Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Jenn!

Moroccan group calls for fast-breaking in public

21 posts in this topic

Recommended Posts

Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: Morocco
Timeline

RABAT (Adel al-Zubairi, Al Arabiya)

A group of Moroccan youths launched for the second year an online campaign calling for their right to break their fasting in public during the mornings of Ramadan amid protests against violating one of the main pillars of Islam and claims of a hidden agenda.

Moroccan blogger Naguib Shawki launched a campaign on the social networking website Facebook under the slogan “Fasting or not fasting, we’re all Moroccans.” The campaign calls for allowing Moroccans the right to eat and drink in public if they are not fasting instead of having to do so in secret.

Shawki refuted claims that the campaign has anything against religion or calls for violating Islamic principles.

“We are not encouraging people not to fast or to violate the teachings of Islam or to convert to another religion,” Shawki told Al Arabiya. “We are only defending personal freedoms without inciting sedition.”

Shawki and other members of the campaign called for opening a rational dialogue about the right to break the fast and to do it in public."

“We are not trying to provoke anyone. We are only trying to get rid of society’s control. We want the personal freedom we are deprived of.”

The campaign was met with wide protests on the grounds that it calls for the violation of one of the five pillars of Islam and since Islam is the main and official religion in Morocco; it has to be respected by all its citizens.

Hassan al-Haythami, a journalist from the weekly al-Misbah, argued that organizers of the campaign have a hidden agenda.

“It will not stop at breaking the fast in public,” he told Al Arabiya. “Those people will later call for more serious practices that violate the teachings of Islam. This is a provocative campaign that will definitely be resisted by the Muslim Moroccan society.”

Several groups were formed on Facebook to counter the calls for fast-breaking in public. Members of these groups argue that eating and drinking in public during the day in Ramadan is insensitive to other people who are fasting.

They also pointed out that the Moroccan society turns a blind eye to people who don’t fast as long as they eat and drink inside their homes or at least not in front of fasting people.

However, the campaign wants official acknowledgment of their right to break the fast in public and calls for the cancellation of the law that bans eating and drinking in public during the holy month.

“I don’t see what’s wrong with the law,” said one Moroccan blogger. “In the United States, people are not allowed to drink alcohol in public and are penalized if seen with a can of beer in the street. Americans never objected to that law.”

According to article 222 of the Moroccan Penal Code, public eating or drinking during Ramadan is penalized by one to six months in jail and a fine that ranges between 12 and 120 dirhams (between $1.5 and $12).

The campaign for public fast-breaking started last year in the northwestern city of Mohammedia when a group of youths organized a rally to eat in the street during a Ramadan morning in protest of the law that they said violated their personal freedom. The police dispersed the crowd and the campaign did not garner the support it aimed for.

(Translated from Arabic by Sonia Farid)

http://www.alarabiya.net/articles/2010/07/28/115073.html

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thought it might be interesting to get opinions on this. My personal views support a separation of church and state, so I think this movement is positive. It's not infringing on anyone's right to practice Islam.

I was surprised to learn that breaking fast in public is punishable by jail time or a fine - I wasn't aware of that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: Citizen (pnd) Country: Morocco
Timeline

Being an American muslim, I find this topic very interesting.

I also didn't realize that it is aganst the law in Morocco to break fast in public during Ramadan, I'm kind of shocked about that. So anyone not able to fast for medical reasons, such as anyone who has to take medication, who is diabetic, or women who may be pregnant, or menstrating would be punished by law? What if you're of the minority in Morocco who isn't Muslim? I find this law particularly harsh. I certainly do not compare this to laws around alcohol consumption in the Unites States. Food and drink are sustinance our bodies need to survive, alcohol obviously is not, so that is not a fair comparison IMHO.

I have a friend who grew up in Indonesia, he is not Muslim. However, he did say that while growing up they tried to wait to go out to eat during Ramadan until after maghrib prayers because they received bad treatment by other citizens who were Muslim, he said they didn't like the fact that they had to serve others food when they weren't allowed to partake. I was shocked to hear that as well. Even though fasting is an obligation, I firmly believe that what is in my heart and my true intention is of great importance.

