venusfire503

I'm a little more paranoid, I guess - I don't know that it's worth the risk... even if the chance of something going wrong is small... It's up to you, though.

Make sure you don't leave the country until you get status!

There's no actual time limit, but technically once you marry, the beneficiary is in an odd place in regards to immigration status. Don't worry too much, but make sure to send in the paperwork as soon as you can. I've heard some stories about problems due to strange situations. The main thing is, if someone procrastinates, there's too much of a chance to keep putting it off for different reasons. I heard about a couple that got married, even had a child, but never filed. Unfortunately the USC ended up dying some years later, which created a huge problem since the beneficiary then couldn't adjust status... (I never did find out what happened)

Don't feel stupid - my husband was very nervous when he visited Morocco as a green card holder, too. Everything went fine, though. You don't need anything other than what you mentioned.

Enjoy your trip!

venusfire

I love this thread - I was just thinking it might be a good idea to have 2 pinned threads - one about relationships that didn't work out (what is most commonly posted), and another about relationships that are working. It would be a good way to show both, and have some balance. This way, if someone is concerned for any reason, they could read the 'warning' thread, but if they need to read something positive (the journey is so difficult, and hearing negative things is sometimes a little too much) they can read about the success stories.

I'm one of those who rarely makes an appearance, because my husband got his citizenship more than 2 years ago. We celebrated our 7 year anniversary recently, and people who see us with each other are surprised we've been together so long because we're so happy! We like to hang out together, even if it's just sitting on the couch, or shoveling snow (like today). He sometimes surprises me at work by showing up to spend my lunch break with me - that always brightens my day. We made it through the entire immigration process, from being in different countries, all the way up through citizenship, and beyond. We were totally different people - on paper - when we met, but our hearts are very similar, which is why I think we've made it despite the odds. We also take good care of each other, and make our marriage a priority.

venusfire

I see plenty of good posts here. I admit I haven't been on VJ much for a while, and am unfamiliar with the people and situations. But some things haven't changed. There are still relationships that work, and some that don't. I just want to put in my two cents, without claiming that what I have to say does or does not apply to any particular people.

One thing that I remember from the earlier days of my 'journey' is how annoying it was (and still is) when people bad-mouth/sterotype/pigeon hole MENA people and MENA/USC relationships. Trust me, I completely understand that people who have been hurt emotionally (and also sometimes - but not always - have been used for immigration purposes) want to warn everyone else. It makes sense to want to spare others the pain you're going through - I'm not a psychologist but am sure there's a deeper psychological reason, too, about taking back a sense of control of one's own situation by helping someone else avoid potential harm or something. However, I think in their state of pain, too many over-do it and claim that ALL (fill in the blank - here, usually MENA men) are scammers who use women for visas/green cards/citizenship. It makes others defensive, and can also actually push some to overlook certain things they might not accept otherwise. If you keep hearing that younger Moroccan men always target older American women, for example (one thing I kept hearing), you might be more inclined to insist to others - and maybe yourself - that 'everyone' has to be wrong, because "that could never happen to me".

Let's be honest. Yes, it DOES happen. Yes, even (fill in the blank - young, attractive, intelligent, confident - whatever you want to put in there) women can get scammed. Yes, it's probably more likely when the women are older, wealthy, overweight, whatever. But the thing is - and someone mentioned something about this - it's NOT IN EVERY CASE. Even in the most sterotypical cases, it's possible that the man really does love the woman, has the best of intentions, and the relationship will last and be a good one.

What used to bother me was that people made their assumptions on what they knew and could see, and not from any 'insider information' about our relationship. I had people, when they heard I married someone from another country, tell me about some guy they knew who scammed someone for a green card, etc. These people included friends, family members, and even people I barely knew. I don't care how solid your relationship is, marriage is challenging. Add in those other stressors such as the immigration process, being in different countries, the waiting, cultural adjustments, etc, and it's even more difficult to deal with. Having people feel the need to tell you that you're probably being scammed (or being told you're crazy, etc) - especially when it's coming from a faceless online post - can bring out the worst in anyone! No wonder there are arguments here! It's annoying when it's coming from someone who has no idea what they're talking about (like a woman I know who never left the small town she was born in and turned white as a ghost when she met my husband), but it's downright scary when it comes from someone in an international relationship that didn't work out.

