Evidence of ongoing relationship for packet 3 - simple question

[paul p 0]

All;

This is a bit obvious but want to triple check.

When we wrote a cover letter for the I-134F detailing our relatiionship we wrote it on behalf of the petitioner (i.e. met my fiance from England on this date, he came over here on this date, this photo is of me and my fiance at the pool etc.).

For packet 3 we need to do the same but more recent to now. I assume we switch the emphasis over so that it from the beneficiaries viewpoin (My fiance from the USA can over on this date, and this is my fiancee and me at my parents house in England.

Do you agree?

Paul

[baron555 934]

All;

This is a bit obvious but want to triple check.

When we wrote a cover letter for the I-134F detailing our relatiionship we wrote it on behalf of the petitioner (i.e. met my fiance from England on this date, he came over here on this date, this photo is of me and my fiance at the pool etc.).

For packet 3 we need to do the same but more recent to now. I assume we switch the emphasis over so that it from the beneficiaries viewpoin (My fiance from the USA can over on this date, and this is my fiancee and me at my parents house in England.

Do you agree?

Paul

Sure but you'll want more to prove you have an ongoing relationship, not just a one time visit. You need to show you two are involved in a relationship, from both perspectives.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

All;

This is a bit obvious but want to triple check.

When we wrote a cover letter for the I-134F detailing our relatiionship we wrote it on behalf of the petitioner (i.e. met my fiance from England on this date, he came over here on this date, this photo is of me and my fiance at the pool etc.).

For packet 3 we need to do the same but more recent to now. I assume we switch the emphasis over so that it from the beneficiaries viewpoin (My fiance from the USA can over on this date, and this is my fiancee and me at my parents house in England.

Do you agree?

Paul

You're a little confused on the forms. The I-129F is the K1 (or K3) visa petition, which the petitioner sends to USCIS. The I-134 is an affidavit of support. The evidence required for the I-129F is proof that you have physically met each other within two years. The evidence required for the I-134 is proof that the petitioner meets the minimum income requirements to sponsor their fiance/e.

What they are probably asking for in packet 3 (varies from one consulate to another) is evidence of a bona fide relationship. Providing a letter describing your relationship is ok, but what is really required is concrete evidence. Otherwise, whatever you say in the letter is not worth much. Provide anything that demonstrates you have a real relationship. This includes evidence of time spent together, of course, but also includes ongoing communications - emails, chat logs, webcam pics, etc. This sort of evidence is usually neutral, in terms of viewpoint. For example, a printout of a chat session will contain whatever each party wrote, regardless of who prints it out. Consulates in low fraud countries generally don't need any detailed explanations from either party - they are more interested in the evidence. Detailed explanations are sometimes essential in high fraud countries to counter the presumption that the relationship is a sham.

You'll also want an updated letter of intent from both parties to re-affirm your intention to get married when the beneficiary arrives in the US.

[paul p 0]

All;

This is a bit obvious but want to triple check.

When we wrote a cover letter for the I-134F detailing our relatiionship we wrote it on behalf of the petitioner (i.e. met my fiance from England on this date, he came over here on this date, this photo is of me and my fiance at the pool etc.).

For packet 3 we need to do the same but more recent to now. I assume we switch the emphasis over so that it from the beneficiaries viewpoin (My fiance from the USA can over on this date, and this is my fiancee and me at my parents house in England.

Do you agree?

Paul

You're a little confused on the forms. The I-129F is the K1 (or K3) visa petition, which the petitioner sends to USCIS. The I-134 is an affidavit of support. The evidence required for the I-129F is proof that you have physically met each other within two years. The evidence required for the I-134 is proof that the petitioner meets the minimum income requirements to sponsor their fiance/e.

What they are probably asking for in packet 3 (varies from one consulate to another) is evidence of a bona fide relationship. Providing a letter describing your relationship is ok, but what is really required is concrete evidence. Otherwise, whatever you say in the letter is not worth much. Provide anything that demonstrates you have a real relationship. This includes evidence of time spent together, of course, but also includes ongoing communications - emails, chat logs, webcam pics, etc. This sort of evidence is usually neutral, in terms of viewpoint. For example, a printout of a chat session will contain whatever each party wrote, regardless of who prints it out. Consulates in low fraud countries generally don't need any detailed explanations from either party - they are more interested in the evidence. Detailed explanations are sometimes essential in high fraud countries to counter the presumption that the relationship is a sham.

You'll also want an updated letter of intent from both parties to re-affirm your intention to get married when the beneficiary arrives in the US.