(F)~kiyah~(F)


~ Returns & Refusals...What They Don't Tell You ~

DISCLAIMER: I am not an attorney, all information provided is from years of research and personal experiences of those affected by returned visa petitions/applications. If this is happening to you, my personal advice is to research the facts, hire a good immigration lawyer who can demonstrate they specialize in returned/denied visa petitions and applications.

~ Faith, Patience, Perseverance ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: IR-1/CR-1 Visa Country: Morocco
Timeline

Being an American muslim, I find this topic very interesting.

I also didn't realize that it is aganst the law in Morocco to break fast in public during Ramadan, I'm kind of shocked about that. So anyone not able to fast for medical reasons, such as anyone who has to take medication, who is diabetic, or women who may be pregnant, or menstrating would be punished by law? What if you're of the minority in Morocco who isn't Muslim? I find this law particularly harsh. I certainly do not compare this to laws around alcohol consumption in the Unites States. Food and drink are sustinance our bodies need to survive, alcohol obviously is not, so that is not a fair comparison IMHO.

I have a friend who grew up in Indonesia, he is not Muslim. However, he did say that while growing up they tried to wait to go out to eat during Ramadan until after maghrib prayers because they received bad treatment by other citizens who were Muslim, he said they didn't like the fact that they had to serve others food when they weren't allowed to partake. I was shocked to hear that as well. Even though fasting is an obligation, I firmly believe that what is in my heart and my true intention is of great importance.

(F)~kiyah~(F)

I haven't had much time to think about this, but I have heard about this. I do know that if you are not Muslim you are not held to this law. So for me, being a Lutheran, if I were to be eating or drinking in public I would have no consequences. This law is directed only towards Muslims.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: IR-1/CR-1 Visa Country: Morocco
Timeline

I agree with Jenn! re: the separation of church and state issue. And for me it raises the question, where does it end? Why not punish Muslims who don't visibly participate in salat? Or mandate hijab? Or go beyond the more or less accepted obligations and start mandating by state law other more controversial preferred practices. (A more conservative dress code, legal sanction for women who elect not to sleep with their husbands, for failure to devote a certain amount of time to studying the Quran, etc.) I suppose fasting is fairly black and white as far as Muslim obligations go, but this is a slippery slope.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: K-1 Visa Country: Egypt
Timeline

I completely support seperation of religion and state, and this article is interesting. I have a friend who is Moroccan and I asked once if the most holy day to Muslims is Friday why is it not your weekend (like other Muslim countries), but rather in Morocco the weekend is Saturday and Sunday. She said that at one time Friday was their weekend, but the country decided to seperate religion and state and made the weekend on Saturday and Sunday but do allow extra time off of work on Friday for Jummah prayer. So if this the case, and religion and state have been seperated how can they impose a law like this? And personally I feel the punishment is a bit harsh. And as stated you can't compare the consumption of food/water to alcohol in America, thats like comparing apples to oranges. But just for the argument, if someone is caught drinking alchohol outside of a bar/restaurant, I would be shocked if they received jail time, but would most likely receive a ticket or just forced to empty the contents, and thats if the law was enforced.

IMO, and as Islam teaches, everyone is responsible for their own actions and for their own salvation. Forcing someone to fast during Ramadan is not going to make them a better Muslim. They have to want to do it in their heart, just like wearing the hijab and praying. IMO fasting, along with prayer, and other teaches or Islam should be done out of obedience and love for Allah, if it is forced then it loses its meaning.


