Guns-on-campus bill advances in Senate

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Has anyone ever considered that parts of the constitution may be outdated and harmful to americans? I think that's why they allow amendments. Anyway, I know that we, as a species, have learned and developed a LOT since the Constitution was drafted. To think that one room of people 220 years ago know the best way for society to function now is just silly.

I think we give the founding fathers a bit too much credit for that anyway. They did draft the documents - but they didn't just pull the stuff out of thin air. They actually used equivalent British documents as the founding basis for the US versions.

There is a (very old) English Bill of rights, for example, that includes a right to bear arms.

[mawilson 2,133]

Has anyone ever considered that parts of the constitution may be outdated and harmful to americans? I think that's why they allow amendments. Anyway, I know that we, as a species, have learned and developed a LOT since the Constitution was drafted. To think that one room of people 220 years ago know the best way for society to function now is just silly.

It's really not. Societies haven't changed - the same principles applied 220 years ago and 2,200 years ago.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Has anyone ever considered that parts of the constitution may be outdated and harmful to americans? I think that's why they allow amendments. Anyway, I know that we, as a species, have learned and developed a LOT since the Constitution was drafted. To think that one room of people 220 years ago know the best way for society to function now is just silly.

It's really not. Societies haven't changed - the same principles applied 220 years ago and 2,200 years ago.

I agree with this. Oddly enough its the Neoconservative school of thought that actually advocates repealing parts of the constitution in certain contexts (like National Emergencies).

A dodgy road to go down IMO.

[Ban Hammer 14,290]

So now, instead of a deranged individual having to buy a gun before going on a rampage, he just needs to find someone carrying and steal the gun from them.

With more fuel on the fire, i guess some would rather rely on natural selection to take care of the problem.

that's such a brilliant idea....unarmed yoyo tries to take gun from armed citizen.

my cch class included training in how to keep someone from getting your firearm.

Millions of women stay in abusive relationships for fear of getting hurt - it's nothing new.

just like millions of men stay in abusive relationships for fear of being financially hurt.

[AnewKINDofFEELIN 0]

my cch class included training in how to keep someone from getting your firearm.

My driver's education class taught me how to avoid accidents.

[Dan J 277]

So now, instead of a deranged individual having to buy a gun before going on a rampage, he just needs to find someone carrying and steal the gun from them.

With more fuel on the fire, i guess some would rather rely on natural selection to take care of the problem.

that's such a brilliant idea....unarmed yoyo tries to take gun from armed citizen.

my cch class included training in how to keep someone from getting your firearm.

Just because someone may not be able to take away a gun from you, doesn't mean that person won't be successful in taking away a gun from someone else.

[AnewKINDofFEELIN 0]

Has anyone ever considered that parts of the constitution may be outdated and harmful to americans? I think that's why they allow amendments. Anyway, I know that we, as a species, have learned and developed a LOT since the Constitution was drafted. To think that one room of people 220 years ago know the best way for society to function now is just silly.

I think we give the founding fathers a bit too much credit for that anyway. They did draft the documents - but they didn't just pull the stuff out of thin air. They actually used equivalent British documents as the founding basis for the US versions.

There is a (very old) English Bill of rights, for example, that includes a right to bear arms.

And what happened to the English Bill of Rights that includes a right to bear arms?

I'm just not going to consider EVERYTHING in the Constitution as infallable. Also, not every right allowed by the Bill of Rights is absolute.

Seriously, though, our founding fathers thought they landed in India.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Has anyone ever considered that parts of the constitution may be outdated and harmful to americans? I think that's why they allow amendments. Anyway, I know that we, as a species, have learned and developed a LOT since the Constitution was drafted. To think that one room of people 220 years ago know the best way for society to function now is just silly.

I think we give the founding fathers a bit too much credit for that anyway. They did draft the documents - but they didn't just pull the stuff out of thin air. They actually used equivalent British documents as the founding basis for the US versions.

There is a (very old) English Bill of rights, for example, that includes a right to bear arms.

And what happened to the English Bill of Rights that includes a right to bear arms?

I'm just not going to consider EVERYTHING in the Constitution as infallable. Also, not every right allowed by the Bill of Rights is absolute.

Seriously, though, our founding fathers thought they landed in India.

I believe the English document was from the 1600s - it didn't become less relevant exactly - rather we had some political issues with how government was run (that whole deal with the English Civil War and the monarchy coming into and out of favor). The document itself was also couched in the language and politics of the Reformation (i.e. originally it was stipulated that only Protestants were allowed to bear arms. It was later expanded to include Catholics also).

