garya505

I'll have to watch H&C - I'm not sure Obama will do well with someone as combative as Hannity.

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see. But I gotta give him props for coming on H&C at all.

Ya, he's got balls to do that.

Will McCain or Obama if elected push for this? After jumping thru all the hoops and paying hard earned cash to get your SO in the US LEGALLY.

I understand why they come here illegally .......... but..........i dont like it.....i was born in Guatemala.....my parents brought me here legally......yup i know a lot will disagree with me but.......those of us that have worked hard to be usa citizens the right way it does not sit well with us when something is given to people that come here the wrong way.......

Word!

When I explain this stuff to my wife, who came here legally, she thinks it's NUTS!

Seems honest and unambiguous.

Sounds good to me too. If no tapes surface, he should be able to ride this one out with minimal residual damage.

In context we're talking about one chapter of a very large nationwide church attended by approximately 1.2 million people nationwide whose members variously include:

Daniel Akaka — U.S. Senator from Hawaii (Democrat)

Max Baucus — U.S. Senator from Montana (Democrat)

Julian Bond — Chair NAACP (2004–present)

Walter Brueggemann — contemporary theologian, poet, and UCC minister, retired professor at Columbia Theological Seminary

William Sloane Coffin — Late Presbyterian/UCC minister and activist; 'pastor, prophet, poet'; former Chaplain at Yale University and Senior Pastor of Riverside Church, New York City

Common — Rapper, recording artist, member of Trinity UCC in Chicago

Jon Corzine — Governor of New Jersey (Democrat)

Howard Dean — Former Governor of Vermont (Democrat)

Mark Fernald — Former New Hampshire State senator pg 10

Donald Hall — United States US Poet Laureate

Mills Godwin — Former Governor of Virginia

Bob Graham — Former U.S. Senator from Florida (Democrat)

Judd Gregg — U.S. Senator from New Hampshire (Republican)

Jim Jeffords — Former U.S. Senator from Vermont (Independent)

Dean Koontz — American writer and author. Raised UCC, now is Catholic.

John Williamson Nevin — notable 19th-century theologian

Barack Obama — U.S. Senator, 2008 presidential candidate

Robert Orr — Assistant Secretary General of the United Nations

H. Richard Niebuhr — notable 20th-century theologian

Reinhold Niebuhr — notable 20th-century theologian

Sally Pederson — former Lieutenant Governor of Iowa (Democrat)

Leonard Pitts — Nationally syndicated Pulitzer prize–winning (2004) columnist

Marilynne Robinson — Pulitzer prize-winning (2005) author of the novel Gilead

Philip Schaff — notable 19th-century theologian

George Smathers — Democratic Senator from Florida

Max L. Stackhouse — public theologian and professor at Princeton Theological Seminary

William "Bill" McKinney — President of Pacific School of Religion, since 1996

Paul Tillich — notable 20th-century theologian

Andrew Young — Civil rights leader, ordained UCC pastor, and former member of Congress, UN ambassador, and mayor of Atlanta, Georgia

Jeri Kehn Thompson - wife of Law & Order star and former U.S. Senator and presidential candidate Fred Thompson

The Chicago chapter is one congregation of this church. We're not talking some obscure place in the back of beyond.

It's not the church that's in question here, it's Obama's choice of pastor. The questions are, did Obama know about this guy's political beliefs, did he listen to it in his sermons, and did he agree?

I think it's a stretch that Rev, Wright only talked about his political views once in 20 years...

Is that what you read? Because that's not what I wrote.

If Wright talked like this often then Obama would have known about it from others. So, then only actually hearing it himself once would be less relevant.

Republicans always say that the Democrats will be weak on terrorist,But as i reamber 9/11 happen on the Republicans watch.

Bill Clinton was the one who had several chances to get Bin Laden and missed. Bush was only on office a few months before 9/11.

I agree with both of you. But the thing is, black nationalism scares a lot of people. Rev. Wrights words are clearly very radical. If the perception is that Obama is closely tied to this guy, then he needs to fix it. Irritating? Yes. But he still has to.

