Protecting humanity from homosexuality is as important as protecting the rainforest

[one...two...tree 2,762]

For anyone interested....

The Myth of Papal Infallibility

Papal infallibility is the idea that the pope is infallible, that is, he is unable to err in teaching revealed truth. Many lay Catholics are under the impression that this is an old doctrine of the church which must be pretty well proven for their church to use as one of the main tenets of their faith. They are wrong on both counts:

• Papal infallibility is a very recent doctrine.
• Historical evidence clearly speaks against papal infallibility.

Papal Infallibility: A Recent Doctrine

It is, however, a very recent development in the history of the Roman Church. It was formally affirmed only in 1870, at the First Vatican Council. In that council, the doctrine was not immediately accepted by the delegates; it was not immediately obvious to these bishops, even after eighteen centuries, that the pope should be infallible. The "papal infallibalist" were in the majority however, and the final statement was passed. There were some modifications done to the initial proposal before it was passed. This limited the pope's infallibility on doctrines regarding faith and morals. [1] The mistakes of the papal pronouncements on matters scientific were too well known for the doctrine to include this. (One needs only to be reminded of Pope Urban VIII's sentence on Galileo for providing proofs of the heliocentric theory.) This doctrine was pronounced in 1870 but predated to St. Peter himself. [2] There are two things to note regarding the 1870 Vatican Council that issued the pronouncement on papal infallibility. The first thing is that it was not immediately accepted by all the bishops; it was not a unanimous pronouncement that was simply formulated in clearer terms what all Roman Catholics had believed till then. The second thing is that the initial pronouncement was actually modified during the council; proof that the pronouncement (which was more restrictive in its scope that originally suggested) was not simply an elucidation of an ancient tradition. This two facts make a mockery of the following claim of the Catholic catechism book Our Faith (1980):

The truth that the Pope teaches infallibly when he defines "a doctrine concerning faith or morals to be held by the whole Church" was always accepted by the Church [italics mine-PT] but was explicitly defined by the First Vatican Council (1870). [3]

It should be clear to the reader that this doctrine was not based on a careful scientific study of papal pronouncements throughout history. It was a bull headed assertion by an ecclesiastical body that was being threaten on all sides by the rise of rationalism, science and humanistic philosophies. As J.M. Robertson observed:

Thus the age which saw the promulgation of the formal decree of papal infallibility (1870) has seen the most vital decline that has ever taken place in the total life and power of the church. [4]

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Proof of Papal Fallibility

[pedroh 21]

the Pope receives orders from Alannis Morrisette (wink wink, movie ref)

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I think people are just wanting to be outraged instead of understanding the logic behind his statement. Hypothetically, if everyone were to turn gay, there'd be no natural procreation. Yes, it's hyperbole, but I think that's what he was gettin at.

And yes, Jesus died. But He arose 3 days later. Amen!

There isn't much logic behind his statement though. Asking what would happen to the human race if everyone became gay is about as meaningful as asking what would happen if the sun didn't come up in the morning. Its about as relevant.

[MrsCat 6]

the Pope receives orders from Alannis Morrisette (wink wink, movie ref)

she was the former Super Pope before Mel. Only Kevin Smith knew at that time.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

While I do not agree with the Pope on this matter, and in fact, I disagree with this particular pope on many matters, what he says is in keeping with the Seven Themes of Catholic Social Teaching. I may not like it, but at least he is not being hypocritical. The very foundation of CST is "the life and dignity of the human person" which is further developed in theme 2 "call to family." Now, again, I don't agree, but what he says is certainly based in these foundations. Of course, the other 5 themes also elaborate and extend to show that as a church Catholics believe in protecting all regardless of sexual orientation, and (again, whether I agree or not) that homosexuality is the sin, the homosexual is not the sinner. It doesn't make sense to many people, especially if you don't believe homosexuality is a choice, but nonetheless, it is there.

There are many facets of the church I disagree with, not the least of which is the scandal involving pedophilia and the re-assignment of those priests without disclosure of their crimes, but there are also many wonderful aspects of the church which are consistently overlooked because of things like this.

There is so much good the Catholic church does worldwide that gets swept under the carpet because it's done by "the evil Catholic church." It's just like the idiots who say "like omg the pope was in Hitler Youth!!!!!111" without the real understanding behind that.

Oh, did I just get on a soapbox

Amen, sister.

[DeadPoolX 9]

the Pope receives orders from Alannis Morrisette (wink wink, movie ref)

she was the former Super Pope before Mel. Only Kevin Smith knew at that time.

Super Pope? Is that when he collects a giant mushroom?

[pedroh 21]

the Pope receives orders from Alannis Morrisette (wink wink, movie ref)

she was the former Super Pope before Mel. Only Kevin Smith knew at that time.

[HAL 9000 96]

While I do not agree with the Pope on this matter, and in fact, I disagree with this particular pope on many matters, what he says is in keeping with the Seven Themes of Catholic Social Teaching. I may not like it, but at least he is not being hypocritical. The very foundation of CST is "the life and dignity of the human person" which is further developed in theme 2 "call to family." Now, again, I don't agree, but what he says is certainly based in these foundations. Of course, the other 5 themes also elaborate and extend to show that as a church Catholics believe in protecting all regardless of sexual orientation, and (again, whether I agree or not) that homosexuality is the sin, the homosexual is not the sinner. It doesn't make sense to many people, especially if you don't believe homosexuality is a choice, but nonetheless, it is there.

There are many facets of the church I disagree with, not the least of which is the scandal involving pedophilia and the re-assignment of those priests without disclosure of their crimes, but there are also many wonderful aspects of the church which are consistently overlooked because of things like this.

