SanjivJivan

Just an update. We have been issued a marriage certificate registered on yesterday's date from the gavisa office. It states we were married "sanskritik parampar anusar" which is to say according to cultural tradition 3 years ago. Hopefully this is no problem, because it shows we had our sindur ceremony before and registered our marriage this year. All of which is truthful. I don't foresee this being a problem, but I can only hope for the best. This is how the marriage certificate are written in his district. We were also told to get a verified English translation in addition to the English on the original certificate.

I filed a k1 application. We had a sindur ceremony but never any marriage certificate. I felt more comfortable filing a fiance visa, and actually did not wish to legally marry in Nepal. I wanted to do so in the US. But now that the k1 was rejected on those grounds, I am ready to register our marriage. 

I have lived in Nepal for a long time (~6 years) so I am pretty familiar with the government offices, but get confused about the details.

I am willing to register our marriage from July 2018, but I don't know if the CDO office will be willing to do that. I am guessing they will recomend registering the other date. Workers in the govt. offices can be pushy and downright rude here (e.g. refusing to write the name I chose for our son on his birth certificate).

I am thinking it might be wise to contact the embassy and hopefully get something in writing to verify that they were truthfully informed of our traditional ceremony, and it is being registered from this month for the purpose of the spousal visa application.

Trust me, I realize it is a delicate matter, and I don't want to do the wrong thing!

Honestly I wasn't considering myself truly, legally married, but the embassy in Kathmandu considered us so, hence the denial. Perhaps it would be better to insist our marriage be registered only from the date we visit the CDO now...?

Hey everyone.

I have a question about creating a marriage certificate here in Nepal. I applied for my husband to come on a k1 visa before but he was denied because we had a traditional marriage. ( I did not know it was an issue for k1- was given bad advice...) We still didn't have a marriage certificate but now are registering it so I can petition a cr1 for him.

My question is about what kind of marriage certificate we need to make and whether we should put the retrospective date we had our small wedding almost 3 years ago. There are two levels of government offices known as the vdc and cdo here. I need to go to the cdo of my husband's district now. The certificate is written such that the date of marriage is written separate from the registry date. My instinct is to put the date of our wedding 3 years ago while the registry date would be sometime this month.  I am guessing that is the correct method but thought I would check here.

I don't know if it is even possible to make a retrospective marriage certificate like that in other countries, but I assume it is understood by the US since many can and do immigrate from Nepal.

And if so, does that make ours a cr1 or ir1 application? Does the marriage "count from our wedding date or the registered date?

It seems quite important for the application since the K1 denial earlier this year was due to having had our small wedding, which I fully disclosed even in the USCIS stage. And of course the interview will be conducted at the same embassy in Kathmandu, where they are obviously aware of our K1 situation.

59 minutes ago, Maria1989 said:

I myself don’t see how this is a common mistake. An unofficial ceremony or religious ceremony is basically you marry without filing the paperwork and in many countries having a ceremony with a “priest” or other religious figure makes you married. The USCIS is clear when it says that if you are legally married in your country they consider that marriage valid. Some people go get their paperwork after to present to the USCIS. I know many legally married people in Africa without a “marriage certificate”. Basically you got dressed up and stood in front of a religious figure of your beliefs or faith and made vows to each other. Sounds like a marriage without the paperwork that is required in the US, some US states even had what they referred to as common law marriages. 

 

Not only is it a mistake to do, but then an even worse mistake to include it in a package where you are telling the US government that you intend to get married. Sometimes people ask about it on this forum and then still do it. So sometimes it’s a case is being stubborn and basically at that point “you get what you get”. Not the case here....... but sometimes people need to properly read the instructions, research, or either hire an attorney. Unless you have lots of money and time to waste. 

 

I really feel sorry for the OP. However this is something you want to prepare properly for because it’s certainly a journey. 

Each country is different. Even though Nepal and India are similar culturally, Indian law makes a religious ceremony a marriage while Nepal does not. Granted in both countries getting married at the age of 14 with a ceremony is all too common, though perfectly illegal.

