What are the real chances of successful ROC and divorced?

[AmandaS 0]

Hello everyone!

I have read here on VJ that we can ROC even after a divorce....but I would like to know what my chances are, or if I better just pack and go back home.

I came on a K1, got married, found out that my husband had been emailing/texting/facebook messages/ another women....I found out after 2 weeks we got married, and I didn't want my marriage to last 15 days, so we talked, and he promissed he never "cheated on me"....

Of course things were never the same, I stoped trusting him, as soon as I got my GC and my first job (which I am not make millions neither) he started making me pay for cable, both his and mine cell phone, my car inssurance, and all my personal expenses.

I am really tired and want to divorce, specially because on top of what he did (the texting, which I believe it's still happening), he treats me like an object.

If I ROC without him, I am supposed to send proofs of mingle finances? But he never trusted me and it looks like he never cared, because I don't have a credit/debit card from his bank account, he ownes his own apartment, made me sign a prenup.........what can I send?

I just have gym and phone contracts that put me as an authorized person, but I pay for my own gym and both phones

I don't know what to do. I don't want to stay with him just to stay in the US, but I would like to stay here.

Thank you in advance!

[Hypnos 6,576]

You would need to be able to demonstrate you entered into a bona fide marriage, if you divorce / plan to divorce and file for RoC. This could be joint bank accounts, joint leases, joint insurance polices, shared expenses, things that normal married couples would usually do when it came to managing their lives together.

Edited December 13, 2013 by Hypnos

[AmandaS 0]

You would need to be able to demonstrate you entered into a bona fide marriage, if you divorce / plan to divorce and file for RoC. This could be joint bank accounts, joint leases, joint insurance polices, shared expenses; things that normal married couples would usually do when it came to managing their lives together.

I understand, but he haven't been married long enough to file for joint taxes, and and he added me as a dependant in his bank account but he doesn't allow me to use it.

I just have gym and phone contract.

Do you think it would be enough?

I do have pictures of us, his family, mi DL with the address, and his texts/messages to another women

[Hypnos 6,576]

No one can say for sure if it would be enough. I wouldn't include his texts to his mistress though, that does not indicate anything with regards to your own marriage being bona fide, which is what you are trying to prove.

One thing is that your petition is unlikely to be denied without an interview, so you would have a chance to explain your personal circumstances and give any additional information there.

It seems like you're a little light on evidence, but in this circumstance that wouldn't be your fault.

Edited December 13, 2013 by Hypnos

[Pitaya 2,576]

~Moved from K-1 Process to ROC Forum~

~Inquiry about ROC, past K-1~

[JayJayH 546]

as soon as I got my GC and my first job (which I am not make millions neither) he started making me pay for cable, both his and mine cell phone, my car inssurance, and all my personal expenses.

You do know that it is normal and socially acceptable in the US for the man and woman to share finances right? Meaning, it's normal for the woman to pay a fair share of the bills also? My wife pays the car and healthcare, I pay the rent and car insurance.. Her shopping habits.. Let's put it this way, she has her own damn credit card to buy shoes with. The USCIS will not consider your husband a horrible man for not paying your personal expenses.

One of the reasons USCIS wants to see bank account statements is to see both parties contributing to shared expenses..

I am really tired and want to divorce, specially because on top of what he did (the texting, which I believe it's still happening), he treats me like an object.

If I ROC without him, I am supposed to send proofs of mingle finances? But he never trusted me and it looks like he never cared, because I don't have a credit/debit card from his bank account, he ownes his own apartment, made me sign a prenup.........what can I send?

First of all, let me explain what removing conditions entail. You currently have a two year conditional green card. This isn't a 'lesser' green card per se, you are a permanent resident with all the rights and obligations that come with permanent residence. The only difference is that yours is conditional. What many people misunderstand, or fail to understand, is that the 'conditional' part doesn't mean that the condition is your marriage. The condition is the intent you had in entering into marriage. So if you entered the marriage in good faith - meaning your intent in getting married was to spend the rest of your lives together - then you are eligible to remove conditions, also after divorce. You just need to request a waiver for the joint filing requirement, and show reasonable evidence that the marriage was on fact bona fide.