Then I wonder if I should tell our story. I don't want to encourage anyone who actually is being scammed but hasn't figured it out yet. Not mentioning anyone in particular (as I said, I'm unfamiliar with almost everyone here, except a few 'old-timers' who almost definitely are past the point where they could be scammed and not know it yet), but statistically speaking, there's bound to be at least one person in that situation who will read this. I don't want my relationship to lull them into a false sense of security. At the same time, I remember getting down sometimes because of all of the negativity directed toward me or others in relationships with MENA men. As sure as I was about my SO, it was difficult at times to feel constantly badgered and/or 'warned' about men "like that". I took solace in hearing about successful relationships, especially when they had similarities to my situation.

Then again, I feel that there are plenty of warnings about the scammers. So, just to add a little balance: I am more than a decade older than my husband. I met him online while going through a divorce, and I have children with my (American) ex-husband. We had/have many of those "red flags" - such as differences in language, religion, culture, etc. I had some money from my divorce, but we're currently experiencing financial difficulties like most people. He's been a citizen for a few years now, and we've been married more than 7 years. We're very happy together, and I don't foresee any problems. I'm not recommending that people do things the way we did, but also want to say that it worked for us.

I think it's a good idea to read through the forums and get ideas of what has happened to others, and what works for some. But don't think that your relationship is going to fit in the exact mould as someone else's. Just be aware of what could happen (good or bad), and look honestly at yourself, your SO, and your relationship. Don't assume that just because of A or B that your relationship is good to go, or that it's doomed. It's not the things on paper that make or break a marriage, it's what's inside the people in it.

I was in a horrible, life-sucking marriage in the past, and now I'm in a wonderful, positive one, so I understand how it is on both ends of the spectrum. I sincerely wish the best of luck to everyone!

No one is blaming you for being abused. But the bottom line is, you alone bear the responsibility for continuing a petition for a man who physically abused you. That's not BLAME, but it is the truth. Your job, imo, is to figure out WHY you did that.

I must admit I read the abuse as having been prior to marriage. It was a bit vague. But ok, you were married when it started but it was before he came here.

No one is 'at fault' for being a victim/survivor of physical abuse....HOWEVER, you need to figure out how you rationalized it as being acceptable enough to get past it, and not immediately canceling his petition. We all tend to ignore warning signs...some more dire than others. This was a big one for you, and I believe your path should involve getting the root of how you were able to ignore this. For your own peace of mind, I suggest focusing on that so you don't repeat a similar pattern in future.

However, he didn't scam/assault/whatever you because he was from MENA. You're bootstrapping (imo) as way of dealing with this in a way that I don't think is fair to yourself, to truly be able to put this behind you. I see you clutching at straws....'I'm not fat, I'm not ugly, I converted, I did blah blah blah'. It's not formulaic...none of those reasons will help you really put this to bed and deal with it. It's not as if any of these listed reasons could or would justify what happened to you.

Again, I wish you well and I'm very sorry you had to go through this. I hope you can see that I'm not posting here to 'pile up' on you, rather to offer you another perspective, that I feel will *truly* help you on the road to healing.

VERY well put!

Excuse me, or you are assuming things? First off you and the other posters have tried to justify the bad behavior done to me by painting me as the one with a problem, rather than looking at the situation for what it really is, a man who was a scam artist and played in my head, as dozens of other men have done on here to other women. You guys paint the woman as the culprit as a defense mechanism to convince yourself that the same won't happen to you because you are "mentally stable" and able to choose a good partner. Good luck. Remember that princes can turn into frogs overnight. Mwahhhh

If you don't learn, and take steps to prevent that from happening again (by NOT being blinded by lust, naive, etc) then you run the risk of it happening again. Nothing is 100% fail-proof, but there are ways to minimize the chances of bad things happening (like eating healthy, wearing a seatbelt, and really taking a look at relationships before losing yourself in them).

