Status following Final divorce decree?

[mbuk 2]

Hello All,

I had to re-register since I had a hard time logging in with my previous credentials.

I hold a permanent residence card that is conditional based upon marriage and expires in May 2011. Sadly, like most users who post threads in this part of the forum, I'm going through divorce proceedings and I'm separated from my wife.

However, I have begun compiling a very thorough document package of emails, photos, tax returns, health benefits, etc etc that establish that our marriage was in good faith. Having already spoken to several attorneys, both they and myself are confident that we can establish that our marriage was in good faith during the filing of the I-751. I expect my decree to be final in circa April 2010 so it will be in good time prior to the original plan of removal of conditions starting in Jan 2011.

However, I have several questions that I would like to ask here based on experiences:

1. As soon as my decree is here I'm going to immediately file for removal of conditions and inform the USCIS. My concern is that am I able to still work legally immediately after receiving my decree and during the process of USCIS processing? This is important since I have an excellent career (based upon my degrees I obtained in my home country) that I do not wish to jeopardize.

2. I'm going to ask an attorney to go to the interview with me. What are your thoughts on this? I believe it's a good investment and would be more favorable (and safer) to be represented legally. I know after reading some posts some people think it's a waste of money but I think $500 for legal representation (this is one quote, some are higher and lower) is worth it.

Thanks for your help in advance.

[Dakine 26]

If you have plenty of evidence you married with good faith and you did so I can't see where a lawyer would help you at all.

If anything to me it looks like it might be a red flag thinking you need one.

I haven't seen many people who use one doing ROC.

Doesn't mean people don't tho. The use of a lawyer just may not get posted.

[Anamaria2009 1]

1. As soon as my decree is here I'm going to immediately file for removal of conditions and inform the USCIS.

- I don't know who advised you to do so but you don't have to file until the 90days window before your GC expiration date. I had the same doubts as you when I got divorced but it turned out that filing just before the expiration of the card was ok (this was also the advice of a lawyer).

My concern is that am I able to still work legally immediately after receiving my decree and during the process of USCIS processing?

- no problem! as long as the GC is valid you can work/travel and so on... after the expiration of the GC you would need the NOA (extension letter) to be able to travel.... and to work... who cares?! don't you see how many illegals work in this country even using somebody elses ssn?! ... the only problem might occur if you change jobs when your GC is expired and you didn't received the extension letter but this takes usualy about 2-3 weeks...

2. I'm going to ask an attorney to go to the interview with me. What are your thoughts on this? I believe it's a good investment and would be more favorable (and safer) to be represented legally.

-The only thing that a lawyer is interested in is getting money from you as much as she/he can! Make no mistake about this. (I delt with lawyers more than I should have ... because I was scared, as you and I thought they help. ... uhhh... what an error. Hire one only if you don't know or cannot do the paperwork yourself.). Hiring a lawyer is not an investment, is a loss!

I know after reading some posts some people think it's a waste of money but I think $500 for legal representation (this is one quote, some are higher and lower) is worth it.

- Get a psychologist for that amount of money; the benefits are much better, I am sure.

[mbuk 2]

1. As soon as my decree is here I'm going to immediately file for removal of conditions and inform the USCIS.

- I don't know who advised you to do so but you don't have to file until the 90days window before your GC expiration date. I had the same doubts as you when I got divorced but it turned out that filing just before the expiration of the card was ok (this was also the advice of a lawyer).

My concern is that am I able to still work legally immediately after receiving my decree and during the process of USCIS processing?

- no problem! as long as the GC is valid you can work/travel and so on... after the expiration of the GC you would need the NOA (extension letter) to be able to travel.... and to work... who cares?! don't you see how many illegals work in this country even using somebody elses ssn?! ... the only problem might occur if you change jobs when your GC is expired and you didn't received the extension letter but this takes usualy about 2-3 weeks...

2. I'm going to ask an attorney to go to the interview with me. What are your thoughts on this? I believe it's a good investment and would be more favorable (and safer) to be represented legally.

