catknit

I wish my husband's had been a little more laid back or at a different venue...we were in a Federal Court with no chance of taking photos.

Edited to add - there was no music at all.

This may not pertain to this specific OP but I'm throwing this out there...

#1 - Your parents' house may not be a safe haven. Depending on how psychotic your soon-to-be-ex is - you may not be safe. Speak with a qualified domestic violence counselor in your area [google it, call the local pd's office number, check the bathroom at the library or other public area for a poster, ask your doctor's office].

#2 - There is a chance that if you are in a dire situation you will need to literally turn your life upside down. If a domestic violence counselor suggests placement in a shelter for your protection chances are they will also ask you to quit your job [or at least take a leave of absence], not visit places you're known to frequent etc etc.

Why? Simple, the violent spouse/partner most likely knows where your parents/family live, they know where you work, etc, etc, etc. If you are truly dealing with someone who wants to do you harm, wants to kill you, wants to save their family's honor, whatever - this may be what it will take. And, your life is worth it.

Vegs beware - chicken plant pic! Evis area .

I know about halal slaughtering, etc.

A couple of years ago I worked for a large chicken producer that also ran halal. In this case, the halal granting group came in and audited our systems to make sure it all complied with their own standards [vegetarian feed for the chickens, quick/well-maintained slaughter lines].

When we would run halal [which wasn't all the time] the slaughter area played a cd of a blessing for the birds and that was the ONLY difference. We had chicken leg quarters being frozen-shipped to Egypt. Because dark meat is so unpopular in the US, they had to find other markets to unload the meat....

Edited to add more detailed info:

The slaughter process was as "stress free" as possible for the birds because it lends to more-tender meat. Believe me, the guys who run chicken plants don't make it stress free just to be nice. Anyhow, birds are offloaded onto a belt, hung be their feet and take a ride on the chain to the slaughter area in a darkened room with music playing in the background [yes, really]. They were then knocked out with an electrical current so the next step would be pain free - the birds would pass through an area where their necks were slit by a very sharp and quick blade. From there, they continued traveling on the chain for a pretty long way to allow them to completely bleed out. Next would be another electric shock to help release feathers and rigor mortis hormone, then de-feathering, then evisceration, followed by USDA wholesomeness check, final stop before being completely processed into the stuff you see in the grocery is a 2 hour bath in 34F water to cool the birds down. From there they were cut into pieces or left whole....

Check with your state elected representative's office - your state probably has a state senate or state legislature. They have interns on staff whose entire days revolve around fixing these problems!

In order to sponsor her for a K1 visa you must be "engaged" however that does NOT mean you must have had some elaborate proposal or ornate affair. One of you must have asked the other about marriage and there must be an agreement that your marrying...that said COs in India are well aware of typical Indian practices. If she comes from a community/family where an elaborate engagement ceremony is par for the course there will be an expectation that you should follow that practice. But, keep in mind that both of the consulates in India have actually denied K1s based on the thought that an ornate engagement party was actually a covert wedding...India can be a pain in the backside to get through for some couples.

If you are looking for safe, I'd recommend marrying in India and applying for the CR1. The timing differences aren't huge [maybe an extra 6+ weeks depending on how you navigate NVC - this depends on a lot of factors, could be longer] and you'll have the bonus of a green card on arrival [she can work, study, or travel immediately with the stamp in her passport, the physical card should get to her within a few weeks] as well as a cheaper journey [no adjusting status on this side].

A few things you should do - #1 if not familiar with Indian marriage issues, do some research. If you yourself are Indian and the both of you are Hindu, you can darn near walk off the plane and marry. If you are both the same religion but not Hindu, there may be a marriage act that covers your marriage and you'll hopefully be able to marry quickly on that trip. If she is Hindu and you are not, you will fall under the Special Marriage Act that has a 30 day wait in order to post an announcement of the impending marriage. In some places, the resident Indian [in your case, your soon-to-be wife] can get it posted without issue. In others, the registrars are crazy and want both of you there to post the announcement which will mean you need to either stay in India over a month OR make two trips.

#2 - Familiarized yourself with the reviews of the consulate you'll be going through - Delhi seems to not like giving K1s and is harder on inter-racial couples. Mumbai doesn't allow the USC to attend the interview...learn about these things.

