Inmate says he needs Thor's hammer, drum

[Ban Hammer 12,830]

SALT LAKE CITY - An inmate is suing the Utah Department of Corrections for denying him his right to practice an ancient Nordic religion while behind bars.

Michael Polk is serving time for aggravated assault and robbery. He filed a lawsuit against corrections officials in federal court, accusing them of denying him religious items that he says are necessary to practice the Asatru religion.

The religion worships ancient Nordic gods like Odin, Thor, Tyr and Heimdal.

In the lawsuit, Polk says he has been a member of the Asatru faith since 2005, and in order to properly practice it he needs items including: a Thor's Hammer, a prayer cloth, a Mead Horn used for drinking Wassail, a drum made of wood and boar skin, a rune staff and a sword.

link

[Nagishkaw 510]

[eric&gen 0]

Inmates have rights!!!!!???? The only right they have is a good azz pounding by bubba lol.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

celebrate diversity.

[Dr. Obvious 49]

Well, you don't need any of those things. Nice, true, but need? No.

I am pretty sure the hammer they are talking about is a kind of pendant that goes on a necklace, not an actual hammer.

[JODO 2]

Inmate with a hammer?? Right.

[PlatyPius 5]

None of those items are "required" for the religion of Asatru.

Asatru is a modern reconstruction of the ancient religion of the Nordic peoples (ie: Vikings, et al). Odinism/Asatru wasn't subjected to the same eradication by the Church that the Celtic religions were. The Eddas and Sagas remained to allow the religion to be reborn with little deviance (we assume) from the original. The main difference between the original and modern Asatru is the lack of the animal sacrifice and feast during the 'Blots'. Today, alcohol is a typical sacrifice.

Thor's hammer is, as mentioned, typically a pendant. It would be a matter of making a shank, rather than hammering out a wall.

The only "freedom of religion" right that the prisoner is really owed is the ability to practice his religion. That means a quiet place, and access to the Eddas and Sagas; just as a Christian would have access to a chapel and a bible.

[Saddle Bronc 124]

Note that he also asked for a rune staff (I suspect it has to be large enough for the runes to be readable) and a sword (that one can certainly become a weapon, no matter what size).

Best compromise is: let GUARDS practice it, using a balsa-hammer with Polk's head being the drum!

[Reba 2]

In another article I read about this, and IIRC, the guy has been in prison since 2003, and converted while inside. Which is fine, but he probably doesn't have access to a lot of books about it, nor a teacher, so he's obviously a little confused about what he does and does not need. As Platypus mentioned, those items are representative of the Asatru religion, but they are not required to practice it.

A friend of mine is a Wiccan volunteer at a local prison (She's got guys from a few different Pagan paths in her group) and in the past year or so they have taken away a lot of the basic rights of her group. She can't even lend them books anymore, and they can't keep books in their cells. But the Christians can keep their bibles.

While I don't agree with the inmate who says he "needs" all of those items, (too much opportunity to make weapons, or sell them to someone else to make as a weapon) I do think that people of any religion should be given the same courtesy as Christianity. If the Christians are allowed their bibles and a chapel and their time on Sunday to worship, then other religions should be offered the same, whatever the equivalent. If there are any Muslim inmates who are allowed prayer rugs, and time out 6 or 7 times per day to pray, then other religions should be offered their equivalent. If Jewish inmates are allowed to observe all of their holy days, and given kosher meals, and access to a Rabbi, then so should the Pagan inmates be allowed to celebrate their holy days, and should have access to a Priest or Priestess of their path.

This is America after all. Freedom of Religion is guaranteed by the constitution.

[Marc and Olga 0]

yes, let's give all the inmates swords!

[Saddle Bronc 124]

In another article I read about this, and IIRC, the guy has been in prison since 2003, and converted while inside. Which is fine, but he probably doesn't have access to a lot of books about it, nor a teacher, so he's obviously a little confused about what he does and does not need. As Platypus mentioned, those items are representative of the Asatru religion, but they are not required to practice it.

A friend of mine is a Wiccan volunteer at a local prison (She's got guys from a few different Pagan paths in her group) and in the past year or so they have taken away a lot of the basic rights of her group. She can't even lend them books anymore, and they can't keep books in their cells. But the Christians can keep their bibles.

While I don't agree with the inmate who says he "needs" all of those items, (too much opportunity to make weapons, or sell them to someone else to make as a weapon) I do think that people of any religion should be given the same courtesy as Christianity. If the Christians are allowed their bibles and a chapel and their time on Sunday to worship, then other religions should be offered the same, whatever the equivalent. If there are any Muslim inmates who are allowed prayer rugs, and time out 6 or 7 times per day to pray, then other religions should be offered their equivalent. If Jewish inmates are allowed to observe all of their holy days, and given kosher meals, and access to a Rabbi, then so should the Pagan inmates be allowed to celebrate their holy days, and should have access to a Priest or Priestess of their path.

This is America after all. Freedom of Religion is guaranteed by the constitution.

True about BOOKS.

But what if the religion that the inmate claims is one that never actually had any (such as medieval Incan or Aztec)?

[Dr. Obvious 49]

But what if the religion that the inmate claims is one that never actually had any (such as medieval Incan or Aztec)?

I would suppose in lieu of that, certain historical study works, copies of codices, etc, would suffice. That said, I am not sure who would really want to practice such a self-hating religion (human sacrifice as an intregal part aside) as native Aztec belief was, but there are takers for all things, I guess.

[PlatyPius 5]

But what if the religion that the inmate claims is one that never actually had any (such as medieval Incan or Aztec)?

I would suppose in lieu of that, certain historical study works, copies of codices, etc, would suffice. That said, I am not sure who would really want to practice such a self-hating religion (human sacrifice as an intregal part aside) as native Aztec belief was, but there are takers for all things, I guess.

Erm..... "We are all born in sin. We are imperfect and all fall short of God's grace." etc etc.

Self-Hate seems to me to be common to many religions....

[Dr. Obvious 49]

Erm..... "We are all born in sin. We are imperfect and all fall short of God's grace." etc etc.

Self-Hate seems to me to be common to many religions....

Part of the reason I am not Christian. I don't agree with that particular point of it, among other things. There is also the bizarre problem of why Jesus who is also God if you accept the Trinity would essentially sacrifice himself to himself to solve a problem he created himself. But beyond the point of this thread about non-Abrahamic religions.

Edited December 25, 2007 by Wacken

[Reba 2]

But what if the religion that the inmate claims is one that never actually had any (such as medieval Incan or Aztec)?

Quite a lot of the ancient Pagan religions did not have written record of their religious practice. Reconstructionists go by historical and archeological evidence to recreate a modern day equivalent as best we can. Information for which we find in books, if we are not ourselves lucky enough to be archeologists or time travelers. (oh, to have a Police Box...!)