Mother-in-law denied US tourist visa-help!

[Noah Lot 387]

Will buying a plane ticket, showing that we can afford the money, and also showing a plan to return, help? Bringing the ticket to the interview should increase the chances right? And if it's still denied, we can cancel the ticket to get a refund, maybe minus a fee? We are willing to take that risk. But will it help the chances of passing the interview, even a little bit?

Thanks...

Airline tickets have no physical control over a person....tickets do not 'prove' nor guarantee that the holder will leave the US when they are supposed to. (ask yourself when the last time an airline ticket hauled you out of bed physically and 'made' you do something? I'm guessing never).

[Dave&Roza 748]

Will buying a plane ticket, showing that we can afford the money, and also showing a plan to return, help? Bringing the ticket to the interview should increase the chances right? And if it's still denied, we can cancel the ticket to get a refund, maybe minus a fee? We are willing to take that risk. But will it help the chances of passing the interview, even a little bit?

Thanks...

No, it will not help becuae it is mentioned to not make travel plans until the visa is issued. Also, the first leg of a plane ticket can be used and the return leg canceled, so it is no guarantee of your MIL return. You must look at it like the IO. What will cause your MIL to return to Brazil? Son, husband, property, job. What would be reasons to remain in the US? SIL, daughter. Does your MIL speak any English?

Here is what happened the first time my now wife applied for a tourist visa from Kazakhstan. She went to the interview and was denied. She reapplied after a mutual friend wrote a letter to her congressman and gave her an invitation letter rather than my invitation letter. She went to the interview and was approved. Difference between first application and second was the invitation letter, the congressman being contacted, and a different IO. All other proof of ties were the same. It might be they wanted to see if she was willing to spend another $131 for the application fee. Who knows. We are waiting for my MIL's interview next Friday. We'll see what happens. I have my fingers crossed as she has evidence of ties, but are they strong enough?

Good luck,

Dave

[eruben 0]

Right, but we can take this argument anywhere. No amount of money or property or ties proves anyone will do anything. Her mother could have all the ties in the world to Brazil on paper and stay in America anyway. Or someone could have no ties but love their country and of course come back. I'm wondering whether an airline ticket back will show further evidence of her intent not to overstay her visa. If so, then we can buy a refundable ticket. If not, then no point in bothering.

[eruben 0]

No, it will not help becuae it is mentioned to not make travel plans until the visa is issued. Also, the first leg of a plane ticket can be used and the return leg canceled, so it is no guarantee of your MIL return. You must look at it like the IO. What will cause your MIL to return to Brazil? Son, husband, property, job. What would be reasons to remain in the US? SIL, daughter. Does your MIL speak any English?

Here is what happened the first time my now wife applied for a tourist visa from Kazakhstan. She went to the interview and was denied. She reapplied after a mutual friend wrote a letter to her congressman and gave her an invitation letter rather than my invitation letter. She went to the interview and was approved. Difference between first application and second was the invitation letter, the congressman being contacted, and a different IO. All other proof of ties were the same. It might be they wanted to see if she was willing to spend another $131 for the application fee. Who knows. We are waiting for my MIL's interview next Friday. We'll see what happens. I have my fingers crossed as she has evidence of ties, but are they strong enough?

Good luck,

Dave

Thanks for the story, Dave. I see similarities. I think perhaps the different IO officer makes the biggest difference, since it is so arbitrary. My wife's mother does not speak English. She has a steady job in Brazil, so I can't imagine why that is not enough of a tie to Brazil. She's never been to America and never cared, the only reason/tie she has here is to attend the wedding. Completely common sense, but that's not how the IO officer she got looked at it.

[aaydrian 479]

Right, but we can take this argument anywhere. No amount of money or property or ties proves anyone will do anything. Her mother could have all the ties in the world to Brazil on paper and stay in America anyway. Or someone could have no ties but love their country and of course come back.

Exactly, that's why applying for a B2 is such a gamble; if you don't try you'll never know what could have happened. Presenting a round trip plane ticket is rubbish, the interviewer may just deny your MIL because of how audacious she is that she WILL be approved for the visa. Save yourself the money until you know the outcome.

[eruben 0]

Update: my wife's mother interviewed for a B-2 tourist visa again this morning, and was denied for a second time. We are very sad, angry, and unsure of our next steps. Below are the details.

Her mother went back to the US Consulate in Recife. By chance, she was assigned the same woman officer as her first interview on April 4. This woman (I'll call her the "first woman") recognized her and said "why are here you here again?" My Mother-In-Law (MIL) explained that she brought new documents showing evidence of her ties to Brazil-proof of job, rental contract, etc. The first woman said the same person could not do the interview again, and therefore brought her to another woman (I'll call her the "second woman") to do the interview. The first woman had a short conversation with the second woman, probably about how my MIL was rejected before.