#3 - You said you've naturalized - if, by chance, you naturalized via marriage to a USC be prepared for extra scrutiny.

#4 - Pictures are considered secondary evidence but they are good to have. Personally, depending on a lot of factors [like if you became a USC from a prior marriage, etc] I would think it's in your best interest to front load your petition including pictures.

There is no girl in India, even if he was the one to say there was.

Anyone believing this conspiracy may as well line up with those who believe the US blew up WTC.

The difference in relationship culture and family drama as seen in India may seem strange to those not familiar with it - do a little research and be amazed by the absolutely crazy stuff that can come from these relationships...also, for kicks, look at MENA for similar issues too. It's all fun to think that there are crazy women who imagine the "true love" back home as some conspiracy theory but there is much, much, much more at play culturally. The sheer amount of infidelity even seen in the subcontinent is astounding. Plus, there is a HUGE reason why Delhi is such a gigantic pain in the backside to get through - this type of thing is tried, ALL THE TIME.

Taal - so sorry to hear this - my heart goes out to you!

Has he removed conditions at this point? Sort of insignificant but it would lend some clarity as to where you are with this...

I would follow Darnell's advice. Please get a letter into the IV unit at the US embassy [Mumbai or Delhi] - unfortunately this story is all too common.

Well, it wasn't really good news. Today it shows that our case was "Returned to NVC" which I can only assume is a denial. I am going to do a lot of research now to see what is the next step. Most likely we will reapply. The only other option is to get married in India, but I'm not sure I can do that. For a court marriage I would have to be there for at least 5 weeks. It's too expensive and I really can't take that much time off from work. I'm not sure if a Hindu marriage is an option or the time it would take to do it. I have so much going through my mind right now and I'm really frustrated with the whole process.

Oh Falene - I'm so sorry. That just sucks!!!

Hindu marriage is totally doable, there is a "conversion" ceremony you can do that will get you a certificate and then you can go ahead and marry immediately. I can't recall the name of it. Hopefully someone here knows it [user TwistedK did that after her denial a few years back].

Also, depending on where your fiance lives and what his marriage office allows, you may not need to be there for the 30-day notice period on the Special Marriage Act. Some do allow the Indian half of the couple to post the notice alone.

Best of luck!!!

Ebunoluwa is right on with her advice!

Is there some reason visiting India is off the table? Obviously he currently has some sort of residency/long-ish term status there [otherwise he would not have been able to interview there]. Truth be told, I don't think any CO would ding you for not hanging out in Iraq given the safety issues there. But, you already have a relatively safe 3rd country option in India. [Look, I get he may not like it there for numerous reasons, it isn't everyone's cup of chai, but it is considered a somewhat typical place to visit with a decent and well known tourist industry - the more convoluted you make certain aspects of this journey, the harder the sell to the CO - you want this to be straightforward and logical as possible].

If you really need another option, Dubai/UAE areas seem to be easier for visas/visits for some people in that area....

Like sara said - Delhi can be a pain...they are hyper-sensitive about possible fraud.

You need to find out what, if anything, your fiance was given at the end of the interview. Chances are he received a sheet explaining that he was denied based on a 221 or a 212. Both mean roughly the same thing - the CO didn't believe your relationship. Look at this as just a speed bump! [if it is anything other than those two things - please let us know!]

Delhi likes to see more than one meeting, they don't really like internet romances.

Historically, Delhi has allowed the USC to attend the interviews. Unless there has been a change in the last couple of months, I would make every effort to be at the next interview...

So - what happens next: Your case will be returned to the service that approved it. USCIS can do one of a few things - let the case expire or re-adjudicate the case. If the case is re-adjudicated you can get a re-affirmation [meaning USCIS finds you to have a legit relationship and for him to be re-interviewed] or a NOIR/NOID [Notice order with intent to revoke or deny]. You will be able to fight the findings of the NOIR/NOID within 30 days. Here's the thing though - start researching here on vj and you'll see time and again that USCIS usually expires out the K1s. Getting a NOIR/NOID or reaffirmation is kinda rare. You can work with your Senators and Congressperson to try and see what's happening with the case - they may be able to get you a little more info but they can not force another interview or change a decision.

