sandinista!

Ack, a triple A. I hope he has a safe surgery, and an easy recovery. Have a good dinner and visit!

This is just my random opinion, but I viewed my participation in the immigration process to bring my then fiancé over here not only in terms of "ohmygosh I love him and want to be with him night and day", but also in terms of his character, ethics, and morality as a boon to the society I live in. My actions, petitioning for him to move here, affected more than just myself, and my family. Beyond if he made a good husband, father, I felt like it was my social responsibility to ensure to the best of my ability that the person I was helping move here would not be detrimental to anyone else here. Others, obviously, disregard that.

Well yeah, I certainly agree with that, especially your last sentence. Which is why I always encourage people to take things slow and really get to know their partner. But I feel like sometimes there's an implication from the veterans that being in a MENA relationship is so inherently risky that there is nothing you can do to negate the risk. That the taking it slow, getting to know him, spending lots of time together, talking about expectations mean nothing because after all, MENA men are the best actors EVAH and can go on scamming for years and years without showing a single sign that he's anything but the world's most perfect partner. Or he'll become a completely different person once he gets over here/becomes a father/turns 40/whatever and he'll no longer bear any resemblance to the man you actually married.

I don't think that's what's happening in this thread, FTR. I've found this thread INCREDIBLY helpful, despite the random spurts of bickering. But if you're already proceeding with caution, keeping your eyes open, being smart about it...eventually you do have to let go of some of your fears and the words of the naysayers, or risk losing a good relationship.

Those are all good things, what you recommend. I've read lots of helpful things you've written, and appreciated your clearheaded approach. And you're right, at some point you've got to chill a bit, and let stuff happen, and take risks, and see where your life takes you.

There are, however, varying degrees of quality to those assessments. And those assessments have been analyzed for many years on VJ, and will probably continue to be, because there are no hard and fast answers that are always correct, in every situation, all of the time. Some people's ideas of what putting their SO through a scrutinizing ringer consists of can be really off. Some people's perceptions of "this action TOTALLY means he loves me forever and ever" are just, no. Some of that is just difference of opinion/values/personalities/priorities. And some of it is just #######. All kinds of opinions on this exist on the board.

Sometimes a guy from MENA is genuinely quirky, and stuff he'll say is totally incongruent culture wise, but that's just him. Other times, he's reciting perfectly rehearsed BS. Does the American in this scenario know enough about the place this guy comes from to know what he's saying is weird for there? If so, does she know enough about him to tell whether or not he's being a big poseur for her sake, and investigate or discuss the matter more in depth with him?

The consulates assess these relationships all day, every day. Even they get it wrong. There's couples denied the first go around that are together years and years later, and ones they've let in that have left me, as a reader, with my jaw hanging open. So obviously it's a hard thing to assess. And without just shouting at people to "respect the consulate's authority and experience !!!!!", there is something to the fact that MENA ones are difficult. And that they far more often err on the side of handing someone a visa who really shouldn't have one, as opposed to blocking legit people.

Some people don't err as much on the side of "they're probably totally legit" with their opinions here. Oh well. Who cares? People are just talking to each other here. The ones who don't err on that side with their opinions usually didn't arrive there out of nowhere. Or out of just not liking women that are older than men in MENA relationships.

There's more to it than "all marriage is risky". Humans driving cars is risky too. But there are degrees to risk, and things that come into play when assessing risk. When my son starts driving a car in a few years, there's a reason why his insurance premiums won't be the same as mine, with my long term, safe driving record. And there's a reason why some of the situations that come up on this board look like major risks, and reckless, and others look more in control.

For those of us wondering, I do hope you'll share what exactly makes you think a reformed scammer is a-ok boyfriend material Kat. Wouldn't touch that with someone else's 10 foot pole. "American woman mistreated me, blah blah blah held me hostage" is nearly always just the stateside version of "all the Arab womens are money grubbing, immature, intellectually inferior" nonsense...

It's fun celebrating all the milestones!

Corgis make me bonkers! They're so ridiculously cute, and they have so much personality. Congrats!

agreed on the above, too, and wish you guys continued happiness.

His work contract, same deal. I imagine the consulates have some idea how work contracts are usually set up in MENA? Hopefully someone with first hand experience with those will answer.

They took my husband's word for it that I was a student, it was a key part of why I didn't have more visits, etc. if it were me, I'd definitely mention it concisely in the cover letter, and maybe the loan detail sheet on hand at interview if it ever came up.

Did I mention I am a grandmother also :)

yes my baby girl turned 6 yesterday....

I cant wait to start cooking a Italian feast for my love's arrival in 39 days - he is a bit of tired of Middle Eastern food.

We are both total watch movie buffs - it never gets old being wrapped in his arms watching our favorites

I need some Lamb recipes - thats the one thing I dont know how to cook.

So many celebrations to come....

Lots and lots of lamb recipes, compiled from over the years.

At one time, MENA even published a cookbook, lol.http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/37637-sultans-kitchen/

Before he got here!

We had lots of things lined up, and other things up in the air. He works at my family's business, and we discussed the pros and cons of that while we were waiting on visa stuff. Once he had his EAD, he had a job there. So far, it's working well. It was important to him and me both that he not arrive destitute. He had savings for while he waited for his EAD. If that's important to you guys, cool. If not, cool too. Understand, like Nasturtium mentioned, how he fits in with where he's from, and how you fit in that picture. No matter what, even though my husband and i are both Muslims, even though we both have similar thoughts and opinions on our religious practices, even though we both love milkshakes, but disagree on chocolate vs strawberry, and even though we grew up both loving Belle and Sebastian cartoons, it's still totally out of the norm that we're together. Culturally, some of the arrangements that come up amongst couples on vj can be really, really out of the norm. Some of that has to do with their individuality, and both sides are happy and comfortable. Other times one side or both sides are uncomfortable with the arrangement, or their partner's stance on something. It can sometimes be a really tricky to deal with combination of cultural and personal stuff. Knowing as much as you can about each others societal norms and your SOs place there can help with sorting them out sometimes.

