Fort Hood's 9/11

[_Simpson_ 250]

Im with you Joe.. lets call a spade a spade... SO from now on please do not refer to what has happened in Iraq as a "War"... its and invasion, occupation, degradation.. Lets do call a spade a spade.. like an administration that lied LIED about this invasion and called it a war... like the over 4,000 AMERICAN military DEAD from what was called a "WAR" .. a spade is a spade...

What ever anyone says, whatever accusations anyone makes.. what happened was a guy became crazy he shot people. Thats not justifiable or honorable. And its just plain wrong and he just lost it.. Perhaps after hearing all the Degrading, dehumanizing conditions that our Military has done all in the name of 'War" he lost it. maybe he lost himself.. it has nothing to do with Islam,, his faith ... And by the way I dont beleive in any term "Islamic Terrorist" there are people who want to achieve thier power, political needs, who use what ever tools they have to manipulate and create thier own agendas. And they happen to use the power of a faith that people would die for as a tool to achieve their own desires. So please just read a little.and get yourself out of the box... of ignorance...

I don't think there is any justification for what he did. What is at discussion here is whether or not he did what he did because of personal or ideological reasons. If it was for ideological reasons, he was indeed by definition a terrorist. Whether or not that is the case and whether or not islam is the catalyst is yet to be determined. All we know at this point is that a man shot a lot of rounds and hit 30+ people, killing 11. Despicable, no matter what label you wish to afix after his name.

Rob is right; nothing justifies Hasan's actions. I didn't agree with President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq but when my number was called I went & served with honor... that's what a soldier does. Shooting dozens of innocent people & killing 13 is murder, plain & simple.

No no no dont assume hes a murderer yet, we just have witnesses saying he is, wait until its proven in a court of law.

Come on Simpson, you're pulling a Joe now. You know damn well what each of us meant by waiting for proof. There are facts that he shot 31 people, killing 11. There are ZERO facts that he was an Islamic Terrorist. See the difference?

No Rob I am pulling a Shelby by having fun with the fact that you all want to hang your hat on "well we dont know for sure" even though its pretty obvious. I suppose when it comes to that point that there is enough info for you naive ones that you will still pat yourself on the backs because you didnt jump to conclusions, you took the high road.

Edited November 10, 2009 by _Simpson_

[_Simpson_ 250]

Nice try, but Hasan's actions & guilt are a slam dunk. His motives are the part that needs to be sorted out. Please do not try to confuse the two.

yeah I know, I was poking fun at the "well we dont know for sure" high road people.

[nowhereman 1]

Im with you Joe.. lets call a spade a spade... SO from now on please do not refer to what has happened in Iraq as a "War"... its and invasion, occupation, degradation.. Lets do call a spade a spade.. like an administration that lied LIED about this invasion and called it a war... like the over 4,000 AMERICAN military DEAD from what was called a "WAR" .. a spade is a spade...

What ever anyone says, whatever accusations anyone makes.. what happened was a guy became crazy he shot people. Thats not justifiable or honorable. And its just plain wrong and he just lost it.. Perhaps after hearing all the Degrading, dehumanizing conditions that our Military has done all in the name of 'War" he lost it. maybe he lost himself.. it has nothing to do with Islam,, his faith ... And by the way I dont beleive in any term "Islamic Terrorist" there are people who want to achieve thier power, political needs, who use what ever tools they have to manipulate and create thier own agendas. And they happen to use the power of a faith that people would die for as a tool to achieve their own desires. So please just read a little.and get yourself out of the box... of ignorance...

I don't think there is any justification for what he did. What is at discussion here is whether or not he did what he did because of personal or ideological reasons. If it was for ideological reasons, he was indeed by definition a terrorist. Whether or not that is the case and whether or not islam is the catalyst is yet to be determined. All we know at this point is that a man shot a lot of rounds and hit 30+ people, killing 11. Despicable, no matter what label you wish to afix after his name.

Rob is right; nothing justifies Hasan's actions. I didn't agree with President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq but when my number was called I went & served with honor... that's what a soldier does. Shooting dozens of innocent people & killing 13 is murder, plain & simple.

No no no dont assume hes a murderer yet, we just have witnesses saying he is, wait until its proven in a court of law.

