Why Are Overdraft Fees Legal?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The thing is - banking didn't use to be this way. It was through deregulation that allowed banks to start charging fees for everything under the sun.

That's silly. Back in the "good old days" (1970s?), banks didn't charge ATM or credit card fees

because ATMs and credit cards didn't exist. There were no overdraft fees because folks used

to go to a bank branch to get their cash.

I've been using debit cards since the mid 80's. You could use your debit back then as a credit card if it was a Visa or MasterCard debit card. Back then, the banks were not charging the kinds of fees and amounts they are charging now.

the question was about 70s...not the 80s.

Yes and I remember monthly fees unless you kept a minimum of like $500 balance, "per check" fees, having to write checks, buy postage stamps and sending them several days before the bill was due, and YES overdraft fees, even in the old days. I remember having to wait until the monthly statement came to balance my checkbook. I do it every day now. I check the account between 2-3 pm when the business closes for the day. If my wife has gone crazy with her debit card somewhere I just transfer funds. If I didn't have funds to transfer, there would be NO going crazy with a debit card. I know my balance at this moment in the bank. I remember having to go to the bank to transfer funds, now I can do it with 3 mouseclicks. There is absolutely no reason (other than stupidity) for an account to be overdrawn in this day and age.

Now we have online banking, I haven't used 200 checks in the last 6 years! No check fees, no minimum balance, bill pay online the day it is due, no postage stamps, no monthly fees (my bank calls it "FREE checking for Life")

The banks have shifted the fees charged from the responsible people to the irresponsible people (thanks to de-regulation) and I like that THEY pay the fees for ME and it results in more services, FREE for me. Ah, yes, the rewards of being responsible! But, hey, you are doing a good job to defend our right to be Stupid. I realize I haven't done my part lately.

So Gary, you'd be okay if your HOA decides to fine you $1,000 if you let your lawn go uncut (beyond the maximum height of 2")? Or if your city decides to impose a fee of $1,000 if you're one day late for your water payment? Because, you have the right to be stupid, right?

[moelarrycheese 0]

Or you could just keep better records of what is in your account so you don't over-spend, or have over-draft protection linked to your savings account.

Who pulls out their checkbook log every time they use their debit card? Might as well write a check.

Regardless...it doesn't justify banks charging multiple, compounded fees. That should be illegal.

You sir, sound like a very lazy and irresponsible man who expects other people to do that which you should be doing yourself, ie keeping track of your personal finances.

[Gary and Alla 3,696]

Wow Gary, you really are an azzhole aren't you

No. I really am a warm fuzzy kind of guy, heavily armed, but warm and fuzzy nonetheless, I see that it does no good to agree with you, or to apologize for assuming you were getting smarter. So I think I shall defer agreeing with you on this topic also. I think you prefer when no one agrees with you. Yes?

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Definitely an azzhole.

[Gary and Alla 3,696]

The thing is - banking didn't use to be this way. It was through deregulation that allowed banks to start charging fees for everything under the sun.

That's silly. Back in the "good old days" (1970s?), banks didn't charge ATM or credit card fees

because ATMs and credit cards didn't exist. There were no overdraft fees because folks used

to go to a bank branch to get their cash.

I've been using debit cards since the mid 80's. You could use your debit back then as a credit card if it was a Visa or MasterCard debit card. Back then, the banks were not charging the kinds of fees and amounts they are charging now.

the question was about 70s...not the 80s.

Yes and I remember monthly fees unless you kept a minimum of like $500 balance, "per check" fees, having to write checks, buy postage stamps and sending them several days before the bill was due, and YES overdraft fees, even in the old days. I remember having to wait until the monthly statement came to balance my checkbook. I do it every day now. I check the account between 2-3 pm when the business closes for the day. If my wife has gone crazy with her debit card somewhere I just transfer funds. If I didn't have funds to transfer, there would be NO going crazy with a debit card. I know my balance at this moment in the bank. I remember having to go to the bank to transfer funds, now I can do it with 3 mouseclicks. There is absolutely no reason (other than stupidity) for an account to be overdrawn in this day and age.