The second woman interviewed her, but like the interview with the first woman, the second woman didn't want to see the documents that my MIL brought. Instead, the second woman started questioning why my MIL's husband and son aren't coming with her to America for the wedding. She said her husband is too old and sick to travel, and her son is studying for the bar exam. My MIL offered to present documents as supporting evidence (including a doctor's medical note) but the woman interviewing said she didn't want to see them. Then the woman said "I have to deny your visa". MIL asked "why, why? I have all the documents. What do you want?" The woman said "The denial reason is in the letter". The letter the second woman gave my MIL was the same letter as she got the first interview, a standard form saying she needs evidence of ties to overcome the presumption of the applicant being an intending immigrant. My MIL told the interviewing woman "I already got this letter, so I brought more documents! Look at them! What am I missing?" The woman wouldn't answer, and said "you have to leave, I have other people to interview".

This process and interview seemed grossly unfair. The interviewing officers continue to ignore the documents my MIL bring to the interview. My wife and her mother are devastated that she was rejected again. What are our possible next steps? If letters and appeals wont work, is there a way to contact a supervisor? I truly believe that if given a fair shot, my MIL should receive a visa. Please please help!

[Noah Lot 387]

Update: my wife's mother interviewed for a B-2 tourist visa again this morning, and was denied for a second time. We are very sad, angry, and unsure of our next steps. Below are the details.

Her mother went back to the US Consulate in Recife. By chance, she was assigned the same woman officer as her first interview on April 4. This woman (I'll call her the "first woman") recognized her and said "why are here you here again?" My Mother-In-Law (MIL) explained that she brought new documents showing evidence of her ties to Brazil-proof of job, rental contract, etc. The first woman said the same person could not do the interview again, and therefore brought her to another woman (I'll call her the "second woman") to do the interview. The first woman had a short conversation with the second woman, probably about how my MIL was rejected before.

The second woman interviewed her, but like the interview with the first woman, the second woman didn't want to see the documents that my MIL brought. Instead, the second woman started questioning why my MIL's husband and son aren't coming with her to America for the wedding. She said her husband is too old and sick to travel, and her son is studying for the bar exam. My MIL offered to present documents as supporting evidence (including a doctor's medical note) but the woman interviewing said she didn't want to see them. Then the woman said "I have to deny your visa". MIL asked "why, why? I have all the documents. What do you want?" The woman said "The denial reason is in the letter". The letter the second woman gave my MIL was the same letter as she got the first interview, a standard form saying she needs evidence of ties to overcome the presumption of the applicant being an intending immigrant. My MIL told the interviewing woman "I already got this letter, so I brought more documents! Look at them! What am I missing?" The woman wouldn't answer, and said "you have to leave, I have other people to interview".

This process and interview seemed grossly unfair. The interviewing officers continue to ignore the documents my MIL bring to the interview. My wife and her mother are devastated that she was rejected again. What are our possible next steps? If letters and appeals wont work, is there a way to contact a supervisor? I truly believe that if given a fair shot, my MIL should receive a visa. Please please help!

As you noticed, documents do not prove INTENT. A VO does NOT have to pore over papers if he or she is either convinced or not convinced about the applicant's INTENTIONS. The VO is not there to judge a pile of papers. Writing a supervisor is an excercise in futility...why would the VO's own supervisor believe YOU versus their own colleague? I cannot think of one. What you think is a 'fair shot' is summed up in only one way...that your MIl gets a visa - any other result you will classify as unfair....but no matter what YOU think, it does NOT matter.

There are no specific documents one must bring or have in order to get a tourist visa...if there were such a piece of paper, every visa applicant on planet earth would have one (whether genuine or not)....that is why documents do little in the way of demonstrating intent...there is also no bright line set of requirements an applicant must possess in order to be granted a visa....again, if there were, every applicant would find a way to produce them.

[aaydrian 479]

Update: my wife's mother interviewed for a B-2 tourist visa again this morning, and was denied for a second time. We are very sad, angry, and unsure of our next steps. Below are the details.

Her mother went back to the US Consulate in Recife. By chance, she was assigned the same woman officer as her first interview on April 4. This woman (I'll call her the "first woman") recognized her and said "why are here you here again?" My Mother-In-Law (MIL) explained that she brought new documents showing evidence of her ties to Brazil-proof of job, rental contract, etc. The first woman said the same person could not do the interview again, and therefore brought her to another woman (I'll call her the "second woman") to do the interview. The first woman had a short conversation with the second woman, probably about how my MIL was rejected before. I really doubt what was said between the CO's at that point wasn't already in their computer system.

