Consensus emerging on universal healthcare - but single payer is off the table

[rocks 494]

So McCain's plan was horrible and was rightly rejected - but rather than doing what is really necessary (a wholesale reform of the healthcare system that tears it apart to its foundations) we'll take the same leaky old house, paper over the cracks and flog it back to an unsuspecting mug (i.e. Us).

Job done. Apparently

Exactly. The Baucus 'plan' is a joke.

What do the liberals suggest, that will not cost the taxpayer further tax?

war costs lots of money, do you agree with that?

War costs aren't budgeted. Wars come upon us without warning, so the money is borrowed, not budgeted.

that isn't the point. the point is the money is wasted on war when it could be used for something far more useful.

[mawilson 2,133]

So McCain's plan was horrible and was rightly rejected - but rather than doing what is really necessary (a wholesale reform of the healthcare system that tears it apart to its foundations) we'll take the same leaky old house, paper over the cracks and flog it back to an unsuspecting mug (i.e. Us).

Job done. Apparently

Exactly. The Baucus 'plan' is a joke.

What do the liberals suggest, that will not cost the taxpayer further tax?

war costs lots of money, do you agree with that?

War costs aren't budgeted. Wars come upon us without warning, so the money is borrowed, not budgeted.

that isn't the point. the point is the money is wasted on war when it could be used for something far more useful.

No. You can borrow money for a war, but you cannot borrow money to pay for universal healthcare.

[rocks 494]

So McCain's plan was horrible and was rightly rejected - but rather than doing what is really necessary (a wholesale reform of the healthcare system that tears it apart to its foundations) we'll take the same leaky old house, paper over the cracks and flog it back to an unsuspecting mug (i.e. Us).

Job done. Apparently

Exactly. The Baucus 'plan' is a joke.

What do the liberals suggest, that will not cost the taxpayer further tax?

war costs lots of money, do you agree with that?

War costs aren't budgeted. Wars come upon us without warning, so the money is borrowed, not budgeted.

that isn't the point. the point is the money is wasted on war when it could be used for something far more useful.

No. You can borrow money for a war, but you cannot borrow money to pay for universal healthcare.

how is this "borrowed" money going to be paid back from these wars we are losing?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Debt isn't "paid back", only serviced. Think of it as an interest-only mortgage with a term of 'forever'.

The ultimate ponzi scheme!

[LikeALadybug 2]

I like universal health care but I really don't think it is the solution for the USA. It just goes against everything about America. Having said that, I would much rather see my tax money go towards some sort of health care than towards war - what a waste! I would like to see the government do something, even if it means raising our taxes a little bit (no, I don't no how much, but not too much, ok?) and maybe figure something out to control the cost in general.

I'm sure hospitals take loses from all the uninsured who receive treatment and I just read an article the other day that many doctors take a loss of giving shots but something has to be done about the cost. In the end, I think we would end up with more productive people who do not suddenly have to receive social security because they had some minor illness that was never treated and has now become so bad they ca no longer work. That costs tax payers money too. if I'm gonna pay I would rather pay to help you stay at work than pay for you to sit on your yeah in pain. Also, so many kids are uninsured...did any one hear about the kid a while back that died because the infection in his tooth got so bad it went to his brain? Obviously, things have to change, this is not a 3rd world country.

[rocks 494]

Debt isn't "paid back", only serviced. Think of it as an interest-only mortgage with a term of 'forever'.

The ultimate ponzi scheme!

so why not make this un-repayable debt about saving american lives than some un-winnable wars? it's pretty simple, isn't it? or do you think i am making this too complicated for people?

[mawilson 2,133]

Debt isn't "paid back", only serviced. Think of it as an interest-only mortgage with a term of 'forever'.

The ultimate ponzi scheme!

so why not make this un-repayable debt about saving american lives than some un-winnable wars? it's pretty simple, isn't it? or do you think i am making this too complicated for people?

These "wars we are losing" don't last forever, therefore the amount of borrowed money is limited.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

True, we do win a few every now and then.

[rocks 494]

Debt isn't "paid back", only serviced. Think of it as an interest-only mortgage with a term of 'forever'.

The ultimate ponzi scheme!

so why not make this un-repayable debt about saving american lives than some un-winnable wars? it's pretty simple, isn't it? or do you think i am making this too complicated for people?

These "wars we are losing" don't last forever, therefore the amount of borrowed money is limited.

the amount of money that has been used on the wars is vast, you know that as well as i do. the amount of taxes required to implement healthcare for everyone would never be as high as that.

[HAL 9000 96]

Or the government can do other things like put regulation where it belongs- in bringing down costs so that affordability and fair access to coverage can be done without jumping through loops of corporate greed.

human life is worth far more than corporate profits. greed is disgusting, look at what happened to that walmart employee that got killed.

