After all the whining & b*tching, look what the Dems did

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I think a bigger fear than a suitcase nuke is the suicide bomber. As a man I know who is on the bomb squad has said, it's not a case of if, but a case of when. There really is no defense against this.

As I say, if you've ever worked in a big city where you've had to use mass transit - train or subway etc to get to or from the office. you know that if something were to happen, that you would be totally f*cked.

And it doesn't take much to cause a sizeable explosion - homemade explosives in a backpack. Death, destruction, mass panic - and you don't need specialized equipment or a lot of money to do it.

It's quite frightening really - but there's nothing that anyone can really do to prevent it.

In London just after 7/7, that poor ####### was shot in the head 7 times on the subway by the police over a case of mistaken identity. Noone was convicted for that. Scandalous that you can murder someone in broad daylight, in front of witnesses and get off scot free!

[ready4ONE 5,400]

Hmm...

Thought the Republicans wanted the Patriot Act. The Dems wanted to have bipartisan compromise. Whereas, the Republicans don't want bipartisanship. They want the absolute agreement. This serves as an example that the Dems want to work with the Reps. Lets see if the Rep will do the same.

In ** think, even working with them is cause for criticism. Any excuse to bash however feeble and all that rot...

[Scott & Lai 12]

We seemed to manage OK before 9/11. What changed?

9/11 happened. It was a wake-up call

[Ali G. 37]

America would recover and then do what needed to be done. There would be a lot of civil liberty types pissed of and profiling would become more prominent. We would surely lose some of our freedom that anything goes. Restrictions would be implemented. It took 9/11 to beef up airline security and a future disaster will do the same. I'm with you, I'd rather do my damndest to prevent it in the first place.

It all depends on the scenario. A nuke in NYC killing 3 million, injuring another 10 million, followed by millions more dying due to radiation poisoning and so on would be a massive blow. We're still suffering from 9/11, which would be nothing in comparison. Anything of that magnitude would take be 20 to 30 years to recover and change America for ever. Plus we'd be in a world war. While the scenario is unthinkable, it is certainly probable.

We absolutely must prevent such a tragedy at any cost.

PS I may be your only option to a radiation free country, so be nice to me..

[spookyturtle 9,466]

As I say, if you've ever worked in a big city where you've had to use mass transit - train or subway etc to get to or from the office. you know that if something were to happen, that you would be totally f*cked.

And it doesn't take much to cause a sizeable explosion - homemade explosives in a backpack. Death, destruction, mass panic - and you don't need specialized equipment or a lot of money to do it.

It's quite frightening really - but there's nothing that anyone can really do to prevent it.

In London just after 7/7, that poor ####### was shot in the head 7 times on the subway by the police over a case of mistaken identity. Noone was convicted for that. Scandalous that you can murder someone in broad daylight, in front of witnesses and get off scot free!

It doesn't even have to be a big device. It doesn't have to kill thousands of people. All it has to do is happen and people will panic. Ask the Israelis' what it's like. It's been a part of their daily lives for quite a long time. We've never had to live with that. And the day may come when the authorities will err on the side of caution, as did the police in London. A tragedy for sure, but innocent people are killed by police from time to time without any threat of terrorism being involved. We would surely lose some of our extravagant freedoms.

[Ali G. 37]

It's quite frightening really - but there's nothing that anyone can really do to prevent it.

Not talking about some little rogue attack, like a subway attack.

I am talking about WMD scale attack. That is what we need to prevent and look out for.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

It all depends on the scenario. A nuke in NYC killing 3 million, injuring another 10 million, followed by millions more dying due to radiation poisoning and so on would be a massive blow. We're still suffering from 9/11, which would be nothing in comparison. Anything of that magnitude would take be 20 to 30 years to recover and change America for ever. Plus we'd be in a world war. While the scenario is unthinkable, it is certainly probable.

We absolutely must prevent such a tragedy at any cost.

PS I may be your only option to a radiation free country, so be nice to me..

I don't think you're going to see a suitcase nuke kill 3 million people or injure 10 million. You'd need a direct hit with a multi-megaton warhead to do that kind of damage, but the numbers aren't the issue. Terror is mental. It's fear. Just the fact that it happened would be devastating. Kill 100 people in three or four cities at the same time and see what would happen. It doesn't have to be a doomsday scenario at all.

[William33 110]

As I say, if you've ever worked in a big city where you've had to use mass transit - train or subway etc to get to or from the office. you know that if something were to happen, that you would be totally f*cked.

And it doesn't take much to cause a sizeable explosion - homemade explosives in a backpack. Death, destruction, mass panic - and you don't need specialized equipment or a lot of money to do it.

