Clarification on options

[Pete and Katelyn 0]

Ive been doing some heavy research online for the past few days and stumbled across these forums which have helped clear up a lot of information for me. I was hoping some helpful people out there could give me some advice on my situation and the best direction to go in.

My situation is as follows:

I am a Canadian citizen living in Toronto, my girlfriend lives in Pennsylvania. We've been together for several years now and we've both reached the point of being worn out by the distance. She's in college with another 18 months to go while I work full time. For a while now we've been discussing the idea of getting married so that I could relocate down to Pennsylvania. After doing research from many different websites I've come across conflicting ideas as to what people should do in this situation. Realistically I'd like to be down there by this time next year with the earliest we could do the wedding being this summer. Is it possible for us to get married and for me to come back up here and to apply for a K3 visa so that I can continue to work in Canada while waiting for my work permits in the US?

On another forum people were talking about how immigration lawyers often recommend that I should simply go down there as a tourist and "randomly" decide to marry her and apply for an adjustment of status from there? Is this an actual option? Any advice on the pro's and con's to this? Obviously this saves on having to get the Fiance visa but this options seems a bit shady to me.

Any other advice that people could give would be appreciated. I don't qualify for any work visas so going down on a work visa isn't an option for me.

Thanks,

Pete

[carslo 0]

The cheapest route is a spousal visa CR-1 only about 845.00 compared to almost 1500.00 for the K3. It takes about a year for the CR-1, could you elope, come back and then file the CR-1 and have a larger wedding when your visa comes through. Since you are in Ontario, Montreal is not far and that is where they do CR-1s and also the K1 and K3.

Just don't tell them you are going to get married when you go down if you chose to elope - they may not let you in. We chose not to adjust status in USA, as I would never take the chance of a ban if they thought aything was fishy - which it is not, but one never knows with immigration. You can't work while adjusting staus also. Your wife/fiance will likely need a co-sponsor if she is a student also.

Just an idea.

Good luck on what ever you decide.

Janet

Edited January 3, 2009 by carslo

[YuAndDan 153]

The cheapest route is a spousal visa CR-1 only about 845.00 compared to almost 1500.00 for the K3. It takes about a year for the CR-1, could you elope, come back and then file the CR-1 and have a larger wedding when your visa comes through. Since you are in Ontario, Montreal is not far and that is where they do CR-1s and also the K1 and K3.

Just don't tell them you are going to get married when you go down if you chose to elope - they may not let you in. We chose not to adjust status in USA, as I would never take the chance of a ban if they thought aything was fishy - which it is not, but one never knows with immigration. You can't work while adjusting staus also. Your wife/fiance will likely need a co-sponsor if she is a student also.

Just an idea.

Good luck on what ever you decide.

Janet

Ditto that.

If you wish to immediately take a Job after entry to the USA, the K-Visa is NOT the way to go.

If considering K-3 think carefully about it. CR-1 and K-3 tend to take about the same time, K-3 may save you about a month, however the K-3 has the added pain of adjustment of status, and it NOT a work authorized visa, so also has the added period of limbo waiting for EAD to be able to do things like take a job, get SSN, etc...

For the most part CR-1 tends to take a bit longer than K-3 to get if you prepare for NVC when they request I-864 fee, and Visa fee, as well as documents requested by NVC. In many cases the CR-1 petition reaches the consulate just before K-3 interview, which causes K-3 to get dropped and the interview becomes a CR-1 visa interview.

K-3:

I-130: $355

I-129F: NONE

Consulate: $131

AOS: $1010

($1496)

CR-1

I-130: $355

NVC I-864: $70

NVC Visa fee: $400 ($355+$45)

($825)

I see many posts from K-3 holders stating, "Wow this sucks, I am stuck at home because I don't have EAD, DL, etc, or I am having hard time getting added to bank accounts because of NO SSN." K-3 has a 90 day or longer period of limbo while waiting for EAD or Green-card.

K-3 was developed at a time when CR-1 was taking much longer that today, NVC has greatly streamlined the CR-1 process to the point where K-3 becomes irrelevant.

[Pete and Katelyn 0]

Thanks for the reply Janet.

One more question that has come up through digging around the site.