In many cases, especially with Delhi, it appears that continuing the relationship and marrying helps eliminate the doubts that cause these denials. That said, this is not a cure-all fix. If there were major red flags [namely huge age differences or cultural/educational/class differences - however that doesn't seem to be your issue] marrying will not help. You must fix whatever issue led to the denial in order for a future case to be approved.

Now - this is where it may get messy - I haven't a clue how you two can get married. Well, I have a clue - I just bet it will be super messy. He's there as a refugee or asylum seeker? Or, is he there on business? I'd guess [just a guess] you two could marry under the Special Marriage Act but again with neither of you being Indian be prepared to pay "fees" of all types. Costly "fees" as you're a USC. In your shoes, I'd research destination wedding providers in Goa or another touristy area - the fees may be big but they will actually know what to do. Make sure you again have lots of documentation of your trip and wedding. Then file again but for a CR-1 highlighting what was lacking in your first petition/case. Research front-loading here on vj. This practice should help your case...Best of luck!

Shannon - Muslim men appear out of India appear to get AP for security checks with some frequency. Generally, all you can do is wait it out...

I will say you do have one heck of a love story . Document as much as you can about your upcoming trip [pics, etc] especially if you are spending time with his family. Did you have a ring ceremony? You may be questioned about that if it's typical for his area.

Falene - Did you get the infamous laundry list AP paper? Where they ask for EVERYTHING under the sun - correspondences, pictures, his voter id card, etc etc etc? Or, did they just say "AP, we'll be in touch"? It's hard to really read into what an individual CO does because each has their own methods but the laundry list, historically, hasn't been a good sign [not to get you down or anything - just trying to let you know what can/has happened].

Here's wishing you both a speedy journey to a visa and marriage!

[PS - a denial is NOT the end of the world, if god forbid, it does happen - more time away from each other, yeah, but you can still soldier on and get the visa]

Brief interview

Interviewer CO was not rude not even helpful.

Co: when u got married?

Answered

Co: when was your son born?

Answered

CO: how come son born before marriage

Wife: when she started telling she was my girlfriend and CO stopped her and said that no that is not the story, I tell u what happened:

First I got married to my wife & then got married to us citizen to get citizenship & got married to u again.

Wife: no that's not true

Co: keep on insisting that accept what CO was saying

Wife : no that's not true, she tried to explain but CO didnot listen,

CO: if u don't accept it then we have to do DNA

& it is very costly. It will cost u approx 1000.

Wife: that's ok but what ever u said is not true.

Co: then I have to put u in AP and we will call u within 1 or 2 week. So u don't accept it.

Wife: no I don't accept it

CO: he handed white paper stating as follows;

We have retained your passport to more quickly process your visa when the processing has been completed.

My real story : she was my girlfriend & my baby was born & after that I got married .

We r just married just once ,she is just 24 right now& I am 27 yrs old.

Everything CO said was wrong,

When I checked ceac website it says AP.

CO didnot see any evidence, marriage album, nothing.

My question is what should I do?

Wait for call from embassy.

Anyone had same situation please share ur experience.

May be they will ask for DNA, how long it will it take?

DNA can take a few weeks at the least. Most of the information found on vj about the DNA test can be found in the Philippines Forum.

Here's the potential issue from your interview run down: How, exactly, is your wife a US citizen? It appears the CO was trying to figure this out and/or confuse your wife into admitting some rather scandalous accusations.

If she did have a previous marriage that granted her US citizenship, you may be in AP for quite a while complete with home visits, etc.

Well - it is VSC, so there is at least a chance for a re-affirmation.

I tried to look for other topics that you've started to see if there is more info about your case other than your timeline, but I don't see much.

With the 212(a)(5)(a) - it could darn well be anything - that's sort of a catch all to refuse a visa.

Going to the embassy won't really do much for you given your current situation. If you were on AP or if you knew the re-affirmation was granted, I would say go to the embassy to followup as your schedule allows [that's what I did with our re-affirmation and I know we got into the interview queue a good month ahead of 2 other couples in the exact same boat with the exact same reaffirmation date].

If you're in India and have the means to stay longer term [X visa, PIO, OCI] and find that giving up on this K1 makes the most sense - I'm not saying it does, just if you weigh all the options, etc and getting married now makes more sense - look at the possibility of DCF.