In my case, I read that it was okay to have done unofficial rites/marriage during the petition stage, and wrote very clearly and honestly that we already had a religious ceremony and in my mind considered it excellent proof of being a bona fide couple. I wrote that in the petition and during the consular phase. I did my best to research things, but as mentioned before, at that stage I had really limited internet access. I never thought about it again, since the petition was approved, and I had stated it there. Like I said, I learned about it being a problem the day of the interview when the consular officer said you are already married and refused the visa. I searched online and of course a million results came up. I don't have any illusions about it now, and was here to ask a question about 221g, not religious ceremonies, but I do think it is definitely worth having a discussion about.

I think it's a very easy mistake to make, actually, because the law is the law and religion is religion usually. Is a baptism the same as a birth certificate? Does giving a eulogy for a loved one give you access to their bank account? The K1 visa sees the religion and law as more interrelated, and I totally understand that, especially when some nations do legally recognize marriage without paperwork. But I do NOT think it is intuitive, it's just that it seems obvious if you have already heard about denials based on this issue. 

21 minutes ago, Jaquelly said:

TNJ can be a bit rude. They used to miff me when I first came around, but if you cut the emotion out of yourself when you read their replies, it's good information and solid to think back to going forward.

 

We're all burnt out about the topic. We see it at ALL the time. Good luck moving forward.

Right, well the topic got steered towards 'is unofficial marriage bad for k1' which wasn't my question. I found that out after one brutal google search in the middle of the night on Valentine's day. Like I said, even though I read a lot about other things, that never came up before until the moment of truth.

My question was just, is this case at the embassy under AP or sent to USCIS and denied. And the consensus is that it is denied. Go figure. 

TNJ17, of all the replies, yours seem the most aggressive. Not because you are being truthful, but because of your tone. I appreciate the information. I really do. However given what an emotionally charged process this visa is, I think everyone can hold the snark and just appreciate where someone is coming from. It's a little much to say I know little about immigration. I don't know a ton, nor do I know nothing. An average amount, I'd say. There were many hurdles I overcame with the K1 process, and our case was complicated, but it just so happens that this religious ceremony thing was the one hurdle I didn't overcome. I do understand enough about a green card, and that you can travel abroad for periods of less than a year. And even then, you cannot give the impression you don't want to stay in the U.S. Then after 3 years you can try to become a citizen. That would be the perfect situation, but luck isn't usually on my side. I haven't gone into the intricacies of my fragile future plans, but I'm just saying that a year setback is a major disappointment given that I want my son's father here now while I am a student, which is only 2 more years. That is a topic for another day, but just realize there are all kinds of people and all kinds of situations. It's not always meet twice, apply for K1, live happily ever after in America. There's nothing wrong with having unorthodox and even international plans as long as they are legal. And every couple/family is different. Any plans relating to immigration are hypothetical in nature, because it all hinges on the government's decision. 

Thanks for your replies everyone. Usually I'm not too keen to post online about my personal life, but I appreciate getting some feedback. Personally I don't like all the back and forth with forums, but at the same time I am absolutely indebted to all the information I have gained from reading posts on here.

I was confused because I thought 221g was always further review, but what I am hearing is you can have documents requested under 221g or just be flat-out denied under the same clause. I have never seen the words denied anywhere so I was under the impression it was still being reviewed. But again, I have been back and forth about believing it was denied or not because of not having a straight answer. I am glad to have a clearer view of how to move forward. 

I saw someone was wondering why even apply for him to immigrate if I don't want to stay in the US. Well, I am from here, and imagine I will always visit here, even if I am not living here year round. My hope was that my fiance and I could earn some American salaries for a few years and move back to Nepal when we were financially better off. I doubt I am the only one who has gone for this visa for that purpose, although more applicants are looking to settle here. I don't think my partner has a chance at getting a business visa, and the main purpose for his coming here, apart from being my sweetheart and being together as a family, would be to work and build our lives. 

One more question that has come up is whether there might be a better option (ie visa) for him to visit the US, given our situation. I understand UK nationals can and do visit while petitioning/applying for CR1 visa, but what about from countries where visas are harder to obtain? I have no clue if that is feasible, but I guess I'm just brainstorming now. Or other work visa options... is it a guaranteed no even if you apply for that kind of visa after legal marriage to a citizen (not before; obviously it screams fraud if you do it while still unmarried with a k1 denial)... Does anyone have any suggestions?

Okay, to clarify, I have worked with the embassy through a grant, not within. I know some people there, been to some cocktail parties, whathaveyou.

