don't say 'hey I like the same age or slightly older man because...........' it's just there. It's my choice so justifying it to someone else is pointless cos I couldn' give a sh!t about what anyone else has to say about it.

The concern is usually raised by someone NOT in a age different relationship who has nothing positive to say about them. We are not insulted only in the context of immigration, but as a matter of what "should" not be. So it's not a matter of qualifying it to others, but them demeaning it to you. If we cared about what others think about us, we wouldn't still be with our men. For me, within the context of immigration, it's a matter of why some couple's issues are "sacred cows" and unable to be examined with any substance because the majority doesn't want their red flags exposed, but the selected targets, fat women and older women, are seen as easy prey for derision as desparate, in general, and fraud victims, in particular.

Edited April 29, 2007 by Green-eyed girl

[Jenn! 918]

For me, within the context of immigration, it's a matter of why some couple's issues are "sacred cows" and unable to be examined with any substance because the majority doesn't want their red flags exposed, but the selected targets, fat women and older women, are seen as easy prey for derision as desparate, in general, and fraud victims, in particular.

You brought up the issue of interracial marriages, a good topic to discuss IMO. But a few people took offense, much like there are those who take offense when the issue of age difference is brought up. I noticed that those who did take offense to your statements regarding Arab men marrying non-Arab women were not even the same people who habitually raise the age difference issue. I think that everything is fair game, and I fail to see these "sacred cows".

[Fuzzness 2]

VJ sheesh

[Sofiyya 1,687]

For me, within the context of immigration, it's a matter of why some couple's issues are "sacred cows" and unable to be examined with any substance because the majority doesn't want their red flags exposed, but the selected targets, fat women and older women, are seen as easy prey for derision as desparate, in general, and fraud victims, in particular.

You brought up the issue of interracial marriages, a good topic to discuss IMO. But a few people took offense, much like there are those who take offense when the issue of age difference is brought up. I noticed that those who did take offense to your statements regarding Arab men marrying non-Arab women were not even the same people who habitually raise the age difference issue. I think that everything is fair game, and I fail to see these "sacred cows".

I agree with you that everything is fair game, and I have a habit of treating everything that way that has caused me to be perceived to be a divisive force on the MENA board. I enjoy a good, friendly debate, too, but I've learned from experience that our treating everythig as fair game doesn't go over well on the MENA board.

I'll dare say that no one takes offense that the issue of age is relevent, it's the context of negativity rankles; it's always raised as a cautionary tale of love and deception between an older woman and an Arab man, or an indicator of a woman's lessening value as a mate. We can't even discuss Arab men marrying non-Arab women at all without the discussion immediately dissolving into name-calling. This recent try was not my forst, and both ended badly. There's been no debate or diversity of thought allowed about this issue because those who are in them do not allow for a discussion to progess. They want to shut them down, but feel free to criticize other unlike themselves as somehow deficient.

Women in age difference relationships, and I'm sure those here will agree with me, don't raise the issue as much as those who aren't, nor are we adverse to a discussion of the subject. I know I'm not. It's always been, however, when the topic is raised, terms such as "sick" and the infamous "gross and abnormal" are bandied about. How can you have a proper discussion when there are thos among you who insist on characterizing your relationship with such perjorative terms? You can't.

The issue of Arab Muslim men marrying out with western non-Arab, non-Muslim women was one I got a lot of PMS about from people who were interested in the topic and dismayed that those who objected to their relationship being included in the "red flag" category would not allow a coherent discussion to proceed. The majority of people on MENA are western, non-Muslim women with Arab Muslim men, so those of the more sensitive type feel they can dictate who gets to say what, how it is perceived, when they are insulted (easily so) and who can be insulted for supposedly insulting them. That is what I've learned from my attempts to interject some substantive observations into the subjects of red flags. It's a taboo to bring that up.

There are sacred cows, alright, although the same people may not be always the objectors. That there were so few who encouraged the discussion was telling. The majority of comments regarding having such a debate were very negative, not nurturing of the topic. It's been a case of killing the messenger rather than an exchange of viewpoints. The reaction is as if those who are in that group were made to look closely at their own situation, they may not like what they see. They certainly do not welcome nor support an examination of it.

Edited April 30, 2007 by Green-eyed girl