It's quite frightening really - but there's nothing that anyone can really do to prevent it.

In London just after 7/7, that poor ####### was shot in the head 7 times on the subway by the police over a case of mistaken identity. Noone was convicted for that. Scandalous that you can murder someone in broad daylight, in front of witnesses and get off scot free!

With all due respect, you are offering an "apples to oranges" comparison. The likely incidence of terrorism in the USA is much more likely.

[Ali G. 37]

It doesn't even have to be a big device. It doesn't have to kill thousands of people. All it has to do is happen and people will panic. Ask the Israelis' what it's like. It's been a part of their daily lives for quite a long time. We've never had to live with that. And the day may come when the authorities will err on the side of caution, as did the police in London. A tragedy for sure, but innocent people are killed by police from time to time without any threat of terrorism being involved. We would surely lose some of our extravagant freedoms.

Spot on there. It's the psychological factor that is the worst impact.

Can you imagine the impact of a nuke on US soil killing a hundred thousand Americans in one single go?

I don't think you're going to see a suitcase nuke kill 3 million people or injure 10 million. You'd need a direct hit with a multi-megaton warhead to do that kind of damage, but the numbers aren't the issue. Terror is mental. It's fear. Just the fact that it happened would be devastating. Kill 100 people in three or four cities at the same time and see what would happen. It doesn't have to be a doomsday scenario at all.

A few hundred thousand in a city as dense as NYC would definitely be probable. Watch day after disaster, were experts discuss this stuff. It's definitely eyebrow raising to see and hear.

Edited February 25, 2010 by Booyah

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

With all due respect, you are offering an "apples to oranges" comparison. The likely incidence of terrorism in the USA is much more likely.

How so? I was speaking in general - the same kind of thing that happened in London or Madrid, could happen in any metropolitan area with mass transit. Take one of the rush hour NJ transit train services to NYC - those things are packed. Noone checks bags or backpacks before you get on, it just isn't feasible.

Much cheaper to blow up a crowded train or subway - and cause the same effect. The city closes for a day, business and commerce are disrupted. Story is all over the national news. That is the reality of terrorism - not someone importing suitcase nukes into the country.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

Spot on there. It's the psychological factor that is the worst impact.

Can you imagine the impact of a nuke on US soil killing millions in one single go?

I know someone on the bomb squad who has studied terrorism abroad and has had special learning and training sessions in Israel. Multiple coordinated small attacks would have the desired effect. And I won't even go into the various scenarios that he studied.

[Ali G. 37]

How so? I was speaking in general - the same kind of thing that happened in London or Madrid, could happen in any metropolitan area with mass transit. Take one of the rush hour NJ transit train services to NYC - those things are packed. Noone checks bags or backpacks before you get on, it just isn't feasible.

Much cheaper to blow up a crowded train or subway - and cause the same effect. The city closes for a day, business and commerce are disrupted. Story is all over the national news. That is the reality of terrorism - not someone importing suitcase nukes into the country.

Well the experts you see and read about strongly disagree with this statement. They're actually worried Al Qaeda is planning something big, hence no attempt on US soil since 9/11. Basically laying low and ready to strike when the time is right. This is what is undetectable, until it's too late.

Edited February 25, 2010 by Booyah

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I know someone on the bomb squad who has studied terrorism abroad and has had special learning and training sessions in Israel. Multiple coordinated small attacks would have the desired effect. And I won't even go into the various scenarios that he studied.

If you have nutters ready to blow themselves up, all they'd need to do is coordinate attacks at the major transit stations - Grand Central, Port Authority, Penn Station. Even the false alarms cause huge disruption.

Well the experts you see and read about strongly disagree with this statement. They're actually worried Al Qaeda is planning something big, hence no attempt on US soil since 9/11. Basically laying low and ready to strike when the time is right. This is what is undetectable, until it's too late.

Sensationalist TV shows always deal in the worst case scenario. It doesn't mean it is the most likely.

[Ali G. 37]

I know someone on the bomb squad who has studied terrorism abroad and has had special learning and training sessions in Israel. Multiple coordinated small attacks would have the desired effect. And I won't even go into the various scenarios that he studied.

Just look at the hit Israel orchestrated. There are enough nations out there that hate us, that could aid in WMD scale attack against us.

I'd rather be prepared than be proven right on this one.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

If you have nutters ready to blow themselves up, all they'd need to do is coordinate attacks at the major transit stations - Grand Central, Port Authority, Penn Station. Even the false alarms cause huge disruption.

Exactly. And much easier to do than a nuclear or biological attack.