Auto sales at 16 year low - sudden shift towards passenger cars hitting Detroit hard

[Heracles 417]

You're working under the assumption that everyone needs a 300+HP car, which they do not. As driving is not a race, or a ####### measuring competition, but merely getting from Destination A to B, the most efficient way to get there is most logical. Also, a Geo Metro gets decent mileage too, comparable to a diesel VW Golf, also small as hell. Like your Fiat, they are smaller than ####. The Prius is a family vehicle made for good ol' large America, so of course it isn't selling greatly everywhere, because the world does not have exactly the same demands. Your Fiat-to-Prius comparison is like comparing the mileage of a Datsun to the mileage of a U-Haul.

And the Prius isn't a fashion statement. It's as much a fashion statement as a Scion xB is, which is to say, you need to like everything else but the looks.

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Toyota Prius 5 door

Hybrid Unleaded

Power: 76HP

Overall height/width/length: 58.7/67.9/175

MPG COMBINED: 46

Highway MPG: 45

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Fiat Punto 5 door

Naturally aspirated Diesel

Power: 75 HP

Overall height/width/length: 58/66/158

MPG Combined: 62.8

Highway MPG: 80.7

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Fiat Bravo

Turbo Diesel

Power: 150HP

Overall height/width/length: 59/70.5/170

MPG Combined: 50.4

Highway MPG: 62.8

The problem with European diesels, some of which are great passenger cars, is that they cannot meet US emissions standards, in particular our standard for NOx emissions. The technology to have a passenger diesel meet the US NOx standard for cars, particularly in the lower bins, simply doesn't exist yet.

The US is stricter? I find that very hard to believe. But I may be wrong. Especially considering gasoline truck engines still use push rods here

Edited August 4, 2008 by Aficionado

[SMOKE 1,426]

I recently bought a new car and my car doesn't get awesome mileage but I don't drive that much either. I took it on a 1200 mile (combined) road trip last week and I didn't spend as much on gas as I anticipated. I have a Pontiac G8 GT.

that is a good stong vehicle. i resently worked on one. i was very impressed w/ the amount of reinforcement to the passenger area of the vehicle....good call amber

Don't tell me someone crashed one already..

yah rental car companies...we get new models wadded up all the time.

Edited August 4, 2008 by SMOKE

[Amby 490]

I recently bought a new car and my car doesn't get awesome mileage but I don't drive that much either. I took it on a 1200 mile (combined) road trip last week and I didn't spend as much on gas as I anticipated. I have a Pontiac G8 GT.

that is a good stong vehicle. i resently worked on one. i was very impressed w/ the amount of reinforcement to the passenger area of the vehicle....good call amber

Don't tell me someone crashed one already..

4 days after I got mine a cop ran a red light and smashed into the passenger side. Completely not my fault since he hit 3 other cars too!

[S and S 12]

I recently bought a new car and my car doesn't get awesome mileage but I don't drive that much either. I took it on a 1200 mile (combined) road trip last week and I didn't spend as much on gas as I anticipated. I have a Pontiac G8 GT.

that is a good stong vehicle. i resently worked on one. i was very impressed w/ the amount of reinforcement to the passenger area of the vehicle....good call amber

Don't tell me someone crashed one already..

4 days after I got mine a cop ran a red light and smashed into the passenger side. Completely not my fault since he hit 3 other cars too!

That sucks!

[Ken y Leidys 20]

My gas-guzzling 4WD loves fuel-sippers too!

[MrsCat 6]

^ badassness!

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

http://www.mpgomatic.com/2007/10/08/super-...cars-1978-1981/

Funny how the 'free' market has sent us backwards in both price and fuel economy... Maybe the 'free' market is less free than we would like to believe?

yup

[mendeleev 69]

The problem with European diesels, some of which are great passenger cars, is that they cannot meet US emissions standards, in particular our standard for NOx emissions. The technology to have a passenger diesel meet the US NOx standard for cars, particularly in the lower bins, simply doesn't exist yet.

The US is stricter? I find that very hard to believe. But I may be wrong. Especially considering gasoline truck engines still use push rods here

The Euro4 standard for passenger diesels is 0.25 g/km NOx, which converts to about 0.40 g/mile NOx.

The medium-strict US standard (Tier 2, bin 5) is 0.07 g/mile NOx. Diesels can't make this standard. They struggle to meet the loosest US standard and those lose standards will be phased out. Technology doesn't exist for a passenger diesel to meet stringent emission control standards. The Europeans, who want to promote diesels, tolerate dirty vehicles.

*That* is the true advantage of a hybrid: diesel-like fuel economy and modern emission control capability.

[HAL 9000 96]

The problem with European diesels, some of which are great passenger cars, is that they cannot meet US emissions standards, in particular our standard for NOx emissions. The technology to have a passenger diesel meet the US NOx standard for cars, particularly in the lower bins, simply doesn't exist yet.

The US is stricter? I find that very hard to believe. But I may be wrong. Especially considering gasoline truck engines still use push rods here

The Euro4 standard for passenger diesels is 0.25 g/km NOx, which converts to about 0.40 g/mile NOx.

The medium-strict US standard (Tier 2, bin 5) is 0.07 g/mile NOx. Diesels can't make this standard. They struggle to meet the loosest US standard and those lose standards will be phased out. Technology doesn't exist for a passenger diesel to meet stringent emission control standards. The Europeans, who want to promote diesels, tolerate dirty vehicles.

*That* is the true advantage of a hybrid: diesel-like fuel economy and modern emission control capability.

Lucky Europe to not rely so much on the automobile as opposed to our pattern of usage and available modes of transport.