Bush plans to veto banning of waterboarding

[SMOKE 1,426]

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

If you're guilty to begin with - why bother with the trial at all? Why not just go straight to jail.

you do go straight to jail. then you pay to get out. then you pay a lawyer to prove you're not guilty. then you pay the court for their services.

[Peikko 1,575]

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

Lol, maybe if you are caught with your pants down. Seriously, the court of law is based on the premiss inocent until proven guilty.

Of course, I have never been arrested, but I am sure it's not a 'nice' experience, and nor should it be. However, they are not allowed to use force or torture and *newsflash for you* that's an infringement of human rights. Oh but then again, maybe you don't believe in human rights

[Niels Bohr 72]

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

If you're guilty to begin with - why bother with the trial at all? Why not just go straight to jail.

you do go straight to jail. then you pay to get out. then you pay a lawyer to prove you're not guilty. then you pay the court for their services.

You, my friend, needs to experience a country with " guilty until proven innocent." You do not have rights like over here. The bail fines is a way of paying for the court. It's not all free.

[SMOKE 1,426]

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

I have never been arrested, but I am sure it's not a 'nice' experience, and nor should it be. However, they are not allowed to use force or torture and *newsflash for you* that's an infringement of human rights. Oh but then again, maybe you don't believe in human rights

nuff said, refer to first bolden part, the gov't has a right to protect you & me even if you don't agree w/ the tactics.

[SMOKE 1,426]

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

If you're guilty to begin with - why bother with the trial at all? Why not just go straight to jail.

you do go straight to jail. then you pay to get out. then you pay a lawyer to prove you're not guilty. then you pay the court for their services.

You, my friend, needs to experience a country with " guilty until proven innocent." You do not have rights like over here. The bail fines is a way of paying for the court. It's not all free.

maybe you should experience life away from your computer. bail gets you out of jail....you pay to get out. court cost pay for court. if can't pay you stay.

Edited March 8, 2008 by SMOKE

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

I have never been arrested, but I am sure it's not a 'nice' experience, and nor should it be. However, they are not allowed to use force or torture and *newsflash for you* that's an infringement of human rights. Oh but then again, maybe you don't believe in human rights

nuff said, refer to first bolden part, the gov't has a right to protect you & me even if you don't agree w/ the tactics.

Sure. Like they protected us from Khalid El-Masri

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

If you're guilty to begin with - why bother with the trial at all? Why not just go straight to jail.

you do go straight to jail. then you pay to get out. then you pay a lawyer to prove you're not guilty. then you pay the court for their services.

You, my friend, needs to experience a country with " guilty until proven innocent." You do not have rights like over here. The bail fines is a way of paying for the court. It's not all free.

maybe you should experience life away from your computer. bail gets you out of jail....you pay to get out. court cost pay for court.

The onus is also on the prosecution to prove the case against you. Its not the other way around.

Edited March 8, 2008 by Number 6

[KandD 1]

OMG. Thats him alright

In other news

[Peikko 1,575]

Jail isn't prison either and yes, as Numero 6 said, the court premiss is that the prosecution has to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you committed the crime.

As for how people are treated in custody, actually, I am sure the majority of police officers follow the rules and treat their suspects ethically. The strong armers are few and far between and the reason is? Well strange as it may seem, playing by the rules actually delivers results, strong arming rarely does. Cases have been thrown out for technicalities for police brutality when gathering evidence.

[HAL 9000 96]

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

I have never been arrested, but I am sure it's not a 'nice' experience, and nor should it be. However, they are not allowed to use force or torture and *newsflash for you* that's an infringement of human rights. Oh but then again, maybe you don't believe in human rights

nuff said, refer to first bolden part, the gov't has a right to protect you & me even if you don't agree w/ the tactics.

They should also follow the international treatises on humane treatment of prisoners without looking for legal loopholes to use and abuse.

We whine about defending freedom yet seem to forget all about what freedom is supposed to be. Interesting.

[SMOKE 1,426]

Sure. Like they protected us from Khalid El-Masri

The onus is also on the prosecution to prove the case against you. Its not the other way around.

cherry pickin w/ wiki again i see & horsesh!t if that was the case why do they take the accused to jail first?

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

I have never been arrested, but I am sure it's not a 'nice' experience, and nor should it be. However, they are not allowed to use force or torture and *newsflash for you* that's an infringement of human rights. Oh but then again, maybe you don't believe in human rights

nuff said, refer to first bolden part, the gov't has a right to protect you & me even if you don't agree w/ the tactics.

They should also follow the international treatises on humane treatment of prisoners without looking for legal loopholes to use and abuse.

We whine about defending freedom yet seem to forget all about what freedom is supposed to be. Interesting.

yah everyone else play fair right?

[Don_Joy's Prince 0]

Rights provided by law in a civil setting differ from rights of enemy combatants during a war.