Now we have online banking, I haven't used 200 checks in the last 6 years! No check fees, no minimum balance, bill pay online the day it is due, no postage stamps, no monthly fees (my bank calls it "FREE checking for Life")

The banks have shifted the fees charged from the responsible people to the irresponsible people (thanks to de-regulation) and I like that THEY pay the fees for ME and it results in more services, FREE for me. Ah, yes, the rewards of being responsible! But, hey, you are doing a good job to defend our right to be Stupid. I realize I haven't done my part lately.

So Gary, you'd be okay if your HOA decides to fine you $1,000 if you let your lawn go uncut (beyond the maximum height of 2")? Or if your city decides to impose a fee of $1,000 if you're one day late for your water payment? Because, you have the right to be stupid, right?

You really ARE clueless to the whole idea. PART of being indivually responsible is there is NO HOA. I do not submit to the local prolitariet (the soviet name for Homeowners Association and one I prefer to use for them) I have my own property, my own tractor and I mow it when I want to and no one has anything to say about it. If that changes, I will move.

I have my own well for water. Dammit eh? Bu to answer your question in an abstract way, yes, if the penalty for overdue water is $1000 I would be very stupid not to pay it on time.

[Gary and Alla 3,696]

Definitely an azzhole.

(sigh) I had hopes for you, but when faced with logic and meaningful discussion you reverted back to personal insults and one liners. Oh well, such displays of wisdom are the best thing for conservatives. Thanks.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Or you could just keep better records of what is in your account so you don't over-spend, or have over-draft protection linked to your savings account.

Who pulls out their checkbook log every time they use their debit card? Might as well write a check.

Regardless...it doesn't justify banks charging multiple, compounded fees. That should be illegal.

You sir, sound like a very lazy and irresponsible man who expects other people to do that which you should be doing yourself, ie keeping track of your personal finances.

No. I just gave up trying to keep a paper log of my account when I found impractical and inaccurate. I check my balance online regularly to know what the balance is, but it is nearly impossible to know your accurate balance when you have transactions coming and going...things like automatic payments, direct deposits, etc. If you actually keep a paper log of every single transaction from your account, you must either live a very simple and modest lifestyle or just clueless.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Definitely an azzhole.

(sigh) I had hopes for you, but when faced with logic and meaningful discussion you reverted back to personal insults and one liners. Oh well, such displays of wisdom are the best thing for conservatives. Thanks.

Oh I'm up for a discussion, your lame attempts to patronise me - not so much. Lets see if we can have a single post from you that isn't dripping in derisive sarcasm.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The thing is - banking didn't use to be this way. It was through deregulation that allowed banks to start charging fees for everything under the sun.

That's silly. Back in the "good old days" (1970s?), banks didn't charge ATM or credit card fees

because ATMs and credit cards didn't exist. There were no overdraft fees because folks used

to go to a bank branch to get their cash.

I've been using debit cards since the mid 80's. You could use your debit back then as a credit card if it was a Visa or MasterCard debit card. Back then, the banks were not charging the kinds of fees and amounts they are charging now.

the question was about 70s...not the 80s.

Yes and I remember monthly fees unless you kept a minimum of like $500 balance, "per check" fees, having to write checks, buy postage stamps and sending them several days before the bill was due, and YES overdraft fees, even in the old days. I remember having to wait until the monthly statement came to balance my checkbook. I do it every day now. I check the account between 2-3 pm when the business closes for the day. If my wife has gone crazy with her debit card somewhere I just transfer funds. If I didn't have funds to transfer, there would be NO going crazy with a debit card. I know my balance at this moment in the bank. I remember having to go to the bank to transfer funds, now I can do it with 3 mouseclicks. There is absolutely no reason (other than stupidity) for an account to be overdrawn in this day and age.