A member on here, Capri, once stated this in the best terms I can think of (I don't remember verbatim) - you already proved that your marriage was bona fide when you had your K-1 interview and subsequent AOS interview. What you are doing now is just re-affirming it. You are not proving the bona fide nature of your marriage from scratch, but rather, you are adding to what you've already shown. It is true that the USCIS tends to naturally be very suspicious when you split very shortly after the green card was issued. Thus, your burden of proof will be higher.

What's different when proving a legitimate relationship at the K-1 stage, and marriage at the AOS stage, is that when removing conditions, you will have actually lived together, as man and wife, in the same country for a substantial period of time. Thus, CIS expects to see some common husband/wife 'stuff.' Most married couples do have some form of co-mingled finances and/or assets. Joint something - family cell phone plan at least? The other reason that the joint assets/finances are so important is because they are the hardest to fake. Anyone can take pictures together and conjure up a few affidavits, but very few are actually willing to sign their car over to someone they're just 'helping out.' Likewise, few scammers would be willing to share their hard earned American dollars with a person they're scamming. Or so is the theory at least. The truth is that unless all your other evidence is absolutely rock solid, it is very hard to get around showing shared finances - If there is zero shared finances/assets, how do you plan to build a life together "as one?" - Make sense?

The first thing that the CIS will look at is your divorce decree. The divorce decree will state when you got divorced, how long you lived together etc. This will be your primary evidence, however, it will not suffice by itself. You'll need to back up whatever is in the divorce decree with more evidence. If you paid for your cable bill, there's one. If you paid for the cell phones, there's two. This is co-mingling of finances, and the more you have to show for, the better. What health insurance do you have? Is it through your husband? Or is his through you? If either of you have health insurance through your employer, many employers also offer life insurance - who is the beneficiary of yours? Your husband's? You say you live at his apartment. I take it the lease is in his name. So you don't share the financial responsibility but can you at least prove that you live there?

As far as the texting logs go - Only use these as evidence if they actually prove something. If all they show is him 'being nice' to another female, you can forget about using them to prove anything. However, if they prove that he has cheated, or been over the top 'friendly' with other women, that's another story. Still, I wouldn't send this in with your ROC package. The USCIS does not care why your marriage failed. They care that it was entered into in good faith. If you get an interview, and the officer begins questioning you about why it didn't work, then you can explain what you've said here, and show all kinds of text logs to back up your story.

The vast majority of I-751 divorce waivers with a reasonable amount of evidence do get approved. However, leaving two weeks after the arrival of the green card looks very suspicious. Be creative, only you and your husband know the real story. Look at it from an outsider's perspective.

Edited December 14, 2013 by Yang-Ja

[AmandaS 0]

You couldn't have explain it in a better way, thank you so much for taking your time to reply! That was exactly my doubt, if the idea is to proof why we got divorced, or that we entered the marriage in good faith.

I have always been an independent woman, and paid for my own shoes. It bottered me his attitude because I don't make enough to pay for everything that he is asking me for. But that is just a small part, and not the reason of the divorce.........I received a few "advises" saying that I should send everything claiming abuse and I would get my documents faster, but I am glad I don't have to "proof" that he was mean to me, I really didn't want to get to that point and that is not my goal.

Our journey has been smooth and light, no interview for the conditional GC and received it in the mail after 4 months of filling. I have gym, phone, and car insurance........the "heavy" stuff that requires a bigger commitment, like life insurance, health insurance, lease, bank account, we don't share. So I shouldn't send any receipts saying that I pay for all the bills? Good to know.

And yes, his texts and emails are more than friendly, but I will keep them in case I need it for the interview.

Thank you so much!!!

You do know that it is normal and socially acceptable in the US for the man and woman to share finances right? Meaning, it's normal for the woman to pay a fair share of the bills also? My wife pays the car and healthcare, I pay the rent and car insurance.. Her shopping habits.. Let's put it this way, she has her own damn credit card to buy shoes with. The USCIS will not consider your husband a horrible man for not paying your personal expenses.

One of the reasons USCIS wants to see bank account statements is to see both parties contributing to shared expenses..

First of all, let me explain what removing conditions entail. You currently have a two year conditional green card. This isn't a 'lesser' green card per se, you are a permanent resident with all the rights and obligations that come with permanent residence. The only difference is that yours is conditional. What many people misunderstand, or fail to understand, is that the 'conditional' part doesn't mean that the condition is your marriage. The condition is the intent you had in entering into marriage. So if you entered the marriage in good faith - meaning your intent in getting married was to spend the rest of your lives together - then you are eligible to remove conditions, also after divorce. You just need to request a waiver for the joint filing requirement, and show reasonable evidence that the marriage was on fact bona fide.