Unless you really, really, really want to get married in the US, getting married in India and filing the CR1 or DCF seems to be a safer bet especially when the Delhi consulate starts one of their "refuse K1s!!!" benders [it happens every now and again if you look through the history here].

Its probably cheaper for a wife to stay home and take care of the kids than work a minimum wage job and attempt to pay for two kids in day care (assuming the kids aren't in school yet)

ETA

Or the husband. Whatever.

This is true for a large portion of the population. Working just to pay child care costs makes no fiscal sense for many people who work in the service sector or general labor. In many cases, there is little or no room for advancement so staying on to earn more experience is pretty much worthless.

The only place where keeping both parents working is when an excellent benefits package is available to the low wage earner...but that is completely employer dependent. For some families, a generous medical insurance plan will outweigh the net $10-75/wk the parent makes while sending the kid(s) off to daycare - or - possibly, a company that still has a traditional pension plan or very generous 401(k) match. But, for many, it completely doesn't pay to have both parents working. I saw this all the time while managing a general labor force - but only in traditional families [married parents]. Those not married usually had subsidies to fall back on [section 8, SNAP, state medicaid for the kids] and some did play the hours game to make sure they were under the allocated amounts to keep their benefits. But, it made sense to them- working extra hours may have only garnered them an extra $10k/yr in pay but staying on the subsidies was the equivalent of $25k/yr. That's a whole other thing though...

We stepped knee-deep into this with our baby. I moved from the corporate world [pre-pregnancy] to a social services agency working heavy part time [32 hrs/wk]. I went back to work last month only because we were able to find child care that cost roughly 50% of my take home pay. I would not have done so if the childcare were more expensive because it would not have made fiscal sense for our family. I did return because of an impending promotion, though estimated for a couple years down the road. [Of course, as of last night, this is all water-under-the-bridge thinking as the hubster just took a job 100 miles away and we're relocating ].

One of the reasons I love VJ and the off-topic/p&r areas is the education I get - seriously. Therefore, when I saw this story, I thought - aha - I know how to get to the bottom of this!

What the hell is this all about? I don't get it. As best I can gather, the coach of a university football team fired a contractor for wearing a rival's tshirt???? Then, the contractor sued for breach of contract??? I can't even begin to fathom this AT ALL. Is this a thing in some parts of the country? So, if this is so earth-shattering, what do people do about, say, doctors. Do they research where their cardiologist went to undergrad???

The Bedlam rivalry is heading to the courtroom, as nearly two years after a lawsuit was initially filed, a contractor’s claim against Oklahoma State head coach Mike Gundy is moving forward.

Back in August of 2011, Brent Loveland sued Gundy and his wife Kristen for firing him over wearing an Oklahoma baseball shirt to his first day on the job at their house in Stillwater. Loveland claims Gundy approached him said he was offending Mrs. Gundy with “that [expletive] shirt you have on.”

Gundy’s wife was later dropped from the suit, but there will be a pretrial conference on June 17. The details of Loveland’s claim, from the Tulsa World:

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-dr-saturday/lawsuit-against-mike-gundy-over-oklahoma-shirt-moves-150449764.html

Since you will be in a Muslim/Christian marriage, I'm guessing you will marrying under the Special Marriage Act? If so, she will need to register the impending marriage 30 days before the actual wedding. In some localities, the registration office will demand both parties to be present to file the paperwork. In others, just the Indian side of the couple can do it on their own - it truly seems like luck of the draw on whether or not this becomes a PITA thing to deal with...

Your list looks great - a couple of things to think about though, a female Muslim marrying a Christian man is considered in most circles in Islam forbidden. I don't want to start a Islamic jurisprudence fight about it here but there are also some more modern interpretations that say it is all good as long as the guy is "of the book" meaning Christian or Jewish - this stance is in the smallest of minorities. Chances are, if you took a poll, it would be an avalanche of "oh hell no, she can't do that". I'd be willing to bet all the COs are more than familiar with this too. So, here in lies a possible problem. There could be questions about it at the interview. As long as the answer make sense within the scope of your relationship, it should be fine [as in, her family is really progressive and doesn't care OR her family is very old fashioned and now hates me so we married at the municipal offices - what wouldn't make sense would be "well, daddy threatened to kill him and told me I'm burning in hell for this but look at the wedding photos - 500 guests!" - having the family put on a huge celebration after a death threat would look weird to anyone].

