Police union calls for change in immigration rule

[Peikko 1,575]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Ice needs more money, they don't need to change the remit of other authorities to do the job they are meant to do. Apart from all the other objections, having two agencies trying to do the same job is patently stupid.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Apart from all the other objections, having two agencies trying to do the same job is patently stupid.

exactly....

[DeadPoolX 9]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

The most HPD seems to do is make periodic arrests in brothels. It's rare to see them actually do anything about violent crime. So enforcing immigration law wouldn't take away from their "ability and quality" of law enforcement.

[Peikko 1,575]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

The most HPD seems to do is make periodic arrests in brothels. It's rare to see them actually do anything about violent crime. So enforcing immigration law wouldn't take away from their "ability and quality" of law enforcement.

That's the second time you have made this claim. What's with the HPD and brothels then, spill!

[spookyturtle 9,466]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

I think that the local police would be much more in touch with what is going on in their community than ICE is. I think that a good place to begin clean up would be on a local level. When they stop someone for a motor vechicle violation, if the person can't provide proper ID, they should be detained until their identity can be verified. Then ICE can step in. If they are illegal, deport them. If I got stopped and didn't provide proper ID to prove my identity, I would be arrested or detained, why not the illegals?

[Peikko 1,575]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

I think that the local police would be much more in touch with what is going on in their community than ICE is. I think that a good place to begin clean up would be on a local level. When they stop someone for a motor vechicle violation, if the person can't provide proper ID, they should be detained until their identity can be verified. Then ICE can step in. If they are illegal, deport them. If I got stopped and didn't provide proper ID to prove my identity, I would be arrested or detained, why not the illegals?

You would? Is that because you are not the USC? Clearly, this is a police state after all...

It's rather fanciful to suggest that everyone stopped without ID should be locked up until they can provide it - the police will not thank you for that idea and nor will the state's budgets.

Edited May 12, 2009 by Madame Cleo

[DeadPoolX 9]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

The most HPD seems to do is make periodic arrests in brothels. It's rare to see them actually do anything about violent crime. So enforcing immigration law wouldn't take away from their "ability and quality" of law enforcement.

That's the second time you have made this claim. What's with the HPD and brothels then, spill!

I've lived in Houston my entire life and for the most part, HPD does nothing. Oh sure, they'll pull over speeders every so often, but they don't like violent crime. In fact, if you call HPD, you're lucky if they arrive at the scene two hours later. This is from experience too.

As for brothels, well... Houston is notorious for its "adult entertainment" scene. This city has tons of strip clubs and just as many active brothels. Due to a lack of zoning laws, some of these brothels are in odd locations.

For instance, on Westheimer (a very busy road) there's a brothel called the Vellagio. It's an eyesore, especially at night considering all the neon light it uses. Anyway... it's right across the street from The Palms, an upscale restaurant. A couple of strip clubs (Legends and Centerfolds) are positioned extremely close to Ruth Chris Steakhouse on Richmond (another busy street).

Westheimer and Richmond house most of the brothels and strip clubs. Neither attempt to make themselves hidden or at least, less conspicuous. No one cares -- until sweeps come around. When that happens, HPD makes a token effort to appear as if they're doing something and bust some brothels and/or strip clubs (the latter of which prostitution can sometimes occur in too).

[SMOKE 1,426]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

clearly you don't hear anything but yourself. they are re-arresting the same people. that is not quality law enforcement. they have appealed to ICE to do their jobs. they are unable to do so. HPD wants to help.

[Peikko 1,575]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

The most HPD seems to do is make periodic arrests in brothels. It's rare to see them actually do anything about violent crime. So enforcing immigration law wouldn't take away from their "ability and quality" of law enforcement.

That's the second time you have made this claim. What's with the HPD and brothels then, spill!

I've lived in Houston my entire life and for the most part, HPD does nothing. Oh sure, they'll pull over speeders every so often, but they don't like violent crime. In fact, if you call HPD, you're lucky if they arrive at the scene two hours later. This is from experience too.

As for brothels, well... Houston is notorious for its "adult entertainment" scene. This city has tons of strip clubs and just as many active brothels. Due to a lack of zoning laws, some of these brothels are in odd locations.

For instance, on Westheimer (a very busy road) there's a brothel called the Vellagio. It's an eyesore, especially at night considering all the neon light it uses. Anyway... it's right across the street from The Palms, an upscale restaurant. A couple of strip clubs (Legends and Centerfolds) are positioned extremely close to Ruth Chris Steakhouse on Richmond (another busy street).

Westheimer and Richmond house most of the brothels and strip clubs. Neither attempt to make themselves hidden or at least, less conspicuous. No one cares -- until sweeps come around. When that happens, HPD makes a token effort to appear as if they're doing something and bust some brothels and/or strip clubs (the latter of which prostitution can sometimes occur in too).

If this is an accurate picture of HDP, I can't imagine why they would want to take on another agency's remit - unless it's simply an excuse for why they are currently failing to do their proper job correctly.

After all, the Chief must know full well that the remit will not change. I smell fish.

[The_Dude 1,142]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

I think that the local police would be much more in touch with what is going on in their community than ICE is. I think that a good place to begin clean up would be on a local level. When they stop someone for a motor vechicle violation, if the person can't provide proper ID, they should be detained until their identity can be verified. Then ICE can step in. If they are illegal, deport them. If I got stopped and didn't provide proper ID to prove my identity, I would be arrested or detained, why not the illegals?