His statement reads well. He says he never heard anything like this in the sermons he attended or any of the private conversations he's had. Hopefully no new tape comes out proving him wrong.

I posted that in another thread.

I think it's a stretch that Rev, Wright only talked about his political views once in 20 years, and that Obama wasn't there that time, but I suppose it's possible.

New tape would be a disaster.

Again, its one comment being fussed about 5 years ago when the politician in question was not even in audience. Facts!

The pastor only talked about politics once, 5 years ago?

I have relatives and friends who have some pretty far out ideas - politically. Should I not talk to them anymore simply because I disagree with some of their beliefs?

If one of these friends is your religious leader and you listen to his/her sermon every week, and you are planning on running for a high level elected office (like President, for example), then yes you should dump him/her. It's just common sense.

Then I guess the Bushes should have dumped the anti-American Bin Ladens from their commercial contacts.

If Bush was running for President now that might be a valid question, but he's not.

Just curious, the Bin Laden family is large, are they all anti- American?

Religious leaders use the pulpit ALL THE TIME to speak about political issues. Abortion; prayer in schools; public education; 'sin' taxes on drink and cigarettes; zoning - you name it, they talk about it - especially local politics, where their comments and idealogy can actually be more influential.

As if racism and gender weren't enough in this contest, now we have to throw religion into the mix. Reminds of Kennedy and how some folks were afraid if he were elected the Pope would be running the country. Now we're skeered of the minister........

Religion gets added to the mix if a candidate has a long-time religious leader who chooses to use his pulpit as a place to promote his political views. It's only common sense to ask then, does the candidate share those political views? If not, why would he listen to them for 20 years?

I have relatives and friends who have some pretty far out ideas - politically. Should I not talk to them anymore simply because I disagree with some of their beliefs?

If one of these friends is your religious leader and you listen to his/her sermon every week, and you are planning on running for a high level elected office (like President, for example), then yes you should dump him/her. It's just common sense.

I have to wonder why Obama didn't distance himself from this guy a long time ago.

I don't understand this concept. Do we only associate ourselves with people who think exactly like us? Obviously, they both share a love for God. I've been a member of Parish where the priest's homilies would make some people get up and walk out. My father, who is a deacon has preached, and after Mass, had people come up to him and tell him they liked what he said as well as some who told him they didn't like it at all. Anyone who's listened to a preacher knows that many times they'll say things that make the congression go, 'huh?'

The pastor has political views that make him a liability to Obama.

So maybe he should be 'taken out?'

My best friend is conservative and has Republican party political aspirations. Does that make me a liability to him? OR vice versa? We don't seem to think so.

People will ask, why would Obama have this guy as a pastor for 20 years if he doesn't agree with him on politics. I mean, would anyone choose to listen to a religious figure who they disagreed with for that long? There must be plenty of other pastors who Obama agrees with on religion, yet he chose this one. People are going to be wondering about that.

I have to wonder why Obama didn't distance himself from this guy a long time ago.

I don't understand this concept. Do we only associate ourselves with people who think exactly like us? Obviously, they both share a love for God. I've been a member of Parish where the priest's homilies would make some people get up and walk out. My father, who is a deacon has preached, and after Mass, had people come up to him and tell him they liked what he said as well as some who told him they didn't like it at all. Anyone who's listened to a preacher knows that many times they'll say things that make the congression go, 'huh?'

The pastor has political views that make him a liability to Obama.

I have to wonder why Obama didn't distance himself from this guy a long time ago.

Well? We're still waiting!

According to polls, 9 out of 10 black people in Mississippi voted for Obama and 7 out of 10 white people voted for Clinton. Does that mean Mississippi voters are racist? If so, are Mississippi blacks are more racist than whites? Or is there some other explanation?

I believe MMR is only contraindicated for pregnant women in the first trimester.

Who's McCain again?

He was interviewed on 60 Minutes last night. I find him to have a lot of great qualities.

So, does that mean we can count on your vote for McCain? I had you figured for a Clinton supporter.

