Sundayyyy

[sarah and hicham 3]

Ahhh Doodle first you say you were not judging hicham then you say "I guess that really hit a sore spot with you". Like JP said it isn't a sore spot since we went to the pub together, clearly. I see you trying to make it into something it's not but that isn't working for you because it certainly wasn't a sore spot. Why else would I post what we did? Yikes.

Anyways hon, I think peezey and JP and Bosco and MBP have summed everything up so that it is clear enough for you to understand.

So if you're emotionally attached to something it's too hard to give up so that's ok. What if you're emotionally attached to drugs? That's ok though, cause you were emotionally attached to drugs before you converted, right?

Hicham is laughing so hard at me explaining what happened in the last 4 pages. Doodle you're a real hoot! Hicham is wondering if you are joking about all of this but I had to explain that no, she just wants to double check and make sure she can't have ####### sex in Egypt this December.

I have a question:

When you convert to Islam, does one not have to, hmm, go through a process, or talk to a religious leader, or be in a group or something? I'm just curious; I'm Catholic, and if you want to be Catholic, you have several months of classes in the faith in order to learn about it.

How did you convert? Is it as simple as waking up one day and deciding to be Muslim? Or do you have to do anything?

No it's not like going through RCIA at all. You have to believe that there is only one God (no trinity) and that Muhammed, pbuh, is His final messenger. If you are Christian you also have to believe that Jesus, pbuh, is not God. One you truly believe this in your heart you can say the shahada which is basically just stating the above. Then you are muslim.

What abusive actions? Do you think people really believed you were trying to learn if alcohol was haram? No, it was clear you were trying to call Hicham out. You stated yourself it is black and white and have posted before about knowing Muslims don't drink. If you had just said "I am riding you Sarah as you ride me", this never would have developed into this. Instead you tried to say you were learning. Then you go on about how it is black and white and how doing something clearly haram would not sit right with you. Then you went on to drown in your own pool of hypocrisy when you called your own boyfriend haram.

Now we are abusers because it backfired. Guess what? The victim game isn't fooling anyone either.

You believe what you want to believe to justify your actions. That's cool. I know what my intentions are and I was wrong to think that I could have a normal conversation with Sarah without it turning into something like this. A few days ago she said it was boring in here so I guess now she has her fun. Shame that it means piling on someone whose intentions were not as you think, but you are the one who has to go to sleep with yourself at night. Good luck with that.

I don't have to justify anything. You can read through this thread, just as anyone else can. Can you sleep at night claiming your question about alcohol and Hicham was only because "sometimes I'm confused on what is haram and what is halal"?

And, swee pea, I get to sleep with my husband at night

BTW - the judgmental thing doesn't suit you

Nope, it doesn't work for her does it?

[mybackpages 0]

Too many good people have been driven from this board for this very behaviour and quite frankly it is sickening to me.

I guess the old saying is true, if you repeat something often enough people start to believe it.

[Caladan 19]

In any case, I don't think anyone's attacking you. You needled Sarah, she needled back, and for the love of little apples, if someone has a drinking problem, they don't order a damned coffee.

Dunno what coffee has to do with it but thanks for your input. I disagree that I needled her. Asked a simple question is all. Normally when she starts things I tend to ignore the bullying but tonight I dont' feel like backin' down. Too many good people have been driven from this board for this very behaviour and quite frankly it is sickening to me.

doodle, in the pic she posted, there's a beer and a coffee. You've been insinuating that the only reason Sarah's getting antsy is because of a hidden alcohol problem.

[doodlebug 3]

Ahhh Doodle first you say you were not judging hicham then you say "I guess that really hit a sore spot with you". Like JP said it isn't a sore spot since we went to the pub together, clearly. I see you trying to make it into something it's not but that isn't working for you because it certainly wasn't a sore spot. Why else would I post what we did? Yikes.

Anyways hon, I think peezey and JP and Bosco and MBP have summed everything up so that it is clear enough for you to understand.

So if you're emotionally attached to something it's too hard to give up so that's ok. What if you're emotionally attached to drugs? That's ok though, cause you were emotionally attached to drugs before you converted, right?

Hicham is laughing so hard at me explaining what happened in the last 4 pages. Doodle you're a real hoot! Hicham is wondering if you are joking about all of this but I had to explain that no, she just wants to double check and make sure she can't have ####### sex in Egypt this December.