Excellent and thanks. Yep, when i did the evidence for the initial USCIS part i submitted a 2 page letter stating our story with details to corresponding evidence. The evidence was over 80 pages (photos, phone reciepts, messenger logs, plane tickets, hotels etc. et.c). Was going to do exectly the same for packet 3. It will be easier this time as i have the template and it is concrete undisputable proof. USCIS accepted it straight away so assume the U.S. embassy will as well. Obviously this time it is new evidence from when we first posted to USCIS and now for this new packet.

My question was when we created it last time we worded it with the evidence as if the petitioner created it. This was because the petitioner was initiating the process. Now it is packet 3, i assume it switches to the benificiary and therefore everything should be worded as if they have created the evidence pack. I know this is a small detail but dont want any stupid slip ups.

Letters - Yep going to get those as well. Petitoner will send hers over when she sends the Affadavit of Support and the original I-129F pack

[kona 0]

Hey Paul,

Quick question to you since I haven't received a reply to my earlier post the other day about packet 3 from the uk london embassy... what exactly do we have to send off to them in reply to their initial letter? Different embassies are different and trying to find out on here is proving more tricky than i expected! As far as i know: forms 230, 156, 156K, 157, and IV-15... anything else? I appreciate your time in replying in advance!

I also notice you submitted your application (although to California, not Vermont) only the week before i did, so i'm paying particular attention to your timeline!

Cheers mate,

Max

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

All;

This is a bit obvious but want to triple check.

When we wrote a cover letter for the I-134F detailing our relatiionship we wrote it on behalf of the petitioner (i.e. met my fiance from England on this date, he came over here on this date, this photo is of me and my fiance at the pool etc.).

For packet 3 we need to do the same but more recent to now. I assume we switch the emphasis over so that it from the beneficiaries viewpoin (My fiance from the USA can over on this date, and this is my fiancee and me at my parents house in England.

Do you agree?

Paul

You're a little confused on the forms. The I-129F is the K1 (or K3) visa petition, which the petitioner sends to USCIS. The I-134 is an affidavit of support. The evidence required for the I-129F is proof that you have physically met each other within two years. The evidence required for the I-134 is proof that the petitioner meets the minimum income requirements to sponsor their fiance/e.

What they are probably asking for in packet 3 (varies from one consulate to another) is evidence of a bona fide relationship. Providing a letter describing your relationship is ok, but what is really required is concrete evidence. Otherwise, whatever you say in the letter is not worth much. Provide anything that demonstrates you have a real relationship. This includes evidence of time spent together, of course, but also includes ongoing communications - emails, chat logs, webcam pics, etc. This sort of evidence is usually neutral, in terms of viewpoint. For example, a printout of a chat session will contain whatever each party wrote, regardless of who prints it out. Consulates in low fraud countries generally don't need any detailed explanations from either party - they are more interested in the evidence. Detailed explanations are sometimes essential in high fraud countries to counter the presumption that the relationship is a sham.

You'll also want an updated letter of intent from both parties to re-affirm your intention to get married when the beneficiary arrives in the US.

Excellent and thanks. Yep, when i did the evidence for the initial USCIS part i submitted a 2 page letter stating our story with details to corresponding evidence. The evidence was over 80 pages (photos, phone reciepts, messenger logs, plane tickets, hotels etc. et.c). Was going to do exectly the same for packet 3. It will be easier this time as i have the template and it is concrete undisputable proof. USCIS accepted it straight away so assume the U.S. embassy will as well. Obviously this time it is new evidence from when we first posted to USCIS and now for this new packet.

My question was when we created it last time we worded it with the evidence as if the petitioner created it. This was because the petitioner was initiating the process. Now it is packet 3, i assume it switches to the benificiary and therefore everything should be worded as if they have created the evidence pack. I know this is a small detail but dont want any stupid slip ups.

Letters - Yep going to get those as well. Petitoner will send hers over when she sends the Affadavit of Support and the original I-129F pack

In response to packet 3, the evidence isn't generally required to be submitted in the form of a "package" to the consulate. In fact, I'm not aware of any consulate that wants you to actually send this stuff to them. Usually, all they want in response to packet 3 is some specific forms, although they will often advise what additional forms, documents, and evidence will be required at the interview. You get more specific information about that in packet 4. The relationship evidence is usually something you bring to the interview, and you present it when they ask for it. For example, if the CO asks if you've got photos, then you hand them your photos. If they ask if you've got emails, then you hand them your emails. You won't be handing them an 80 page stack of paper because they won't have time to go through it. Just cherry pick the best stuff to present to them. Besides, they'll have already reviewed any evidence that was included with the original petition, since they'll have a copy of everything.