~ Our Journey ~

10/27/09 - Met online

04/21/10 - Travel to Egypt to meet in person

05/08/10 - Sent I-129F

05/10/10 - VSC receives I-129F

05/11/10 - NOA1

05/13/10 - Touched

05/14/10 - Touched

05/17/10 - Received NOA1 in the mail

07/06/10 - NOA2 - Approved!!!! :)

07/12/10 - Received NOA2 in the mail

07/13/10 - Received at NVC

07/16/10 - NVC changes embassy per our request

07/19/10 - Told we are in AP @ NVC

07/30/10 - Case sent to Cairo embassy

08/05/10 - Case received at embassy

09/07/10 - Received packet 3 - FINALLY!!!

09/15-10 - 2nd trip to Egypt, returned home on 10/5/10

12/14/10 - Received interview date

01/09/11 - 3rd trip to Egypt

01/12/11 - Interview - APPROVED!!!...but AP

01/24/11 - Returned to the states without my habibi :(

04/06/11 - AP was completed!! :)

05/10/11 - Visa has been issued!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: Citizen (pnd) Country: Morocco
Timeline

IMO, and as Islam teaches, everyone is responsible for their own actions and for their own salvation. Forcing someone to fast during Ramadan is not going to make them a better Muslim. They have to want to do it in their heart, just like wearing the hijab and praying. IMO fasting, along with prayer, and other teaches or Islam should be done out of obedience and love for Allah, if it is forced then it loses its meaning.

Absolutely, and exactly what I was trying to convey. :thumbs:

I had no idea that Morocco had separated 'religion and state' and if this is the case then this law makes even less sense to me. My husband and I spoke about this last night, let's just say this is a topic we don't agree upon and have decided to respect our difference in opinion, he supports the law. :)

(F)~kiyah~(F)


~ Returns & Refusals...What They Don't Tell You ~

DISCLAIMER: I am not an attorney, all information provided is from years of research and personal experiences of those affected by returned visa petitions/applications. If this is happening to you, my personal advice is to research the facts, hire a good immigration lawyer who can demonstrate they specialize in returned/denied visa petitions and applications.

~ Faith, Patience, Perseverance ~

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Separation of church and state is impossible. Even in USA that is "supposed" to be the way it is, but truly it isn't. you know if you receive benefits (i.e. welfare in various forms) they put the people to work to "earn" those benefits... how many people knew that? (you receive $x amount in food stamps you will divide that by minimum wage and that's how many hours the person will "work" for that organization). now here is the kicker... most times those "jobs" they work at are working for church based organizations. so much for separation of church and state huh?

or what about the "bluelight law" that still exists in smaller more rural areas? anyone remember those who have moved away or live with it now? That is state law based on churchgoers wishes.

but they've taken it to the extreme in gov't schools ... not a single show of faith is allowed to be uttered, displayed, discussed. i can understand it not being taught in school, so that children in minority groups are not pressured, but at same time a child should be allowed to say prayer over their food, they should be allowed to discuss and debate especially at the high school level, when they discuss and debate everything from homosexuality, abortion, and so on. GOD exists, why arent they allowed to speak His name.

now as for the original post...

i am on the other side with this. This is a muslim country so the majority would be fasting. They are NOT requiring or making law everyone has to fast, they are saying just not to do it in public during fasting hours. and IMHO that is just a common courtesy, something we learn as small children even! you dont eat/drink in front of others who cannot. society has become so selfish and uncaring toward others, always worrying "what about MY rights" but what about thinking of others first... imagine what a beautiful society we could have if people truly thought about others first before themselves.

and just my 2¢ but i DO believe these people are being anti-muslim... there seems to be a growing mindset "it's ok to bash muslims" and it's shocking. look at all the chaos over the mosque in NY which has been there since the 70s but now suddenly people are throwing a hissy fit about it becasue OMG it is close to ground zero. well, how far away do they have to be to make these hatemongers happy? 20 blocks away? a city away? no mosques in the whole state of NY?

now let's look at it this way, and step back just a few years (and really not that many!) and go down south...

how many people said "i dont want a Baptist church built here" when blacks (even children) were killed? no one cared did they?:(

or how about on our news stations when a muslim commits a crime it's all about that he is muslim and the hatemongers come out with "we dont want those *nasty label* on our soil, send'em back where they came from"... yet not once have i ever heard mention on the news when a KKK or Aryan nation guy goes on a rampage that they say "a christian man" even though they're christian based organizations (yes, people dont like to talk about that).