Come on Simpson, you're pulling a Joe now. You know damn well what each of us meant by waiting for proof. There are facts that he shot 31 people, killing 11. There are ZERO facts that he was an Islamic Terrorist. See the difference?

No Rob I am pulling a Shelby by having fun with the fact that you all want to hang your hat on "well we dont know for sure" even though its pretty obvious. I suppose when it comes to that point that there is enough info for you naive ones that you will still pat yourself on the backs because you didnt jump to conclusions, you took the high road.

OK so if a Muslim kills someone you can automatically assume he's a terrorist? I'm guessing you're a big fan of Joe McCarthy too, since he applied the exact same "logic" that you're using. Edited November 10, 2009 by nowhereman

[Peikko 1,575]

Nice try, but Hasan's actions & guilt are a slam dunk. His motives are the part that needs to be sorted out. Please do not try to confuse the two.

yeah I know, I was poking fun at the "well we dont know for sure" high road people.

It's not a high road, it's not putting the cart before the horse. Try it some time, you might like it

[_Simpson_ 250]

Im with you Joe.. lets call a spade a spade... SO from now on please do not refer to what has happened in Iraq as a "War"... its and invasion, occupation, degradation.. Lets do call a spade a spade.. like an administration that lied LIED about this invasion and called it a war... like the over 4,000 AMERICAN military DEAD from what was called a "WAR" .. a spade is a spade...

What ever anyone says, whatever accusations anyone makes.. what happened was a guy became crazy he shot people. Thats not justifiable or honorable. And its just plain wrong and he just lost it.. Perhaps after hearing all the Degrading, dehumanizing conditions that our Military has done all in the name of 'War" he lost it. maybe he lost himself.. it has nothing to do with Islam,, his faith ... And by the way I dont beleive in any term "Islamic Terrorist" there are people who want to achieve thier power, political needs, who use what ever tools they have to manipulate and create thier own agendas. And they happen to use the power of a faith that people would die for as a tool to achieve their own desires. So please just read a little.and get yourself out of the box... of ignorance...

I don't think there is any justification for what he did. What is at discussion here is whether or not he did what he did because of personal or ideological reasons. If it was for ideological reasons, he was indeed by definition a terrorist. Whether or not that is the case and whether or not islam is the catalyst is yet to be determined. All we know at this point is that a man shot a lot of rounds and hit 30+ people, killing 11. Despicable, no matter what label you wish to afix after his name.

Rob is right; nothing justifies Hasan's actions. I didn't agree with President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq but when my number was called I went & served with honor... that's what a soldier does. Shooting dozens of innocent people & killing 13 is murder, plain & simple.

No no no dont assume hes a murderer yet, we just have witnesses saying he is, wait until its proven in a court of law.

Come on Simpson, you're pulling a Joe now. You know damn well what each of us meant by waiting for proof. There are facts that he shot 31 people, killing 11. There are ZERO facts that he was an Islamic Terrorist. See the difference?

No Rob I am pulling a Shelby by having fun with the fact that you all want to hang your hat on "well we dont know for sure" even though its pretty obvious. I suppose when it comes to that point that there is enough info for you naive ones that you will still pat yourself on the backs because you didnt jump to conclusions, you took the high road.

OK so if a Muslim kills someone you can automatically assume he's a terrorist? I'm guessing you're a big fan of Joe McCarthy too, since he applied the exact same "logic" that you're using.

Just because hes a muslim? when did I say that?, he shouted "Allahu Akbar" (which was also shouted as flight 93 was driven into the ground on 9/11)as he shot american soldiers, he attended a mosque with a radical leader and where two 9/11 hijackers attended, he tried contacting a individual that was connected to Al-Qaeda, and then there was his rants. Sure lets find out something a little more concrete before we go to court but why the need do you people have to get on people who call this guy a terrorist?

[Peikko 1,575]

Facts not supposition, simple. Where do you get your 'facts' from Simpson?

[nowhereman 1]

Im with you Joe.. lets call a spade a spade... SO from now on please do not refer to what has happened in Iraq as a "War"... its and invasion, occupation, degradation.. Lets do call a spade a spade.. like an administration that lied LIED about this invasion and called it a war... like the over 4,000 AMERICAN military DEAD from what was called a "WAR" .. a spade is a spade...