Maybe at the end of the day its the man who asks the woman to marry! I was 22 and blinded by lust. This guy took advantage and made lots of promises, in addition to throwing gifts and gold and fancy European trips at me. I am a very respectable person. I was just naive and lonely and I didn't know the truth about him until all these skeletons came popping out of his closet after our 1 year anniversary. THE POINT IS, it doesn't matter how careful somebody is or how loving a man seems, it is a big risk when you combine all these factors of visa interests and cultural differences combined with religion and distance.

If the man asks, it's still the woman who says "yes" or "no" (I'm actually the one who first suggested marriage in my case). It doesn't matter who asks anyway, you both still married each other.

At least you admit that you were: blinded by lust, naive, and lonely - and fell for his ruse. That's a promising sign. Yes, he's a jerk who took advantage of you - no one is disputing that (as far as I've seen). But we can't change a-holes. All we can do is protect ourselves. I don't think anyone here is 'blaming' you - we're just saying that you fell for him for whatever reason, and if you figure out how to prevent that in the future, then you'll be better off. It's much easier to 'warn' others than figure out how to 'warn' ourselves sometimes. Trust me, I look back at my first marriage and can't believe how stupid I was! I'm just happy I didn't repeat my mistakes (we can't change the past).

I think the over-the-top courting would've been a red flag to me. When a man tries to dazzle a woman, I can't help but wonder what (if anything) he's trying to hide. Kind of along the line of "if it seems too good to be true...." Not saying a man can't spend money on a woman, but if that's how he 'makes' her fall for him, then there could be a problem. I fell in love with my husband's heart, his consideration for me and my feelings, and the way he treated me (without money). Yes, the visa is an additional risk, which is why I made sure to carefully listen to what he did (and did not) say, and how he felt about different things. Most importantly, I am aware of his strengths and weaknesses. No one's perfect, but we have to decide what flaws we can and cannot tolerate, and we need to be realistic about what we are/are not, and what our spouses are/are not.

Best of luck to all of us!

He paid for everything.

Your dad is still financially responsible for him.

Again, you are the one judging WITHOUT knowing the entire story. The abuse started AFTER marriage and whether the women on here want to admit it or not, I guarantee at least one of you has had to endure some type of physical or verbal abuse at the hands of a MENA spouse.

YOU are judging everyone here without knowing OUR stories. You think just because I'm an American married to a MENA man that I must have converted, lost my identity by taking on his culture, and that he'll some day turn on me. And that must be true of all (or at least most) of the women who have married MENA men.

I know who I am. Yes, I like some of the music he brought here with him (I've always liked being exposed to new music by people I know, ever since I was a child) just as he likes new music that he discovered here, and I occasionally cook the recipes he gave me (c'mon - couscous - who can blame me?) just as he's developed a taste for American foods, I find it odd when people I meet assume I would've converted. I tell them no, and he hasn't converted either. Yes, I flew hours to visit with him (he couldn't do the same because of the difficulties in getting a tourist visa), but he LEFT THE ONLY LIFE HE KNEW to be with me in a totally unfamiliar and not always welcoming place. He learned my language (which he barely knew at first - now he's fluent), and I barely know any of his. I didn't even 'cover' when I visited his country. If anything, he's done more and given up more than I have.

I was married to an emotionally abusive American before. My MENA husband (NO quotes) has supported me and encouraged me (as I've done for him - I think that's vital to a good relationship), and I've not just survived, but I've risen to the challenges that I've encountered. I've accomplished more in the 7+ years I've known him than I previously thought I could. He has empowered me and helped me see what's wonderful about myself. HE is not abusive. I learned from the mistakes I made marrying my abusive ex. We all just want you to do the same thing.