Now we have online banking, I haven't used 200 checks in the last 6 years! No check fees, no minimum balance, bill pay online the day it is due, no postage stamps, no monthly fees (my bank calls it "FREE checking for Life")

The banks have shifted the fees charged from the responsible people to the irresponsible people (thanks to de-regulation) and I like that THEY pay the fees for ME and it results in more services, FREE for me. Ah, yes, the rewards of being responsible! But, hey, you are doing a good job to defend our right to be Stupid. I realize I haven't done my part lately.

So Gary, you'd be okay if your HOA decides to fine you $1,000 if you let your lawn go uncut (beyond the maximum height of 2")? Or if your city decides to impose a fee of $1,000 if you're one day late for your water payment? Because, you have the right to be stupid, right?

You really ARE clueless to the whole idea. PART of being indivually responsible is there is NO HOA. I do not submit to the local prolitariet (the soviet name for Homeowners Association and one I prefer to use for them) I have my own property, my own tractor and I mow it when I want to and no one has anything to say about it. If that changes, I will move.

I have my own well for water. Dammit eh? Bu to answer your question in an abstract way, yes, if the penalty for overdue water is $1000 I would be very stupid not to pay it on time.

It was a hypothetical, Gary. Not everyone is a Ted Kazinksy...they actually are part of society.

[Amby 490]

I think it is a huge rip-off that credit card companies are allowed to charge 30% interest. Maybe the preamble needs to be changed from we the people to we the politicians and friends

How about 288% interest?

See below:

that's insane!

my friend worked for collections at a bank and she said people would get these alienware computers on credit and pay like 45% interest and then default on payments so they'd take it away.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Or you could just keep better records of what is in your account so you don't over-spend, or have over-draft protection linked to your savings account.

Who pulls out their checkbook log every time they use their debit card? Might as well write a check.

Regardless...it doesn't justify banks charging multiple, compounded fees. That should be illegal.

You sir, sound like a very lazy and irresponsible man who expects other people to do that which you should be doing yourself, ie keeping track of your personal finances.

No. I just gave up trying to keep a paper log of my account when I found impractical and inaccurate. I check my balance online regularly to know what the balance is, but it is nearly impossible to know your accurate balance when you have transactions coming and going...things like automatic payments, direct deposits, etc. If you actually keep a paper log of every single transaction from your account, you must either live a very simple and modest lifestyle or just clueless.

You can keep track of your finances on something like Quicken Online which downloads transaction data direct to your PC. With all the pending transactions that get applied to your account when using a debit card, you can get a general day to day picture, but you're not going to have 100% up to the minute information.

[mawilson 2,133]

No. I just gave up trying to keep a paper log of my account when I found impractical and inaccurate. I check my balance online regularly to know what the balance is, but it is nearly impossible to know your accurate balance when you have transactions coming and going...things like automatic payments, direct deposits, etc. If you actually keep a paper log of every single transaction from your account, you must either live a very simple and modest lifestyle or just clueless.

Sure it is. You don't need a paper log - you already have an online transaction log, which

includes pending transactions.

[Amby 490]

or you can just put everything on a credit card and get one statement each month that you pay off. that's the easiest thing to do.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I think it is a huge rip-off that credit card companies are allowed to charge 30% interest. Maybe the preamble needs to be changed from we the people to we the politicians and friends

How about 288% interest?

See below:

that's insane!

my friend worked for collections at a bank and she said people would get these alienware computers on credit and pay like 45% interest and then default on payments so they'd take it away.

Collections is a whole other story there, if you let something go that far you're in deep trouble.

[Amby 490]

I think it is a huge rip-off that credit card companies are allowed to charge 30% interest. Maybe the preamble needs to be changed from we the people to we the politicians and friends

How about 288% interest?

See below:

that's insane!

my friend worked for collections at a bank and she said people would get these alienware computers on credit and pay like 45% interest and then default on payments so they'd take it away.

Collections is a whole other story there, if you let something go that far you're in deep trouble.

she said they would take the stuff back and sell it on ebay. then the person would be responsible for whatever was left on the loan. normally it wasn't anywhere near what the loan was.