The K1 seems like the quickest way for me to get down there despite the obvious draw backs of not being able to work down there while I wait for the EAD once I've put in for the AOS. Does the 90 days on the K1 visa start from when the visa is issued or from the date you cross the border? My girlfriend is away in the UK for 3 months from September to December so I would hate to go through the process of getting a K1 visa only to find that its issued when she's away and that the 90 days starts from when the visa is issued.

Thanks again for the help!

[YuAndDan 153]

Thanks for the reply Janet.

One more question that has come up through digging around the site.

The K1 seems like the quickest way for me to get down there despite the obvious draw backs of not being able to work down there while I wait for the EAD once I've put in for the AOS. Does the 90 days on the K1 visa start from when the visa is issued or from the date you cross the border? My girlfriend is away in the UK for 3 months from September to December so I would hate to go through the process of getting a K1 visa only to find that its issued when she's away and that the 90 days starts from when the visa is issued.

Thanks again for the help!

There are 2 clocks.

The K-1 visa is valid for 6 months after it is issued. You have up to 6 months to use it to enter the USA.

It is VOIDED upon entry to the USA, at which time the 90 day I-94 clock begins. It is this 90 days that you need to marry within.

More info: http://travel.state.gov/visa/frvi/reciproc...ocity_3531.html (Note the table at top of page showing K-1 valid 6 months)

[carslo 0]

the K1 is good for a period of around 6 months from when it is issued - that means you have 6 months to enter the USA and then 90 days - not three months in which to get married.

Janet

[Flames9_RN 358]

One has 6 months(after the interview) to "activate" the visa, which is down at the POE (port of entry), with the k1, ur 90 days to get married starts when u "activate" it

Since ur In Ontario, time wise, the k3 and cr-1 run about the same time, so ur better off to go with the CR-1!

Keep in mind with immigration, it doesn't always make sense. Yes, the k1 should be the fastest of the 3 visas ur discussing, but thats NOT always the case. faster is not always better,lol (that's what she said,lol)

Look over the visas, and decide which one suits u the best: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...mp;page=compare

Some of us have gone to the USA and gotten married, then started the process. You don't have to wait till u get back to Canada, get married, and then send in the appropriate paperwork. Filling out the paperwork isnt that hard, just take ur time and do it, and if ya have any questions, ask on VJ. Ensure you checkout the Canadian VJ WIKI pages, probably anwers all ur questions right there!! http://www.visajourney.com/wiki/index.php/Canada or the regula r WIKI http://www.visajourney.com/wiki/index.php/Special:AllPages

[Galateia 1]

Thanks for the reply Janet.

One more question that has come up through digging around the site.

The K1 seems like the quickest way for me to get down there despite the obvious draw backs of not being able to work down there while I wait for the EAD once I've put in for the AOS. Does the 90 days on the K1 visa start from when the visa is issued or from the date you cross the border? My girlfriend is away in the UK for 3 months from September to December so I would hate to go through the process of getting a K1 visa only to find that its issued when she's away and that the 90 days starts from when the visa is issued.

Thanks again for the help!

When you receive a K-1 visa you have 6 months to enter the US. Once you've entered the US and activated the visa, you have 90 days to get your tush to a chapel/court house, etc and get married.

If you get married ASAP (I got married within 2 business days of arriving) you can file for AOS (including Advanced Parole -aka freedom to leave before GC received-- and an Employment Authorization Document) basically immediately. Get all the paperwork in order before you come down, get the court house to make a certified copy (or two, or several) of your marriage certificate before they take it away to be put in the county records.

You could conceivably send off your AOS package within a week of arriving in the US, if you get your ducks in order. If you have a lot of time to kill before you enter the US after you've got your visa in hand, it would be worth it to have an AOS package in a can -- add marriage certificate and stir.

The K-1 theoretically gives you immediate permission to work once you land in the US. The SSN policy document (available from VJ for download) explicitly states that K-1s are allowed to work 'by class of visa' and take that with you to the SSN office and hit them with it if they balk at giving you your SSN.

It takes about 3 months for the AOS package application to cough up an EAD and AP, so timing is everything if working is your priority. I sent in my AOS package in July, and despite getting a Request for Intial Evidence which slowed things down, I got my EAD/AP in September and GC in hand in November.

