4 year old shoots herself

[Ban Hammer 14,880]

DEAR MAGS:

Please come home soon. Your husband is scaring me.

i'm certain the local and state law enforcement is keeping sharp objects away from him.

I think blame can be divided up between the grandmother and the Sam's Club store. We've already discussed the grandmother and how she should've known better than to keep a loaded firearm that close and easily accessible to a small child; however, it seems we've all missed the part Sam's Club played in this. Most places -- including banks, schools, malls and grocery stores -- have clearly labled signs indicating that "no weapons are allowed" on the premises. The story says that no such warning was posted on this particular Sam's Club, which led the grandmother to believe that she was legally entitled to bring her CHL-approved gun in with her. Had such a sign existed, she would've left her gun either at home or in the car. In either case, her grandchild would've been able to grab and use it.

i really fail to understand your logic in blaming sam's club for any part of this.

[brnidokiegurl 1]

In the car, in the house, at the bank, at the grocery store wouldnt matter if the adult is not responsible to take steps to secure this gun

[DeadPoolX 9]

DEAR MAGS:

Please come home soon. Your husband is scaring me.

i'm certain the local and state law enforcement is keeping sharp objects away from him.

I think blame can be divided up between the grandmother and the Sam's Club store. We've already discussed the grandmother and how she should've known better than to keep a loaded firearm that close and easily accessible to a small child; however, it seems we've all missed the part Sam's Club played in this. Most places -- including banks, schools, malls and grocery stores -- have clearly labled signs indicating that "no weapons are allowed" on the premises. The story says that no such warning was posted on this particular Sam's Club, which led the grandmother to believe that she was legally entitled to bring her CHL-approved gun in with her. Had such a sign existed, she would've left her gun either at home or in the car. In either case, her grandchild would've been able to grab and use it.

i really fail to understand your logic in blaming sam's club for any part of this.

It's really quite simple. Had Sam's Club stated that no firearms were allowed (like most businesses do), then the grandmother probably would've thought twice about bringing her gun into the store in the first place. If the gun wasn't in there, the kid couldn't have shot herself.

Yes, it's entirely possible that such a thing could've have happened at home, but it didn't. It took place at a business -- a large discount chain grocery store, so what occurs there is that store's responsibility. What happens in someone's home has nothing to do with Sam's Club and the fault would rest entirely on the grandmother's shoulders.

I know most people on here will say that it was the grandmother's responsibility to "know better" and I tend to agree. However, I'm sorry to say that the "average person" is a complete moron. They'll do something without ever considering the consequences first. This is why they sometimes have to be told what to do -- if not for their own good, for the good of others. I wish that weren't true and that everyone could think their actions through first, but it'll be a very cold day in Hell before that happens.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I dunno man - blaming the store seems a little unfair, as quite apart from whether they had signage or not - there's no reasonable way they can enforce those rules.

If anything those things are posted merely as disclaimers to inform people of potential risks - in much the same way that TV ads showing a guy jumping off a cliff have to display "Do Not Attempt", or why a packet of peanuts has to carry the message "Warning: may contain nuts".

[Ban Hammer 14,880]

DEAR MAGS:

Please come home soon. Your husband is scaring me.

i'm certain the local and state law enforcement is keeping sharp objects away from him.

I think blame can be divided up between the grandmother and the Sam's Club store. We've already discussed the grandmother and how she should've known better than to keep a loaded firearm that close and easily accessible to a small child; however, it seems we've all missed the part Sam's Club played in this. Most places -- including banks, schools, malls and grocery stores -- have clearly labled signs indicating that "no weapons are allowed" on the premises. The story says that no such warning was posted on this particular Sam's Club, which led the grandmother to believe that she was legally entitled to bring her CHL-approved gun in with her. Had such a sign existed, she would've left her gun either at home or in the car. In either case, her grandchild would've been able to grab and use it.

i really fail to understand your logic in blaming sam's club for any part of this.

It's really quite simple. Had Sam's Club stated that no firearms were allowed (like most businesses do), then the grandmother probably would've thought twice about bringing her gun into the store in the first place. If the gun wasn't in there, the kid couldn't have shot herself.