A member on here, Capri, once stated this in the best terms I can think of (I don't remember verbatim) - you already proved that your marriage was bona fide when you had your K-1 interview and subsequent AOS interview. What you are doing now is just re-affirming it. You are not proving the bona fide nature of your marriage from scratch, but rather, you are adding to what you've already shown. It is true that the USCIS tends to naturally be very suspicious when you split very shortly after the green card was issued. Thus, your burden of proof will be higher.

What's different when proving a legitimate relationship at the K-1 stage, and marriage at the AOS stage, is that when removing conditions, you will have actually lived together, as man and wife, in the same country for a substantial period of time. Thus, CIS expects to see some common husband/wife 'stuff.' Most married couples do have some form of co-mingled finances and/or assets. Joint something - family cell phone plan at least? The other reason that the joint assets/finances are so important is because they are the hardest to fake. Anyone can take pictures together and conjure up a few affidavits, but very few are actually willing to sign their car over to someone they're just 'helping out.' Likewise, few scammers would be willing to share their hard earned American dollars with a person they're scamming. Or so is the theory at least. The truth is that unless all your other evidence is absolutely rock solid, it is very hard to get around showing shared finances - If there is zero shared finances/assets, how do you plan to build a life together "as one?" - Make sense?

The first thing that the CIS will look at is your divorce decree. The divorce decree will state when you got divorced, how long you lived together etc. This will be your primary evidence, however, it will not suffice by itself. You'll need to back up whatever is in the divorce decree with more evidence. If you paid for your cable bill, there's one. If you paid for the cell phones, there's two. This is co-mingling of finances, and the more you have to show for, the better. What health insurance do you have? Is it through your husband? Or is his through you? If either of you have health insurance through your employer, many employers also offer life insurance - who is the beneficiary of yours? Your husband's? You say you live at his apartment. I take it the lease is in his name. So you don't share the financial responsibility but can you at least prove that you live there?

As far as the texting logs go - Only use these as evidence if they actually prove something. If all they show is him 'being nice' to another female, you can forget about using them to prove anything. However, if they prove that he has cheated, or been over the top 'friendly' with other women, that's another story. Still, I wouldn't send this in with your ROC package. The USCIS does not care why your marriage failed. They care that it was entered into in good faith. If you get an interview, and the officer begins questioning you about why it didn't work, then you can explain what you've said here, and show all kinds of text logs to back up your story.

The vast majority of I-751 divorce waivers with a reasonable amount of evidence do get approved. However, leaving two weeks after the arrival of the green card looks very suspicious. Be creative, only you and your husband know the real story. Look at it from an outsider's perspective.

[Darnell 8,478]

If I ROC without him, I am supposed to send proofs of mingle finances?

Yup. Absolutely. Not have it? Suggest submitting letters of attestation covering exactly where the money went, each month, by month.

I received a few "advises" saying that I should send everything claiming abuse and I would get my documents faster That doesn't apply to ROC casefiles, so I'll posit you've gotten the wrong advises.

Edited December 14, 2013 by Darnell

[JayJayH 546]

The advise you received to claim abuse does not apply to your situation. Forget about it. If you get a divorce, you will be filing for removal of conditions because you divorced, not because you were a victim of "extreme cruelty." Whoever advised you to do that advised you to file a frivolous domestic abuse case, and undermine the Violence Against Women Act (VAWA). This act was designed to help victims of extreme cruelty, and has unfortunately been abused enough to the point where it is difficult to, even for genuine domestic violence victims, to remove conditions this way.

Unless you can prove that your husband beats you, subjects you to psychological torture, false imprisonment, rape etc., this is not an option for you.

As far as co-mingled finances. Take Darnell's advice. Like I said, not only are co-mingled finances credible evidence (as it's difficult to fake), it is also expected. You will have a very difficult time removing conditions on your own if you cannot show at the very least basic sharing of finances. I.e. If you do not have a joint bank account, you should still be able to show where your money went, and what it paid for. Or, if you have a car, but it's in his name, can you at least show that you regularly drove it, and often times filled the tank? I'm throwing out examples here.

Edited December 14, 2013 by Yang-Ja