There probably wouldn't be much point in preparing a letter like you describe from the beneficiary's viewpoint. You probably won't have an opportunity to submit it, the CO probably won't have time to read it, and the beneficiary will be at the interview - if the CO has any questions for the beneficiary they can ask them directly.

When I was talking about detailed explanations for high fraud consulates, I was speaking primarily about consulates that issue RFE's at the interview for explanations that were not asked for in either packet 3 or packet 4. For example, the consulate in Ho Chi Minh City likes to give RFE's for something they call a "timeline of the relationship". They want a chronology that demonstrates the relationship developed over time in a believable manner, and wasn't cobbled together quickly for the purpose of immigration. In their case, they specifically ask that the timeline be written by the petitioner (they never believe the beneficiary), and they want it notarized. I've never heard of anything like this being requested in London.

[paul p 0]

All;

This is a bit obvious but want to triple check.

When we wrote a cover letter for the I-134F detailing our relatiionship we wrote it on behalf of the petitioner (i.e. met my fiance from England on this date, he came over here on this date, this photo is of me and my fiance at the pool etc.).

For packet 3 we need to do the same but more recent to now. I assume we switch the emphasis over so that it from the beneficiaries viewpoin (My fiance from the USA can over on this date, and this is my fiancee and me at my parents house in England.

Do you agree?

Paul

You're a little confused on the forms. The I-129F is the K1 (or K3) visa petition, which the petitioner sends to USCIS. The I-134 is an affidavit of support. The evidence required for the I-129F is proof that you have physically met each other within two years. The evidence required for the I-134 is proof that the petitioner meets the minimum income requirements to sponsor their fiance/e.

What they are probably asking for in packet 3 (varies from one consulate to another) is evidence of a bona fide relationship. Providing a letter describing your relationship is ok, but what is really required is concrete evidence. Otherwise, whatever you say in the letter is not worth much. Provide anything that demonstrates you have a real relationship. This includes evidence of time spent together, of course, but also includes ongoing communications - emails, chat logs, webcam pics, etc. This sort of evidence is usually neutral, in terms of viewpoint. For example, a printout of a chat session will contain whatever each party wrote, regardless of who prints it out. Consulates in low fraud countries generally don't need any detailed explanations from either party - they are more interested in the evidence. Detailed explanations are sometimes essential in high fraud countries to counter the presumption that the relationship is a sham.

You'll also want an updated letter of intent from both parties to re-affirm your intention to get married when the beneficiary arrives in the US.

Excellent and thanks. Yep, when i did the evidence for the initial USCIS part i submitted a 2 page letter stating our story with details to corresponding evidence. The evidence was over 80 pages (photos, phone reciepts, messenger logs, plane tickets, hotels etc. et.c). Was going to do exectly the same for packet 3. It will be easier this time as i have the template and it is concrete undisputable proof. USCIS accepted it straight away so assume the U.S. embassy will as well. Obviously this time it is new evidence from when we first posted to USCIS and now for this new packet.

My question was when we created it last time we worded it with the evidence as if the petitioner created it. This was because the petitioner was initiating the process. Now it is packet 3, i assume it switches to the benificiary and therefore everything should be worded as if they have created the evidence pack. I know this is a small detail but dont want any stupid slip ups.

Letters - Yep going to get those as well. Petitoner will send hers over when she sends the Affadavit of Support and the original I-129F pack

In response to packet 3, the evidence isn't generally required to be submitted in the form of a "package" to the consulate. In fact, I'm not aware of any consulate that wants you to actually send this stuff to them. Usually, all they want in response to packet 3 is some specific forms, although they will often advise what additional forms, documents, and evidence will be required at the interview. You get more specific information about that in packet 4. The relationship evidence is usually something you bring to the interview, and you present it when they ask for it. For example, if the CO asks if you've got photos, then you hand them your photos. If they ask if you've got emails, then you hand them your emails. You won't be handing them an 80 page stack of paper because they won't have time to go through it. Just cherry pick the best stuff to present to them. Besides, they'll have already reviewed any evidence that was included with the original petition, since they'll have a copy of everything.

There probably wouldn't be much point in preparing a letter like you describe from the beneficiary's viewpoint. You probably won't have an opportunity to submit it, the CO probably won't have time to read it, and the beneficiary will be at the interview - if the CO has any questions for the beneficiary they can ask them directly.