The bottom line for you is choosing which tradeoff you're going to take. K-1 -- get there faster, have a normal wedding, but unable to work for months (many employers will only accept a GC) or go with the CR-1 -- Work right away, but must get a quickie marriage and be immediately separated for longer.

Edit: I spel gud, and holy beaten to the punch while typing!

Edited January 3, 2009 by Galateia

[YuAndDan 153]

When you receive a K-1 visa you have 6 months to enter the US. Once you've entered the US and activated the visa, you have 90 days to get your tush to a chapel/court house, etc and get married.

If you get married ASAP (I got married within 2 business days of arriving) you can file for AOS (including Advanced Parole -aka freedom to leave before GC received-- and an Employment Authorization Document) basically immediately. Get all the paperwork in order before you come down, get the court house to make a certified copy (or two, or several) of your marriage certificate before they take it away to be put in the county records.

You could conceivably send off your AOS package within a week of arriving in the US, if you get your ducks in order. If you have a lot of time to kill before you enter the US after you've got your visa in hand, it would be worth it to have an AOS package in a can -- add marriage certificate and stir.

The K-1 theoretically gives you immediate permission to work once you land in the US. The SSN policy document (available from VJ for download) explicitly states that K-1s are allowed to work 'by class of visa' and take that with you to the SSN office and hit them with it if they balk at giving you your SSN.

It takes about 3 months for the AOS package application to cough up an EAD and AP, so timing is everything if working is your priority. I sent in my AOS package in July, and despite getting a Request for Intial Evidence which slowed things down, I got my EAD/AP in September and GC in hand in November.

The bottom line for you is choosing which tradeoff you're going to take. K-1 -- get there faster, have a normal wedding, but unable to work for months (many employers will only accept a GC) or go with the CR-1 -- Work right away, but must get a quickie marriage and be immediately separated for longer.

Edit: I spel gud, and holy beaten to the punch while typing!

NOTE: K-1 is not a work visa, it is a fiancee visa for entry to the USA and marriage, K-1 is "Work Auth" primarily to be able to get the SSN, some states are strict in their interpretation of a federal law that requires persons applying for a "license" to have SSN, this can cause a problem with marriage license if only one person has SSN and the other (the K-1 holder) does not.

You may want to look carefully at form I-90.

The SSN will be marked "Valid with DHS auth only" This indicates that an item in column A and B will be needed to prove work authorization.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/men...00045f3d6a1RCRD

Employers can use e-verify to confirm work auth, a K-1 wont have it unless they have "EAD" stamp, EAD card, or Green-card. http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/men...0004718190aRCRD

USCIS tells SSA to treat K-1 as work auth so that the K-1 can get SSN.

[Pete and Katelyn 0]

When you receive a K-1 visa you have 6 months to enter the US. Once you've entered the US and activated the visa, you have 90 days to get your tush to a chapel/court house, etc and get married.

If you get married ASAP (I got married within 2 business days of arriving) you can file for AOS (including Advanced Parole -aka freedom to leave before GC received-- and an Employment Authorization Document) basically immediately. Get all the paperwork in order before you come down, get the court house to make a certified copy (or two, or several) of your marriage certificate before they take it away to be put in the county records.

You could conceivably send off your AOS package within a week of arriving in the US, if you get your ducks in order. If you have a lot of time to kill before you enter the US after you've got your visa in hand, it would be worth it to have an AOS package in a can -- add marriage certificate and stir.

The K-1 theoretically gives you immediate permission to work once you land in the US. The SSN policy document (available from VJ for download) explicitly states that K-1s are allowed to work 'by class of visa' and take that with you to the SSN office and hit them with it if they balk at giving you your SSN.

It takes about 3 months for the AOS package application to cough up an EAD and AP, so timing is everything if working is your priority. I sent in my AOS package in July, and despite getting a Request for Intial Evidence which slowed things down, I got my EAD/AP in September and GC in hand in November.

The bottom line for you is choosing which tradeoff you're going to take. K-1 -- get there faster, have a normal wedding, but unable to work for months (many employers will only accept a GC) or go with the CR-1 -- Work right away, but must get a quickie marriage and be immediately separated for longer.

Edit: I spel gud, and holy beaten to the punch while typing!