Oh I"m glad he's laughing. Thats so sweet. I don't recall bringing ####### sex into this conversation. When I brought it up it was a joke, but then you already acknowledged that you didn't understand that. That's ok.

Actually things were clear before JP, Bosco, peezey and MBP explained it to me. Thanks for your concern though.

If this wasn't a sore spot then you obviously were just looking for a fight then. I hope I've supplied your entertainment for the night. Good luck tomorrow since I won't be here to pick on. I'm sure you'll find another victim though and someone for Hicham to laugh at.

[mybackpages 0]

Anyways hon, I think peezey and JP and Bosco and MBP have summed everything up so that it is clear enough for you to understand.

Wait....Peezy, JP, Bosco, me and Sarah....that's not a trio. That a quintet

But seriously i have joined a duo with Jenn so i won;t make the next world tour

[doodlebug 3]

Too many good people have been driven from this board for this very behaviour and quite frankly it is sickening to me.

I guess the old saying is true, if you repeat something often enough people start to believe it.

Actually I received more than one email today from people stating what I said above. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

In any case, I don't think anyone's attacking you. You needled Sarah, she needled back, and for the love of little apples, if someone has a drinking problem, they don't order a damned coffee.

Dunno what coffee has to do with it but thanks for your input. I disagree that I needled her. Asked a simple question is all. Normally when she starts things I tend to ignore the bullying but tonight I dont' feel like backin' down. Too many good people have been driven from this board for this very behaviour and quite frankly it is sickening to me.

doodle, in the pic she posted, there's a beer and a coffee. You've been insinuating that the only reason Sarah's getting antsy is because of a hidden alcohol problem.

She didn't post it. Someone else did. Perhaps you could read through the thread before commenting?

[mybackpages 0]

Too many good people have been driven from this board for this very behaviour and quite frankly it is sickening to me.

I guess the old saying is true, if you repeat something often enough people start to believe it.

Actually I received more than one email today from people stating what I said above. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

Like I said, alot of people have convinced themselves this is true.

[Bosco 1]

Anyways hon, I think peezey and JP and Bosco and MBP have summed everything up so that it is clear enough for you to understand.

Wait....Peezy, JP, Bosco, me and Sarah....that's not a trio. That a quintet

But seriously i have joined a duo with Jenn so i won;t make the next world tour

Will you be drinking wine on that tour B) ?

[doodlebug 3]

Too many good people have been driven from this board for this very behaviour and quite frankly it is sickening to me.

I guess the old saying is true, if you repeat something often enough people start to believe it.

Actually I received more than one email today from people stating what I said above. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt.

Like I said, alot of people have convinced themselves this is true.

With good reason I"m finding out tonight. It's a shame though because one of them was a really good poster and never said a bad word to anyone.

[amal 4]

I know a great deal of Muslims and I don't recall a single revert telling me that they knew every detail about Islam when they reverted. I know for sure that I didn't. If I didn't have the help from some of the ladies I met here in VJ (before I met others in my area) I wouldn't have gotten the answers in the beginning that I needed. Some people have been known to convert/revert after seeing just 1 act of kindness from a Muslim. They don't know ANYTHING about the faith. So there may have been a bad judgement call on what was said but is that any reason to badger a person and rip them to bits? Why not just give a simple answer and let it be that? I like everybody in this forum and I hate to see such bickering going on.

hehe do I need to put you in your corners like I did last time?? Do I need to take away the sweets that we've been sharing DON'T MAKE ME LICK THEM ALL AGAIN

also...If there are any new Muslims out there that have questions (or even those of you just considering Islam) I am happy to help you find your answers in PM anytime.

amal

I haven't said this yet, but now I will. I dont' believe for a second Doodle doesn't know alcohol is haram, I fully believe she was trying to get a little feisty with Sarah, and originally I didn't see it as much more than jokey banter that has now gotten into deeper questions, which I actually don't see as a whole, are an issue to discuss.

If you know of anyone, even non-muslims, who don't know alcohol is haram in Islam, I'd like to know how they've gotten this far in life.

I wasn't commenting necessarily about the alcohol. I was commenting on the comments of how she should keep her questions off the forums (in a round-about way) and how she should only get her answers via quraan and studying hadiths. While I agree that those are the best ways to learn, I wouldn't have learned near as much without the help of my friends (and of course my husband). That is what my post was based on.

Someone asked what is required to become Muslim.

(I asked my husband to help me write this so it would be correct...here goes)

You have to believe in the 5 pillars of Islam...