What ever anyone says, whatever accusations anyone makes.. what happened was a guy became crazy he shot people. Thats not justifiable or honorable. And its just plain wrong and he just lost it.. Perhaps after hearing all the Degrading, dehumanizing conditions that our Military has done all in the name of 'War" he lost it. maybe he lost himself.. it has nothing to do with Islam,, his faith ... And by the way I dont beleive in any term "Islamic Terrorist" there are people who want to achieve thier power, political needs, who use what ever tools they have to manipulate and create thier own agendas. And they happen to use the power of a faith that people would die for as a tool to achieve their own desires. So please just read a little.and get yourself out of the box... of ignorance...

I don't think there is any justification for what he did. What is at discussion here is whether or not he did what he did because of personal or ideological reasons. If it was for ideological reasons, he was indeed by definition a terrorist. Whether or not that is the case and whether or not islam is the catalyst is yet to be determined. All we know at this point is that a man shot a lot of rounds and hit 30+ people, killing 11. Despicable, no matter what label you wish to afix after his name.

Rob is right; nothing justifies Hasan's actions. I didn't agree with President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq but when my number was called I went & served with honor... that's what a soldier does. Shooting dozens of innocent people & killing 13 is murder, plain & simple.

No no no dont assume hes a murderer yet, we just have witnesses saying he is, wait until its proven in a court of law.

Come on Simpson, you're pulling a Joe now. You know damn well what each of us meant by waiting for proof. There are facts that he shot 31 people, killing 11. There are ZERO facts that he was an Islamic Terrorist. See the difference?

No Rob I am pulling a Shelby by having fun with the fact that you all want to hang your hat on "well we dont know for sure" even though its pretty obvious. I suppose when it comes to that point that there is enough info for you naive ones that you will still pat yourself on the backs because you didnt jump to conclusions, you took the high road.

OK so if a Muslim kills someone you can automatically assume he's a terrorist? I'm guessing you're a big fan of Joe McCarthy too, since he applied the exact same "logic" that you're using.

Just because hes a muslim? when did I say that?, he shouted "Allahu Akbar" (which was also shouted as flight 93 was driven into the ground on 9/11)as he shot american soldiers, he attended a mosque with a radical leader and where two 9/11 hijackers attended, he tried contacting a individual that was connected to Al-Qaeda, and then there was his rants. Sure lets find out something a little more concrete before we go to court but why the need do you people have to get on people who call this guy a terrorist?

Based on what I know it seems to me that Major Hasan's religious beliefs were a factor, but my point is that there are a lot of people trying to connect Hasan's actions with Muslims as a whole & that is the part that concerns me. Moreover you have individuals (e.g. Joe & Ana) suggesting that anyone who wants to reserve judgement until all of the facts are in are terrorist sympathizers, even lumping me into that group knowing full well I am also a service member who served in Iraq (and then making it worse by saying my comments were BS). Although your comments may not have been as offensive or inappropriate as Joe's, you are still "poking fun" at anyone who simply wants to wait until they know more about what motivated Major Hasan to kill innocent people.

It's easy to react to something with fear & ignorance (not pointing a finger at you, but in general), but a whole lot harder to want to know the truth. That's all that I am after & I hope that when the dust settles Hasan pays for what he did, regardless of what his motives were.

[_Simpson_ 250]

Im with you Joe.. lets call a spade a spade... SO from now on please do not refer to what has happened in Iraq as a "War"... its and invasion, occupation, degradation.. Lets do call a spade a spade.. like an administration that lied LIED about this invasion and called it a war... like the over 4,000 AMERICAN military DEAD from what was called a "WAR" .. a spade is a spade...

What ever anyone says, whatever accusations anyone makes.. what happened was a guy became crazy he shot people. Thats not justifiable or honorable. And its just plain wrong and he just lost it.. Perhaps after hearing all the Degrading, dehumanizing conditions that our Military has done all in the name of 'War" he lost it. maybe he lost himself.. it has nothing to do with Islam,, his faith ... And by the way I dont beleive in any term "Islamic Terrorist" there are people who want to achieve thier power, political needs, who use what ever tools they have to manipulate and create thier own agendas. And they happen to use the power of a faith that people would die for as a tool to achieve their own desires. So please just read a little.and get yourself out of the box... of ignorance...

