Confused between 864 and 864A

[lovinglive 24]

Hello forum members, 

 

I was finalizing the 864 and 864A earlier today and came across something that I may have done wrong.  I wasn't sure if my income and assets would fulfill the requirements under the form 864,  and I wanted to be on the cautious side, so I asked a parent to support.  We completed form 864A.    

 

Then I came across language or instructions saying that you have to prove that the person in the 864A has the same principal residence as the sponsor (me).  On the instructions for 864A, under the instructions for Part 2, Item 1.c, it says "If you select any other relative except for spouse, you must provide proof of the relationship and that you have the same principal residence as the sponsor".  This means that we would have to provide some kind of proof that my spouse and I live in the same residence with my parent.  While my spouse has lived there for a while, and I also lived there for a short time, we don't have a lot of evidence that we all reside in the same household.  We only have a few things that came in the mail.  

 

Then when looking around about this, I see that there can be an additional 'joint sponsor' in addition to the main sponsor.  So I'm not sure if it makes more sense to continue to try to have my parent support us with the 864A, or do a second 864 with my parent listed as a joint sponsor?

 

Would it be better to try to meet the residency requirement for the 864A, or just have 2 form 864s?  What are the pros and cons of each?

[Redro 4,602]

1 minute ago, lovinglive said:

Hello forum members, 

 

I was finalizing the 864 and 864A earlier today and came across something that I may have done wrong.  I wasn't sure if my income and assets would fulfill the requirements under the form 864,  and I wanted to be on the cautious side, so I asked a parent to support.  We completed form 864A.    

 

Then I came across language or instructions saying that you have to prove that the person in the 864A has the same principal residence as the sponsor (me).  On the instructions for 864A, under the instructions for Part 2, Item 1.c, it says "If you select any other relative except for spouse, you must provide proof of the relationship and that you have the same principal residence as the sponsor".  This means that we would have to provide some kind of proof that my spouse and I live in the same residence with my parent.  While my spouse has lived there for a while, and I also lived there for a short time, we don't have a lot of evidence that we all reside in the same household.  We only have a few things that came in the mail.  

 

Then when looking around about this, I see that there can be an additional 'joint sponsor' in addition to the main sponsor.  So I'm not sure if it makes more sense to continue to try to have my parent support us with the 864A, or do a second 864 with my parent listed as a joint sponsor?

 

Would it be better to try to meet the residency requirement for the 864A, or just have 2 form 864s?  What are the pros and cons of each?

Have your parents be the joint sponsor not the co-sponsor. 

You don't want to add their incomes to yours.... it complicates things and might lead to an RFE. 

[Timona 3,977]

If you asked your dad to sponsor AND your dad and mom file taxes jointly, head of household on that IRS taxes for your parents will sign I-864 and the other I-864A. Simple. 

 

So if dad is head of household, he'd sign 84 and mom 84A, but only if they do taxes jointly. 

 

You yourself will sign your own 84 since you don't make enough to sponsor. 

Edited July 9, 2022 by Timona

[lovinglive 24]

10 minutes ago, ROK2USA said:

Have your parents be the joint sponsor not the co-sponsor. 

You don't want to add their incomes to yours.... it complicates things and might lead to an RFE. 

Thanks for your reply.  This is starting to make sense.  I had no idea that more than one person can file the 864, and it seemed like the 864A fits for my parent.  

 

But maybe not, if it is going to create more problems related to us having to prove that we reside in the same household.

[lovinglive 24]

4 minutes ago, Timona said:

If you asked your dad to sponsor AND your dad and mom file taxes jointly, head of household on that IRS taxes for your parents will sign I-864 and the other I-864A. Simple. 

 

So if dad is head of household, he'd sign 84 and mom 84A, but only if they do taxes jointly. 

 

You yourself will sign your own 84 since you don't make enough to sponsor. 

Thank you Timona, thanks for your reply.  Actually my parent is single, so the complicated issue of married filing jointly doesn't apply.

 

The question is just whether its better for me to file 864 and my parent 864A?  or we file two 864s- one for me and one for my parent.

 

If my parent files the 864A, I would have to demonstrate somehow that we are living in the same residence.  And currently we don't have much evidence other than a small amount of mail.  Also,  it's somewhat likely that my spouse and I won't continue to live in the same residence with my parent in the future. 

 

Do you have any additional comment based on that scenario?

 

[Villanelle 4,121]

The few pieces of mail should be sufficient along with driver licenses. 

 

It's your choice if you want to do the 864 as household member or separate sponsor. You qualify for either way.

 

Provided its just you, spouse, and your single parent (with no other dependents)-

Scenario 1- you do the 864. Size 2. You don't have enough income. Parent files 864 as well.  Household size is 2- them and your spouse. They need to show income for 2.

 

Scenario 2- you file 864 and parent does 864a as your household member. Size is now 3. Your income plus parents must cover size 3. 

 

For your situation its less income needed for Scenario 1. That's not always the case, it depends on the specifics. 

[lovinglive 24]

3 minutes ago, Villanelle said:

The few pieces of mail should be sufficient along with driver licenses. 

 

It's your choice if you want to do the 864 as household member or separate sponsor. You qualify for either way.

 

Provided its just you, spouse, and your single parent (with no other dependents)-

Scenario 1- you do the 864. Size 2. You don't have enough income. Parent files 864 as well.  Household size is 2- them and your spouse. They need to show income for 2.

 

Scenario 2- you file 864 and parent does 864a as your household member. Size is now 3. Your income plus parents must cover size 3. 

 

For your situation its less income needed for Scenario 1. That's not always the case, it depends on the specifics. 

Thank you Villanelle, that is really helpful.

 

Actually, my driver's license does not list my parent's address, it lists another state.  So it still seems tenuous claiming that we are residing in the same household.  I don't know what standard of evidence USCIS has for this and how closely they look at that factor.

 

It's actually me, my spouse, our child and my parent.  So if I do the 864 it would be 3 people.  And then if my parent does their own 864, I think it would be 2 for them.  

 

In either case my parent easily has the income level- seems to be $28,787 for three people and $34,687 for four.  

 

 

[Villanelle 4,121]

Your 864 would show 3. Parent would do a second 864. It would include them(Parent), the immigrant (spouse) and any one else required- you can find info on who to count in the instructions. Basically you count unmarried children under 21 regardless of where they live/custody, any one listed as your dependent on taxes, and any one else you may be supporting regardless of taxes. 

 

Most likely your parents 864 would show size 2 as Parent is not married and I assume no one else is to be counted. 

 

 

[lovinglive 24]

11 hours ago, Villanelle said:

Your 864 would show 3. Parent would do a second 864. It would include them(Parent), the immigrant (spouse) and any one else required- you can find info on who to count in the instructions. Basically you count unmarried children under 21 regardless of where they live/custody, any one listed as your dependent on taxes, and any one else you may be supporting regardless of taxes. 

 

Most likely your parents 864 would show size 2 as Parent is not married and I assume no one else is to be counted. 

 

 

Yes I think that's right- 2 household members for for my parent.

 

I think I've decided to do the 864 rather than the 864A.  As ROK2USA said above, if they are not sure that I am residing there, they may issue and RFE delaying the case.  I have read a number of old posts where people got RFEs related to form 864A.  Most of the time it was due to the relationship with the person completing the 864A- seemed that USCIS didn't think they met the standard of a household/family member.  But in my case the issue of a residence, or sharing a household, could also come up.

 

There were also a number of forum users in the past that advised to use the 864 rather than the 864A- they said it's easier and cleaner.