1. Believing in there being no God but Allah and that Prophet Mohammed is the messenger of God.

2. Prayer

3 Fasting

4. Giving to the poor (zakat)

5. Hajj

If you believe all of these things in your heart, then you can say shahadah and become Muslim.

You can study for a long time (as I did) or you can say shahadah after learning the basics about the pillars. As long as you believe it and say shahadah...that is all that is required.

I hope that helped.

[sarah and hicham 3]

Ahhh Doodle first you say you were not judging hicham then you say "I guess that really hit a sore spot with you". Like JP said it isn't a sore spot since we went to the pub together, clearly. I see you trying to make it into something it's not but that isn't working for you because it certainly wasn't a sore spot. Why else would I post what we did? Yikes.

Anyways hon, I think peezey and JP and Bosco and MBP have summed everything up so that it is clear enough for you to understand.

So if you're emotionally attached to something it's too hard to give up so that's ok. What if you're emotionally attached to drugs? That's ok though, cause you were emotionally attached to drugs before you converted, right?

Hicham is laughing so hard at me explaining what happened in the last 4 pages. Doodle you're a real hoot! Hicham is wondering if you are joking about all of this but I had to explain that no, she just wants to double check and make sure she can't have ####### sex in Egypt this December.

Oh I"m glad he's laughing. Thats so sweet. I don't recall bringing ####### sex into this conversation. When I brought it up it was a joke, but then you already acknowledged that you didn't understand that. That's ok.

Actually things were clear before JP, Bosco, peezey and MBP explained it to me. Thanks for your concern though.

If this wasn't a sore spot then you obviously were just looking for a fight then. I hope I've supplied your entertainment for the night. Good luck tomorrow since I won't be here to pick on. I'm sure you'll find another victim though and someone for Hicham to laugh at.

Doodle what exactly were you looking for in asking Hicham's drinking habits?

The problem I have is with your extreme levels of hypocrisy, not the question you asked.

Oh and just for a reference here is a thread from a while ago where you stated you have given up alcohol because you know it's not allowed in Islam.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...st&p=529501

Doodle if you swear to Allah right now that you didn't know that alcohol was haram then I would gladly apologize to you...

[mybackpages 0]

Anyways hon, I think peezey and JP and Bosco and MBP have summed everything up so that it is clear enough for you to understand.

Wait....Peezy, JP, Bosco, me and Sarah....that's not a trio. That a quintet

But seriously i have joined a duo with Jenn so i won;t make the next world tour

Will you be drinking wine on that tour B) ?

only halal wine Do you think Absolut makes a halal vodka?

[doodlebug 3]

I don't have to justify anything. You can read through this thread, just as anyone else can. Can you sleep at night claiming your question about alcohol and Hicham was only because "sometimes I'm confused on what is haram and what is halal"?

Beyond a shadow of a doubt, yes. I have read that the majority think it haram but I have also read about two articles questioning it using a quote from Muhammed, pbuh, where he infers that sometimes it is good for you. Thinking that perhaps Hicham was a muslim I thought that if he did drink, which wasn't clear from what she posted, perhaps he knew more about it. I was actually hoping that she could ask him for a reference. Kinda water under the dam now though since you've already figured out what you think my intentions are.

BTW - the judgmental thing doesn't suit you

Seems to fit you quite snugly though huh?

Ahhh Doodle first you say you were not judging hicham then you say "I guess that really hit a sore spot with you". Like JP said it isn't a sore spot since we went to the pub together, clearly. I see you trying to make it into something it's not but that isn't working for you because it certainly wasn't a sore spot. Why else would I post what we did? Yikes.

Anyways hon, I think peezey and JP and Bosco and MBP have summed everything up so that it is clear enough for you to understand.

So if you're emotionally attached to something it's too hard to give up so that's ok. What if you're emotionally attached to drugs? That's ok though, cause you were emotionally attached to drugs before you converted, right?

Hicham is laughing so hard at me explaining what happened in the last 4 pages. Doodle you're a real hoot! Hicham is wondering if you are joking about all of this but I had to explain that no, she just wants to double check and make sure she can't have ####### sex in Egypt this December.

Oh I"m glad he's laughing. Thats so sweet. I don't recall bringing ####### sex into this conversation. When I brought it up it was a joke, but then you already acknowledged that you didn't understand that. That's ok.

Actually things were clear before JP, Bosco, peezey and MBP explained it to me. Thanks for your concern though.