I don't think there is any justification for what he did. What is at discussion here is whether or not he did what he did because of personal or ideological reasons. If it was for ideological reasons, he was indeed by definition a terrorist. Whether or not that is the case and whether or not islam is the catalyst is yet to be determined. All we know at this point is that a man shot a lot of rounds and hit 30+ people, killing 11. Despicable, no matter what label you wish to afix after his name.

Rob is right; nothing justifies Hasan's actions. I didn't agree with President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq but when my number was called I went & served with honor... that's what a soldier does. Shooting dozens of innocent people & killing 13 is murder, plain & simple.

No no no dont assume hes a murderer yet, we just have witnesses saying he is, wait until its proven in a court of law.

Come on Simpson, you're pulling a Joe now. You know damn well what each of us meant by waiting for proof. There are facts that he shot 31 people, killing 11. There are ZERO facts that he was an Islamic Terrorist. See the difference?

No Rob I am pulling a Shelby by having fun with the fact that you all want to hang your hat on "well we dont know for sure" even though its pretty obvious. I suppose when it comes to that point that there is enough info for you naive ones that you will still pat yourself on the backs because you didnt jump to conclusions, you took the high road.

OK so if a Muslim kills someone you can automatically assume he's a terrorist? I'm guessing you're a big fan of Joe McCarthy too, since he applied the exact same "logic" that you're using.

Just because hes a muslim? when did I say that?, he shouted "Allahu Akbar" (which was also shouted as flight 93 was driven into the ground on 9/11)as he shot american soldiers, he attended a mosque with a radical leader and where two 9/11 hijackers attended, he tried contacting a individual that was connected to Al-Qaeda, and then there was his rants. Sure lets find out something a little more concrete before we go to court but why the need do you people have to get on people who call this guy a terrorist?

Based on what I know it seems to me that Major Hasan's religious beliefs were a factor, but my point is that there are a lot of people trying to connect Hasan's actions with Muslims as a whole & that is the part that concerns me. Moreover you have individuals (e.g. Joe & Ana) suggesting that anyone who wants to reserve judgement until all of the facts are in are terrorist sympathizers, even lumping me into that group knowing full well I am also a service member who served in Iraq (and then making it worse by saying my comments were BS). Although your comments may not have been as offensive or inappropriate as Joe's, you are still "poking fun" at anyone who simply wants to wait until they know more about what motivated Major Hasan to kill innocent people.

It's easy to react to something with fear & ignorance (not pointing a finger at you, but in general), but a whole lot harder to want to know the truth. That's all that I am after & I hope that when the dust settles Hasan pays for what he did, regardless of what his motives were.

I dont think there is a lot of people trying to associate this person with muslims as a whole, actually I have seen the exact opposite, people are going beyond the call of duty and its getting annoying, we dont need to have this crammed down our throat, we know.

To say I am poking fun at anyone who simply wants to wait until they know more about the motivation is not a correct assessment of what happened here. People are getting on my case for what they call "jumping the gun" and I call "pointing out the obvious." I was trying to prove a point and it wasnt going far so I started having fun with it.

I dont have a issue with people who dont want to call Hasan a terrorist, I have a issue with people who want to get on my case or anybody else's for calling him a terrorist.

Edited November 11, 2009 by _Simpson_

[alienlovechild 75]

Moreover you have individuals (e.g. Joe & Ana) suggesting that anyone who wants to reserve judgement until all of the facts are in are terrorist sympathizers, even lumping me into that group knowing full well I am also a service member who served in Iraq (and then making it worse by saying my comments were BS). Although your comments may not have been as offensive or inappropriate as Joe's, you are still "poking fun" at anyone who simply wants to wait until they know more about what motivated Major Hasan to kill innocent people.

It's easy to react to something with fear & ignorance (not pointing a finger at you, but in general), but a whole lot harder to want to know the truth. That's all that I am after & I hope that when the dust settles Hasan pays for what he did, regardless of what his motives were.

Unfortunately, it appears some other officers in his chain-of-command reserved judgment when this officer should have been discharged and now there's now platoon's worth of dead and injured soldiers. Are soldiers held responsible for the actions of subordinates? Yes, but are they always punished, no. The question is was this foreseeable? Maybe, but not to this extent.

