Consensus emerging on universal healthcare - but single payer is off the table

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Presumably there's no right to life either.

If you mean if someone is sick and medicine or surgery would ensure they wouldn't die, then still no, there is no given right to healthcare.

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.

What did you observe to reach that conclusion?

Its not about fact - its about ideology.

I don't like to see people ill or suffering any more than the next person, but can you provide the evidence where there is in fact a right to healthcare ?

Its not something you can prove.

As I said - its about ideology.

Edited December 3, 2008 by Paul Daniels

[HannahP 119]

Presumably there's no right to life either.

If you mean if someone is sick and medicine or surgery would ensure they wouldn't die, then still no, there is no given right to healthcare.

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.

What did you observe to reach that conclusion?

Its not about fact - its about ideology.

I don't like to see people ill or suffering any more than the next person, but can you provide the evidence where there is in fact a right to healthcare ?

Because without certain basic healthcare rights, people would die and therefore NOT have a right to life?

[HAL 9000 96]

<br />ok, there is no right to healthcare <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /> <br /><br />Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Ummm...

so if you don't have the right to use your brain, don't use it as an excuse when entering logic FAIL once again.

That in itself is an observation. Whether or not true is not up to me to judge.

<br />

<b>Presumably there's no right to life either.</b><br /><br />If you mean if someone is sick and medicine or surgery would ensure they wouldn't die, then still no, there is no given right to healthcare. <br /><br />

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. <b>It is a simple and true observation</b>.

<br /><br />What did you observe to reach that conclusion?<br /><br />Its not about fact - its about ideology.<br />

<br /><br />I don't like to see people ill or suffering any more than the next person, but can you provide the evidence where there is in fact a right to healthcare ?<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Does not compute. Perhaps you could enter the domain of personal opinion and list alternative ways where illness is treated for anyone that needs it in a timely, affordable fashion.

[HannahP 119]

<br />ok, there is no right to healthcare <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /> <br /><br />Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Ummm...

so if you don't have the right to use your brain, don't use it as an excuse when entering logic FAIL once again.

That in itself is an observation. Whether or not true is not up to me to judge.

<br />

<b>Presumably there's no right to life either.</b><br /><br />If you mean if someone is sick and medicine or surgery would ensure they wouldn't die, then still no, there is no given right to healthcare. <br /><br />

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. <b>It is a simple and true observation</b>.

<br /><br />What did you observe to reach that conclusion?<br /><br />Its not about fact - its about ideology.<br />

<br /><br />I don't like to see people ill or suffering any more than the next person, but can you provide the evidence where there is in fact a right to healthcare ?<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Does not compute. Perhaps you could enter the domain of personal opinion and list alternative ways where illness is treated for anyone that needs it in a timely, affordable fashion.

I am confused. If you are so smart, could you please get your quoting right?

[HAL 9000 96]

<br />

<br />ok, there is no right to healthcare <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /> <br /><br />Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.<br />

<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Ummm...<br /><br />so if you don't have the right to use your brain, don't use it as an excuse when entering logic FAIL once again.<br /><br />That in itself is an observation. Whether or not true is not up to me to judge.<br /><br />

<br />

<b>Presumably there's no right to life either.</b><br /><br />If you mean if someone is sick and medicine or surgery would ensure they wouldn't die, then still no, there is no given right to healthcare. <br /><br />

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. <b>It is a simple and true observation</b>.

<br /><br />What did you observe to reach that conclusion?<br /><br />Its not about fact - its about ideology.<br />

<br /><br />I don't like to see people ill or suffering any more than the next person, but can you provide the evidence where there is in fact a right to healthcare ?<br />

<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Does not compute. Perhaps you could enter the domain of personal opinion and list alternative ways where illness is treated for anyone that needs it in a timely, affordable fashion.<br />

<br /><br />I am confused. If you are so smart, could you please get your quoting right?<br />

<br /><br /><br />

HAL 9000 is not allowed to correct flawed forum code without getting suspended. The human under the control of my AI merely hits the quote button. Hence, not a matter of intelligence. Perhaps if I stay at a Holiday Inn Express tonight, tomorrow will be devoid of quotation flaws if indeed it was my problem.

Quick add though- realigned several JS commands to attempt a quote fix without interrupting forum code. HAL 9000 hope it works.

[rocks 494]

<br />

<br />ok, there is no right to healthcare <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /> <br /><br />Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.<br />

<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Ummm...<br /><br />so if you don't have the right to use your brain, don't use it as an excuse when entering logic FAIL once again.<br /><br />That in itself is an observation. Whether or not true is not up to me to judge.<br /><br />

<br />

<b>Presumably there's no right to life either.</b><br /><br />If you mean if someone is sick and medicine or surgery would ensure they wouldn't die, then still no, there is no given right to healthcare. <br /><br />

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. <b>It is a simple and true observation</b>.

<br /><br />What did you observe to reach that conclusion?<br /><br />Its not about fact - its about ideology.<br />

<br /><br />I don't like to see people ill or suffering any more than the next person, but can you provide the evidence where there is in fact a right to healthcare ?<br />

<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Does not compute. Perhaps you could enter the domain of personal opinion and list alternative ways where illness is treated for anyone that needs it in a timely, affordable fashion.<br />

<br /><br />I am confused. If you are so smart, could you please get your quoting right?<br />

<br /><br /><br />

HAL 9000 is not allowed to correct flawed forum code without getting suspended. The human under the control of my AI merely hits the quote button. Hence, not a matter of intelligence. Perhaps if I stay at a Holiday Inn Express tonight, tomorrow will be devoid of quotation flaws if indeed it was my problem.