You claim to be 'over' him and the relationship, but the fact that you feel the need to bash anyone with his "same" background (according to you - I think there are vast differences throughout the entire MENA area) and/or anyone in a MENA/non-MENA relationship says otherwise. I don't feel the need to group all men from my ex's background with him, or warn others to avoid Italian-Americans (just self-centered, uncaring, manipulative men of ANY background).

We're not defensive about our men because we're afraid of anything within our relationships - we're just sick of the stereotyping, and the unfair discrimination against them by people who think they're all alike. Oh, and the stereotyping of women who love them.

Any man can change overnight. My mom's best friend, her husband had a brain injury in an accident. After surgeries and rehab he came home and wasn't the same. He verbally abused his wife and started cheating on her. He's about as WASP as WASP can be.

For your information, I'm not defending blind love here. I have said some pretty reprehensible things on this forum to women who I thought were in their relationships with blinders on. I guess I was hoping to give them pause before they made what I thought would be a big mistake. I regret the delivery of my message now. But I still firmly believe people shouldn't rush into marriage without considering what the real challenges will be. I mean that about everyone, not just American-MENA couples. Divorce is expensive, no joke.

I know a woman whose husband changed (drastically) after 20+ years of marriage. They're both "white Americans".

I would suggest getting sleep, getting familiar with your area, observing, figuring out where to find things (favorite foods, stores, etc).

Oh, and you could get a journal or notebook or something - write down your thoughts. Take pictures/videos, if you can. My SO did some of that when he first got here, and it's really nice to look over it now!

The best part, though, is enjoying the company of the person you love, knowing that you're finally together for good!

Enjoy!

venusfire

So, I have a question....

I know we're not allowed to help someone stay here illegally. But now I have a new job, and have been told that we're a non-reporting agency. In other words, if clients tell me they are illegal, I'm not supposed to report them (same if they admit to fleeing the law, for example). My husband is now a citizen, so that makes it a little less complicated, but... is this a conflict of interest? I can't take a chance of losing my job, so I can't report anyone (I was told even if questioned by someone official, I should just refer them to my supervisor). At the same time, what should someone in my position do, especially if they or their SO is 'only' a permanent resident or just applied for residency?

venusfire

P.S. kind of off topic, but I also found out I'm a mandatory reporter for child abuse - kind of strange (but I'd rather be allowed to report suspected child abuse)

Sorry, this is condensed and simplified, but correct and in chronological order.

I was married once before. He filed for divorce. I met my SO online, then went to visit him. I started to prepare the K-1 paperwork. I visited my SO again, and we worked on more paperwork. I got my divorce decree and immediately sent out the packet (the divorce decree was required for the packet to be complete). So, I got engaged while technically still married - but I was in the middle of getting a divorce. I didn't send the petition until the divorce was finalized. As someone pointed out, you MUST be free to marry to petition - otherwise, it will be rejected/returned/denied (whatever term you want to use).

My SO said he was questioned about this during his visa interview. He just told them the truth - yes, he was talking to and then engaged to a technically still married woman. But, we didn't meet until after I was already in the process of divorce. He told them we were simply waiting for the divorce to be finalized.

It can definitely raise red flags if you were the beneficiary, divorced the USC, and then petition for someone from your "home country", though, so if that's true in your case, make sure to be prepared for that. If it just worked out that way and wasn't planned, don't be nervous. (easier said than done)

Of course, there is no guarantee a visa will be issued in ANY case, but being engaged "too early" isn't an automatic denial either. I think I've heard of people who were able to get a visa even when they started dating before anyone filed for divorce (not giving any opinions on this - just reporting what I think I remember hearing). Of course, the "cleaner" your case, the more likely the chance of success. Our case wasn't the most uncomplicated/pristine one, but it all worked out well. I hope that gives hope to others!