I think having the #1 most liberal Senator running for President is a hinderance, frankly, to the Dem party.

It didn't work with Kerry, and it won't work with Obama either. That's why I'm hoping he gets the nomination.

This is so ugly.

When I read these threads I just feel really awful about people in general.

I mean obviously some posters are more rancorous, mean-spirited and generally unpleasant in most ways than others, but for the most part, this is just icky to read.

So don't?

Sometimes I suspect Alex is into S&M.

That was an appropriate response by Sen. Obama. Conversely, the Clinton's statement about a possible Clinton-Obama ticket is pre-mature, condescending, and bold. However, it was a good political tactic that was countered very well by Sen. Obama. Let the games begin... We can look forward to a back and forth exchange in the upcoming weeks. Even though it would be nice if the Democratic nominee was decided, I do look forward to the political death-match between the two heavy-weights.

Death-match!

I didn't become cynical, I have always been cynical about politicians because political people have to live a very different life style to most people.

To be a successful politician you have to devote most of your life to the service of politics. That's not a 9-5 job and it takes a certain egocentricity to be able to do that, particulary at the higher levels. What is important, is not that a leader is egocentric, but that he/she wishes to be a leader to achieve goals that are important to not just themselves, but the people who elect them.

Being cynical is not necessarily a bad thing, it can be, but only if you take it to such a degree that you see no good in anyone. I don't see any of the current crop of candidates as all bad, not even Huckabee (and yes I know he has finally dropped out!)

Its like Gore/Bush and Kerry/Bush... people, given the choice over how much damage a President could do to the planet, chose whom they chose and now we can see the effects of the decision. Its a clear and cut case this time around in my opinion, independent of which candidate you like more (or dislike more in others' convoluted views of reality), that if you wish for something to be done about things that are currently not happening how you like them, then try to at least bring in someone that at the minimum taunts a change rather than flaunting the status quo or worse, experience as a catchphrase.

I agree, it would have been much worse had we elected Gore and/or Kerry.

Care to tell that to the families of the fallen in Iraq?

Hindsight is always 20/20. There are many scenarios that would lead to much worse results than what has happened in Iraq.

I didn't become cynical, I have always been cynical about politicians because political people have to live a very different life style to most people.

To be a successful politician you have to devote most of your life to the service of politics. That's not a 9-5 job and it takes a certain egocentricity to be able to do that, particulary at the higher levels. What is important, is not that a leader is egocentric, but that he/she wishes to be a leader to achieve goals that are important to not just themselves, but the people who elect them.

Being cynical is not necessarily a bad thing, it can be, but only if you take it to such a degree that you see no good in anyone. I don't see any of the current crop of candidates as all bad, not even Huckabee (and yes I know he has finally dropped out!)

Its like Gore/Bush and Kerry/Bush... people, given the choice over how much damage a President could do to the planet, chose whom they chose and now we can see the effects of the decision. Its a clear and cut case this time around in my opinion, independent of which candidate you like more (or dislike more in others' convoluted views of reality), that if you wish for something to be done about things that are currently not happening how you like them, then try to at least bring in someone that at the minimum taunts a change rather than flaunting the status quo or worse, experience as a catchphrase.

I agree, it would have been much worse had we elected Gore and/or Kerry.

I'm curious as to what people would consider "too old" to have a baby.

I'd say, for women, too old is 45 and up. For men, they can never get too old

I am 30 and I feel that I should seriously consider having kids, only if we can provide for all their needs. Age is irrelevant to us now, we just have to wait for the perfect time.

The biggest need you have to provide is to love them and give them a good start in life. There will never be a perfect time. You could die tomorrow. Life is what happens while you are planning for the future.

If Clinton and Obama believe the Democratic Party is best for the US and really are interested in doing what's best for the country, in order to beat McCain they would get together and cook a deal where one of them would step down and the other would get a place in the cabinet. However, it appears that both of them are more interested in being President than doing what they believe is best for the country (or maybe they don't really believe it).