How do you feel about Legalization of Illegals in US?

[SMOKE 1,426]

Pretend, for a moment, that you are holding a camera (video).

Now, zoom out so that you can see your city.

Zoom out furthar...see your country.

Zoom out all the way to get a vantage point from outer space.

See our beautiful blue and green planet with some clouds hovering here and there?

Now ask yourself:

Is there really such a thing as an "illegal" human being?

(L) (L)

take the same camera, put a truth lens on it. take away your college degree, so you can compete w/ illegals to feed & house your family w/ a manual labor job. i think you'll see a different picture(video)

there are illegal immigrants & they are hurting those who are not fortunate enough to have a college education.

but hey...it doesn't hurt you right?

[Heracles 417]

Is there really such a thing as an "illegal" human being?

But is it okay for them to prosper at somebody else's loss?

[HAL 9000 96]

Is there really such a thing as an "illegal" human being?

But is it okay for them to prosper at somebody else's loss?

The argument can and does go both ways.

Who benefits at *their* expense to drive them our way?

[SMOKE 1,426]

Is there really such a thing as an "illegal" human being?

But is it okay for them to prosper at somebody else's loss?

The argument can and does go both ways.

Who benefits at *their* expense to drive them our way?

so keep letting the blue collar Americans take it on the chin?

[Peikko 1,575]

I just can't see any administration spending billions of dollars on this situation - and yes, life is unfair in all kinds of ways.

[HAL 9000 96]

Is there really such a thing as an "illegal" human being?

But is it okay for them to prosper at somebody else's loss?

The argument can and does go both ways.

Who benefits at *their* expense to drive them our way?

so keep letting the blue collar Americans take it on the chin?

Again, its a two way street.

So keep letting the pre-illegals take it up the wazoo.

Problem is, um, that there's causation involved and God forbid we actually did something to really prevent the problem from becoming, a problem.

And, no, I do not favor screwing our workers over unless there are lines that I have apparently written in invisible bits and bytes here. Legislate all you want to punish, but fact of the matter is that if you prevent the problem in the first place...

Edited March 14, 2008 by maviwaro

[SMOKE 1,426]

I just can't see any administration spending billions of dollars on this situation - and yes, life is unfair in all kinds of ways.

not needed. Oklahoma & Arizona are showing the way. take the social services & jobs away...penalize people aiding illegal immiration & the problem will take care of its self.

[Peikko 1,575]

So, a fence is not required then? Oh good, that's a relief.

You do know that penalizing people requires discovery and discovery requires money? Just to be sure I have this right.

[SpiritAlight 1]

Is there really such a thing as an "illegal" human being?

But is it okay for them to prosper at somebody else's loss?

The argument can and does go both ways.

Who benefits at *their* expense to drive them our way?

so keep letting the blue collar Americans take it on the chin?

Thanks for giggling about it initially Smoke.

I am not saying that anyone should suffer.

And believe me after doing this blasted K1 and AOS thingies (which I despise), I am not one to say, "Great, we suffered and waited and paid exorbitant amounts of money and let's allow others to have it all for 'free'."

What I'm trying to get at is the meat of it, the heart...where (some) people are doing the best they can with what they have.

When I am emperor, borders will be non-existent and we will all live in harmony as one giant community.

Ha!

(the never-ending idealist)

What can we feel or what can we request from the government if, let's say, everyone gets "legallized" without having paid for it (via time and money), that would make it seem fair to all of us???

Hmmm??

[SMOKE 1,426]

Is there really such a thing as an "illegal" human being?

But is it okay for them to prosper at somebody else's loss?

The argument can and does go both ways.

Who benefits at *their* expense to drive them our way?

so keep letting the blue collar Americans take it on the chin?

Again, its a two way street.

So keep letting the pre-illegals take it up the wazoo.

Problem is, um, that there's causation involved and God forbid we actually did something to really prevent the problem from becoming, a problem.

And, no, I do not favor screwing our workers over unless there are lines that I have apparently written in invisible bits and bytes here. Legislate all you want to punish, but fact of the matter is that if you prevent the problem in the first place...

you can stand on your soap box all day it doesn't change the facts. the worlds poor is not the US fault or burden. 1 time....look at the illegal immigration issue from the POV of a blue collar worker. you can't deny its a problem, its hurting everyone & letting it continue is not the answer.

[HAL 9000 96]

So, a fence is not required then? Oh good, that's a relief.

You do know that penalizing people requires discovery and discovery requires money? Just to be sure I have this right.

Well some folks are willing to spend more in legal costs penalizing rather than spending a little to prevent the problem. Seems to go around in all sorts of issues... education vs prison, health prevention vs out of control health complications... etc.

Then they complain about low paying jobs requiring little skills that go to undocumented workers willing to work for a living. It seems we let ourselves set the bar rather low for ourselves.

[GabiandVi 34]

I am pro-immigration!

I remembered the raid in New Bedford, MA. Yes, it's their fault for being here illegally. However, mistreating them when they were detained is unforgivable. Treating them as animals, worse than regular prisoners who murdered people. There's a documentary film called Detained that gives the audience a chance to grasp the horror in being detained by ICE.

I'm not jumping down your throat, but saying you are pro-immigration with regard to illegal immigration is a misnomer. Obviously everyone on this site is pro-immigration. What you mean is that you are pro-illegal immigration, and I don't see how that is possible. How can anyone be pro-illegal anything? It doesn't make any sense. Or are you anti border laws? That can never work, and I don't think anybody actually thinks it can.

As for the treatment of illegal aliens, I think most people would agree that it should be fair and with dignity. I'm sure that documentary is horrifying, and some sort of compensation should be made to the detainees. Perhaps even amnesty. But general amnesty would be a huge mistake. We tried it once and we only encouraged illegal immigration. It amounts to open borders.

[SMOKE 1,426]

So, a fence is not required then? Oh good, that's a relief.

You do know that penalizing people requires discovery and discovery requires money? Just to be sure I have this right.

yes..have you looked at whats happening in OK & AZ? fines & asset seizure is funding the discovery

[Heracles 417]

So, a fence is not required then? Oh good, that's a relief.

Of course a fence is required. It is a border not a national park for everyone to enter at their leisure.

The ultimate enforcement would come from penalizing employers as well as preventing any government services from being handed out to them. I just saw a story on CNN, the other day, where Mexican mothers are coming into the US just before going into labor to ensure their kids become American citizenship. The hospitals must also deliver the baby basically for free.

Edited March 14, 2008 by Boo-Yah!

[HAL 9000 96]

Is there really such a thing as an "illegal" human being?

But is it okay for them to prosper at somebody else's loss?

The argument can and does go both ways.

Who benefits at *their* expense to drive them our way?

so keep letting the blue collar Americans take it on the chin?

Again, its a two way street.

So keep letting the pre-illegals take it up the wazoo.

Problem is, um, that there's causation involved and God forbid we actually did something to really prevent the problem from becoming, a problem.

And, no, I do not favor screwing our workers over unless there are lines that I have apparently written in invisible bits and bytes here. Legislate all you want to punish, but fact of the matter is that if you prevent the problem in the first place...

you can stand on your soap box all day it doesn't change the facts. the worlds poor is not the US fault or burden. 1 time....look at the illegal immigration issue from the POV of a blue collar worker. you can't deny its a problem, its hurting everyone & letting it continue is not the answer.

Again... more invisible lines to read here.

We are not discussing the world's poor- at least I'm not. We're discussing the cake we like to have and eat on someone else's plate. THAT is called causation for them to come and eat our pie.