venusfire

Sorry this is so short - it's late, and I really need to get to bed. I just happened to see your thread, and wanted to chime in. My husband and I are very happy. We've been together for more than 6 years now (he's been here more than 5-1/2 of those). We both hated when (small minded) people assumed he was just with me for - well, first the visa, then the green card, then citizenship - just because he was from a MENA country. Now that he's been a citizen for more than a year, those people have finally shut up!

heehee

I wish I had time to read though what everyone else has to say (hopefully another day, soon). I just remember how scary it was at times, hearing the worst of what could happen, and loving to hear the happy stories. Now we are one of the happy stories!

Best of luck to all!

venusfire

Hi daroum! Welcome to MENA VJ.

I need to bone up on my french and arabic languages well enough to read and write fluently in them so I can be of some help here.

Yes you could try for a tourist visa or even a student visa and it's not very difficult but it will cost money and is not always guaranteed. Women being petitioned for don't have as difficult a time from the MENA region with their petitions. I suspect in your case since your husband came on a lottery visa and you're already married that it will be rather quick and easy for your case.

My question is what is holding up your husband from filing as soon as possible to bring you over here? Is it money? If it is money then I'd put it towards the family based visa of CR-1/IR-1 because the K3 no longer is an option. The processing times have increased on the CR-1/IR-1 with the average taking about 11 months from first filing the petition to receiving the visa to travel here. I'm not certain about Algeria though because sometimes the visa process can be case specific. Your husband should really file that petition quickly because there is no reason you should have to endure a long distances relationship. LDRs are really difficult especially when you're both already married. It was so stressful on me waiting all those years for my husband to come here and now I think if it was for my protection or the countries then the extreme caution and background casing was all for nothing really. He's fine and like a lamb really. We couldn't be happier now that we're counting the years together instead of day, weeks and months. Couples getting to be together is happiness and being apart is pure hellishness.

I hope you guys get to be together soon and that you keep us, in the MENA forum, updated on your case and what you decide to do.

It might be 11 months if the petitioner is a USC, but isn't it different if the petitioner is a permanent resident (as hers is)?

Sorry - brain hasn't woken up yet, and I'm really rusty on immigration things now....

Best of luck to all!

venusfire

We saw each other on webcam before meeting in person - it was the easiest way to converse, since we could talk to and hear each other (for free). Typing for hours every night got tiring after a while! I took a laptop to him the second trip, so we could talk during the day and also have privacy. I used to sleep on the couch then (I only had a desktop computer, and it was near the couch), and he kept his computer in his room. We'd keep our cams open all night so if one of us woke up, we could see the other sleeping. It was a way to feel closer to each other. Ok, so I occasionally videotaped him on the cam, snoring..... He got me back after he got here, though.

Also, once I got to know him and we decided to do the K-1, I introduced him to my children using the camera, so they'd be somewhat used to him before he got here. I used the webcam when I visited him so I could connect with my kids - it helped, since I missed them so much! They liked being able to see me, too. I also got to see his family on cam.

I loved that he was so respectful on the camera - it was one of the things that won me over.

Time goes so quickly. We've been married 5-1/2 years now, and he's been a citizen for more than a year. Just wanted to add that.

Best wishes to all!

Ramadan kareem

venusfire

Just assume if the phrase "my queen" is ever uttered - you are a kersmillion percent likely being taken for a ride.

just being facetious of course, but ya know - when it's laid on that thick..

Maybe that's it - he never called me his queen.

HAHA

Seriously, I wish I could stay up and read the rest of the posts, but I can't. Without REALLY paying for it tomorrow.