[nowhereman 1]

Moreover you have individuals (e.g. Joe & Ana) suggesting that anyone who wants to reserve judgement until all of the facts are in are terrorist sympathizers, even lumping me into that group knowing full well I am also a service member who served in Iraq (and then making it worse by saying my comments were BS). Although your comments may not have been as offensive or inappropriate as Joe's, you are still "poking fun" at anyone who simply wants to wait until they know more about what motivated Major Hasan to kill innocent people.

It's easy to react to something with fear & ignorance (not pointing a finger at you, but in general), but a whole lot harder to want to know the truth. That's all that I am after & I hope that when the dust settles Hasan pays for what he did, regardless of what his motives were.

Unfortunately, it appears some other officers in his chain-of-command reserved judgment when this officer should have been discharged and now there's now platoon's worth of dead and injured soldiers. Are soldiers held responsible for the actions of subordinates? Yes, but are they always punished, no. The question is was this foreseeable? Maybe, but not to this extent.

If you recall I made a similar remark earlier (i.e. about the leadership potentially missing or worse yet ignoring the warning signs). We're in agreement here ALC.

As for Simpson I hear you & if the facts clearly point to Hasan as being a terrorist then I will join you in calling him a terrorist. IMO he's a murderer at this point & we'll wait to see about his motives.

[Peikko 1,575]

Im with you Joe.. lets call a spade a spade... SO from now on please do not refer to what has happened in Iraq as a "War"... its and invasion, occupation, degradation.. Lets do call a spade a spade.. like an administration that lied LIED about this invasion and called it a war... like the over 4,000 AMERICAN military DEAD from what was called a "WAR" .. a spade is a spade...

What ever anyone says, whatever accusations anyone makes.. what happened was a guy became crazy he shot people. Thats not justifiable or honorable. And its just plain wrong and he just lost it.. Perhaps after hearing all the Degrading, dehumanizing conditions that our Military has done all in the name of 'War" he lost it. maybe he lost himself.. it has nothing to do with Islam,, his faith ... And by the way I dont beleive in any term "Islamic Terrorist" there are people who want to achieve thier power, political needs, who use what ever tools they have to manipulate and create thier own agendas. And they happen to use the power of a faith that people would die for as a tool to achieve their own desires. So please just read a little.and get yourself out of the box... of ignorance...

I don't think there is any justification for what he did. What is at discussion here is whether or not he did what he did because of personal or ideological reasons. If it was for ideological reasons, he was indeed by definition a terrorist. Whether or not that is the case and whether or not islam is the catalyst is yet to be determined. All we know at this point is that a man shot a lot of rounds and hit 30+ people, killing 11. Despicable, no matter what label you wish to afix after his name.

Rob is right; nothing justifies Hasan's actions. I didn't agree with President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq but when my number was called I went & served with honor... that's what a soldier does. Shooting dozens of innocent people & killing 13 is murder, plain & simple.

No no no dont assume hes a murderer yet, we just have witnesses saying he is, wait until its proven in a court of law.

Come on Simpson, you're pulling a Joe now. You know damn well what each of us meant by waiting for proof. There are facts that he shot 31 people, killing 11. There are ZERO facts that he was an Islamic Terrorist. See the difference?

No Rob I am pulling a Shelby by having fun with the fact that you all want to hang your hat on "well we dont know for sure" even though its pretty obvious. I suppose when it comes to that point that there is enough info for you naive ones that you will still pat yourself on the backs because you didnt jump to conclusions, you took the high road.

OK so if a Muslim kills someone you can automatically assume he's a terrorist? I'm guessing you're a big fan of Joe McCarthy too, since he applied the exact same "logic" that you're using.

Just because hes a muslim? when did I say that?, he shouted "Allahu Akbar" (which was also shouted as flight 93 was driven into the ground on 9/11)as he shot american soldiers, he attended a mosque with a radical leader and where two 9/11 hijackers attended, he tried contacting a individual that was connected to Al-Qaeda, and then there was his rants. Sure lets find out something a little more concrete before we go to court but why the need do you people have to get on people who call this guy a terrorist?