I'm sure someone thought the guy 'was in the way' of a deal.

So McCain's plan was horrible and was rightly rejected - but rather than doing what is really necessary (a wholesale reform of the healthcare system that tears it apart to its foundations) we'll take the same leaky old house, paper over the cracks and flog it back to an unsuspecting mug (i.e. Us).

Job done. Apparently

Exactly. The Baucus 'plan' is a joke.

What do the liberals suggest, that will not cost the taxpayer further tax?

war costs lots of money, do you agree with that?

War costs aren't budgeted. Wars come upon us without warning, so the money is borrowed, not budgeted.

Well, at least with the example rocks was thinking of, it was hardly a surprise but I certainly would agree with it not really being budgeted.

[HAL 9000 96]

Debt isn't "paid back", only serviced. Think of it as an interest-only mortgage with a term of 'forever'.

The ultimate ponzi scheme!

so why not make this un-repayable debt about saving american lives than some un-winnable wars? it's pretty simple, isn't it? or do you think i am making this too complicated for people?

These "wars we are losing" don't last forever, therefore the amount of borrowed money is limited.

the amount of money that has been used on the wars is vast, you know that as well as i do. the amount of taxes required to implement healthcare for everyone would never be as high as that.

We could speculate on the decrease in costs in a healthcare plan over time as well... as the plan matures its likely to not have increases in its expenses.

[rocks 494]

Or the government can do other things like put regulation where it belongs- in bringing down costs so that affordability and fair access to coverage can be done without jumping through loops of corporate greed.

human life is worth far more than corporate profits. greed is disgusting, look at what happened to that walmart employee that got killed.

I'm sure someone thought the guy 'was in the way' of a deal.

So McCain's plan was horrible and was rightly rejected - but rather than doing what is really necessary (a wholesale reform of the healthcare system that tears it apart to its foundations) we'll take the same leaky old house, paper over the cracks and flog it back to an unsuspecting mug (i.e. Us).

Job done. Apparently

Exactly. The Baucus 'plan' is a joke.

What do the liberals suggest, that will not cost the taxpayer further tax?

war costs lots of money, do you agree with that?

War costs aren't budgeted. Wars come upon us without warning, so the money is borrowed, not budgeted.

Well, at least with the example rocks was thinking of, it was hardly a surprise but I certainly would agree with it not really being budgeted.

i was only replying to the silly comment that apparently only liberals raise taxes and cost the country money.

[HAL 9000 96]

Or the government can do other things like put regulation where it belongs- in bringing down costs so that affordability and fair access to coverage can be done without jumping through loops of corporate greed.

human life is worth far more than corporate profits. greed is disgusting, look at what happened to that walmart employee that got killed.

I'm sure someone thought the guy 'was in the way' of a deal.

So McCain's plan was horrible and was rightly rejected - but rather than doing what is really necessary (a wholesale reform of the healthcare system that tears it apart to its foundations) we'll take the same leaky old house, paper over the cracks and flog it back to an unsuspecting mug (i.e. Us).

Job done. Apparently

Exactly. The Baucus 'plan' is a joke.

What do the liberals suggest, that will not cost the taxpayer further tax?

war costs lots of money, do you agree with that?

War costs aren't budgeted. Wars come upon us without warning, so the money is borrowed, not budgeted.

Well, at least with the example rocks was thinking of, it was hardly a surprise but I certainly would agree with it not really being budgeted.

i was only replying to the silly comment that apparently only liberals raise taxes and cost the country money.

Yeah that line of thoughtlessness is rather petty and silly isn't it?

[rocks 494]

Yeah that line of thoughtlessness is rather petty and silly isn't it?

yes. i find it offensive. i was tempted to press the report button.

also, with regard to the walmart thing...

Kimberly Cribbs, who witnessed the stampede, said shoppers were acting like "savages."

"When they were saying they had to leave, that an employee got killed, people were yelling `I've been on line since yesterday morning,'" she said. "They kept shopping."

clearly many people thought he was in the way of a deal or he wouldn't have been crushed to death. this is comparable to insurance companies and their greed.

[mawilson 2,133]

Debt isn't "paid back", only serviced. Think of it as an interest-only mortgage with a term of 'forever'.

The ultimate ponzi scheme!

so why not make this un-repayable debt about saving american lives than some un-winnable wars? it's pretty simple, isn't it? or do you think i am making this too complicated for people?

These "wars we are losing" don't last forever, therefore the amount of borrowed money is limited.

the amount of money that has been used on the wars is vast, you know that as well as i do. the amount of taxes required to implement healthcare for everyone would never be as high as that.

That's just not true.

In 2007, total national health spending was $2.3 TRILLION.

Six years in (2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 and 2008), the total cost of the Iraq war comes to roughly $600 billion.