I feel compelled to mention my relationship when topics like this come up because if I had listened to all of the warnings about other relationships, I would have missed out on the best relationship - one I never could have imagined. I read and heard the worst things... but once people met him, their opinions changed. Yes, everyone needs to take a step back and make sure they're not overlooking things because of the excitement. But I think it's important to really look at it and not just write it off immediately just because of where he's from, age differences, different religions, whatever. That's what I did - I heard all the horror stories, but did my best to look at our relationship honestly. I didn't assume the relationship was going to work just because I was in love, but I also didn't assume it wasn't going to work just because I'm older and he's a Muslim MENA man.

I am very sad when I hear about what some posters are going through. Although I'm very lucky with my MENA man, I am going through horrors with my (USC) ex. He makes it his hobby to do anything he can to make me miserable. It's not exactly the same as being used/scammed or whatever... but I wish I didn't have to deal with it. I can't get into it all here and now, but one thing I'll say is he's not above sacrificing the children's happiness to accomplish his selfish goals. How sick is that? That's really all he has on me, and he maximizes it. I would never 'use' my children. I live by the saying "love your children more than you hate your ex".

Anyway, I wish peace, happiness, and love to everyone.

venusfire

How many of them brought their husband to the United States and how many met them here? How many are converts to Islam

Any marriages you know of where the woman is lets say 8 to 13 years older that after 5 years they are together?

Mine. I'm 11 years older, and we've been married more than 5 years now and together almost 6 years.

I brought him here. Neither of us converted.

It is a warning against MENA men so lets not try to sugarcoat it. I know tons of wildly successful MENA/American marriages. They are similar in age or the man is older, have children together, and share a religion. The shortest has been married for over 5 years and the longest close to 14. These are personal friends of ours but we know, through the grapevine, of those married much much longer. It's not all gloom and doom but you have to be honest and take a good look at yourself and your partner.

I wholeheartedly agree with Staashi

We don't share a religion, either.

I'm the older one.

Oh, and not only does he parent my children from before, he deals with the ####### from their father. Those who say it's none of his business are delusional. Anything that affects one of us (especially that much) affects both of us to some extent.

Maybe the odds aren't the greatest, but it IS possible for a MENA man to fall in love with an American woman who is older and be a wonderful husband to her.

And TRUST ME, he FAR outshines the American man (around my age) who I married the first time. In every way.

venusfire

Actually, let me say, it is a MENA warning - when I look at my friends who are married to MENA dudes, the only ones that seemed to have worked out are the ones where the couples are similar in age and are able to bear children. I only know of one couple on here that had an age difference but are still together. I remember Debbie and her posts, I thought she and her husband would make it - and here we are, another scammer.

And yes, Americans get divorced all the time, however, some poor chick doesn't have to spend thousands of dollars on the front end to bring her dude over here.

Please know, I'm not against immigration and foreign relationships. I have many friends with great relationships with their MENA dudes, but they are in an exclusive group. So yes, when it comes to those red flags take them seriously. Not every guy is an azzhole, but ask yourself this question: if you don't have men beating down your doors in the US, what makes you think they're going to beat down your doors from afar without something to benefit them?

I just want to let everyone know that I'm part of a couple that is working out. He's been a citizen since last summer. I'm 11 years older, and we don't have a child together (we'd love to, but the chances of it happening arent very high).

As far as men beating down my door... I never took the time to find out if they would or not (Americans or not). I wasn't looking for a relationship - I was just talking to people for something to do, and ended up falling in love. Luckily for me, he did too.

There might be general rules, but not absolute ones.

venusfire

If getting her here quickly AND marrying there are both important, what about doing the K-1 (which seems to be faster, from what everyone is saying), and then later having a wedding ceremony in her country so her family can attend?

Just a thought.

venusfire

USAA Federal Savings Bank also let me add my SO before he even got here. I opened a joint account and sent him the ATM card so he could access money for things like his medical exam, without the delay, hassle, and expense of sending through a service like Moneygram. I also liked that he could just take smaller sums when needed, instead of lump sums. I just needed his passport number, and they added him. Later, I called and updated his information once he got here and got his ss#.

venusfire

It might be a good idea to pin this.....

venusfire