it's sickening the hate that is breeding and the people who rear their children on it. intolerance. hatred. contempt. it's infecting the next generation if parents, teachers, leaders, dont teach them properly. we will go backward and self-distruct as a people.


if you gave your info (receipt #s, full name, etc) to anyone on VJ under the guise that they would "help" you through the immigration journey with his inside contacts (like his sister at USCIS) ... please contact OLUInquiries@dhs.gov, and go to http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact to report anything suspicious. Contact your congressman and senator's offices as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: K-1 Visa Country: Egypt
Timeline

Separation of church and state is impossible. Even in USA that is "supposed" to be the way it is, but truly it isn't. you know if you receive benefits (i.e. welfare in various forms) they put the people to work to "earn" those benefits... how many people knew that? (you receive $x amount in food stamps you will divide that by minimum wage and that's how many hours the person will "work" for that organization). now here is the kicker... most times those "jobs" they work at are working for church based organizations. so much for separation of church and state huh?

or what about the "bluelight law" that still exists in smaller more rural areas? anyone remember those who have moved away or live with it now? That is state law based on churchgoers wishes.

but they've taken it to the extreme in gov't schools ... not a single show of faith is allowed to be uttered, displayed, discussed. i can understand it not being taught in school, so that children in minority groups are not pressured, but at same time a child should be allowed to say prayer over their food, they should be allowed to discuss and debate especially at the high school level, when they discuss and debate everything from homosexuality, abortion, and so on. GOD exists, why arent they allowed to speak His name.

now as for the original post...

i am on the other side with this. This is a muslim country so the majority would be fasting. They are NOT requiring or making law everyone has to fast, they are saying just not to do it in public during fasting hours. and IMHO that is just a common courtesy, something we learn as small children even! you dont eat/drink in front of others who cannot. society has become so selfish and uncaring toward others, always worrying "what about MY rights" but what about thinking of others first... imagine what a beautiful society we could have if people truly thought about others first before themselves.

and just my 2¢ but i DO believe these people are being anti-muslim... there seems to be a growing mindset "it's ok to bash muslims" and it's shocking. look at all the chaos over the mosque in NY which has been there since the 70s but now suddenly people are throwing a hissy fit about it becasue OMG it is close to ground zero. well, how far away do they have to be to make these hatemongers happy? 20 blocks away? a city away? no mosques in the whole state of NY?

now let's look at it this way, and step back just a few years (and really not that many!) and go down south...

how many people said "i dont want a Baptist church built here" when blacks (even children) were killed? no one cared did they?:(

or how about on our news stations when a muslim commits a crime it's all about that he is muslim and the hatemongers come out with "we dont want those *nasty label* on our soil, send'em back where they came from"... yet not once have i ever heard mention on the news when a KKK or Aryan nation guy goes on a rampage that they say "a christian man" even though they're christian based organizations (yes, people dont like to talk about that).

it's sickening the hate that is breeding and the people who rear their children on it. intolerance. hatred. contempt. it's infecting the next generation if parents, teachers, leaders, dont teach them properly. we will go backward and self-distruct as a people.

First I can say at one point I struggled financially and needed to go to the government for help, and I never had to work for what I was given. I know if a person is not presently working they must actively seek work in order to receive any benefits. And if they do make you vonlunteer at a church or something what is wrong with helping others, they are not forcing you to attend church or believe in their doctrine.

As for the Mosque at ground zero, I have heard a lot about that, but honestly I have heard more people supporting it rather than objecting it. Majority of people feel this is America and freedom of religion, and are well aware that Muslims died on that day as well, and the ones who don't understand that are just ignorant.