-The only thing that a lawyer is interested in is getting money from you as much as she/he can! Make no mistake about this. (I delt with lawyers more than I should have ... because I was scared, as you and I thought they help. ... uhhh... what an error. Hire one only if you don't know or cannot do the paperwork yourself.). Hiring a lawyer is not an investment, is a loss!

I know after reading some posts some people think it's a waste of money but I think $500 for legal representation (this is one quote, some are higher and lower) is worth it.

- Get a psychologist for that amount of money; the benefits are much better, I am sure.

Thanks for the post.

With respect to question 1, there are numerous posts here on VJ in this sub-forum that suggest filing the I-751 immediately after receiving a decree since a holder of a conditional green card is allowed to be in this country based upon marriage. Since that marriage is no longer valid, by proxy, one might suggest that the green card is no longer valid.

I see your point with respect to question 2. I'm in 2 minds whether to hire an attorney or not. One reputable lawyer I interviewed who had good knowledge on this is only charging $750 for removal of conditions. If I file myself it's $600 so I figured the presence of a lawyer's name on my application might give it 'more weight'.

[Anamaria2009 1]

<<With respect to question 1, there are numerous posts here on VJ in this sub-forum that suggest filing the I-751 immediately after receiving a decree since a holder of a conditional green card is allowed to be in this country based upon marriage.>>

- you obtained the GC based on marriage and your status, wich was "married" (not single, divorced or widow....)

<<Since that marriage is no longer valid, by proxy, one might suggest that the green card is no longer valid.>>

- no, your status as a person changed and you become "divorced" (not married, widower... ). your GC is valid until the expiration date on it (that's whay is tere, on the card. If the divorce decree would end the validity of the card, it would say so on it. Valid until xx/xx/xxxxx or until a divorce decree is issued....).

The exception to this might be an annulment of marriage based on fraud for obtaining immigration benefits but even then, the USCIS has to have serious evidence against you to deprive you of your priviledge of recidency. Another exception is: you having criminal record.

I read the posts of a lot of people that obtain a divorce decree way before that 90 days window but they filed only during that 90 days window, like I did.

( - read my profile - )

<<I see your point with respect to question 2. I'm in 2 minds whether to hire an attorney or not. One reputable lawyer I interviewed who had good knowledge on this is only charging $750 for removal of conditions. If I file myself it's $600 so I figured the presence of a lawyer's name on my application might give it 'more weight'.>>

- The only "weight" is that you are hiring a lawyer because you can afford one!

There are people that clean their own houses and there are some that hire cleaning ladies ... because they can afford it.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

<<With respect to question 1, there are numerous posts here on VJ in this sub-forum that suggest filing the I-751 immediately after receiving a decree since a holder of a conditional green card is allowed to be in this country based upon marriage.>>

- you obtained the GC based on marriage and your status, wich was "married" (not single, divorced or widow....)

<<Since that marriage is no longer valid, by proxy, one might suggest that the green card is no longer valid.>>

- no, your status as a person changed and you become "divorced" (not married, widower... ). your GC is valid until the expiration date on it (that's whay is tere, on the card. If the divorce decree would end the validity of the card, it would say so on it. Valid until xx/xx/xxxxx or until a divorce decree is issued....).

The exception to this might be an annulment of marriage based on fraud for obtaining immigration benefits but even then, the USCIS has to have serious evidence against you to deprive you of your priviledge of recidency. Another exception is: you having criminal record.

I read the posts of a lot of people that obtain a divorce decree way before that 90 days window but they filed only during that 90 days window, like I did.

( - read my profile - )

This is not the policy of USCIS, and many attorneys would recommend against it. Technically, when a marriage ends then the "condition" upon which the conditional status is based also ends. If USCIS learns about the divorce then they are compelled to take action to revoke the LPR status of the conditional resident. This means sending a notice of intent to the immigrant, followed by removal proceedings. This is spelled out in section 216.3 of Title 8 of the Code of Federal Regulations. If USCIS learns of the divorce then the conditional resident could be forced to immediately self-petition for removal of conditions or face deportation. USCIS can learn about the divorce any number of ways, including something as simple as a letter from the sponsor.