Based on what I know it seems to me that Major Hasan's religious beliefs were a factor, but my point is that there are a lot of people trying to connect Hasan's actions with Muslims as a whole & that is the part that concerns me. Moreover you have individuals (e.g. Joe & Ana) suggesting that anyone who wants to reserve judgement until all of the facts are in are terrorist sympathizers, even lumping me into that group knowing full well I am also a service member who served in Iraq (and then making it worse by saying my comments were BS). Although your comments may not have been as offensive or inappropriate as Joe's, you are still "poking fun" at anyone who simply wants to wait until they know more about what motivated Major Hasan to kill innocent people.

It's easy to react to something with fear & ignorance (not pointing a finger at you, but in general), but a whole lot harder to want to know the truth. That's all that I am after & I hope that when the dust settles Hasan pays for what he did, regardless of what his motives were.

I dont think there is a lot of people trying to associate this person with muslims as a whole, actually I have seen the exact opposite, people are going beyond the call of duty and its getting annoying, we dont need to have this crammed down our throat, we know.

To say I am poking fun at anyone who simply wants to wait until they know more about the motivation is not a correct assessment of what happened here. People are getting on my case for what they call "jumping the gun" and I call "pointing out the obvious." I was trying to prove a point and it wasnt going far so I started having fun with it.

I dont have a issue with people who dont want to call Hasan a terrorist, I have a issue with people who want to get on my case or anybody else's for calling him a terrorist.

On an individual basis, I don't give a ####### who wants to call this guy a terrorist based on speculation derived from the media.  I do however take issue with media pundits who do so in order to score cheap political points. The OP's article was what I was objecting to because it does exactly that in spades.  That was the whole thrust of my argument, not what you personally can and can't conclude based on the scant facts available to the general public.  

Tell me this one thing.  In your opinion, was the OP article an example of a well researched, objective piece?

[_Simpson_ 250]

On an individual basis, I don't give a ####### who wants to call this guy a terrorist based on speculation derived from the media.  I do however take issue with media pundits who do so in order to score cheap political points. The OP's article was what I was objecting to because it does exactly that in spades.  That was the whole thrust of my argument, not what you personally can and can't conclude based on the scant facts available to the general public.  

Tell me this one thing.  In your opinion, was the OP article an example of a well researched, objective piece?

If the only reason for making such a assumption was to score cheap political points then I would have a issue with it, but as you know I think that there is some valid points to what some of these pundits are saying.

Tell me this one thing. In your opinion, was the OP article an example of a well researched, objective piece?

I agree, this was not a well researched, objective piece. Example, like when it makes the assumption that once Muslim organizations make public statements objecting to this they go laughing behind the scenes(I do believe that some organizations are like that but not a lot) or that Obama needs to step up to the plate and call him a terrorist, he is the president and doesnt have that luxury of pointing out the obvious. I think Obama has handled this situation correctly. I do however think the article brought up some good points, like how PC might of had something to do with him not coming under more scrutiny.

Facts not supposition, simple. Where do you get your 'facts' from Simpson?

I took a bunch of facts and came to a reasonable conclusion.

Edited November 11, 2009 by _Simpson_

[Peikko 1,575]

On an individual basis, I don't give a ####### who wants to call this guy a terrorist based on speculation derived from the media. I do however take issue with media pundits who do so in order to score cheap political points. The OP's article was what I was objecting to because it does exactly that in spades. That was the whole thrust of my argument, not what you personally can and can't conclude based on the scant facts available to the general public.

Tell me this one thing. In your opinion, was the OP article an example of a well researched, objective piece?

If the only reason for making such a assumption was to score cheap political points then I would have a issue with it, but as you know I think that there is some valid points to what some of these pundits are saying.

Tell me this one thing. In your opinion, was the OP article an example of a well researched, objective piece?

I agree, this was not a well researched, objective piece. Example, like when it makes the assumption that once Muslim organizations make public statements objecting to this they go laughing behind the scenes(I do believe that some organizations are like that but not a lot) or that Obama needs to step up to the plate and call him a terrorist, he is the president and doesnt have that luxury of pointing out the obvious. I think Obama has handled this situation correctly. I do however think the article brought up some good points, like how PC might of had something to do with him not coming under more scrutiny.