When I was talking about detailed explanations for high fraud consulates, I was speaking primarily about consulates that issue RFE's at the interview for explanations that were not asked for in either packet 3 or packet 4. For example, the consulate in Ho Chi Minh City likes to give RFE's for something they call a "timeline of the relationship". They want a chronology that demonstrates the relationship developed over time in a believable manner, and wasn't cobbled together quickly for the purpose of immigration. In their case, they specifically ask that the timeline be written by the petitioner (they never believe the beneficiary), and they want it notarized. I've never heard of anything like this being requested in London.

Excellent response and information my friend. Sounds like the letter isnt required and makes my job easier. I have actually already written it but what i will do is use it to simply compile the evidence for the interview.

So conclusion - Packet 3 is just the forms and added extras like birth certificate, police record, divorce paper.

Packet 4 is stuff for the interview like evidence of an ongoing relationship

Correct?

[paul p 0]

Hey Paul,

Quick question to you since I haven't received a reply to my earlier post the other day about packet 3 from the uk london embassy... what exactly do we have to send off to them in reply to their initial letter? Different embassies are different and trying to find out on here is proving more tricky than i expected! As far as i know: forms 230, 156, 156K, 157, and IV-15... anything else? I appreciate your time in replying in advance!

I also notice you submitted your application (although to California, not Vermont) only the week before i did, so i'm paying particular attention to your timeline!

Cheers mate,

Max

Hi Max;

For context, i am from UK (beneficiary) and my fiancee is from the U.S (petitioner). Bet you knew that already

This is what i think i will have to fill out for packet 3 (havent got it yet)

1. Fill in DS-230-1 Part 1 (Part 2 is completed by me at interview)

• Birth Certificate (long version)

• Adoption Certificates

• Court and Prison records (any other country lived for over a year or where picked up criminal record)

• Court and Prison records UK

• Deportation Documents

• Marriage Termination Documents

• Military Records

• Photocopy of Passport Bio graphic page

• Police certificates (any other country lived for over a year or where picked up criminal record)

• Police certificate UK. An immigrant visa applicant who has resided in the United Kingdom for 6 months or more since the age of 16, is required to obtain a police certificate from the Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO). Further information is available from their website at http://www.acpo.police.uk/certificates.asp . This police certificate will serve to advise the U.S. Embassy, London whether or not any criminal conviction is held against him/her.

• Photographs

• Translations

2. Ds-156 x 2

3. Electronic Visa

4. DS-156K (Do not sign)

5. DS-157 (Male only)

6. IV-15 Checklist

• Tick off checklist

I dont know what the Elcctronic Visa is? Do you?

From the petitioner i will be getting:

7. Original I-129f packet

8. Letter affirming her wish still to marry me (i will complete one too)

9. Affidavit of Support (with all evidence - I have other posts about that on here)

10. Some proof of an ongoing relationship. Will be text logs, photos, phone call logs etc. and i will add things that i have like msngr logs etc. etc.

11. Maybe a copy of NOA1 and NOA2. We are having a real problem with NOA2. My fiancee moved between NOA1 and NOA2 and 3 times in a row the letter has been sent back. Wea re being told dont need it for this but do for AOS. Maybe USCIS will have sorted it by then?

Thats about it. Any other questions, please ask

Paul

[baron555 934]

My question was when we created it last time we worded it with the evidence as if the petitioner created it. This was because the petitioner was initiating the process. Now it is packet 3, i assume it switches to the benificiary and therefore everything should be worded as if they have created the evidence pack. I know this is a small detail but dont want any stupid slip ups.

I don't agree with wording it as if one or the other created the documents. To me it should be worded as you both created it. You both should be involved in the relationship and your evidence should show this and tell the story of your relationship to each other.

I simply sent summaries of OUR emails to each other, receipt of the book I sent to HER and a photo of HER with the book. I think you catch my drift.

She will tell her side of the story at the interview and will most usually be asked a few questions.

[paul p 0]

My question was when we created it last time we worded it with the evidence as if the petitioner created it. This was because the petitioner was initiating the process. Now it is packet 3, i assume it switches to the benificiary and therefore everything should be worded as if they have created the evidence pack. I know this is a small detail but dont want any stupid slip ups.

I don't agree with wording it as if one or the other created the documents. To me it should be worded as you both created it. You both should be involved in the relationship and your evidence should show this and tell the story of your relationship to each other.

I simply sent summaries of OUR emails to each other, receipt of the book I sent to HER and a photo of HER with the book. I think you catch my drift.

She will tell her side of the story at the interview and will most usually be asked a few questions.

Thats a very good point my friend and i think you are right? I have sent her gifts so as like with your book, it shows a nice and warm relationship is ongoing. Thanks for this. Really appreciated.