Yes, it's entirely possible that such a thing could've have happened at home, but it didn't. It took place at a business -- a large discount chain grocery store, so what occurs there is that store's responsibility. What happens in someone's home has nothing to do with Sam's Club and the fault would rest entirely on the grandmother's shoulders.

I know most people on here will say that it was the grandmother's responsibility to "know better" and I tend to agree. However, I'm sorry to say that the "average person" is a complete moron. They'll do something without ever considering the consequences first. This is why they sometimes have to be told what to do -- if not for their own good, for the good of others. I wish that weren't true and that everyone could think their actions through first, but it'll be a very cold day in Hell before that happens.

that's rather weak. a business that does not have that sign means people who have the permit may carry in there. nor do i see how it's possible to assign any blame to the business for not having the sign -after all, maybe they consider it beneficial to have concealed carry holders in the store, discounting this one individual of course.

[DeadPoolX 9]

I dunno man - blaming the store seems a little unfair, as quite apart from whether they had signage or not - there's no reasonable way they can enforce those rules.

If anything those things are posted merely as disclaimers to inform people of potential risks - in much the same way that TV ads showing a guy jumping off a cliff have to display "Do Not Attempt", or why a packet of peanuts has to carry the message "Warning: may contain nuts".

I'm not suggesting the store should be sued. Sam's Club can't really be held accountable for this woman's actions. All I'm saying is that if a sign like that had been there (and I see them up practically everywhere here in Texas, so I know they exist), it might have sent a brief signal to her brain suggesting to her that she refrain from entering the store with the firearm.

I suppose I'm just thinking about myself here. One of the reasons I've never applied for a CHL is I wouldn't be allowed to take them inside anywhere. Virtually every single business (government-run or privately-owned) disallows anyone but law enforcement officers to carry guns on them when on or inside the property. So if I have to leave my gun at home or in the car, what good would a CHL do me?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I dunno man - blaming the store seems a little unfair, as quite apart from whether they had signage or not - there's no reasonable way they can enforce those rules.

If anything those things are posted merely as disclaimers to inform people of potential risks - in much the same way that TV ads showing a guy jumping off a cliff have to display "Do Not Attempt", or why a packet of peanuts has to carry the message "Warning: may contain nuts".

I'm not suggesting the store should be sued. Sam's Club can't really be held accountable for this woman's actions. All I'm saying is that if a sign like that had been there (and I see them up practically everywhere here in Texas, so I know they exist), it might have sent a brief signal to her brain suggesting to her that she refrain from entering the store with the firearm.

I suppose I'm just thinking about myself here. One of the reasons I've never applied for a CHL is I wouldn't be allowed to take them inside anywhere. Virtually every single business (government-run or privately-owned) disallows anyone but law enforcement officers to carry guns on them when on or inside the property. So if I have to leave my gun at home or in the car, what good would a CHL do me?

That's really part of the problem with it - but I'm inclined to think that a lot of people ignore those signs anyway. I mean - the signage itself doesn't threaten you with a ticket or jail time if you ignore it, does it?

Taking the example of the Sam's Club. Have you ever been to a Sam's club or a Costco on a busy weekend? Unless you're one of those people who stops traffic to get a parking space in the front of the lot - you more often than not end up parking all the way in the back - so I'm inclined to think that someone who walks all the way over to the doors and assuming they even see the sign (they tend to be quite small - and probably invisible for all pratical purposes if you're distracted looking through your wallet for your members card, find a shopping cart and manage a kid at the same time), there's nothing to hold them to obeying it - and you probably wouldn't trek all the way across the lot just to put your pistol back in the car.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Taking the example of the Sam's Club. Have you ever been to a Sam's club or a Costco on a busy weekend? Unless you're one of those people who stops traffic to get a parking space in the front of the lot - you more often than not end up parking all the way in the back - so I'm inclined to think that someone who walks all the way over to the doors and assuming they even see the sign (they tend to be quite small - and probably invisible for all pratical purposes if you're distracted looking through your wallet for your members card, find a shopping cart and manage a kid at the same time), there's nothing to hold them to obeying it - and you probably wouldn't trek all the way across the lot just to put your pistol back in the car.

true say

costco on weekend afternoons is a killer.