There is so much good the Catholic church does worldwide that gets swept under the carpet because it's done by "the evil Catholic church." It's just like the idiots who say "like omg the pope was in Hitler Youth!!!!!111" without the real understanding behind that.

Oh, did I just get on a soapbox

But it was a good soapbox at least. You can't be in line with such strictness if you don't immediately excommunicate pedophile priests.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Ha, everyone here thinks they're da freakin Pope.

Enough already. There's only one Pope and ain't any of youse.

[Fandango 1,440]

While I do not agree with the Pope on this matter, and in fact, I disagree with this particular pope on many matters, what he says is in keeping with the Seven Themes of Catholic Social Teaching. I may not like it, but at least he is not being hypocritical. The very foundation of CST is "the life and dignity of the human person" which is further developed in theme 2 "call to family." Now, again, I don't agree, but what he says is certainly based in these foundations. Of course, the other 5 themes also elaborate and extend to show that as a church Catholics believe in protecting all regardless of sexual orientation, and (again, whether I agree or not) that homosexuality is the sin, the homosexual is not the sinner. It doesn't make sense to many people, especially if you don't believe homosexuality is a choice, but nonetheless, it is there.

There are many facets of the church I disagree with, not the least of which is the scandal involving pedophilia and the re-assignment of those priests without disclosure of their crimes, but there are also many wonderful aspects of the church which are consistently overlooked because of things like this.

There is so much good the Catholic church does worldwide that gets swept under the carpet because it's done by "the evil Catholic church." It's just like the idiots who say "like omg the pope was in Hitler Youth!!!!!111" without the real understanding behind that.

Oh, did I just get on a soapbox

Amen, sister.

Amen, sister? You were calling it an asinine thing to say...this post above to me explains why what was said was in keeping with the Church's teachings.

'

[DeadPoolX 9]

While I do not agree with the Pope on this matter, and in fact, I disagree with this particular pope on many matters, what he says is in keeping with the Seven Themes of Catholic Social Teaching. I may not like it, but at least he is not being hypocritical. The very foundation of CST is "the life and dignity of the human person" which is further developed in theme 2 "call to family." Now, again, I don't agree, but what he says is certainly based in these foundations. Of course, the other 5 themes also elaborate and extend to show that as a church Catholics believe in protecting all regardless of sexual orientation, and (again, whether I agree or not) that homosexuality is the sin, the homosexual is not the sinner. It doesn't make sense to many people, especially if you don't believe homosexuality is a choice, but nonetheless, it is there.

There are many facets of the church I disagree with, not the least of which is the scandal involving pedophilia and the re-assignment of those priests without disclosure of their crimes, but there are also many wonderful aspects of the church which are consistently overlooked because of things like this.

There is so much good the Catholic church does worldwide that gets swept under the carpet because it's done by "the evil Catholic church." It's just like the idiots who say "like omg the pope was in Hitler Youth!!!!!111" without the real understanding behind that.

Oh, did I just get on a soapbox

Amen, sister.

Amen, sister? You were calling it an asinine thing to say...this post above to me explains why what was said was in keeping with the Church's teachings.

'

You were expecting someone on VJ to actually READ the entire post before responding?

[HAL 9000 96]

[MrsCat 6]

the Pope receives orders from Alannis Morrisette (wink wink, movie ref)

she was the former Super Pope before Mel. Only Kevin Smith knew at that time.

Super Pope? Is that when he collects a giant mushroom?

Perhaps. That is the mystery of the position. We're not too sure how they acquired Super Pope status, but you may be on to something.

Maybe Nintendo was in on it too.

[jundp 191]

It's just that as a Catholic who tries REALLY HARD to live according to my faith, I get really tired of people nit-picking certain aspects of the Church. I am still a practicing Catholic because of the social teachings of Catholicism. There is so very much good the Catholic church has done in the world that is not praised or recognized. The people who do this work don't seek praise or glory, but sometimes I just can't take how only the bad is noticed.

That being said, Pope John Paul II was, IMHO, an amazing man. My jury is still out on this current pope, but I think JPII's shoes were some pretty darn big ones to fill, so maybe I would have felt this way about anyone taking over. I just remember the days leading up to the election of this pope and the disappointment I felt when he was chosen. There were quite a few other candidates who might have continued the work JPII had started.

[jundp 191]

While I do not agree with the Pope on this matter, and in fact, I disagree with this particular pope on many matters, what he says is in keeping with the Seven Themes of Catholic Social Teaching. I may not like it, but at least he is not being hypocritical. The very foundation of CST is "the life and dignity of the human person" which is further developed in theme 2 "call to family." Now, again, I don't agree, but what he says is certainly based in these foundations. Of course, the other 5 themes also elaborate and extend to show that as a church Catholics believe in protecting all regardless of sexual orientation, and (again, whether I agree or not) that homosexuality is the sin, the homosexual is not the sinner. It doesn't make sense to many people, especially if you don't believe homosexuality is a choice, but nonetheless, it is there.

There are many facets of the church I disagree with, not the least of which is the scandal involving pedophilia and the re-assignment of those priests without disclosure of their crimes, but there are also many wonderful aspects of the church which are consistently overlooked because of things like this.

There is so much good the Catholic church does worldwide that gets swept under the carpet because it's done by "the evil Catholic church." It's just like the idiots who say "like omg the pope was in Hitler Youth!!!!!111" without the real understanding behind that.

Oh, did I just get on a soapbox

Amen, sister.

Amen, sister? You were calling it an asinine thing to say...this post above to me explains why what was said was in keeping with the Church's teachings.

'

You were expecting someone on VJ to actually READ the entire post before responding?

I think Steven was agreeing with my comment that although what the Pope was saying is in keeping with the Church's teachings, there is still much good the Church does. I may be wrong, because I am ASSuming, but I am basing that on interaction Steven and I have had regarding Catholicism in the past.