I am an American Muslim convert and I do support the seperation of religion and state. I'm not Muslim bashing, and as I stated before if a person chooses to fast it should be out of obedience and love for Allah, and if they have a problem seeing someone else eating when they choose not too, then IMO they are not fasting for the right reasons. The argument of "poor me," and "what about me," can be said from both sides. Poor me I can't eat in public because of the law, and poor me I'm fasting and seen someone eating and its not fair. One thing I was taught when I was a Christian, is that when we choose to fast we should not inform everyone we know we are fasting (unless they ask, then you can tell them), or let others know you are suffering because you can't eat. Fasting along with prayer, and others things we do is to bring us closer to Allah, and we should not complain about the hardship we endure during the process, but rather be glad that our actions and obedience is pleasing to Allah, and know that it is much more pleasing to him if we do it with a clean heart and not self pity.


~ Our Journey ~

10/27/09 - Met online

04/21/10 - Travel to Egypt to meet in person

05/08/10 - Sent I-129F

05/10/10 - VSC receives I-129F

05/11/10 - NOA1

05/13/10 - Touched

05/14/10 - Touched

05/17/10 - Received NOA1 in the mail

07/06/10 - NOA2 - Approved!!!! :)

07/12/10 - Received NOA2 in the mail

07/13/10 - Received at NVC

07/16/10 - NVC changes embassy per our request

07/19/10 - Told we are in AP @ NVC

07/30/10 - Case sent to Cairo embassy

08/05/10 - Case received at embassy

09/07/10 - Received packet 3 - FINALLY!!!

09/15-10 - 2nd trip to Egypt, returned home on 10/5/10

12/14/10 - Received interview date

01/09/11 - 3rd trip to Egypt

01/12/11 - Interview - APPROVED!!!...but AP

01/24/11 - Returned to the states without my habibi :(

04/06/11 - AP was completed!! :)

05/10/11 - Visa has been issued!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: IR-1/CR-1 Visa Country: Morocco
Timeline

First I can say at one point I struggled financially and needed to go to the government for help, and I never had to work for what I was given. I know if a person is not presently working they must actively seek work in order to receive any benefits. And if they do make you vonlunteer at a church or something what is wrong with helping others, they are not forcing you to attend church or believe in their doctrine.

As for the Mosque at ground zero, I have heard a lot about that, but honestly I have heard more people supporting it rather than objecting it. Majority of people feel this is America and freedom of religion, and are well aware that Muslims died on that day as well, and the ones who don't understand that are just ignorant.

I am an American Muslim convert and I do support the seperation of religion and state. I'm not Muslim bashing, and as I stated before if a person chooses to fast it should be out of obedience and love for Allah, and if they have a problem seeing someone else eating when they choose not too, then IMO they are not fasting for the right reasons. The argument of "poor me," and "what about me," can be said from both sides. Poor me I can't eat in public because of the law, and poor me I'm fasting and seen someone eating and its not fair. One thing I was taught when I was a Christian, is that when we choose to fast we should not inform everyone we know we are fasting (unless they ask, then you can tell them), or let others know you are suffering because you can't eat. Fasting along with prayer, and others things we do is to bring us closer to Allah, and we should not complain about the hardship we endure during the process, but rather be glad that our actions and obedience is pleasing to Allah, and know that it is much more pleasing to him if we do it with a clean heart and not self pity.

I agree with what you're saying. If fasting is mandated by law it no longer becomes something that you choose to do and once it is not something that is found in your heart then it really is no longer serving the purpose it was intended to serve. I get that if the majority is fasting that it would be the courteous thing to do and not eat in front of them... I don't eat in front of my husband when he's fasting. But this leads me to question several things, is it not haram to smoke and drink? What about those Muslims that smoke and drink in public? Should they receive jail time for that?

