Amnesty international slams Israeli 'war crimes'

[I'm Gone 60]

That story will never see the light of day in any U.S. newpaper or news broadcast.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

doesn't anyone find the numbers on the wall interesting? another one of those staged pictures making the rounds....

I hope you're not suggesting the clearly bomb shattered cities of Southern Lebanon didn't precipitate more than a small amount of human suffering

i believe what i said above was quite clear........

So human suffering in Lebanon is staged?

Dropping bombs on populated area doesn't kill people?

sigh...for being so bright sometimes you are quite dense.

the pic in that one article was staged for the benefit of the photographer. i'm not saying that the coffins are not real, or that they don't contain dead people, or that bombing didn't occur. i am saying i've seen reports on this very photo, citing how the women are wedged between the coffins and the wall, with the large numbers painted above the coffins. all for the benefit of the photo opportunity.....

I wasn't focussing on the photo - but on the Amnesty report. What's your conclusion then - that the majority of the humanitarian suffering is grossly exaggerated or otherwise made up?

i was not addressing the amnesty report - just the picture used within it - nice try at baiting me.

Baiting you? Says the guy who launched right in with a personal attack.

The thread is about the Amnesty Report - I commented on the fact that we see fit to accept their findings when it pertains to oppressive totalitarian regimes like Burma, China, Iraq etc. but not when they point the finger of criticism at the US for Guantanamo Bay and secret "Black Hole" prisons, or our allies - such as Israel who, while they had justification to respond to Hezbollah aggression - did so in a typically heavy handed manner that has caused massive civilian death and displaced over 1 million people.

[Ban Hammer 14,295]

doesn't anyone find the numbers on the wall interesting? another one of those staged pictures making the rounds....

I hope you're not suggesting the clearly bomb shattered cities of Southern Lebanon didn't precipitate more than a small amount of human suffering

i believe what i said above was quite clear........

So human suffering in Lebanon is staged?

Dropping bombs on populated area doesn't kill people?

sigh...for being so bright sometimes you are quite dense.

the pic in that one article was staged for the benefit of the photographer. i'm not saying that the coffins are not real, or that they don't contain dead people, or that bombing didn't occur. i am saying i've seen reports on this very photo, citing how the women are wedged between the coffins and the wall, with the large numbers painted above the coffins. all for the benefit of the photo opportunity.....

I wasn't focussing on the photo - but on the Amnesty report. What's your conclusion then - that the majority of the humanitarian suffering is grossly exaggerated or otherwise made up?

i was not addressing the amnesty report - just the picture used within it - nice try at baiting me.

Baiting you? Says the guy who launched right in with a personal attack.

The thread is about the Amnesty Report - I commented on the fact that we see fit to accept their findings when it pertains to oppressive totalitarian regimes like Burma, China, Iraq etc. but not when they point the finger of criticism at the US for Guantanamo Bay and secret "Black Hole" prisons, or our allies - such as Israel who, while they had justification to respond to Hezbollah aggression - did so in a typically heavy handed manner that has caused massive civilian death and displaced over 1 million people.

yawn. when i'm commenting about the picture and you're trying to draw me into something about the article, either you have an agenda or you're being dense. your choice as to which one

Edited August 23, 2006 by charlesandnessa

[Fischkoepfin 1]

And on the topic of the numbers, the ones spray-painted on the wall were the kind used in the west, not in South Lebanon, thus erasing any doubt about the photo-op’s intended audience.

You are not suggesting that people in Lebanon don't use Arabic numerals as we do, are you?

The phote might be staged, but so what? The women mourning have the right to make their personal loss public and have it broadcasted to a wide audience because the world has obviously failed them.

About the report: Like erekose, I find it odd that Amnesty is good when it tells us that Iran or Syria commit crimes against humanity but bad when they draw attention to Israel's war crimes? And this is not a question of definition. The Geneva conventions clearly state that in times of war the attacker should try to inflict the least possible "collateral damage." Dropping guided missiles into civilian neighborhoods is not a way to prevent civilian casualties.

Finally, it is also not as if AI singles out Israel. The article says:

The group also calls for a UN investigation into whether both Israel and Hezbollah broke humanitarian law.

It later states that:

The human rights organisation said it would look into Hezbollah's attacks on Israel separately.

None of this suggests that AI is biased against Israel or that they are trying to blame Israel for the war. Instead, they draw attention to the fact that we, as an audience constantly confronted in war, have become so desensitized to the cost of war, that we don't consider civilian casualties an outrage anymore, as long as we can justify their death as being somehow connected to the "war on terror."

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

doesn't anyone find the numbers on the wall interesting? another one of those staged pictures making the rounds....