[Sister Fracas 5]

that's all I have to say is I'm glad I don't shop at Sam's

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Taking the example of the Sam's Club. Have you ever been to a Sam's club or a Costco on a busy weekend? Unless you're one of those people who stops traffic to get a parking space in the front of the lot - you more often than not end up parking all the way in the back - so I'm inclined to think that someone who walks all the way over to the doors and assuming they even see the sign (they tend to be quite small - and probably invisible for all pratical purposes if you're distracted looking through your wallet for your members card, find a shopping cart and manage a kid at the same time), there's nothing to hold them to obeying it - and you probably wouldn't trek all the way across the lot just to put your pistol back in the car.

true say

costco on weekend afternoons is a killer.

Esp. that one in Union. They have the tiniest entrance for such a large store. As far as civil engineering goes - its a joke!

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Taking the example of the Sam's Club. Have you ever been to a Sam's club or a Costco on a busy weekend? Unless you're one of those people who stops traffic to get a parking space in the front of the lot - you more often than not end up parking all the way in the back - so I'm inclined to think that someone who walks all the way over to the doors and assuming they even see the sign (they tend to be quite small - and probably invisible for all pratical purposes if you're distracted looking through your wallet for your members card, find a shopping cart and manage a kid at the same time), there's nothing to hold them to obeying it - and you probably wouldn't trek all the way across the lot just to put your pistol back in the car.

true say

costco on weekend afternoons is a killer.

Esp. that one in Union. They have the tiniest entrance for such a large store. As far as civil engineering goes - its a joke!

I go to the one in Bridgewater. It's designed fine but there's just wayyyyyyyyy too many people

[SteveLaura 0]

If anything those things are posted merely as disclaimers to inform people of potential risks - in much the same way that TV ads showing a guy jumping off a cliff have to display "Do Not Attempt", or why a packet of peanuts has to carry the message "Warning: may contain nuts".

WARNING: PEDANT CROSSING

Actually, a peanut is a legume, not a nut. Someone with nut allergies can eat a peanut without issue. The warning comes from the fact that factories where peanuts are packaged may also package nuts, with a risk of cross-contamination. The label seems ridiculous but is actually necessary.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

If anything those things are posted merely as disclaimers to inform people of potential risks - in much the same way that TV ads showing a guy jumping off a cliff have to display "Do Not Attempt", or why a packet of peanuts has to carry the message "Warning: may contain nuts".

WARNING: PEDANT CROSSING

Actually, a peanut is a legume, not a nut. Someone with nut allergies can eat a peanut without issue. The warning comes from the fact that factories where peanuts are packaged may also package nuts, with a risk of cross-contamination. The label seems ridiculous but is actually necessary.

Well discounting the fact that there are peanut allergies (as separate from "nut" allergies)...

[SteveLaura 0]

If anything those things are posted merely as disclaimers to inform people of potential risks - in much the same way that TV ads showing a guy jumping off a cliff have to display "Do Not Attempt", or why a packet of peanuts has to carry the message "Warning: may contain nuts".

WARNING: PEDANT CROSSING

Actually, a peanut is a legume, not a nut. Someone with nut allergies can eat a peanut without issue. The warning comes from the fact that factories where peanuts are packaged may also package nuts, with a risk of cross-contamination. The label seems ridiculous but is actually necessary.

Well discounting the fact that there are peanut allergies (as separate from "nut" allergies)...

Sure. But you gotta be pretty damn stoopid to not know a packet of peanuts may contain peanuts.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

If anything those things are posted merely as disclaimers to inform people of potential risks - in much the same way that TV ads showing a guy jumping off a cliff have to display "Do Not Attempt", or why a packet of peanuts has to carry the message "Warning: may contain nuts".

WARNING: PEDANT CROSSING

Actually, a peanut is a legume, not a nut. Someone with nut allergies can eat a peanut without issue. The warning comes from the fact that factories where peanuts are packaged may also package nuts, with a risk of cross-contamination. The label seems ridiculous but is actually necessary.

Well discounting the fact that there are peanut allergies (as separate from "nut" allergies)...

Sure. But you gotta be pretty damn stoopid to not know a packet of peanuts may contain peanuts.

Exactly.