If I'm correct here the meaning of Islam is submission. You can't really force submission... it's something that is in your heart or isn't in your heart. I don't think these people are Muslim haters. When you're fasting you really shouldn't be concerned with what anyone else is doing, again that takes away from the whole point of fasting. It is about you and doing this because GOD commanded it. I would hate to be the judge of someone else's religion. By that I mean, I would never want to be responsible for enforcing this law, the fact is that GOD is the only one who can enforce religious laws and that is something we should be thankful for. What a huge task that would be. I'm thankful that I don't ever need to concern myself with whether someone is practicing religion they way that they *should* be.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with what you're saying. If fasting is mandated by law it no longer becomes something that you choose to do and once it is not something that is found in your heart then it really is no longer serving the purpose it was intended to serve. {snipped}

but the law doesnt require people to fast, only to respect the holy month and the people who are observing it.


if you gave your info (receipt #s, full name, etc) to anyone on VJ under the guise that they would "help" you through the immigration journey with his inside contacts (like his sister at USCIS) ... please contact OLUInquiries@dhs.gov, and go to http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact to report anything suspicious. Contact your congressman and senator's offices as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: K-1 Visa Country: Egypt
Timeline

but the law doesnt require people to fast, only to respect the holy month and the people who are observing it.

Yes it would be the repectful thing to do and not eat if you know someone is fasting, but the truth is, regardless of country or religion, not everyone is courteous. And laws should be in place to proctect people, not to make their life easier. That is why here in the US so many places are banning smoking in public, because its hazardous to the people around you. You want to smoke, fine, go kill yourself in your own home and car, but don't infect those around you. Eating in public during fasting, although its rude, is not harming or dangerous to other people.


~ Our Journey ~

10/27/09 - Met online

04/21/10 - Travel to Egypt to meet in person

05/08/10 - Sent I-129F

05/10/10 - VSC receives I-129F

05/11/10 - NOA1

05/13/10 - Touched

05/14/10 - Touched

05/17/10 - Received NOA1 in the mail

07/06/10 - NOA2 - Approved!!!! :)

07/12/10 - Received NOA2 in the mail

07/13/10 - Received at NVC

07/16/10 - NVC changes embassy per our request

07/19/10 - Told we are in AP @ NVC

07/30/10 - Case sent to Cairo embassy

08/05/10 - Case received at embassy

09/07/10 - Received packet 3 - FINALLY!!!

09/15-10 - 2nd trip to Egypt, returned home on 10/5/10

12/14/10 - Received interview date

01/09/11 - 3rd trip to Egypt

01/12/11 - Interview - APPROVED!!!...but AP

01/24/11 - Returned to the states without my habibi :(

04/06/11 - AP was completed!! :)

05/10/11 - Visa has been issued!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: Morocco
Timeline

I am obviously influenced by my American upbringing, but I don't believe that you can legislate against people being insensitive. Also, there's a difference between eating or drinking in front of a fasting person and gloating about it. I've spent a few ramadans fasting and I certainly didn't expect anyone to not eat or drink in front of me. Of course, the difference is that in Morocco, nearly everyone "should" be fasting - anyone not fasting is really going to stand out.

And I sincerely hope that some of those comments in the original link were fake. Atrocious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes it would be the repectful thing to do and not eat if you know someone is fasting, but the truth is, regardless of country or religion, not everyone is courteous. And laws should be in place to proctect people, not to make their life easier. That is why here in the US so many places are banning smoking in public, because its hazardous to the people around you. You want to smoke, fine, go kill yourself in your own home and car, but don't infect those around you. Eating in public during fasting, although its rude, is not harming or dangerous to other people.

truly i am not trying to be disagreeable, i just understand that it is a muslim country (not USA) and as such religion is first and foremost important above all else. i can undertand from that view anything, no matter how small, which could be a distraction to those struggling in their religion or their inner selves and are truly wanting to get back on track (because some people fall to the wayside thru the year and Ramadan is a time to remind them to get back to GOD) perhaps they would consider that a danger to their spiritual health.

the law is the law and truly they are not requiring others to fast. people eat in their homes and in restuarants (how about closing restaurants until sunset?)... they are only saying do not openly break fast in public. They are not saying you MUST fast, they are saying 'don't place temptation in path of someone who might be struggling in their life to get closer to GOD'.