I hope you're not suggesting the clearly bomb shattered cities of Southern Lebanon didn't precipitate more than a small amount of human suffering

i believe what i said above was quite clear........

So human suffering in Lebanon is staged?

Dropping bombs on populated area doesn't kill people?

sigh...for being so bright sometimes you are quite dense.

the pic in that one article was staged for the benefit of the photographer. i'm not saying that the coffins are not real, or that they don't contain dead people, or that bombing didn't occur. i am saying i've seen reports on this very photo, citing how the women are wedged between the coffins and the wall, with the large numbers painted above the coffins. all for the benefit of the photo opportunity.....

I wasn't focussing on the photo - but on the Amnesty report. What's your conclusion then - that the majority of the humanitarian suffering is grossly exaggerated or otherwise made up?

i was not addressing the amnesty report - just the picture used within it - nice try at baiting me.

Baiting you? Says the guy who launched right in with a personal attack.

The thread is about the Amnesty Report - I commented on the fact that we see fit to accept their findings when it pertains to oppressive totalitarian regimes like Burma, China, Iraq etc. but not when they point the finger of criticism at the US for Guantanamo Bay and secret "Black Hole" prisons, or our allies - such as Israel who, while they had justification to respond to Hezbollah aggression - did so in a typically heavy handed manner that has caused massive civilian death and displaced over 1 million people.

yawn. when i'm commenting about the picture and you're trying to draw me into something about the article, either you have an agenda or you're being dense. your choice as to which one

No I'm not. I'm commenting on the report at the centre of this news story, which is topic under discussion. Simply wondering why you focus on one specific picture in the reporting of the Amnesty story rather than on the claims being made. The implication (whether intentional or not), is that the claims themselves are somehow falsified.

If you wish to debate the topic itself fine - but I'm getting rather tired of the "my ####### is bigger than your #######" game you seem to like playing with people.

Amazing that the older someone gets, it doesn't seem to change their propensity for childish behaviour.

Edited August 23, 2006 by erekose

[Ban Hammer 14,295]

doesn't anyone find the numbers on the wall interesting? another one of those staged pictures making the rounds....

I hope you're not suggesting the clearly bomb shattered cities of Southern Lebanon didn't precipitate more than a small amount of human suffering

i believe what i said above was quite clear........

So human suffering in Lebanon is staged?

Dropping bombs on populated area doesn't kill people?

sigh...for being so bright sometimes you are quite dense.

the pic in that one article was staged for the benefit of the photographer. i'm not saying that the coffins are not real, or that they don't contain dead people, or that bombing didn't occur. i am saying i've seen reports on this very photo, citing how the women are wedged between the coffins and the wall, with the large numbers painted above the coffins. all for the benefit of the photo opportunity.....

I wasn't focussing on the photo - but on the Amnesty report. What's your conclusion then - that the majority of the humanitarian suffering is grossly exaggerated or otherwise made up?

i was not addressing the amnesty report - just the picture used within it - nice try at baiting me.

Baiting you? Says the guy who launched right in with a personal attack.

The thread is about the Amnesty Report - I commented on the fact that we see fit to accept their findings when it pertains to oppressive totalitarian regimes like Burma, China, Iraq etc. but not when they point the finger of criticism at the US for Guantanamo Bay and secret "Black Hole" prisons, or our allies - such as Israel who, while they had justification to respond to Hezbollah aggression - did so in a typically heavy handed manner that has caused massive civilian death and displaced over 1 million people.

yawn. when i'm commenting about the picture and you're trying to draw me into something about the article, either you have an agenda or you're being dense. your choice as to which one

No I'm not. I'm commenting on the report at the centre of this news story, which is topic under discussion. Simply wondering why you focus on one specific picture in the reporting of the Amnesty story rather than on the claims being made. The implication (whether intentional or not), is that the claims themselves are somehow falsified.

If you wish to debate the topic itself fine - but I'm getting rather tired of the "my ####### is bigger than your #######" game you seem to like playing with people.

Amazing that the older someone gets, it doesn't seem to change their propensity for childish behaviour.

ok erekose, in the future everyone will discuss only what you want to discuss

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

ok erekose, in the future everyone will discuss only what you want to discuss

The topic will be just fine.

[Ban Hammer 14,295]

ok erekose, in the future everyone will discuss only what you want to discuss

The topic will be just fine.

said picture was from the link on the op topic. but according to you, no one can discuss the pictures that accompany said article...

Edited August 23, 2006 by charlesandnessa

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

ok erekose, in the future everyone will discuss only what you want to discuss

The topic will be just fine.

said picture was from the link on the op topic. but according to you, no one can discuss the pictures that accompany said article...