Facts not supposition, simple. Where do you get your 'facts' from Simpson?

I took a bunch of facts and came to a reasonable conclusion.

How, based on what?

From the OP:

..."But Hasan isn’t the sole guilty party. The US Army’s unforgivable political correctness is also to blame for the casualties at Ft. Hood.

Given the myriad warning signs, it’s appalling that no action was taken against a man apparently known to praise suicide bombers and openly damn US policy. But no officer in his chain of command, either at Walter Reed Army Medical Center or at Ft. Hood, had the guts to take meaningful action against a dysfunctional soldier and an incompetent doctor."

What part of that is based on fact and evidence? I see a lot of invective derived from the original premise (that this was a known terrorist who one could forsee was going to commit a murderous terrorist act) but no evidence of army policy that would lead one to believe that the army is ham strung by the strictures of political correctness. When, exactly did the army become so hung up on political correctness? What policies are in place that prevents the army from taking 'meaningful' action in cases where it is 'obvious' that there is a problem with a 'dysfunctional soldier'? I don't see any evidence of this. I don't remember reading one article prior to this incident that suggested the army was struggling with these problems and that such an incident was bound to happen.

This appalling opinion piece had one aim, that of painting the current president as unfit to call himself an American, and someone under whom even the army has gone to the dogs and where those wretched muslims will win the war by default because America is too pc to deny a us muslim their rights as a citizen. The author of this is:

For the first time since I joined the Army in 1976, I’m ashamed of its dereliction of duty. The chain of command protected a budding terrorist who was waving one red flag after another. Because it was safer for careers than doing something about him.

Get ready for the apologias. We’ve already heard from the terrorist’s family that "he’s a good American." In their world, maybe he is.

But when do we, the American public, knock off the PC nonsense?

A disgruntled Muslim soldier murdered his officers way back in 2003, in Kuwait, on the eve of Operation Iraqi Freedom. Recently? An American mullah shoots it out with the feds in Detroit. A Muslim fanatic attacks an Arkansas recruiting station. A Muslim media owner, after playing the peace card, beheads his wife. A Muslim father runs over his daughter because she’s becoming too Westernized.

Muslim terrorist wannabes are busted again and again. And we’re assured that "Islam’s a religion of peace."

This is appalling, wretched and inciteful nonsense. Who knew?

[Ban Hammer 14,569]

Fort Hood Service: Meaning Behind the Memorial

The memorial service that honored the 13 killed in the shooting rampage at Fort Hood invoked many somber military traditions. Here, the meaning behind some of the most common.

Taps

The lone bugle call has been played since the Civil War to musically mourn the fallen. The composer, Union Army Brigadier General Daniel Butterfield wrote it in 1862 to replace the earlier "Extinguished Lights Out," which he thought too formal. The tune became known as "Taps" because the 24 notes can be tapped on a drum when there is no bugler. Although the call originated with the Northern army, the tradition spread to camps in the north and south, and has become the tradition for the armed forces ever since.

Rifle volley

Firing three shots originated from the battlefield. Once the dead were removed, a volley of three shots would be fired to signal that the battle could continue. That's different from a 21-gun salute, which is generally reserved for heads of state.

Boots on display

President Obama spoke in front of the grim reminders of the deceased men and women: Each of the 13 was remembered with a photo, boots, and a helmet atop an inverted gun. According to army lore, helmet and ID tags represent the fallen soldier. The rifle pointed toward the ground notes a break in action to pay tribute to the dead. The combat boots symbolize the soldier's last march.

Commander-in-chief coin

After the president spoke, he and the first lady paid their respects. The president left a commander-in-chief coin for each of the fallen. This is a tradition among military officers but considered the highest honor coming from the commander in chief.

The roll call of the dead — the name is called but there is no response — and a final salute are also invoked to bring some closure for the grieving families. As Obama said in his tribute to the 13 lost on the base, not the battlefield, "They were killed here on American soil ... It's the fact that makes the tragedy ever more painful, even more incomprehensible."

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[~PalmTreeGurl~ 154]

Thanks for posting that info Charles. Hopefully in the midst of all the VJ arguing over who is right or wrong, we all might stop and remember the ones who just died and the families left behind.

Edited November 11, 2009 by ~PalmTreeGurl~