NOTE: K-1 is not a work visa, it is a fiancee visa for entry to the USA and marriage, K-1 is "Work Auth" primarily to be able to get the SSN, some states are strict in their interpretation of a federal law that requires persons applying for a "license" to have SSN, this can cause a problem with marriage license if only one person has SSN and the other (the K-1 holder) does not.

You may want to look carefully at form I-90.

The SSN will be marked "Valid with DHS auth only" This indicates that an item in column A and B will be needed to prove work authorization.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/men...00045f3d6a1RCRD

Employers can use e-verify to confirm work auth, a K-1 wont have it unless they have "EAD" stamp, EAD card, or Green-card. http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/men...0004718190aRCRD

USCIS tells SSA to treat K-1 as work auth so that the K-1 can get SSN.

So, to try and clarify what you are saying - The K1 allows me to get an SSN but isn't in itself a work visa. I would plan to arrive only a few days before the wedding so that I could get on with the AOS process straight away but I understand that I would need a SSN to get a marriage license correct? So the plan of action would be to arrive in the country, get the SSN, get married, put in the papers for the AOS, EAD and AP and then wait around until the EAD comes through. I don't intend to work in the US on my K1 visa before getting married (that is if I go ahead with this idea).

The CR-1 would be ideal but due to various family situations, running off and eloping is a last option for now so if I were to go with the CR-1 then it would add another 6 months to a year onto things.

Again, thanks to all for the help. Its a big relief to find somewhere online where you can get sound advice on these matters

[BermyCat 1]

I think that what Galateia was saying is that if you marry and send off the AOS with a week or so of entering on the K-1, you lose very little working time. If you've managed to get a temporary EAD stamp when you activated your K-1, you might even have the permanent EAD before it runs out.

Of course the 90 day estimate for getting the EAD after filing for AOS is just an estimate an estimate (though a good one) , which is why I said might.

She's suggesting coming to the US with all the AOS forms ready to go so you can send them as soon as you have the marriage certificate.

It depends on what state you marry in whether you need an SSN to get a marriage license. I didn't need one in Georgia. In fact, we got our marriage license when I was just visiting. I didn't even have the K-1 yet. We got married within two days of me entering the US with the visa.

~ Catherine

Edited January 3, 2009 by BermyCat

[Flames9_RN 358]

Sometimes the k1 takes a year!!! and yes just because one has a SSN card does mean ur legally able to work.

[Pete and Katelyn 0]

I think that what Galateia was saying is that if you marry and send off the AOS with a week or so of entering on the K-1, you lose very little working time. If you've managed to get a temporary EAD stamp when you activated your K-1, you might even have the permanent EAD before it runs out.

Of course the 90 day estimate for getting the EAD after filing for AOS is just an estimate an estimate (though a good one) , which is why I said might.

She's suggesting coming to the US with all the AOS forms ready to go so you can send them as soon as you have the marriage certificate.

It depends on what state you marry in whether you need an SSN to get a marriage license. I didn't need one in Georgia. In fact, we got our marriage license when I was just visiting. I didn't even have the K-1 yet. We got married within two days of me entering the US with the visa.

~ Catherine

Thanks for the clarification Catherine. To follow up on one of your comments - if I were to enter and get my K1 visa stamped for work authorisation and I were to get married a few days later, does that work authorisation still stay in effect for the rest of the 90 day period? I had read elsewhere that the pre-marriage work authorisation on the K1 visa is terminated as soon as you are married and apply for an AOS?

[Galateia 1]

I think that what Galateia was saying is that if you marry and send off the AOS with a week or so of entering on the K-1, you lose very little working time. If you've managed to get a temporary EAD stamp when you activated your K-1, you might even have the permanent EAD before it runs out.

Of course the 90 day estimate for getting the EAD after filing for AOS is just an estimate an estimate (though a good one) , which is why I said might.

She's suggesting coming to the US with all the AOS forms ready to go so you can send them as soon as you have the marriage certificate.

It depends on what state you marry in whether you need an SSN to get a marriage license. I didn't need one in Georgia. In fact, we got our marriage license when I was just visiting. I didn't even have the K-1 yet. We got married within two days of me entering the US with the visa.

~ Catherine

Yes, that is what I was saying.

Also, Yu, you will notice that the paragraph you highlighted was in reference to the SSN and how to use the policy document to prevent the SSN office from refusing to give you a SSN because you aren't work authorized. Note I said 'theoretically' allowed to work, in the eyes of the SS as per their own policy document.