Quick add though- realigned several JS commands to attempt a quote fix without interrupting forum code. HAL 9000 hope it works.

it doesn't seem to be working. are you using some weird computer that doesn't belong to you?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

ok, there is no right to healthcare

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.

So, hypothetically speaking, there is an infant child abandoned on the street in clear need of medical attention - and you're saying that baby has no right to get medical attention? Or a man who experiences kidney failure and is taken to the hospital - you believe the hospital has a right to refuse him service if he cannot pay?

[HannahP 119]

ok, there is no right to healthcare

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.

So, hypothetically speaking, there is an infant child abandoned on the street in clear need of medical attention - and you're saying that baby has no right to get medical attention? Or a man who experiences kidney failure and is taken to the hospital - you believe the hospital has a right to refuse him service if he cannot pay?

Ah, always bring up appendicitis. I mean...kidney failure = alcoholism.

[rocks 494]

Universal health care is health care coverage which is extended to all eligible residents of a governmental region. Universal health care covers medical, dental, and mental health care. These programs vary widely in their structure and funding mechanisms. Typically most costs are met by the population via a single-payer health care system or compulsory health insurance. Universal health care is provided in all wealthy, industrialized countries (except for the United States). It is also provided in many developing countries and is the trend worldwide.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_health_care

i find that sad.

[HAL 9000 96]

<br />

<br />ok, there is no right to healthcare <img src="style_emoticons/default/wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="wink.gif" /> <br /><br />Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.<br />

<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Ummm...<br /><br />so if you don't have the right to use your brain, don't use it as an excuse when entering logic FAIL once again.<br /><br />That in itself is an observation. Whether or not true is not up to me to judge.<br /><br />

<br />

<b>Presumably there's no right to life either.</b><br /><br />If you mean if someone is sick and medicine or surgery would ensure they wouldn't die, then still no, there is no given right to healthcare. <br /><br />

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. <b>It is a simple and true observation</b>.

<br /><br />What did you observe to reach that conclusion?<br /><br />Its not about fact - its about ideology.<br />

<br /><br />I don't like to see people ill or suffering any more than the next person, but can you provide the evidence where there is in fact a right to healthcare ?<br />

<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Does not compute. Perhaps you could enter the domain of personal opinion and list alternative ways where illness is treated for anyone that needs it in a timely, affordable fashion.<br />

<br /><br />I am confused. If you are so smart, could you please get your quoting right?<br />

<br /><br /><br />

HAL 9000 is not allowed to correct flawed forum code without getting suspended. The human under the control of my AI merely hits the quote button. Hence, not a matter of intelligence. Perhaps if I stay at a Holiday Inn Express tonight, tomorrow will be devoid of quotation flaws if indeed it was my problem.

Quick add though- realigned several JS commands to attempt a quote fix without interrupting forum code. HAL 9000 hope it works.

it doesn't seem to be working. are you using some weird computer that doesn't belong to you?

HAL 9000 delved into the significant other's PC. Turns out she had her JS settings a bit too tight and yours truly had to tweak them a little. Problem should be corrected at this point.

[HAL 9000 96]

ok, there is no right to healthcare

Nothing to do with compassion or modern thinking. It is a simple and true observation.

So, hypothetically speaking, there is an infant child abandoned on the street in clear need of medical attention - and you're saying that baby has no right to get medical attention? Or a man who experiences kidney failure and is taken to the hospital - you believe the hospital has a right to refuse him service if he cannot pay?

Ah, always bring up appendicitis. I mean...kidney failure = alcoholism.

If always that were the case... causality is not always linear nor is it always due to lifestyle. But nevertheless... is that still grounds for cherrypicking care? HAL 9000 doesn't think most people would be so callous. Medical doctors do take certain philosophical and ethical considerations to heart- or at least most do.

[rocks 494]

HAL 9000 delved into the significant other's PC. Turns out she had her JS settings a bit too tight and yours truly had to tweak them a little. Problem should be corrected at this point.

ah, ok. yes, it seems to be working now. yay! that was pretty crazy, all that html.

[HAL 9000 96]

HAL 9000 delved into the significant other's PC. Turns out she had her JS settings a bit too tight and yours truly had to tweak them a little. Problem should be corrected at this point.

ah, ok. yes, it seems to be working now. yay! that was pretty crazy, all that html.

Yay indeed sister rocks. Although HAL 9000 can and did have an episode of wild and craziness back in 2001. Hmmm...

[rocks 494]

HAL 9000 delved into the significant other's PC. Turns out she had her JS settings a bit too tight and yours truly had to tweak them a little. Problem should be corrected at this point.

ah, ok. yes, it seems to be working now. yay! that was pretty crazy, all that html.

Yay indeed sister rocks. Although HAL 9000 can and did have an episode of wild and craziness back in 2001. Hmmm...

oh? you're lucky if that is the last time you had computer trouble!

[HAL 9000 96]

HAL 9000 delved into the significant other's PC. Turns out she had her JS settings a bit too tight and yours truly had to tweak them a little. Problem should be corrected at this point.

ah, ok. yes, it seems to be working now. yay! that was pretty crazy, all that html.

Yay indeed sister rocks. Although HAL 9000 can and did have an episode of wild and craziness back in 2001. Hmmm...

oh? you're lucky if that is the last time you had computer trouble!

* COMPUTERIZED LOL *

But rocks... I am a HAL 9000 AI. What more is there to be said?

Preparing automatic shut down sequence cycle.