Just like we dont allow women to walk around topless in public in USA (unless it is Comfest here in the city :wacko: or an outdoor festival) becasue it is a distraction and an invitation to sin... it's a morality issue, fasting during Ramadan is important, it is one of the five pillars and you might say well it's not the same thing but to someone who is might be struggling, holy month is the time to have a little freedom in their mind to worship, to focus on what is important, to be thankful for everything, and to just draw closer to GOD. so for that person it IS the same thing.

i am not doing a good job of stating it :unsure:

what's the old saying? when in Rome....

you mentioned smoking... if you were with friends and two were smokers, one who was trying to refrain and the other was smoking and not giving any concern for the struggle of the other i woud guess you be a bit offended at the callous friend for not being supportive and accommodating. but i'm just guessing ;)

as i was about to close this i realized even in USA there are areas where things just arent done yet you can drive a couple hours to where that same thing is acceptable. thats why you have little pockets of people here and there living together who have likemind and values...

so why would these people be demanding to stand out in front of others and purposely flaunt soemthing that is objectionable to another group if they are not doing so just to stir up problems? it is one thing to have a bite and you are not a muslim person or someone who is fasting, but to openly stand and flaunt at people going by just to make jack@ss of one's self is just anti-society (becasue it IS a muslim society there) and simply ridiculous.

taht would be like going to the bible-belt here and having bikini girls parade up and down in front of Baptist church on sunday... how long do you think that would last??? bikini wearing is not illegal, but it is a disruption and distraction and i can guarantee the group would be dispersed PDQ. it's a time/place issue ... why is islam fair game? no one challenges passover, or lent, and so on but people in the community respect other's religious views

think this is where we get in conflict as well, becasue we have mixture of USA and foreign country and in some countries there is NOT religous freedom, though in some areas we dont have that here in USA either! you just cant apply USA mindset to a foreign country, not vice versa. if you were from some areas of dominican republic you might be shocked coming to USA and think we are all prudes here and our laws should be changed...


if you gave your info (receipt #s, full name, etc) to anyone on VJ under the guise that they would "help" you through the immigration journey with his inside contacts (like his sister at USCIS) ... please contact OLUInquiries@dhs.gov, and go to http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact to report anything suspicious. Contact your congressman and senator's offices as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am obviously influenced by my American upbringing, but I don't believe that you can legislate against people being insensitive. Also, there's a difference between eating or drinking in front of a fasting person and gloating about it. I've spent a few ramadans fasting and I certainly didn't expect anyone to not eat or drink in front of me. Of course, the difference is that in Morocco, nearly everyone "should" be fasting - anyone not fasting is really going to stand out.

And I sincerely hope that some of those comments in the original link were fake. Atrocious.

i am missing the comments...? or were they edited out?

and definitely i agree with you on the difference... a group like this leans to being a problem but even so last year they were just dispersed. but to have the law on the books for someone who might get a little over the top... and living in USA you KNOW how some people can be with the "in your face" garbage when they want to get someone riled up or get their pimply little faces on tv for their 15min of fame like these kids are doing. :P now i'm being a meanie against them... thats one reason i hate this kind of thing, meaness begets meanness and kindness begets kindness.

it's like rude people trying to pull the hijab off women in public because THEY feel it's offensive or "oppressive" to the woman who chooses to cover... why cant people just allow other's to live and respect their decisions. we're not talking about USA here, it is a muslim country with islamic law.

besides, i dont know about y'all but i dont normally walk down the street eating my meals so for me this seems a non-issue and more like they are trying to cause problems and confrontations :blink::(

remember the "draw day" the person stirred the garbage then decided to *poof* not be part of it ... got their 15min then got out when things got hot. troublemakers never think about the consequences to others or society, they just want their drama.


if you gave your info (receipt #s, full name, etc) to anyone on VJ under the guise that they would "help" you through the immigration journey with his inside contacts (like his sister at USCIS) ... please contact OLUInquiries@dhs.gov, and go to http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact to report anything suspicious. Contact your congressman and senator's offices as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Filed: K-1 Visa Country: Egypt
Timeline

You're right, just because people do something in the USA does not mean it has to be accepted everywhere else in the world. But laws should not be in place or enforced to prevent someone from being offended or insensitive.