We are at war with these people, they attacked us first. Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was the main one that we waterboarded. And he spilled his guts about the whole operation. That one action gave us more information then all the rest combined. Which in turn has allowed us to dismantle Al-Qaida. Which is now only a fraction of its former strength.

Confession before his Combatant Status Review Tribunal

In March 2007, Mohammed testified before a closed-door hearing in Guantánamo Bay. According to transcripts of the hearing released by the Pentagon, he said "I was responsible for the 9/11 operation, from A to Z." The transcripts also show him confessing to: organizing the 1993 World Trade Center bombing; the Bali nightclub bombings; and Richard Reid's attempted shoe bombing. He also confessed to planning attacks on Heathrow Airport and Big Ben clock tower in London, Pearl's murder in 2002, and planned assassination attempts on Pope John Paul II, Pervez Musharraf and Bill Clinton.

This is what water boarding gets you!

When the time comes he will be executed just like Saddam was!

I don't know why you Liberals are more worried about Protecting murderers and dictators than protecting innocent human beings.

What about their "human rights"?

[HAL 9000 96]

Sure. Like they protected us from Khalid El-Masri

The onus is also on the prosecution to prove the case against you. Its not the other way around.

cherry pickin w/ wiki again i see & horsesh!t if that was the case why do they take the accused to jail first?

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

I have never been arrested, but I am sure it's not a 'nice' experience, and nor should it be. However, they are not allowed to use force or torture and *newsflash for you* that's an infringement of human rights. Oh but then again, maybe you don't believe in human rights

nuff said, refer to first bolden part, the gov't has a right to protect you & me even if you don't agree w/ the tactics.

They should also follow the international treatises on humane treatment of prisoners without looking for legal loopholes to use and abuse.

We whine about defending freedom yet seem to forget all about what freedom is supposed to be. Interesting.

yah everyone else play fair right?

We everyone else? No, we are we. Right?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Sure. Like they protected us from Khalid El-Masri

The onus is also on the prosecution to prove the case against you. Its not the other way around.

cherry pickin w/ wiki again i see & horsesh!t if that was the case why do they take the accused to jail first?

They don't always. It depends on the charges.

I think your reasoning is a tad askew here. If it were the case that a person was guilty until proven innocent - then they would surely skip the trial and go straight to sentencing, and a person would have to prove their innocence on appeal.

The key here is that you are sentenced when you are found guilty. Not when you're accused. The judge and jury don't automatically assume a person is guilty - that's what's known as prejudice.

[Peikko 1,575]

Rights provided by law in a civil setting differ from rights of enemy combatants during a war.

We are at war with these people, they attacked us first. Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was the main one that we waterboarded. And he spilled his guts about the whole operation. That one action gave us more information then all the rest combined. Which in turn has allowed us to dismantle Al-Qaida. Which is now only a fraction of its former strength.

Confession before his Combatant Status Review Tribunal

In March 2007, Mohammed testified before a closed-door hearing in Guantánamo Bay. According to transcripts of the hearing released by the Pentagon, he said "I was responsible for the 9/11 operation, from A to Z." The transcripts also show him confessing to: organizing the 1993 World Trade Center bombing; the Bali nightclub bombings; and Richard Reid's attempted shoe bombing. He also confessed to planning attacks on Heathrow Airport and Big Ben clock tower in London, Pearl's murder in 2002, and planned assassination attempts on Pope John Paul II, Pervez Musharraf and Bill Clinton.

This is what water boarding gets you!

When the time comes he will be executed just like Saddam was!

I don't know why you Liberals are more worried about Protecting murderers and dictators than protecting innocent human beings.

What about their "human rights"?

Education is a wonderful thing. Please ask this question again whey you actually understand what human rights are and how they should be applied. Oh, but hang on, because you decided that something is true, it has to be, correct?

[SMOKE 1,426]

Sure. Like they protected us from Khalid El-Masri

The onus is also on the prosecution to prove the case against you. Its not the other way around.

cherry pickin w/ wiki again i see & horsesh!t if that was the case why do they take the accused to jail first?

This country follows the motto, " Innocent until Proven Guilty " not " Guilty until proven innocent." Imagine if it were " Guilty until proven innocent."

ever been charged w/ anything? *newsflash for ya....you are guilty until you prove your innocence*

I have never been arrested, but I am sure it's not a 'nice' experience, and nor should it be. However, they are not allowed to use force or torture and *newsflash for you* that's an infringement of human rights. Oh but then again, maybe you don't believe in human rights

nuff said, refer to first bolden part, the gov't has a right to protect you & me even if you don't agree w/ the tactics.

They should also follow the international treatises on humane treatment of prisoners without looking for legal loopholes to use and abuse.

We whine about defending freedom yet seem to forget all about what freedom is supposed to be. Interesting.

yah everyone else play fair right?

We everyone else? No, we are we. Right?

yes we are we. like it or not we can & will do what we need to protect our arses....you keep bitchin & cryin from your high horse..someone else will take care of the real problems...mkay