And I appreciate honesty, but not condescending 'I told you so'. I never came across anything about religious ceremonies being an issue. I actually read advice on a law firm website that explicitly said it was acceptable if not a legal union. Just another case of lawyers being worthless, I guess? When I was first preparing the petition, I was in a remote part of the country, and without internet. I was able to access the internet to research the process for a few minutes a few times on a mobile phone. We had this ceremony within a few months of meeting, long before we considered a visa application at all. This is definitely not a case of being told not to do it and doing it anyways. We have always been planning to have a wedding in the US, followed by legal documents, if he can come, which is why I thought K1 was the best option, in addition to the shorter wait. I suppose it is a case of being out in the jungle and mistakenly thinking K1 was the right choice when it would have been better to do CR1 from the beginning.

Forgive me for saying but if this is a rookie mistake, what applicant is an expert? Isn't everyone who applies for a K1 a rookie, unless they have applied before? We all learn as we go, unless we have direct previous experience. And some of us don't have access to the internet. In my case, even when I did have internet, I never ever came across information about this problem, just information about the 100 other concerns I had. The only time I even learned about it was after the interview.

My question is simply is this case being processed further or is it showing AP when it is really denied? It seems like there response here is that it is basically denied. I have had that feeling already. But I am still a little foggy on this, because it is listed as 221g and has been updated several times. Is that typical as well? Is there a way of knowing if it has really left the embassy, and is it even worth contacting a congressman to find out?

I did write that I do want to live in my fiance's country, but I am finishing my degree in the United States. I studied there for some time, but the education system is really inadequate there, even though there are so many smart people from there who do go through the Nepali education system. A huge majority of people who can go, go to study abroad for that reason. I have been ready with plan B from before the interview, which is to finish this semester, go home to my partner in Nepal over the summer, and study abroad next semester in a country where my partner can live with me. And in the meantime, our paperwork would be run through the gamut and result in a CR1 interview.

My fiance had his interview on February 15th, which was the morning in Nepal but the night of Valentine's Day here in the U.S. I was getting all romantic and optimistic, but there is no love in legislation, and the consular officer refused my fiance's visa. The reason? We included a photo of a Hindu ceremony which he believed meant we were married, and ineligible for the K1 visa. Now it's been about a month, and I have been all kinds of confused, thinking he was outright denied, to thinking it was AP, and there was a sliver of hope. The CEAC status has been administrative processing since the interview. At times I have felt a whole lot of hope for the K1, and other times feel resigned to make other plans and slowly but surely apply for the CR1.

A little background: I am a US citizen but I have been in Nepal for several years. I met my fiance in 2015 and now we have a child together. We are young and only want to be in America for a few years to earn some money. I have never posted on VJ, but have manically studied the site since we began our petition. Of all the things I did read, somehow I never managed to find anything about a religious ceremony being grounds for denial with the K1. On the contrary, I had read some things that said it was okay, and was not a legal marriage. Well, now I know! The thing is, I purposefully never filed for marriage because I wanted my partner to apply for this visa. In retrospect, it would have been so much easier to just get married. I have been with my fiance for the vast majority of our relationship in Nepal, and have struggled with immigration there because I was trying to stay on a different visa than the much easier marriage visa. The 'ceremony' we did have was also before I was even the legal age for marriage in Nepal (20 years old), and it wasn't legal. Very informal, just the two of us and a Hindu priest, and truly for religious reasons. 

Anyways, now my fiance has been refused under 221g, and I am having trouble understanding what to do. I have worked with the embassy in the past, and since I knew someone at the consular personally, I was able to ask him to check on the application. All he was able to find was that it was refused because our unofficial ceremony was deemed to be a legal marriage. I have sent a few well thought-out, well-written letters, but I fear they are not even read. All I want to know is should I give up the K1 or not? Is this administrative processing going to bear any fruit, or is it really just over?? I was informed our case is being returned to USCIS - I don't really understand if this is normal for AP, or if it is a set up for the case to expire. I feel very distraught, because I am in the U.S. with our toddler alone now, and my fiance and I don't even want to live in the U.S. long term. But right now? We really want to be here, together, while I am working and finishing school. Another year for the CR1 and it would almost be pointless...