The second woman interviewed her, but like the interview with the first woman, the second woman didn't want to see the documents that my MIL brought. Instead, the second woman started questioning why my MIL's husband and son aren't coming with her to America for the wedding. I figured this was there line of thinking. She said her husband is too old and sick to travel, and her son is studying for the bar exam. My MIL offered to present documents as supporting evidence (including a doctor's medical note)[if they agreed to look at this 'note', in order for it to be taken seriously it would have to come from a US embassy/consulate authorized physician/doctor] but the woman interviewing said she didn't want to see them. Then the woman said "I have to deny your visa". MIL asked "why, why? I have all the documents. What do you want?" The woman said "The denial reason is in the letter". The letter the second woman gave my MIL was the same letter as she got the first interview, a standard form saying she needs evidence of ties to overcome the presumption of the applicant being an intending immigrant. My MIL told the interviewing woman "I already got this letter, so I brought more documents! Look at them! What am I missing?" The woman wouldn't answer, and said "you have to leave, I have other people to interview". One very useful piece of info for applicants is never be pushy. It only makes matters worse by resulting in the COs thinking 'Why sooo desperate for a B2?' (you may even be flagged in their system). If you'd like a question answered, be as pleasant as you can and if they refuse just walk away.

This process and interview seemed grossly unfair. The interviewing officers continue to ignore the documents my MIL bring to the interview. My wife and her mother are devastated that she was rejected again. What are our possible next steps? Have 2 weddings, 1 in the US the other Brazil or have the wedding streamed live via Skype (that way mother, father and son get to be 'involved' in the ceremony. If letters and appeals wont work, is there a way to contact a supervisor? The super is not going to disregard the decision of two of his COs. I truly believe that if given a fair shot, my MIL should receive a visa. When I really think about it, the interviewers in their minds had an easy 'No' for your MIL. Fair shots are out of the question considering that your MIL recently began working at her current job, has a sick elderly husband, an adult son and has a daughter who will most llikely become a USC in 3 years (to COs, your MIL could choose to stay until your wife has completed a I-130 petion for permanent residence which is a B2 violation).

Please please help! If your MIL wants to visit the US in the future, maybe she should give it a rest for a while. This could be the reason why the CO's had a brief convo. They could have been discussing the details of your MIL's application meaning that chances are whatever situation your MIL was in at the 1st interview, is the same situation she's in for the 2nd interview (8 days later) therefore it triggered an automatic denial.

[Boiler 43,391]

She should give it a couple of years and try again.

[aaydrian 479]

As you noticed, documents do not prove INTENT. A VO does NOT have to pore over papers if he or she is either convinced or not convinced about the applicant's INTENTIONS. The VO is not there to judge a pile of papers. Writing a supervisor is an excercise in futility...why would the VO's own supervisor believe YOU versus their own colleague? I cannot think of one. What you think is a 'fair shot' is summed up in only one way...that your MIl gets a visa - any other result you will classify as unfair....but no matter what YOU think, it does NOT matter.

There are no specific documents one must bring or have in order to get a tourist visa...if there were such a piece of paper, every visa applicant on planet earth would have one (whether genuine or not)....that is why documents do little in the way of demonstrating intent...there is also no bright line set of requirements an applicant must possess in order to be granted a visa....again, if there were, every applicant would find a way to produce them.

If you were to syntesize the perfect B2 applicant what ingredients would you gather? And if your answer is 'Someone who shows little to no intenttion to immigrate' then how would your perfect being overcome this suspicion?

Edited April 13, 2012 by aaydrian

[Noah Lot 387]

If you were to syntesize the perfect B2 applicant what ingredients would you gather? And if your answer is 'Someone who shows little to no intenttion to immigrate' then how would your perfect being overcome this suspicion?

confidence without being overly pushy, answering questions easily without sounding rehearsed, avoid shoving papers into the noses of the VOs and if the applicant has any weak points, try to address those (if asked) in a straight forward manner, without resorting to blaming as yet unnamed third parties for whatever might have happened....

[eruben 0]

Aadryian, you said "When I really think about it, the interviewers in their minds had an easy 'No' for your MIL. Fair shots are out of the question considering that your MIL recently began working at her current job, has a sick elderly husband, an adult son and has a daughter who will most llikely become a USC in 3 years (to COs, your MIL could choose to stay until your wife has completed a I-130 petion for permanent residence which is a B2 violation)."

My MIL has worked at her job for 33 straight years. She got promoted recently, that's why it's her "new position" and she misunderstood the question at her first interview. She has a few more years of work left before she gets a pension for life. Trust me, she has no intention of giving that and her great life in Brazil up to come to America and struggle here. But the officers obviously don't care to think about it that way, they aren't using their heads. This isn't a court of law where people actually look at the evidence and its credibility. It's like a unfair dictatorship, with no checks and balances as far as I can tell.

Yes, my MIL is desperate for a B2. Why shouldn't she be, as this is her only chance to be part of her daughter's wedding? Waiting a couple of years to try again obviously isn't an option since the wedding is taking place in two months.

[Boiler 43,391]

Sounds like. you need to marry in Brazil

[eruben 0]

Sounds like. you need to marry in Brazil

And my side? What about all my friends and family, who can't or won't make it to Brazil? What if their visas to Brazil get denied because they're assumed to be intending immigrants too? The obvious solution is to LET A MOTHER VISIT THE US FOR HER DAUGHTERS WEDDING

[Boiler 43,391]

How about live video?