Things that would make your case less air-tight: out of wedlock kids on either side, divorces, the inability to communicate well [lack of common language], if she's tried every which way to get a visa in the past including past relationship attempts [K1s or other CR1s]. All of these are very surmountable if you take the time to address them. Search for "front loading" here to see how some people have included information in the original packet.

Other things to think about doing pre-filing that could strengthen your case: add her to bank accounts, credit cards, and insurances immediately including proof of those additions in your CR1 packet.

You do not need to worrying about the I-864 for the first phase of this process. The petition will need to be approved and forwarded to the National Visa Center before that comes into play. The flow chart here on vj will be of great help for you to see the details of how that all shakes down.

Best of luck on your marriage! Let us know how it's going!!!

Prescious - you may have a bit of an uphill battle.

First, the basics - you'll want to read the guides for a CR-1 petition/visa. Go ahead and begin to fill out the forms now given you are together and signatures, etc will be easy to get. It appears timeline are running about a year.

You can even go ahead and file the CR-1 petition by mailing it to the US - this will get you in the queue now as opposed to in August when you return to the US. As long as both of you were free to marry when you married in India, you have the proper paperwork, the fees paid, and can pass through AOS at NVC, he will be granted the interview. This part of the process has very little to do with cultural judgement calls and more to do with paperwork simply proving you are married and can sponsor your husband.

As to your specifics - the age difference, the lack of family approval on his side, etc. This is where things might be a bit sticky at the consulate during the interview [which is step 2 of this process]. The CO who ends up interviewing him will be looking at your relationship from the outside with the knowledge that some Indians are out to defraud USCs and the US govt for a green card. The COs look for typical markers - young men who have lured older women into fairy tale romances. For example. maybe the guy says it's okay you have 3 kids, are 20 years older and 60 pounds overweight, and that my family hates you - it doesn't matter because I have by-hearted your soul into mine! [seriously, there are guys who play this game].

I'm not saying that your husband is like this - but the COs have seen it time and again and they call it out as potential fraud [that's when you get a thing called a 221g and the consulate pays the guy's family a visit].

So, what you need to do is show the legitimacy and genuineness [not sure that that is a word] of your specific relationship from the very beginning - because on paper the COs fraud meter will be going off just because of the age difference. A few pictures that show the race difference will seal the "wait - I need to really see what's happening" actions of the CO. Start looking here for information on "front loading" your petition.

The fact that his family has issues with you may be less of a big deal than you think. Worst case scenario - people from the embassy go to interview his family - and his parents say something to the effect of "we told him not to marry her, but he went on and on about loving her, it's such a big mistake - he needs to stay here and take care of us!" - that type of answer may point to your relationship being pretty genuine. Now, on the other hand, they start carrying on about how he'd marry anyone to get to America - well, that would just about sink the boat. Has he introduced you to friends? Maybe cousins? Siblings who "get" your relationship? Affidavits from these people may help in front loading the petition and would be people that could be mentioned if asked at the interview "Who knows about your marriage?".

Also, just as an fyi - my number 1 piece of advice far ANYONE going through Delhi [which should be the consulate he will be interviewing at] - attend the interview with him. This accomplishes two things: #1 you will be able to provide the emotional support needed and you will be showing the CO that you are there providing emotional support; #2 you will be able to address any of the CO's concerns in person as well as ask questions about procedure if needed.

Best of luck!

Blurg - the face lift didn't allow for longer editing times?

Anyway, since there is a political party angle to this too - my county [Accomack, VA] historically votes Rep [2012 Romney, 2008 McCain, etc etc]

Interesting side note, the foundation helping to make this research tool available is Kellogg - this country's food processing folks know there is big money is keeping SNAP well funded.

I see I'm still in the lead...why am I not surprised

Since food stamps and their usage comes up pretty frequently here in P&R, I thought this link could be fun.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/map_of_the_week/2013/04/food_stamp_recipients_by_county_an_interactive_tool_showing_local_snap_data.html

I live in an area with 18% of the population getting SNAP benefits averaging $63/month/person.

What's up where you live???

Nah, I'm with AT&T

Lol!