Many people do wait until the 90 day window before the expiration of the green card to self-petition, and have no problems because they were fortunate enough that USCIS didn't discover the divorce before that time, or didn't take any action if they did discover the divorce. It's not advisable to rely on being that fortunate. You could be caught off guard by receiving a letter of intent to begin removal proceedings, and be forced to prepare your evidence for a waiver on short notice.

The best advice, and the advice which you'll get from many immigration attorneys, is to prepare your evidence while the divorce is pending, and to self-petition for removal of conditions as soon as the divorce is final.

[Anamaria2009 1]

<<This is not the policy of USCIS, and many attorneys would recommend against it. Technically, when a marriage ends then the "condition" upon which the conditional status is based also ends. If USCIS learns about the divorce then they are compelled to take action to revoke the LPR status of the conditional resident. This means sending a notice of intent to the immigrant, followed by removal proceedings. This is spelled out in section 216.3 of Title 8 of the Code of Federal Regulations. If USCIS learns of the divorce then the conditional resident could be forced to immediately self-petition for removal of conditions or face deportation. USCIS can learn about the divorce any number of ways, including something as simple as a letter from the sponsor.>>

- Oh well, if this would be true in the real world, then I would have been deported a year ago, when my sponsor made all the efforts humanly possible to have me deported. He called the ICE accusing me of fraud. He even filed a false missing person report with the police trying to stage me and "to prove" what a "fraud" I was. His allegations werent true and it only took the police detective one phone call on my cell phone, to find me.

Even in cases where the USC tryies desperately to have the immigrant deported, that ain't happening! (unless proven guilty of fraud or some criminal activity)

<<The best advice, and the advice which you'll get from many immigration attorneys, is to prepare your evidence while the divorce is pending, and to self-petition for removal of conditions as soon as the divorce is final.>>

- ALL the immigration atturneys that I interviewed (because as you can see, my case was difficult, not quite a typical brake up...) told me that only during those 90 days I should apply for I-751.

A while ago, on this forum I read the post of somebody complaining that the application was rejected because was filed before the 90 days window.....

Still, if it makes you sleep better at night, file early. All you risk is loosing is some money (the atturney and/or application fee).

But then again, it might be a success and you will get your GC early.

Good luck and keep us posted!!

[Chica Yeyé 41]

This is not the policy of USCIS, and many attorneys would recommend against it. Technically, when a marriage ends then the "condition" upon which the conditional status is based also ends. If USCIS learns about the divorce then they are compelled to take action to revoke the LPR status of the conditional resident. This means sending a notice of intent to the immigrant, followed by removal proceedings. This is spelled out in section 216.3 of Title 8 of the Code of Federal Regulations. If USCIS learns of the divorce then the conditional resident could be forced to immediately self-petition for removal of conditions or face deportation. USCIS can learn about the divorce any number of ways, including something as simple as a letter from the sponsor.

Many people do wait until the 90 day window before the expiration of the green card to self-petition, and have no problems because they were fortunate enough that USCIS didn't discover the divorce before that time, or didn't take any action if they did discover the divorce. It's not advisable to rely on being that fortunate. You could be caught off guard by receiving a letter of intent to begin removal proceedings, and be forced to prepare your evidence for a waiver on short notice.

The best advice, and the advice which you'll get from many immigration attorneys, is to prepare your evidence while the divorce is pending, and to self-petition for removal of conditions as soon as the divorce is final.

Exactly right. Why on earth would people argue about doing it in a different fashion when USCIS has spelled it our properly is beyond me. If USCIS learns of your divorce by any means without you having submitted your I-751, your conditional status ends. Do not risk it.

To the OP: People have different experiences and they will share theirs; but it is always the best indicated step to follow USCIS regulations as closely as possible.

Best of luck.