That is in actuality how it does work, at least in theory. The reality is that after a motorist is stopped and briefly detained for not having proper ID to operate a motor vehicle, ICE will more often than not decline to take custody of the detainee. I don't know their rationale, that is for a much higher pay grade. I do know that there are procedures, very similarly to how you posit. The problem is with ICE, not the police.

You cannot combine the function of ICE and Police, no matter how logical or convenient it may sound. I hate to do it, but lets delve into hypotheticals. If police start asking people their residency status, you will see a sharp decline in both cooperation with police and reporting of crimes. People who are illegal, and even those who are legal, but might have illegal immigrants in their family will fear deportation if they contact the police, even if it is completely irrelavent to the crime at hand. Police can detain people for either fraudulent identification paperwork, or no identification, but the latter is not a crime, merely a reason to run their fingerprints, or to refer them to ICE to determine their true identity.

[spookyturtle 9,466]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

I think that the local police would be much more in touch with what is going on in their community than ICE is. I think that a good place to begin clean up would be on a local level. When they stop someone for a motor vechicle violation, if the person can't provide proper ID, they should be detained until their identity can be verified. Then ICE can step in. If they are illegal, deport them. If I got stopped and didn't provide proper ID to prove my identity, I would be arrested or detained, why not the illegals?

You would? Is that because you are not the USC? Clearly, this is a police state after all...

It's rather fanciful to suggest that everyone stopped without ID should be locked up until they can provide it - the police will not thank you for that idea and nor will the state's budgets.

Talk to someone on the police dept. that you know well and isn't afraid of getting in trouble and see what they really think. Giving a false id to a cop is grounds for arrest. Enforce the law and see how things change. Don't let illegals register cars. Stop making things so easy for them. I could write a book about what goes on in my area. ICE doesn't do their job, what federal agency does? Except to harrass people who do things legally and who follow due process.

Edited May 12, 2009 by spookyturtle

[The_Dude 1,142]

are you sure that hasn't already happened? they are looking for more authority to do their job.

They don't need the authority to prosecute illegal immigrants to do their job. They need ICE to do their job better.

round & round we go. i understand what you're saying. do you understand me? ICE has failed & is failing to enforce the law, they want the authority to do their job. protect & serve the people of Houston.

Clearly you don't get it. If you give this authority to the police, you will decrease their ability and quality of law enforcement in certain areas. They should try to cooperate with ICE and work on getting funding for them rather than try to take over their jurisdiction.

I think that the local police would be much more in touch with what is going on in their community than ICE is. I think that a good place to begin clean up would be on a local level. When they stop someone for a motor vechicle violation, if the person can't provide proper ID, they should be detained until their identity can be verified. Then ICE can step in. If they are illegal, deport them. If I got stopped and didn't provide proper ID to prove my identity, I would be arrested or detained, why not the illegals?

You would? Is that because you are not the USC? Clearly, this is a police state after all...

It's rather fanciful to suggest that everyone stopped without ID should be locked up until they can provide it - the police will not thank you for that idea and nor will the state's budgets.

Talk to someone on the police dept. that you know well and isn't afraid of getting in trouble and see what they really think. Giving a false id to a cop is grounds for arrest. Enforce the law and see how things change. Don't let illegals register cars. Stop making things so easy for them. I could write a book about what goes on in my area. ICE doesn't do their job, what federal agency does? Except to harrass people who do things legally and who follow due process.

Yes, giving a false ID is a crime, but not having one or not producing one is not a crime. If local police departments usurp the authority of ICE, then not having one would be a crime and would create an entirely different environment for the police.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Being here without papers is a civil violation, not a criminal offense. If a person is apprehended by the police for a law violation that has nothing do with that immigration matters, then it's not an issue and to now allow police departments the authority to check a citizen's legal status would be a violation of our civil rights.

Edited May 12, 2009 by Col. 'Bat' Guano

[spookyturtle 9,466]

Yes, giving a false ID is a crime, but not having one or not producing one is not a crime. If local police departments usurp the authority of ICE, then not having one would be a crime and would create an entirely different environment for the police.

If you get stopped for a motor vehicle violation, you could be ticketed for not having a license or registration with you. If you don't pay the fine or appear in court, you won't be able to renew your license or registration in most states. The illegal won't pay the fine or appear in court and will continue on like nothing happened. Or in worst case senario, get new false documents.

[The_Dude 1,142]

Yes, giving a false ID is a crime, but not having one or not producing one is not a crime. If local police departments usurp the authority of ICE, then not having one would be a crime and would create an entirely different environment for the police.

If you get stopped for a motor vehicle violation, you could be ticketed for not having a license or registration with you. If you don't pay the fine or appear in court, you won't be able to renew your license or registration in most states. The illegal won't pay the fine or appear in court and will continue on like nothing happened. Or in worst case senario, get new false documents.

Well, now you see part of what I have to deal with on a daily basis with my job. I work for a PD, and the brass upstairs tinkered with a similar idea a few years ago. It was the officers and the POA that ultimately shed some light on the scenario. There is a very large hispanic community here, most of which are already leery of law enforcement. If you added the additional function of immigration enforcement, then they feared that many would become even more adversarial with law enforcement. This why I am against this sort of power transfer. I know here, we will not arrest someone for not having an ID, or even ask their status. This is not a primary concern, and thus not a reason to arrest or detain someone. If we arrest someone for something unrelated, his information will be run through various databases and if it comes up that there is an ICE hold, or that he or she is illegally here, they will be referred to ICE for further action.