The most apt comparison, in modern times anyway - is that of the pre-war German Weimar constitution. That's the best example of how dangerous it is to tinker with founding values.

[Ban Hammer 14,290]

So now, instead of a deranged individual having to buy a gun before going on a rampage, he just needs to find someone carrying and steal the gun from them.

With more fuel on the fire, i guess some would rather rely on natural selection to take care of the problem.

that's such a brilliant idea....unarmed yoyo tries to take gun from armed citizen.

my cch class included training in how to keep someone from getting your firearm.

Just because someone may not be able to take away a gun from you, doesn't mean that person won't be successful in taking away a gun from someone else.

i just don't see someone unarmed taking a gun from a cch holder while they are carrying when there are other alternatives for them to obtain a firearm without the threat of personal injury.

[AnewKINDofFEELIN 0]

Has anyone ever considered that parts of the constitution may be outdated and harmful to americans? I think that's why they allow amendments. Anyway, I know that we, as a species, have learned and developed a LOT since the Constitution was drafted. To think that one room of people 220 years ago know the best way for society to function now is just silly.

I think we give the founding fathers a bit too much credit for that anyway. They did draft the documents - but they didn't just pull the stuff out of thin air. They actually used equivalent British documents as the founding basis for the US versions.

There is a (very old) English Bill of rights, for example, that includes a right to bear arms.

And what happened to the English Bill of Rights that includes a right to bear arms?

I'm just not going to consider EVERYTHING in the Constitution as infallable. Also, not every right allowed by the Bill of Rights is absolute.

Seriously, though, our founding fathers thought they landed in India.

I believe the English document was from the 1600s - it didn't become less relevant exactly - rather we had some political issues with how government was run (that whole deal with the English Civil War and the monarchy coming into and out of favor). The document itself was also couched in the language and politics of the Reformation (i.e. originally it was stipulated that only Protestants were allowed to bear arms. It was later expanded to include Catholics also).

The most apt comparison, in modern times anyway - is that of the pre-war German Weimar constitution. That's the best example of how dangerous it is to tinker with founding values.

I just feel like there should be a limit to a person's right to bear arms.

[DeadPoolX 9]

I may be a pro-gun person, but I have an interesting idea... what if we attempt get to the root of the problem, instead of merely waiting for someone to go crazy and then blow them away? I realize this might take more time, money and effort, but perhaps if we invested heavier in psychological services, proactive and prevention programs, we wouldn't need to get to the stage where carrying a firearm on campus would be necessary.

After all... even the most psychotic criminals and killers don't turn that way overnight. Something happens to them and more often than not, they don't receive the proper attention, support and help they needed in the first place. If they had, maybe they wouldn't have gone on a killing spree.

Just a thought.

Edited February 26, 2008 by DeadPoolX

[AnewKINDofFEELIN 0]

I may be a pro-gun person, but I have an interesting idea... what if we attempt get to the root of the problem, instead of merely waiting for someone to go crazy and then blow them away? I realize this might take more time, money and effort, but perhaps if we invested heavier in psychological services, proactive and prevention programs, we wouldn't need to get to the stage where carrying a firearm on campus would be necessary.

After all... even the most psychotic criminals and killers don't turn that way overnight. Something happens to them and more often than not, they don't receive the proper attention, support and help they needed in the first place. If they had, maybe they wouldn't have gone on a killing spree.

Just a thought.

Sounds reasonable. It does seem like a generation of poor parenting is a major cause of it. Everyone wants to point out how messed up generation X is without pointing out how poor of a job the baby boomers did raising them. More emphasis should be placed on family and home life than we do now. Everyone is so vain and outwardly boastful that they forget to look inward.

[Ban Hammer 14,290]

my cch class included training in how to keep someone from getting your firearm.

My driver's education class taught me how to avoid accidents.

well good for you!

[PlatyPius 5]

Sounds reasonable. It does seem like a generation of poor parenting is a major cause of it. Everyone wants to point out how messed up generation X is without pointing out how poor of a job the baby boomers did raising them. More emphasis should be placed on family and home life than we do now. Everyone is so vain and outwardly boastful that they forget to look inward.

Rocinante Approves of This Post.

[Peikko 1,575]

USA society doesn't favour family life despite the religious fervour of the far right. There has to be a way to balance the needs of society with the needs of business. To blame it on 'bad parenting' for x amount of years I find somewhat bizarre.