Sorry for rambling.

I didn't have the opportunity to be in country for very long at all and get any data from acquaintances or co workers unfortunately. One thing that was important to me was getting my parents on board with the whole deal, and having them meet my husband and his family. They weren't all fluttery lovey dovey over him like I was, so their insight was a little more clear headed. All kinds of factors figured into me liking him ss a person, and that turning into him being somebody I loved, and then feeling that he could be someone I could raise my son with and want to have more children with, and all kinds of other life things, some really specific to us as a couple, others more universal. I liked him, my parents liked him, his parents liked us, etc. It's always a bit of a gamble, but everyone has different stakes, and consequences for taking that gamble. Sone bets are played really rashly, and that often ends badly, more often than when the same bets are played with more contemplation. I didn't even go to morocco until I'd been talking to and getting to know my husband for two years. We took it really, really slow.

Wow! I'm glad you came back for an update, and with good news to boot. Hopefully the rest of your process goes smoothly, and you guys can get on with your lives together.

Best of luck

My husband golfs, quite well in fact. That was the whole joke, that I won the kids game of golf. Because that's what we do on eid, stuff with our kids. Which makes it even weirder with you two and the innuendo, because it was more than clear that all that was being discussed was innocuous, family activity.

Vocab fail, so a fallback into inane ad hominem. Ok then.

I keep trying to get my husband to go to do mini golf with me. I think he would like it!

.

Yeah! I think it's almost as fun as croquet.

Putt putt is strictly about putt putt

At 645 pm last night, my husband was losing to me at putt putt golf with our kids. No need to mention this, I just feel like randomly bragging about something.

What now?


Well it's true, a good portion of them are. I give ####### to my sisters all the time for saying, I really need to get married so I don't have to work anymore. Idk if they are my sisters, I tell them to get off there #### and support themselves and quit whining.

Maybe that's where the assumption came from, your own words?

My husband's father takes care of his unmarried daughter, if at any point he was not able to, then my husband would. From here or there, or wherever he was. What he wouldn't do is talk about any of them derogatorily online, regardless of anything, for any reason ever. Or make reference to inflicting violence on any living being. Least of all any female, ever. One of many ways he differs...

Awww here she goes assuming I didn't take care of my sisters. Didn't your husband scamper off to the U.S.too.

Because if they don't want to work they don't have to. Whether he likes it or not. scampering off to the US while not providing for all of the women in your family, instead of just the ones you pick and choose is, well, shameful. As is talking ####### about them to a bunch of strangers, and MOST OF ALL making any references to inflicting violence on them. But whatever. Selective outrage. Sheesh.

Nice.

Point? Essentially they're assisting in what is 100% your job and fulfilling your obligations, and you go online and talk ####### about them because they don't want to do your job for you anymore. Hshuma.

You don't have to tell me anything islamically speaking. I have six sisters, two in El Jadida married, and the other four live 16 hours from Morocco. We work to help our family, we don't ask for help from our families. Our mother is our priority, so yes, my sisters left their home to help support her many years ago, so,there goes your lesson right out the door.

Bumping your post because I thought you made some really great points that got overlooked in all the crazy.

I am 11+ years older than my fiance. When I first started the process, I worried about all my red flags. I kept thinking about all the ways we would be rejected. I even had imaginary conversations in my head with immigration officials pleading my case. Because, after all, I had the most amazing Egyptian fiance ever and I knew my words would just prove it.

Thankfully for me time was on my side. I didn't think so at first, but I have come to realize that in all this mess, DECA slowdowns and consulate closures gave me the chance to know my fiance even better. This summer I was fortunate enough to spend 70 days in Egypt. As a teacher, I was afforded that time. It totally took away the honeymoon feelings I had from my three previous (incredibly short in comparison) trips. We really saw each other's good sides and, well, our not so good sides. He discovered my true feelings on housework--which pretty much mirrored his feelings on delightfully delicious fruits and vegetables (basically he hated them).

One of the other reasons this time was so valuable was because I had family members (who truly love me) doing research. As you might suspect, this research spoke of the young Egyptian scammers. It convinced my family that I was making a huge mistake because the only thing my fiance wanted was a green card. How could I not see it? Because I love my family and I want an authentic, lifelong relationship with this man, I was able to explore those thoughts and ideas. And with the passage of more time there is no doubt. I know--even more strongly than I thought I knew before--that I am making the right decision. Thankfully, my family is making that mind change too.

As I look at the past year of waiting for my dreams to come true, I realize that all of our evidence building not only improved our case, but more importantly it strengthened my love for a 11+ year younger man who is imperfect, just like me.

Best wishes for your journey.

MENA culture lesson: islamically, women are under no obligation to support themselves. If they're not married, it's their fathers and brothers job.

Well it's true, a good portion of them are. I give ####### to my sisters all the time for saying, I really need to get married so I don't have to work anymore. Idk if they are my sisters, I tell them to get off there #### and support themselves and quit whining.

Well it's true, a good portion of them are. I give ####### to my sisters all the time for saying, I really need to get married so I don't have to work anymore. Idk if they are my sisters, I tell them to get off there #### and support themselves and quit whining.

MENA culture lesson: some people don't post photos out of ghayra reasoning. Mileage varies.

All I can do is laugh at your racist post of older women. You only wish you looked like some of the older women who obviously have the guts to posts there picture here.