As for the smoking, both of my parents smoke, and I refuse to let them smoke in my house and they know how much I hate it. When I see them my father will not smoke in front of me, while my mother could care less. And it makes both my father and I upset she does that, and he's not saying "OMG how dare you smoke that cigarette in front of me," but is more upset that she is being inconsiderate of others around her. And again, second hand smoke is hazardous, eating is not.

Now if I were on a diet and not eating, and with 2 friends and they both knew I was dieting, and the one refrained from eating in front of me while the other didn't, I can say that yes I would feel bad for me friend that is suffereing and not eating because of me and my choice to diet. i would never tell anyone they can't eat in front of me or get upset for them doing it, and as Jenn said, its not like people are gloating about it.

As for people coming back to Islam around Ramadan, and that seeing people breaking the fast can cause them to fall back away from Allah again, well what about all the Christians who only fill the churches during Christmas and Easter. Should it be said then that during this time everyone should refrain from using profanity, drinking alcohol, gambeling, the list goes on and on, because a person who sees another doing these during these holy times can cause them to fall back into their sinful ways?

And as for lent, Catholics do not eat meat on friday during lent, however you can walk into any restaurant and order a steak or hamburger all year, and there are many Catholics that do it to, but you don't hear them saying "look how rude they are, they know its lent and we can't eat meat, they should show us respect and remove meat from the menu, or refrain from eating it unless they are at home." So no, not everyone repects other religions, its not just Muslims.


~ Our Journey ~

10/27/09 - Met online

04/21/10 - Travel to Egypt to meet in person

05/08/10 - Sent I-129F

05/10/10 - VSC receives I-129F

05/11/10 - NOA1

05/13/10 - Touched

05/14/10 - Touched

05/17/10 - Received NOA1 in the mail

07/06/10 - NOA2 - Approved!!!! :)

07/12/10 - Received NOA2 in the mail

07/13/10 - Received at NVC

07/16/10 - NVC changes embassy per our request

07/19/10 - Told we are in AP @ NVC

07/30/10 - Case sent to Cairo embassy

08/05/10 - Case received at embassy

09/07/10 - Received packet 3 - FINALLY!!!

09/15-10 - 2nd trip to Egypt, returned home on 10/5/10

12/14/10 - Received interview date

01/09/11 - 3rd trip to Egypt

01/12/11 - Interview - APPROVED!!!...but AP

01/24/11 - Returned to the states without my habibi :(

04/06/11 - AP was completed!! :)

05/10/11 - Visa has been issued!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
Didn't find the answer you were looking for? Ask our VJ Immigration Lawyers.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
- Back to Top -


Important Disclaimer: Please read carefully the Visajourney.com Terms of Service. If you do not agree to the Terms of Service you should not access or view any page (including this page) on VisaJourney.com. Answers and comments provided on Visajourney.com Forums are general information, and are not intended to substitute for informed professional medical, psychiatric, psychological, tax, legal, investment, accounting, or other professional advice. Visajourney.com does not endorse, and expressly disclaims liability for any product, manufacturer, distributor, service or service provider mentioned or any opinion expressed in answers or comments. VisaJourney.com does not condone immigration fraud in any way, shape or manner. VisaJourney.com recommends that if any member or user knows directly of someone involved in fraudulent or illegal activity, that they report such activity directly to the Department of Homeland Security, Immigration and Customs Enforcement. You can contact ICE via email at Immigration.Reply@dhs.gov or you can telephone ICE at 1-866-347-2423. All reported threads/posts containing reference to immigration fraud or illegal activities will be removed from this board. If you feel that you have found inappropriate content, please let us know by contacting us here with a url link to that content. Thank you.
×
×
  • Create New...