Hmmm nowhere did I say you couldn't comment on the photo - I'm just questioning why you focus on it rather than the claims made by Amnesty.

Again I'd sooner not make this some sort of personal pissing match.

[sharky 2]

once again Charlesandnessa simply refuses to even recognize the real facts about what happened in Lebannon, even the pictures speak for themselves, especially the satellite photo of before and after........

or Charles do you think that one is staged as well??? perhaps they made a perfectly accurate scaled down model and then used match boxes for buildings.......... and then just burnt the whole model to show the 'after' photo........

I guess it's possible eh?

stick with the topic charles........and stop trying to make sidetracks by claiming one photo is staged....... now who's being dense eh?

[Ban Hammer 14,295]

once again Charlesandnessa simply refuses to even recognize the real facts about what happened in Lebannon, even the pictures speak for themselves, especially the satellite photo of before and after........

or Charles do you think that one is staged as well??? perhaps they made a perfectly accurate scaled down model and then used match boxes for buildings.......... and then just burnt the whole model to show the 'after' photo........

I guess it's possible eh?

stick with the topic charles........and stop trying to make sidetracks by claiming one photo is staged....... now who's being dense eh?

so far, just you. continue your liberal rant

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

once again Charlesandnessa simply refuses to even recognize the real facts about what happened in Lebannon, even the pictures speak for themselves, especially the satellite photo of before and after........

or Charles do you think that one is staged as well??? perhaps they made a perfectly accurate scaled down model and then used match boxes for buildings.......... and then just burnt the whole model to show the 'after' photo........

I guess it's possible eh?

stick with the topic charles........and stop trying to make sidetracks by claiming one photo is staged....... now who's being dense eh?

so far, just you. continue your liberal rant

Here we are back to the philosophical/political conundrum from last week. What precisely was "liberal" about what he said?

[Ban Hammer 14,295]

once again Charlesandnessa simply refuses to even recognize the real facts about what happened in Lebannon, even the pictures speak for themselves, especially the satellite photo of before and after........

or Charles do you think that one is staged as well??? perhaps they made a perfectly accurate scaled down model and then used match boxes for buildings.......... and then just burnt the whole model to show the 'after' photo........

I guess it's possible eh?

stick with the topic charles........and stop trying to make sidetracks by claiming one photo is staged....... now who's being dense eh?

so far, just you. continue your liberal rant

Here we are back to the philosophical/political conundrum from last week. What precisely was "liberal" about what he said?

it amazes me how i comment on one thing - a picture - and you two have made a mountain out of it. did i disagree with the report? no. did i state that people were not killed there? no. instead, both of you use my post as a way to make personal attacks, and then you whine about it when i finally reply in kind. i've already gotten the message, don't discuss the pictures, just carry on about how evil israel is.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

once again Charlesandnessa simply refuses to even recognize the real facts about what happened in Lebannon, even the pictures speak for themselves, especially the satellite photo of before and after........

or Charles do you think that one is staged as well??? perhaps they made a perfectly accurate scaled down model and then used match boxes for buildings.......... and then just burnt the whole model to show the 'after' photo........

I guess it's possible eh?

stick with the topic charles........and stop trying to make sidetracks by claiming one photo is staged....... now who's being dense eh?

so far, just you. continue your liberal rant

Here we are back to the philosophical/political conundrum from last week. What precisely was "liberal" about what he said?

it amazes me how i comment on one thing - a picture - and you two have made a mountain out of it. did i disagree with the report? no. did i state that people were not killed there? no. instead, both of you use my post as a way to make personal attacks, and then you whine about it when i finally reply in kind. i've already gotten the message, don't discuss the pictures, just carry on about how evil israel is.

My comments thus far have been fairly innocuous - but that didn't stop you from calling me stupid and PaulC a "liberal", if we're talking about personal attacks here…I don't believe I started it.

Questioning what appeared (to me) to be a suggestion that the humanitarian crisis in the ruins of southern Lebanon was somehow falsified or exaggerated, was rather objectionable to me. However, if that wasn't your meaning, then clearly I misunderstood. I don't believe much more needs to be said.

Like I said, I'd sooner stay on topic that have yet another thread devolve into a pissing match. No need to be so touchy.

[sharky 2]

he's only being touchy because he can't defend the fact the Israel committed war crimes by deliberately targeting civilian structure..........FACT......

as far as personal attacks Charles also called me a terrorist lover in another thread......but that's because he has the very narrow-minded view that if you criticize and IDF actions in the war then of course you MUST support Hezbollah...........which I of course don't but......

"i've already gotten the message, don't discuss the pictures, just carry on about how evil israel is. "

at least he's starting to realise a few things eh??