Robinhood, are you sucked into the IPL right now? I know very little about the sport [my hubby is the Indian in the relationship and I a boring gori wife clueless about it] BUT I must admit the cheerleaders/dancers crack me up. Also, I do have a favorite player: Sehwag? Not sure of the spelling but I call him "Shwaggy" when he's playing.

OP - you've received some great advice!

I know firsthand how heartbreaking a denial can be.

A few other pieces of advice that may help out. Look at this more like a speed bump and less like a final decision. You still have options.

Get in touch with the consulate. On very rare occasions, people have been able to reverse a decision or get a 2nd interview [typically the petitioner is required to be at the interview]. This happens very, very rarely and I've never read of it happening in Haiti but, it has happened elsewhere. Time is of the essence, your case will be returned to NVC very quickly.

Get in touch with your congressperson and senators. Each will have immigration liaison who may be able to get you more information about what happened and what's going on with your case. Neither office can change the CO's decision but you may get a little more info.

What happens next - if you don't get the 2nd interview, etc - the case gets returned to NVC where it is dispatched back to the service center that approved it. If it is returned to CSC, you may get a letter stating the petition has expired. If the petition is returned to VSC you may never hear anything, it will be expired but VSC has not sent out letters confirming that. There is also a small chance the petition may be re-adjudicated [it is SOP for the petition to be re-adjudicated however they are typically just expired out]. This could lead to you receiving a NOIR/NOID. The NOIR/NOID will allow you to send addition evidence to the service center to prove your case. If re-affirmed, the case will go back the consulate and you'll be back in the queue for another interview [an even rarer occurrence is getting a re-affirmation without a NOIR/NOID]. You will find cases here where people have waited for a NOIR/NOID on a K1 from their service center and feel they wasted a year or more because no NOIR/NOID or expiration letter ever showed up - just a warning that for many K1 denials, you never hear anything after the fact.

An option for going forward - get married and file for a CR-1 [i-130]. If you do this, you must prove you have overcome whatever it was that caused the denial. If the CO felt the relationship wasn't bonafide, more face to face time and extended time with family may help persuade the next CO into seeing it is a legit relationship. Two perks to the CR-1: if, god forbid, you are denied a second time, you WILL get a NOIR/NOID in a timely manner and you will not need to adjust status in the US [meaning a green card on arrival - he'll be able to work/drive/travel immediately].

Go ahead and use the search feature here and look at more information about K1 denials - then chart your course of action appropriately!

Good Luck!

Yes, you can speak face-to-face with USCIS by making an infopass appointment at your local USCIS office. Did you provide a cover letter explaining what you sent and why you chose those specific items?

As you have already sent in the affidavits in response to the RFE, you'll need to wait and see what happens. I believe [and someone else may be able to comment more knowingly] that you are only given the one chance to respond.

About the affidavits - they should be fine. The consulate in India knows that people your parents' age may not have birth certificates or marriage certificates. It just wasn't done back in the day - the COs see it all the time. The CO may ask for the "No Records Available" report. You'd just need to risk it with only the affidavits if you can't find a way to get them pro-actively. Can you hire an agent to get them? [Yeah, I know, they may just milk you for tons of money and not even get the records, but you may luck out and get a decent agent].

As to the medical insurance, given when you filed for the IR5s it may be a bit of a ####### shoot on how to handle it. Because the ACA exchanges are supposed to open in 2014 you may be able to argue that a 180day short term policy through one of your state's Blue Cross/Blue Shield may be all that can be committed to [and the CO may buy that argument] but the truth of the matter is even after the exchanges open there is no guarantee of "affordable" insurance. Given your parents' ages and pre-existing conditions I wouldn't be surprised if their monthly premiums are greater than $3k. Remember that the ACA is making insurance companies cover pre-existing conditions but not necessarily capping costs [some of this is still be hashed out].

You need to think about worse case scenarios - their med issues may be controlled by scripts - great. But, a heart attack and emergency bypass here will cost easily greater than $100k. And, in that scenario, you can't just plop them on a plane back to India to get affordable care. On the other hand, something like a hip replacement or knee replacement you could totally have it done in India for a fraction of the cost...

Just something to do a little homework on. Call around to local insurance companies, see what you can find out. Also, you can just chance it, the CO may not bring it up.