As for the question of whether marriage invalidates the maybe-work-authorization powers of the K-1, YMMV. I applied for Canadian EI with the 'work authorization' of an unexpired I-94 (what they staple and stamp when you activate your visa) while I waited for my EAD to come through. Some EI people accept the K-1 with unexpired I-94 as permission to work, some say it's invalidated when you marry (warning: some SSN people claim this as well), and some say that only an official EAD will do.

So it's a nasty case of YMMV. Either way, it's in your best interest to marry immediately and file for AOS before the ink on your certified copies of your marriage certificate is dry, to ensure that your EAD comes ASAP.

If I were going through this process again, I would ask for an EAD stamp that explictly says that I have work authorization when I activated my visa, and if they assure you that the unexpired I-94 is "the same thing" like they told me, ask them to give you a letter from their supervisor stating that it is a de fact EAD that gives you official permission to work, and have it signed and dated by the supervisor with whatever ID they have.

Maybe that will give them pause and stop them from BSing K-1ers coming through looking for the stamp.

[JillA 2]

When you receive a K-1 visa you have 6 months to enter the US. Once you've entered the US and activated the visa, you have 90 days to get your tush to a chapel/court house, etc and get married.

If you get married ASAP (I got married within 2 business days of arriving) you can file for AOS (including Advanced Parole -aka freedom to leave before GC received-- and an Employment Authorization Document) basically immediately. Get all the paperwork in order before you come down, get the court house to make a certified copy (or two, or several) of your marriage certificate before they take it away to be put in the county records.

You could conceivably send off your AOS package within a week of arriving in the US, if you get your ducks in order. If you have a lot of time to kill before you enter the US after you've got your visa in hand, it would be worth it to have an AOS package in a can -- add marriage certificate and stir.

The K-1 theoretically gives you immediate permission to work once you land in the US. The SSN policy document (available from VJ for download) explicitly states that K-1s are allowed to work 'by class of visa' and take that with you to the SSN office and hit them with it if they balk at giving you your SSN.

It takes about 3 months for the AOS package application to cough up an EAD and AP, so timing is everything if working is your priority. I sent in my AOS package in July, and despite getting a Request for Intial Evidence which slowed things down, I got my EAD/AP in September and GC in hand in November.

The bottom line for you is choosing which tradeoff you're going to take. K-1 -- get there faster, have a normal wedding, but unable to work for months (many employers will only accept a GC) or go with the CR-1 -- Work right away, but must get a quickie marriage and be immediately separated for longer.

Edit: I spel gud, and holy beaten to the punch while typing!

NOTE: K-1 is not a work visa, it is a fiancee visa for entry to the USA and marriage, K-1 is "Work Auth" primarily to be able to get the SSN, some states are strict in their interpretation of a federal law that requires persons applying for a "license" to have SSN, this can cause a problem with marriage license if only one person has SSN and the other (the K-1 holder) does not.

You may want to look carefully at form I-90.

The SSN will be marked "Valid with DHS auth only" This indicates that an item in column A and B will be needed to prove work authorization.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/men...00045f3d6a1RCRD

Employers can use e-verify to confirm work auth, a K-1 wont have it unless they have "EAD" stamp, EAD card, or Green-card. http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/men...0004718190aRCRD

USCIS tells SSA to treat K-1 as work auth so that the K-1 can get SSN.

So, to try and clarify what you are saying - The K1 allows me to get an SSN but isn't in itself a work visa. I would plan to arrive only a few days before the wedding so that I could get on with the AOS process straight away but I understand that I would need a SSN to get a marriage license correct? So the plan of action would be to arrive in the country, get the SSN, get married, put in the papers for the AOS, EAD and AP and then wait around until the EAD comes through. I don't intend to work in the US on my K1 visa before getting married (that is if I go ahead with this idea).

The CR-1 would be ideal but due to various family situations, running off and eloping is a last option for now so if I were to go with the CR-1 then it would add another 6 months to a year onto things.

Again, thanks to all for the help. Its a big relief to find somewhere online where you can get sound advice on these matters

I got married in PA and you do NOT require an SSN # to obtain a marriage license in this state. I got married first and applied for my SSN a few weeks after! Good luck!