If this wasn't a sore spot then you obviously were just looking for a fight then. I hope I've supplied your entertainment for the night. Good luck tomorrow since I won't be here to pick on. I'm sure you'll find another victim though and someone for Hicham to laugh at.

Doodle what exactly were you looking for in asking Hicham's drinking habits?

The problem I have is with your extreme levels of hypocrisy, not the question you asked.

Oh and just for a reference here is a thread from a while ago where you stated you have given up alcohol because you know it's not allowed in Islam.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...st&p=529501

Doodle if you swear to Allah right now that you didn't know that alcohol was haram then I would gladly apologize to you...

I swear to Allah that my statement above to Bosco is 100% truthful and I could care less if you apologize or not.

[sarah and hicham 3]

I don't have to justify anything. You can read through this thread, just as anyone else can. Can you sleep at night claiming your question about alcohol and Hicham was only because "sometimes I'm confused on what is haram and what is halal"?

Beyond a shadow of a doubt, yes. I have read that the majority think it haram but I have also read about two articles questioning it using a quote from Muhammed, pbuh, where he infers that sometimes it is good for you. Thinking that perhaps Hicham was a muslim I thought that if he did drink, which wasn't clear from what she posted, perhaps he knew more about it. I was actually hoping that she could ask him for a reference. Kinda water under the dam now though since you've already figured out what you think my intentions are.

BTW - the judgmental thing doesn't suit you

Seems to fit you quite snugly though huh?

Doodle, sweetie here's a tip for ya- instead of deciding if it is ok or not drink alcohol depending on what HE does or what your fiance does or anyone else, try to formulate your own thoughts and opinions based on reading the Quran and maybe spend some time in the Mosque asking questions to the imam rather than basing your choices on Muslims who do things that fit your lifestyle but that aren't halal in the name of convenience for you.

[Bosco 1]

I know a great deal of Muslims and I don't recall a single revert telling me that they knew every detail about Islam when they reverted. I know for sure that I didn't. If I didn't have the help from some of the ladies I met here in VJ (before I met others in my area) I wouldn't have gotten the answers in the beginning that I needed. Some people have been known to convert/revert after seeing just 1 act of kindness from a Muslim. They don't know ANYTHING about the faith. So there may have been a bad judgement call on what was said but is that any reason to badger a person and rip them to bits? Why not just give a simple answer and let it be that? I like everybody in this forum and I hate to see such bickering going on.

hehe do I need to put you in your corners like I did last time?? Do I need to take away the sweets that we've been sharing DON'T MAKE ME LICK THEM ALL AGAIN

also...If there are any new Muslims out there that have questions (or even those of you just considering Islam) I am happy to help you find your answers in PM anytime.

amal

I haven't said this yet, but now I will. I dont' believe for a second Doodle doesn't know alcohol is haram, I fully believe she was trying to get a little feisty with Sarah, and originally I didn't see it as much more than jokey banter that has now gotten into deeper questions, which I actually don't see as a whole, are an issue to discuss.

If you know of anyone, even non-muslims, who don't know alcohol is haram in Islam, I'd like to know how they've gotten this far in life.

I wasn't commenting necessarily about the alcohol. I was commenting on the comments of how she should keep her questions off the forums (in a round-about way) and how she should only get her answers via quraan and studying hadiths. While I agree that those are the best ways to learn, I wouldn't have learned near as much without the help of my friends (and of course my husband). That is what my post was based on.

Someone asked what is required to become Muslim.

(I asked my husband to help me write this so it would be correct...here goes)

You have to believe in the 5 pillars of Islam...

1. Believing in there being no God but Allah and that Prophet Mohammed is the messenger of God.

2. Prayer

3 Fasting

4. Giving to the poor (zakat)

5. Hajj

If you believe all of these things in your heart, then you can say shahadah and become Muslim.

You can study for a long time (as I did) or you can say shahadah after learning the basics about the pillars. As long as you believe it and say shahadah...that is all that is required.

I hope that helped.

Amal

Where did anyone say the "she should only get her answers via quraan and studying hadiths."?

My words were "If you are confused about what is halal or haram, the Qur'an is an excellent source, definitely a better choice than asking after the habits of other Muslims."

Also, I did not say friends were not a good source. But asking "does your husband drink" as a way to determine if there is some alcohol loophole (and did anyone buy this) is clearly not the best route.

I stand by my advice.

Edited December 5, 2006 by Bosco